The paradise creator sons

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,10:17)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,03:37) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,02:39) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 11 2013,09:17) I don't fast or pray as a rule, everyday is holy to me. Colter This is what I reported you saying and I was certainly right so why call me a liar? Maybe you should reconsider and pray like your religion teaches you. As a rule, a rule! I pray sincerely, I don't say things to God that I don't really mean, when I pray I don't pray a pre written prayer while my mind is somewhere else. Colter You can slither any way you like but you were not supportive of prayer. Even if you say I don't pray as a rule that means you don't feel a definite need for prayer. Otherwise what is your interpretation of “as a rule” exactly mean? I pray as a rule, I worship as a rule and I submit to God as a rule. either way I have shown you what you said and you were not man enough to apologize for calling me a liar. So we should be clear that saying “I don't fast or Pray as a rule” implied you do not pray and the solid proof of that is you declared that you DO NOT FAST is that correct sir?

More false accusations, you failed to include the ENTIRE conversation we were having:

Quote

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 10 2013,16:30) The Urantia Book speaksabout fasting as though it is not ideal, this seems to not be correct based on the scientificevidence that fasting is very good for the body not to mention the extremely good benefits for th SPIRIT Fasting was not a part of the religion of Jesus. In the kingdom everyday is a day to have a relationship with God and to do his will. Fasting evolved from the more primitive belief that God would be pleased with fasting, that man could manipulate the spirits. Everyday is a day to eat well and care for the temple of the body. Insincere praying, as a compulsion, is an abomination to God. Like praying 5 times a day just because your religion says you should rather then because you truly desire to seek Gods guidance. (1574.1) 140:5.8 2. “Happy are they who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled.” Only those who feel poor in spirit will ever hunger for righteousness. Only the humble seek for divine strength and crave spiritual power. But it is most dangerous to knowingly engage in spiritual fasting in order to improve one’s appetite for spiritual endowments. Physical fasting becomes dangerous after four or five days; one is apt to lose all desire for food. Prolonged fasting, either physical or spiritual, tends to destroy hunger.

rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will.

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48)

rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter

So do you fast at all?

Who do you pray to?

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,16:04)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48) rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter So do you fast at all? Who do you pray to?

1)No

2)God

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,21:12)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,16:04) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48) rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter So do you fast at all? Who do you pray to? 1)No 2)God Colter

Thanks for answering.

Do you pray to Michael “the God of this local universe”?

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 09 2013,11:41)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,21:12) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,16:04) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48) rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter So do you fast at all? Who do you pray to? 1)No 2)God Colter Thanks for answering. Do you pray to Michael “the God of this local universe”?

I ask for guidance from the Father and Son, only in concept can I distinguish between them. They are one.

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 09 2013,12:12)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 09 2013,11:41) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,21:12) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,16:04) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48) rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter So do you fast at all? Who do you pray to? 1)No 2)God Colter Thanks for answering. Do you pray to Michael “the God of this local universe”? I ask for guidance from the Father and Son, only in concept can I distinguish between them. They are one. Colter

I there a need to distinguish between them ever?

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 09 2013,14:19)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 09 2013,12:12) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 09 2013,11:41) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,21:12) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 05 2013,16:04) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 05 2013,11:48) rule=a compulsive, ritualistic requirement rather than truly seeking Gods will. Colter So do you fast at all? Who do you pray to? 1)No 2)God Colter Thanks for answering. Do you pray to Michael “the God of this local universe”? I ask for guidance from the Father and Son, only in concept can I distinguish between them. They are one. Colter I there a need to distinguish between them ever?

Yes

…..”ask in my name”

(1639.3) 146:2.8 7. The cry of the righteous is the faith act of the child of God which opens the door of the Father’s storehouse of goodness, truth, and mercy, and these good gifts have long been in waiting for the son’s approach and personal appropriation. Prayer does not change the divine attitude toward man, but it does change man’s attitude toward the changeless Father. The motive of the prayer gives it right of way to the divine ear, not the social, economic, or outward religious status of the one who prays.

