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Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 04 2013,17:03) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 04 2013,16:31) Boditharta. Of course it is not true; the qur'an is all about
truth,and good words for allah and his prophets.But they do the opposite;it always has been this way.
The qur'an speaks of tolerance;but the muslems preach
kill all the infidels,they are all pigs. Kill every jew that you can see: Look there is one hiding behind the tree;and another one hiding behind the roch;kill them.But then they are all migrating into the countries full of pigs. Fact: The usa is runned by jews. Why go there?
Because of the material comforts; forget the spiritual,
forget about submitting to allah.Why would a good allah worshipping people;tempt themselves by migrating into a country full of pigs?
Pig eating infidels.Here is another fact; they call themsleves in submittance to allah; but the fact is; they dont.
Because we all can see,that they have left their spiritual country,and exchange that for material comfort
in a country full of pig eaters and infidels.Preach one thing,and do the opposite;this is always the case. The proof is in the pudding;and it tastes very bad.
The fruit looks good from the outside;but the inside is full of worms.
Please do not take this pesonally.wakeup.
No offense taken but there are plenty of Material comforts in Muslim countries.Whoso migrateth for the cause of Allah will find much refuge and abundance in the earth, and whoso forsaketh his home, a fugitive unto Allah and His messenger, and death overtaketh him, his reward is then incumbent on Allah. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #100)
Indeed, those whom the angels take [in death] while wronging themselves – [the angels] will say, “In what [condition] were you?” They will say, “We were oppressed in the land.” The angels will say, “Was not the earth of Allah spacious [enough] for you to emigrate therein?” For those, their refuge is Hell – and evil it is as a destination.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #97)
Boditharta.I know that you have many posts to answer.
Remember God brought israel to a land of his chosing.
And told them not to mingle with the surrounding nations because they are full of abominations,and also pig eaters.Why are muslems doing that? Going against God?
Why dont they stay in their own country and stay clean?
To live amongst their brethern? Why mingle with dirt?Is not to submit to God the most important?
Because the material comforts are more important;this we can observe by what they do;is not what they preach.wakeup.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 05 2013,11:01) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 05 2013,09:33) The punishment for APOSTASY FROM ISLAM is death, war is a diffent matter. Colter
No, that is not true at all. This idea you have is not in the Quran the most quoted verse for your position is this:Qur'an 4:89 states that “They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing: But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them”.
But the next verse it becomes very clear:
Qur'an 4:90 “Except those who join a group between whom and you there is a treaty (of peace), or those who approach you with hearts restraining them from fighting you as well as fighting their own people. If Allah had pleased, He could have given them power over you, and they would have fought you: Therefore if they withdraw from you but fight you not, and (instead) send you (Guarantees of) peace, then Allah Hath opened no way for you (to war against them).”
Also this relates to
The idea is more that a person who becomes a traitor like treaon should be put to death this is the same way in America the sentence or treason in America is death
Do you think that Satan inot going to be punished for his apostasy?
bodhitharta,Yes, Satan has already been judged by those in heaven competent to make the judgment.
The rules of conduct of the state are not part of the religion of Jesus, although they are a part of Islam where there is no separation of state from religion in many Muslim countries.
Many have been killed by the religion of Islam for leaving, you denied that but then defended it. Muslims are sensitive about the truth of Islam.
Colter
Before coming to earth Michael incarnate 6 other times as differnt orders of his creation in the heavens in accordance to the will of the Father.
The First Bestowal
(1309.2) 119:1.1 It was a solemn occasion on Salvington almost one billion years ago when the assembled directors and chiefs of the universe of Nebadon heard Michael announce that his elder brother, Immanuel, would presently assume authority in Nebadon while he (Michael) would be absent on an unexplained mission. No other announcement was made about this transaction except that the farewell broadcast to the Constellation Fathers, among other instructions, said: “And for this period I place you under the care and keeping of Immanuel while I go to do the bidding of my Paradise Father.”
(1309.3) 119:1.2 After sending this farewell broadcast, Michael appeared on the dispatching field of Salvington, just as on many previous occasions when preparing for departure to Uversa or Paradise except that he came alone. He concluded his statement of departure with these words: “I leave you but for a short season. Many of you, I know, would go with me, but whither I go you cannot come. That which I am about to do, you cannot do. I go to do the will of the Paradise Deities, and when I have finished my mission and have acquired this experience, I will return to my place among you.” And having thus spoken, Michael of Nebadon vanished from the sight of all those assembled and did not reappear for twenty years of standard time. In all Salvington, only the Divine Minister and Immanuel knew what was taking place, and the Union of Days shared his secret only with the chief executive of the universe, Gabriel, the Bright and Morning Star.