(1639.4) 146:2.9 8. Prayer may not be employed to avoid the delays of time or to transcend the handicaps of space. Prayer is not designed as a technique for aggrandizing self or for gaining unfair advantage over one’s fellows. A thoroughly selfish soul cannot pray in the true sense of the word. Said Jesus: “Let your supreme delight be in the character of God, and he shall surely give you the sincere desires of your heart.” “Commit your way to the Lord; trust in him, and he will act.” “For the Lord hears the cry of the needy, and he will regard the prayer of the destitute.”

(1639.5) 146:2.10 9. “I have come forth from the Father; if, therefore, you are ever in doubt as to what you would ask of the Father, ask in my name, and I will present your petition in accordance with your real needs and desires and in accordance with my Father’s will.” Guard against the great danger of becoming self-centered in your prayers. Avoid praying much for yourself; pray more for the spiritual progress of your brethren. Avoid materialistic praying; pray in the spirit and for the abundance of the gifts of the spirit.

(1639.6) 146:2.11 10. When you pray for the sick and afflicted, do not expect that your petitions will take the place of loving and intelligent ministry to the necessities of these afflicted ones. Pray for the welfare of your families, friends, and fellows, but especially pray for those who curse you, and make loving petitions for those who persecute you. “But when to pray, I will not say. Only the spirit that dwells within you may move you to the utterance of those petitions which are expressive of your inner relationship with the Father of spirits.”

(1640.1) 146:2.12 11. Many resort to prayer only when in trouble. Such a practice is thoughtless and misleading. True, you do well to pray when harassed, but you should also be mindful to speak as a son to your Father even when all goes well with your soul. Let your real petitions always be in secret. Do not let men hear your personal prayers. Prayers of thanksgiving are appropriate for groups of worshipers, but the prayer of the soul is a personal matter. There is but one form of prayer which is appropriate for all God’s children, and that is: “Nevertheless, your will be done.”

(1640.2) 146:2.13 12. All believers in this gospel should pray sincerely for the extension of the kingdom of heaven. Of all the prayers of the Hebrew scriptures he commented most approvingly on the petition of the Psalmist: “Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. Purge me from secret sins and keep back your servant from presumptuous transgression.” Jesus commented at great length on the relation of prayer to careless and offending speech, quoting: “Set a watch, O Lord, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips.” “The human tongue,” said Jesus, “is a member which few men can tame, but the spirit within can transform this unruly member into a kindly voice of tolerance and an inspiring minister of mercy.”

(1640.3) 146:2.14 13. Jesus taught that the prayer for divine guidance over the pathway of earthly life was next in importance to the petition for a knowledge of the Father’s will. In reality this means a prayer for divine wisdom. Jesus never taught that human knowledge and special skill could be gained by prayer. But he did teach that prayer is a factor in the enlargement of one’s capacity to receive the presence of the divine spirit. When Jesus taught his associates to pray in the spirit and in truth, he explained that he referred to praying sincerely and in accordance with one’s enlightenment, to praying wholeheartedly and intelligently, earnestly and steadfastly.

(1640.4) 146:2.15 14. Jesus warned his followers against thinking that their prayers would be rendered more efficacious by ornate repetitions, eloquent phraseology, fasting, penance, or sacrifices. But he did exhort his believers to employ prayer as a means of leading up through thanksgiving to true worship. Jesus deplored that so little of the spirit of thanksgiving was to be found in the prayers and worship of his followers. He quoted from the Scriptures on this occasion, saying: “It is a good thing to give thanks to the Lord and to sing praises to the name of the Most High, to acknowledge his loving-kindness every morning and his faithfulness every night, for God has made me glad through his work. In everything I will give thanks according to the will of God.”

(1640.5) 146:2.16 15. And then Jesus said: “Be not constantly overanxious about your common needs. Be not apprehensive concerning the problems of your earthly existence, but in all these things by prayer and supplication, with the spirit of sincere thanksgiving, let your needs be spread out before your Father who is in heaven.” Then he quoted from the Scriptures: “I will praise the name of God with a song and will magnify him with thanksgiving. And this will please the Lord better than the sacrifice of an ox or bullock with horns and hoofs.”

(1641.1) 146:2.17 16. Jesus taught his followers that, when they had made their prayers to the Father, they should remain for a time in silent receptivity to afford the indwelling spirit the better opportunity to speak to the listening soul. The spirit of the Father speaks best to man when the human mind is in an a
ttitude of true worship. We worship God by the aid of the Father’s indwelling spirit and by the illumination of the human mind through the ministry of truth. Worship, taught Jesus, makes one increasingly like the being who is worshiped. Worship is a transforming experience whereby the finite gradually approaches and ultimately attains the presence of the Infinite.

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 09 2013,22:13)

Yes …..”ask in my name” (1639.3) 146:2.8 7. The cry of the righteous is the faith act of the child of God which opens the door of the Father’s storehouse of goodness, truth, and mercy, and these good gifts have long been in waiting for the son’s approach and personal appropriation. Prayer does not change the divine attitude toward man, but it does change man’s attitude toward the changeless Father. The motive of the prayer gives it right of way to the divine ear, not the social, economic, or outward religious status of the one who prays. (1639.4) 146:2.9 8. Prayer may not be employed to avoid the delays of time or to transcend the handicaps of space. Prayer is not designed as a technique for aggrandizing self or for gaining unfair advantage over one’s fellows. A thoroughly selfish soul cannot pray in the true sense of the word. Said Jesus: “Let your supreme delight be in the character of God, and he shall surely give you the sincere desires of your heart.” “Commit your way to the Lord; trust in him, and he will act.” “For the Lord hears the cry of the needy, and he will regard the prayer of the destitute.” (1639.5) 146:2.10 9. “I have come forth from the Father; if, therefore, you are ever in doubt as to what you would ask of the Father, ask in my name, and I will present your petition in accordance with your real needs and desires and in accordance with my Father’s will.” Guard against the great danger of becoming self-centered in your prayers. Avoid praying much for yourself; pray more for the spiritual progress of your brethren. Avoid materialistic praying; pray in the spirit and for the abundance of the gifts of the spirit. (1639.6) 146:2.11 10. When you pray for the sick and afflicted, do not expect that your petitions will take the place of loving and intelligent ministry to the necessities of these afflicted ones. Pray for the welfare of your families, friends, and fellows, but especially pray for those who curse you, and make loving petitions for those who persecute you. “But when to pray, I will not say. Only the spirit that dwells within you may move you to the utterance of those petitions which are expressive of your inner relationship with the Father of spirits.” (1640.1) 146:2.12 11. Many resort to prayer only when in trouble. Such a practice is thoughtless and misleading. True, you do well to pray when harassed, but you should also be mindful to speak as a son to your Father even when all goes well with your soul. Let your real petitions always be in secret. Do not let men hear your personal prayers. Prayers of thanksgiving are appropriate for groups of worshipers, but the prayer of the soul is a personal matter. There is but one form of prayer which is appropriate for all God’s children, and that is: “Nevertheless, your will be done.” (1640.2) 146:2.13 12. All believers in this gospel should pray sincerely for the extension of the kingdom of heaven. Of all the prayers of the Hebrew scriptures he commented most approvingly on the petition of the Psalmist: “Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me. Purge me from secret sins and keep back your servant from presumptuous transgression.” Jesus commented at great length on the relation of prayer to careless and offending speech, quoting: “Set a watch, O Lord, before my mouth; keep the door of my lips.” “The human tongue,” said Jesus, “is a member which few men can tame, but the spirit within can transform this unruly member into a kindly voice of tolerance and an inspiring minister of mercy.” (1640.3) 146:2.14 13. Jesus taught that the prayer for divine guidance over the pathway of earthly life was next in importance to the petition for a knowledge of the Father’s will. In reality this means a prayer for divine wisdom. Jesus never taught that human knowledge and special skill could be gained by prayer. But he did teach that prayer is a factor in the enlargement of one’s capacity to receive the presence of the divine spirit. When Jesus taught his associates to pray in the spirit and in truth, he explained that he referred to praying sincerely and in accordance with one’s enlightenment, to praying wholeheartedly and intelligently, earnestly and steadfastly. (1640.4) 146:2.15 14. Jesus warned his followers against thinking that their prayers would be rendered more efficacious by ornate repetitions, eloquent phraseology, fasting, penance, or sacrifices. But he did exhort his believers to employ prayer as a means of leading up through thanksgiving to true worship. Jesus deplored that so little of the spirit of thanksgiving was to be found in the prayers and worship of his followers. He quoted from the Scriptures on this occasion, saying: “It is a good thing to give thanks to the Lord and to sing praises to the name of the Most High, to acknowledge his loving-kindness every morning and his faithfulness every night, for God has made me glad through his work. In everything I will give thanks according to the will of God.” (1640.5) 146:2.16 15. And then Jesus said: “Be not constantly overanxious about your common needs. Be not apprehensive concerning the problems of your earthly existence, but in all these things by prayer and supplication, with the spirit of sincere thanksgiving, let your needs be spread out before your Father who is in heaven.” Then he quoted from the Scriptures: “I will praise the name of God with a song and will magnify him with thanksgiving. And this will please the Lord better than the sacrifice of an ox or bullock with horns and hoofs.” (1641.1) 146:2.17 16. Jesus taught his followers that, when they had made their prayers to the Father, they should remain for a time in silent receptivity to afford the indwelling spirit the better opportunity to speak to the listening soul. The spirit of the Father speaks best to man when the human mind is in an attitude of true worship. We worship God by the aid of the Father’s indwelling spirit and by the illumination of the human mind through the ministry of truth. Worship, taught Jesus, makes one increasingly like the being who is worshiped. Worship is a transforming experience whereby the finite gradually approaches and ultimately attains the presence of the Infinite. Colter