(1309.4) 119:1.3 All the inhabitants of Salvington and those dwelling on the constellation and system headquarters worlds assembled about their respective receiving stations for universe intelligence, hoping to get some word of the mission and whereabouts of the Creator Son. Not until the third day after Michael’s departure was any message of possible significance received. On this day a communication was registered on Salvington from the Melchizedek sphere, the headquarters of that order in Nebadon, which simply recorded this extraordinary and never-before-heard-of transaction: “At noon today there appeared on the receiving field of this world a strange Melchizedek Son, not of our number but wholly like our order. He was accompanied by a solitary omniaphim who bore credentials from Uversa and presented orders addressed to our chief, derived from the Ancients of Days and concurred in by Immanuel of Salvington, directing that this new Melchizedek Son be received into our order and assigned to the emergency service of the Melchizedeks of Nebadon. And it has been so ordered; it has been done.”
(1310.1) 119:1.4 And this is about all that appears on the records of Salvington regarding the first Michael bestowal. Nothing more appears until after one hundred years of Urantia time, when there was recorded the fact of Michael’s return and unannounced resumption of the direction of universe affairs. But a strange record is to be found on the Melchizedek world, a recital of the service of this unique Melchizedek Son of the emergency corps of that age. This record is preserved in a simple temple which now occupies the foreground of the home of the Father Melchizedek, and it comprises the narration of the service of this transitory Melchizedek Son in connection with his assignment to twenty-four missions of universe emergency. And this record, which I have so recently reviewed, ends thus:
(1310.2) 119:1.5 “And at noon on this day, without previous announcement and witnessed by only three of our brotherhood, this visiting Son of our order disappeared from our world as he came, accompanied only by a solitary omniaphim; and this record is now closed with the certification that this visitor lived as a Melchizedek, in the likeness of a Melchizedek he worked as a Melchizedek, and he faithfully performed all of his assignments as an emergency Son of our order. By universal consent he has become chief of Melchizedeks, having earned our love and adoration by his matchless wisdom, supreme love, and superb devotion to duty. He loved us, understood us, and served with us, and forever we are his loyal and devoted fellow Melchizedeks, for this stranger on our world has now eternally become a universe minister of Melchizedek nature.”
(1310.3) 119:1.6 And that is all I am permitted to tell you of the first bestowal of Michael. We, of course, fully understand that this strange Melchizedek who so mysteriously served with the Melchizedeks a billion years ago was none other than the incarnated Michael on the mission of his first bestowal. The records do not specifically state that this unique and efficient Melchizedek was Michael, but it is universally believed that he was. Probably the actual statement of that fact cannot be found outside of the records of Sonarington, and the records of that secret world are not open to us. Only on this sacred world of the divine Sons are the mysteries of incarnation and bestowal fully known. We all know of the facts of the Michael bestowals, but we do not understand how they are effected. We do not know how the ruler of a universe, the creator of the Melchizedeks, can so suddenly and mysteriously become one of their number and, as one of them, live among them and work as a Melchizedek Son for one hundred years. But it so happened……..
Colter
Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 05 2013,18:14) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 04 2013,17:03) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 04 2013,16:31) Boditharta. Of course it is not true; the qur'an is all about
truth,and good words for allah and his prophets.But they do the opposite;it always has been this way.
The qur'an speaks of tolerance;but the muslems preach
kill all the infidels,they are all pigs. Kill every jew that you can see: Look there is one hiding behind the tree;and another one hiding behind the roch;kill them.But then they are all migrating into the countries full of pigs. Fact: The usa is runned by jews. Why go there?
Because of the material comforts; forget the spiritual,
forget about submitting to allah.Why would a good allah worshipping people;tempt themselves by migrating into a country full of pigs?
Pig eating infidels.Here is another fact; they call themsleves in submittance to allah; but the fact is; they dont.
Because we all can see,that they have left their spiritual country,and exchange that for material comfort
in a country full of pig eaters and infidels.Preach one thing,and do the opposite;this is always the case. The proof is in the pudding;and it tastes very bad.
The fruit looks good from the outside;but the inside is full of worms.
Please do not take this pesonally.wakeup.
No offense taken but there are plenty of Material comforts in Muslim countries.Whoso migrateth for the cause of Allah will find much refuge and abundance in the earth, and whoso forsaketh his home, a fugitive unto Allah and His messenger, and death overtaketh him, his reward is then incumbent on Allah. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #100)
Indeed, those whom the angels take [in death] while wronging themselves – [the angels] will say, “In what [condition] were you?” They will say, “We were oppressed in the land.” The angels will say, “Was not the earth of Allah spacious [enough] for you to emigrate therein?” For those, their refuge is Hell – and evil it is as a destination.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #97)
Boditharta.I know that you have many posts to answer.
Remember God brought israel to a land of his chosing.