Oh, so when you are in doubt?

Islam believes Jesus when he said this:

John 16:25-27

Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

25 These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father. 26 At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you: 27 for the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.

In the UB that time doesn't come?

[Spock]

Jesus is the way to the Father:

(1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you.

(1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.”

(1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.”

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35)

Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter

You seem to never respond directly to my post.

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post.

Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming”

I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand.

Colter

[Wakeup]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,12:22)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post. Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming” I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand. Colter

Colter.

Look in the mirror, and see.
The pot calling the kettle black.

wakeup.

[Spock]

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 11 2013,09:31)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,12:22) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post. Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming” I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand. Colter Colter. Look in the mirror, and see. The pot calling the kettle black. wakeup.

I looked in the mirror and made the point to myself that I rarely ask questions so you made another bad point.

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 11 2013,13:23)

Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 11 2013,09:31) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,12:22) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post. Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming” I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand. Colter Colter. Look in the mirror, and see. The pot calling the kettle black. wakeup. I looked in the mirror and made the point to myself that I rarely ask questions so you made another bad point. Colter

I think his point was you being insincere which at times you are but I believe it stems from not wanting to dig deeper into what you believe

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 11 2013,16:25)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 11 2013,13:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 11 2013,09:31) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,12:22) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post. Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming” I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand. Colter Colter. Look in the mirror, and see. The pot calling the kettle black. wakeup. I looked in the mirror and made the point to myself that I rarely ask questions so you made another bad point. Colter I think his point was you being insincere which at times you are but I believe it stems from not wanting to dig deeper into what you believe

My beliefs are open to examination, but trying to view them through the disbelief of Mohamed is what leads you to argue silliness.

You should learn to think for yourself instead of how Islam thinks for you.

Colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 12 2013,03:41)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 11 2013,16:25) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 11 2013,13:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 11 2013,09:31) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,12:22) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 10 2013,11:49) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 10 2013,05:35) Jesus is the way to the Father: (1952.3) 180:6.7 And since Jesus knew they asked these questions, he said: “Do you inquire among yourselves about what I meant when I said that in a little while I would not be with you, and that, when you would see me again, I would be on my way to the Father? I have plainly told you that the Son of Man must die, but that he will rise again. Can you not then discern the meaning of my words? You will first be made sorrowful, but later on will you rejoice with many who will understand these things after they have come to pass. A woman is indeed sorrowful in the hour of her travail, but when she is once delivered of her child, she immediately forgets her anguish in the joy of the knowledge that a man has been born into the world. And so are you about to sorrow over my departure, but I will soon see you again, and then will your sorrow be turned into rejoicing, and there shall come to you a new revelation of the salvation of God which no man can ever take away from you. And all the worlds will be blessed in this same revelation of life in effecting the overthrow of death. Hitherto have you made all your requests in my Father’s name. After you see me again, you may also ask in my name, and I will hear you. (1952.4) 180:6.8 “Down here I have taught you in proverbs and spoken to you in parables. I did so because you were only children in the spirit; but the time is coming when I will talk to you plainly concerning the Father and his kingdom. And I shall do this because the Father himself loves you and desires to be more fully revealed to you. Mortal man cannot see the spirit Father; therefore have I come into the world to show the Father to your creature eyes. But when you have become perfected in spirit growth, you shall then see the Father himself.” (1952.5) 180:6.9 When the eleven had heard him speak, they said to each other: “Behold, he does speak plainly to us. Surely the Master did come forth from God. But why does he say he must return to the Father?” And Jesus saw that they did not even yet comprehend him. These eleven men could not get away from their long-nourished ideas of the Jewish concept of the Messiah. The more fully they believed in Jesus as the Messiah, the more troublesome became these deep-rooted notions regarding the glorious material triumph of the kingdom on earth.” Colter You seem to never respond directly to my post. Most of the time I give you specific answers, but on this occasion I provided context for what Jesus meant when he said “the time is coming” I sence that your questions are in the same spirit as those who would ply Jesus with insincere questions for motives other than to truly understand. Colter Colter. Look in the mirror, and see. The pot calling the kettle black. wakeup. I looked in the mirror and made the point to myself that I rarely ask questions so you made another bad point. Colter I think his point was you being insincere which at times you are but I believe it stems from not wanting to dig deeper into what you believe My beliefs are open to examination, but trying to view them through the disbelief of Mohamed is what leads you to argue silliness. You should learn to think for yourself instead of how Islam thinks for you. Colter

Actually most of the things I have asked you have nothing to do with Islam.

Most of th UB was written before adding the papers on Jesus according to UB history so why do you think Jesus was an after thought? I believ it is because it would b the only point of interest fo people to want to read the Urantia Papers. The UB literally steals info directly

In 1992, a reader of The Urantia Book, Matthew Block, self-published a paper that showed The Urantia Book utilized material from 15 other books.[124] All of the source authors identified in Block's paper were published in English between 1905 and 1943 by U.S. publishers and are typically scholarly or academic works that contain concepts and wording similar to what is found in The Urantia Book.[122] Block has since claimed to have discovered over 125 source texts that were incorporated into the papers.[125]

The use of outside source materials was studied separately by Gardner and Gooch, and they concluded that the book did plagiarize many of the sources noted by Block.[126][127]

For instance, Gardner and Block note that Paper 85 appears to have been taken from the first eight chapters of Origin and Evolution of Religion by Edward Washburn Hopkins, published by Yale University Press in 1923.[128] Each section of the paper corresponds to a chapter in the book, with several passages possibly used as direct material and further material used in Papers 86-90 and 92. (In addition to the book's “heavy indebtedness to Hopkins,” Gardner discovered that Hopkins was a major reference in an earlier book authored by Sadler, adding to Gardner's view that it is more likely Sadler had a hand in writing or editing The Urantia Book than that celestial beings wrote it.) Likewise, much of The Urantia Book material relating to the evolution of mankind appears to have been directly taken from Henry Fairfield Osborn, Man Rises to Parnassus: Critical Epochs in the Prehistory of Man published by Princeton University Press in 1928.[129]

In one example cited by Block and confirmed by Gardner and Gooch, the original author discusses the periodicity of the chemical elements and concludes that the harmony in the construction of the atom suggests some unspecified plan of organization. The authors of The Urantia Book assert that this harmony is evidence of the intelligent design of the universe. W. F. G. Swann writes on page 64 of The Architecture of the Universe (italics indicate edits as compared to The Urantia Book, bolding indicates deletions):[130][131]

Starting from any one of them , and noting some property such as the melting point, for example, the property would change as we went along the row, but as we continued it would gradually come back to the condition very
similar to that which we started … The eighth element was in many respects like the first, the ninth like the second, the tenth like the third, and so on. Such a slate of affairs point not only to a varied internal structure, but also to a certain harmony in that variation suggestive of some organized plan in building the atom.

Contrast with The Urantia Book's version:

Starting from any one element, after noting some one property, such a quality will exchange for six consecutive elements, but on reaching the eighth, it tends to reappear, that is, the eighth chemically active element resembles the first, the ninth the second, and so on. Such a fact of the physical world unmistakably points to the sevenfold constitution of ancestral energy and is indicative of the fundamental reality of the sevenfold diversity of the creations of time and space.

Block and other believers do not see the use of the source materials as plagiarism, but express a view instead that the quality of the way the material was borrowed is consistent with authorship by celestial beings and that study of the sources leads to an even deeper understanding of The Urantia Book.[132][133] Gooch, a professor of English, assessed that the use of the sources “does reveal to us an author with a busy genius for metaphysical invention and poetic turns of phrase whose scam was at worst benign and at most visionary.”[134] Meredith Sprunger, a believer and defender of The Urantia Book, states that if humans wrote the book the plagiarisms would indeed be disturbing but not if it was written by supermortals.[132]

[Spock]

Forward to the Urantia Book

“Acknowledgment

(16.8) 0:12.11 In formulating the succeeding presentations having to do with the portrayal of the character of the Universal Father and the nature of his Paradise associates, together with an attempted description of the perfect central universe and the encircling seven superuniverses, we are to be guided by the mandate of the superuniverse rulers which directs that we shall, in all our efforts to reveal truth and co-ordinate essential knowledge, give preference to the highest existing human concepts pertaining to the subjects to be presented. We may resort to pure revelation only when the concept of presentation has had no adequate previous expression by the human mind.

(17.1) 0:12.12 Successive planetary revelations of divine truth invariably embrace the highest existing concepts of spiritual values as a part of the new and enhanced co-ordination of planetary knowledge. Accordingly, in making these presentations about God and his universe associates, we have selected as the basis of these papers more than one thousand human concepts representing the highest and most advanced planetary knowledge of spiritual values and universe meanings. Wherein these human concepts, assembled from the God-knowing mortals of the past and the present, are inadequate to portray the truth as we are directed to reveal it, we will unhesitatingly supplement them, for this purpose drawing upon our own superior knowledge of the reality and divinity of the Paradise Deities and their transcendent residential universe.

(17.2) 0:12.13 We are fully cognizant of the difficulties of our assignment; we recognize the impossibility of fully translating the language of the concepts of divinity and eternity into the symbols of the language of the finite concepts of the mortal mind. But we know that there dwells within the human mind a fragment of God, and that there sojourns with the human soul the Spirit of Truth; and we further know that these spirit forces conspire to enable material man to grasp the reality of spiritual values and to comprehend the philosophy of universe meanings. But even more certainly we know that these spirits of the Divine Presence are able to assist man in the spiritual appropriation of all truth contributory to the enhancement of the ever-progressing reality of personal religious experience — God-consciousness.