And told them not to mingle with the surrounding nations because they are full of abominations,and also pig eaters.Why are muslems doing that? Going against God?
Why dont they stay in their own country and stay clean?
To live amongst their brethern? Why mingle with dirt?Is not to submit to God the most important?
Because the material comforts are more important;this we can observe by what they do;is not what they preach.wakeup.
This earth belongs to God so those who believe are going to be everywhere the wheat growing right side by side with the chaff. In the end there will be no dispute of which is whichQuote (Colter @ Aug. 06 2013,05:27) Before coming to earth Michael incarnate 6 other times as differnt orders of his creation in the heavens in accordance to the will of the Father. The First Bestowal
(1309.2) 119:1.1 It was a solemn occasion on Salvington almost one billion years ago when the assembled directors and chiefs of the universe of Nebadon heard Michael announce that his elder brother, Immanuel, would presently assume authority in Nebadon while he (Michael) would be absent on an unexplained mission. No other announcement was made about this transaction except that the farewell broadcast to the Constellation Fathers, among other instructions, said: “And for this period I place you under the care and keeping of Immanuel while I go to do the bidding of my Paradise Father.”
(1309.3) 119:1.2 After sending this farewell broadcast, Michael appeared on the dispatching field of Salvington, just as on many previous occasions when preparing for departure to Uversa or Paradise except that he came alone. He concluded his statement of departure with these words: “I leave you but for a short season. Many of you, I know, would go with me, but whither I go you cannot come. That which I am about to do, you cannot do. I go to do the will of the Paradise Deities, and when I have finished my mission and have acquired this experience, I will return to my place among you.” And having thus spoken, Michael of Nebadon vanished from the sight of all those assembled and did not reappear for twenty years of standard time. In all Salvington, only the Divine Minister and Immanuel knew what was taking place, and the Union of Days shared his secret only with the chief executive of the universe, Gabriel, the Bright and Morning Star.
(1309.4) 119:1.3 All the inhabitants of Salvington and those dwelling on the constellation and system headquarters worlds assembled about their respective receiving stations for universe intelligence, hoping to get some word of the mission and whereabouts of the Creator Son. Not until the third day after Michael’s departure was any message of possible significance received. On this day a communication was registered on Salvington from the Melchizedek sphere, the headquarters of that order in Nebadon, which simply recorded this extraordinary and never-before-heard-of transaction: “At noon today there appeared on the receiving field of this world a strange Melchizedek Son, not of our number but wholly like our order. He was accompanied by a solitary omniaphim who bore credentials from Uversa and presented orders addressed to our chief, derived from the Ancients of Days and concurred in by Immanuel of Salvington, directing that this new Melchizedek Son be received into our order and assigned to the emergency service of the Melchizedeks of Nebadon. And it has been so ordered; it has been done.”
(1310.1) 119:1.4 And this is about all that appears on the records of Salvington regarding the first Michael bestowal. Nothing more appears until after one hundred years of Urantia time, when there was recorded the fact of Michael’s return and unannounced resumption of the direction of universe affairs. But a strange record is to be found on the Melchizedek world, a recital of the service of this unique Melchizedek Son of the emergency corps of that age. This record is preserved in a simple temple which now occupies the foreground of the home of the Father Melchizedek, and it comprises the narration of the service of this transitory Melchizedek Son in connection with his assignment to twenty-four missions of universe emergency. And this record, which I have so recently reviewed, ends thus:
(1310.2) 119:1.5 “And at noon on this day, without previous announcement and witnessed by only three of our brotherhood, this visiting Son of our order disappeared from our world as he came, accompanied only by a solitary omniaphim; and this record is now closed with the certification that this visitor lived as a Melchizedek, in the likeness of a Melchizedek he worked as a Melchizedek, and he faithfully performed all of his assignments as an emergency Son of our order. By universal consent he has become chief of Melchizedeks, having earned our love and adoration by his matchless wisdom, supreme love, and superb devotion to duty. He loved us, understood us, and served with us, and forever we are his loyal and devoted fellow Melchizedeks, for this stranger on our world has now eternally become a universe minister of Melchizedek nature.”
(1310.3) 119:1.6 And that is all I am permitted to tell you of the first bestowal of Michael. We, of course, fully understand that this strange Melchizedek who so mysteriously served with the Melchizedeks a billion years ago was none other than the incarnated Michael on the mission of his first bestowal. The records do not specifically state that this unique and efficient Melchizedek was Michael, but it is universally believed that he was. Probably the actual statement of that fact cannot be found outside of the records of Sonarington, and the records of that secret world are not open to us. Only on this sacred world of the divine Sons are the mysteries of incarnation and bestowal fully known. We all know of the facts of the Michael bestowals, but we do not understand how they are effected. We do not know how the ruler of a universe, the creator of the Melchizedeks, can so suddenly and mysteriously become one of their number and, as one of them, live among them and work as a Melchizedek Son for one hundred years. But it so happened……..