(17.3) 0:12.14 [Indited by an Orvonton Divine Counselor, Chief of the Corps of Superuniverse Personalities assigned to portray on Urantia the truth concerning the Paradise Deities and the universe of universes.]

colter

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 12 2013,12:41)

Forward to the Urantia Book “Acknowledgment (16.8) 0:12.11 In formulating the succeeding presentations having to do with the portrayal of the character of the Universal Father and the nature of his Paradise associates, together with an attempted description of the perfect central universe and the encircling seven superuniverses, we are to be guided by the mandate of the superuniverse rulers which directs that we shall, in all our efforts to reveal truth and co-ordinate essential knowledge, give preference to the highest existing human concepts pertaining to the subjects to be presented. We may resort to pure revelation only when the concept of presentation has had no adequate previous expression by the human mind. (17.1) 0:12.12 Successive planetary revelations of divine truth invariably embrace the highest existing concepts of spiritual values as a part of the new and enhanced co-ordination of planetary knowledge. Accordingly, in making these presentations about God and his universe associates, we have selected as the basis of these papers more than one thousand human concepts representing the highest and most advanced planetary knowledge of spiritual values and universe meanings. Wherein these human concepts, assembled from the God-knowing mortals of the past and the present, are inadequate to portray the truth as we are directed to reveal it, we will unhesitatingly supplement them, for this purpose drawing upon our own superior knowledge of the reality and divinity of the Paradise Deities and their transcendent residential universe. (17.2) 0:12.13 We are fully cognizant of the difficulties of our assignment; we recognize the impossibility of fully translating the language of the concepts of divinity and eternity into the symbols of the language of the finite concepts of the mortal mind. But we know that there dwells within the human mind a fragment of God, and that there sojourns with the human soul the Spirit of Truth; and we further know that these spirit forces conspire to enable material man to grasp the reality of spiritual values and to comprehend the philosophy of universe meanings. But even more certainly we know that these spirits of the Divine Presence are able to assist man in the spiritual appropriation of all truth contributory to the enhancement of the ever-progressing reality of personal religious experience — God-consciousness. (17.3) 0:12.14 [Indited by an Orvonton Divine Counselor, Chief of the Corps of Superuniverse Personalities assigned to portray on Urantia the truth concerning the Paradise Deities and the universe of universes.] colter

Can you not see how this makes no sense? The Highest concept at thetime of the Urantia Book was to call this planet “EARTH” and not give us a whole listof new names that have no bearing on reality it appears changing the name of earth was purposed for us to suppose a pre-existent knowlede of it, but even that makes no sense.

aso the book di not take the “BEST” concepts available and remained ignorant on a ton of topics especially the immediate surrounding history.

I can believe an entity told the tales but the question is what entity? But the book won't even tell us that.

[Spock]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 12 2013,13:58)

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 12 2013,12:41) Forward to the Urantia Book “Acknowledgment (16.8) 0:12.11 In formulating the succeeding presentations having to do with the portrayal of the character of the Universal Father and the nature of his Paradise associates, together with an attempted description of the perfect central universe and the encircling seven superuniverses, we are to be guided by the mandate of the superuniverse rulers which directs that we shall, in all our efforts to reveal truth and co-ordinate essential knowledge, give preference to the highest existing human concepts pertaining to the subjects to be presented. We may resort to pure revelation only when the concept of presentation has had no adequate previous expression by the human mind. (17.1) 0:12.12 Successive planetary revelations of divine truth invariably embrace the highest existing concepts of spiritual values as a part of the new and enhanced co-ordination of planetary knowledge. Accordingly, in making these presentations about God and his universe associates, we have selected as the basis of these papers more than one thousand human concepts representing the highest and most advanced planetary knowledge of spiritual values and universe meanings. Wherein these human concepts, assembled from the God-knowing mortals of the past and the present, are inadequate to portray the truth as we are directed to reveal it, we will unhesitatingly supplement them, for this purpose drawing upon our own superior knowledge of the reality and divinity of the Paradise Deities and their transcendent residential universe. (17.2) 0:12.13 We are fully cognizant of the difficulties of our assignment; we recognize the impossibility of fully translating the language of the concepts of divinity and eternity into the symbols of the language of the finite concepts of the mortal mind. But we know that there dwells within the human mind a fragment of God, and that there sojourns with the human soul the Spirit of Truth; and we further know that these spirit forces conspire to enable material man to grasp the reality of spiritual values and to comprehend the philosophy of universe meanings. But even more certainly we know that these spirits of the Divine Presence are able to assist man in the spiritual appropriation of all truth contributory to the enhancement of the ever-progressing reality of personal religious experience — God-consciousness. (17.3) 0:12.14 [Indited by an Orvonton Divine Counselor, Chief of the Corps of Superuniverse Personalities assigned to portray on Urantia the truth concerning the Paradise Deities and the universe of universes.] colter Can you not see how this makes no sense? The Highest concept at thetime of the Urantia Book was to call this planet “EARTH” and not give us a whole listof new names that have no bearing on reality it appears changing the name of earth was purposed for us to suppose a pre-existent knowlede of it, but even that makes no sense. aso the book di not take the “BEST” concepts available and remained ignorant on a ton of topics especially the immediate surrounding history. I can believe an entity told the tales but the question is what entity? But the book won't even tell us that.

“human wisdom must evolve”

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Colter @ Sep. 12 2013,22:07)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 12 2013,13:58) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 12 2013,12:41) Forward to the Urantia Book “Acknowledgment (16.8) 0:12.11 In formulating the succeeding presentations having to do with the portrayal of the character of the Universal Father and the nature of his Paradise associates, together with an attempted description of the perfect central universe and the encircling seven superuniverses, we are to be guided by the mandate of the superuniverse rulers which directs that we shall, in all our efforts to reveal truth and co-ordinate essential knowledge, give preference to the highest existing human concepts pertaining to the subjects to be presented. We may resort to pure revelation only when the concept of presentation has had no adequate previous expression by the human mind. (17.1) 0:12.12 Successive planetary revelations of divine truth invariably embrace the highest existing concepts of spiritual values as a part of the new and enhanced co-ordination of planetary knowledge. Accordingly, in making these presentations about God and his universe associates, we have selected as the basis of these papers more than one thousand human concepts representing the highest and most advanced planetary knowledge of spiritual values and universe meanings. Wherein these human concepts, assembled from the God-knowing mortals of the past and the present, are inadequate to portray the truth as we are directed to reveal it, we will unhesitatingly supplement them, for this purpose drawing upon our own superior knowledge of the reality and divinity of the Paradise Deities and their transcendent residential universe. (17.2) 0:12.13 We are fully cognizant of the difficulties of our assignment; we recognize the impossibility of fully translating the language of the concepts of divinity and eternity into the symbols of the language of the finite concepts of the mortal mind. But we know that there dwells within the human mind a fragment of God, and that there sojourns with the human soul the Spirit of Truth; and we further know that these spirit forces conspire to enable material man to grasp the reality of spiritual values and to comprehend the philosophy of universe meanings. But even more certainly we know that these spirits of the Divine Presence are able to assist man in the spiritual appropriation of all truth contributory to the enhancement of the ever-progressing reality of personal religious experience — God-consciousness. (17.3) 0:12.14 [Indited by an Orvonton Divine Counselor, Chief of the Corps of Superuniverse Personalities assigned to portray on Urantia the truth concerning the Paradise Deities and the universe of universes.] colter Can you not see how this makes no sense? The Highest concept at thetime of the Urantia Book was to call this planet “EARTH” and not give us a whole listof new names that have no bearing on reality it appears changing the name of earth was purposed for us to suppose a pre-existent knowlede of it, but even that makes no sense. aso the book di not take the “BEST” concepts available and remained ignorant on a ton of topics especially the immediate surrounding history. I can believe an entity told the tales but the question is what entity? But the book won't even tell us that. “human wisdom must evolve”

The Urantia Book doesn't provide wisdom. Is it wise to give Satan a platform, name worlds after him and label him as misunderstood?

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