Colter
I will not argue these things wth you because, I mean seriously? Salvington? Come on….sounds like salvation huh…What language would that b translated from since english is not a billion years old?
Sorry Colter, but this isnot written for peple who love and Worship God. God Bless you for at least trying to Worship God may your attempt bring you grace and mercy from God. God Bless You, Colter
The Urantia papers were translated into the English language from the Universe language.
BTW, the OT was written in Hebrew, a language that dates to about 1000 bc, long after Moses. And who was quoting God in the creation story created by the Hebrews in Babylon? LOL!
(1319.2) 119:8.9 [This paper, depicting the seven bestowals of Christ Michael, is the sixty-third of a series of presentations, sponsored by numerous personalities, narrating the history of Urantia down to the time of Michael’s appearance on earth in the likeness of mortal flesh. These papers were authorized by a Nebadon commission of twelve acting under the direction of Mantutia Melchizedek. We indited these narratives and put them in the English language, by a technique authorized by our superiors, in the year A.D. 1935 of Urantia time.]*
More has been revealed, I'm so grateful that I found God 28 years ago and have been blessed with the latest revelation of truth.
Colter
Melchizedek materialized 2,000 years before Michael incarnate as Jesus but centuries latter, the oral traditions of those times became distorted as the Hebrew writers of the OT no longer believed the story of Melchizedek as the visible representative of God on earth, so they had God directly working with Abraham and the agreement/covenant.
(1015.1) 93:2.1 It was 1,973 years before the birth of Jesus that Machiventa was bestowed upon the human races of Urantia. His coming was unspectacular; his materialization was not witnessed by human eyes. He was first observed by mortal man on that eventful day when he entered the tent of Amdon, a Chaldean herder of Sumerian extraction. And the proclamation of his mission was embodied in the simple statement which he made to this shepherd, “I am Melchizedek, priest of El Elyon, the Most High, the one and only God.”
(1015.2) 93:2.2 When the herder had recovered from his astonishment, and after he had plied this stranger with many questions, he asked Melchizedek to sup with him, and this was the first time in his long universe career that Machiventa had partaken of material food, the nourishment which was to sustain him throughout his ninety-four years of life as a material being……
Melchizedek’s Covenant with Abraham
(1020.4) 93:6.1 Abraham envisaged the conquest of all Canaan. His determination was only weakened by the fact that Melchizedek would not sanction the undertaking. But Abraham had about decided to embark upon the enterprise when the thought that he had no son to succeed him as ruler of this proposed kingdom began to worry him. He arranged another conference with Melchizedek; and it was in the course of this interview that the priest of Salem, the visible Son of God, persuaded Abraham to abandon his scheme of material conquest and temporal rule in favor of the spiritual concept of the kingdom of heaven.
(1020.5) 93:6.2 Melchizedek explained to Abraham the futility of contending with the Amorite confederation but made it equally clear that these backward clans were certainly committing suicide by their foolish practices so that in a few generations they would be so weakened that the descendants of Abraham, meanwhile greatly increased, could easily overcome them.
(1020.6) 93:6.3 And Melchizedek made a formal covenant with Abraham at Salem. Said he to Abraham: “Look now up to the heavens and number the stars if you are able; so numerous shall your seed be.” And Abraham believed Melchizedek, “and it was counted to him for righteousness.” And then Melchizedek told Abraham the story of the future occupation of Canaan by his offspring after their sojourn in Egypt.
(1020.7) 93:6.4 This covenant of Melchizedek with Abraham represents the great Urantian agreement between divinity and humanity whereby God agrees to do everything; man only agrees to believe God’s promises and follow his instructions. Heretofore it had been believed that salvation could be secured only by works — sacrifices and offerings; now, Melchizedek again brought to Urantia the good news that salvation, favor with God, is to be had by faith. But this gospel of simple faith in God was too advanced; the Semitic tribesmen subsequently preferred to go back to the older sacrifices and atonement for sin by the shedding of blood.
(1021.1) 93:6.5 It was not long after the establishment of this covenant that Isaac, the son of Abraham, was born in accordance with the promise of Melchizedek. After the birth of Isaac, Abraham took a very solemn attitude toward his covenant with Melchizedek, going over to Salem to have it stated in writing. It was at this public and formal acceptance of the covenant that he changed his name from Abram to Abraham.
(1021.2) 93:6.6 Most of the Salem believers had practiced circumcision, though it had never been made obligatory by Melchizedek. Now Abraham had always so opposed circumcision that on this occasion he decided to solemnize the event by formally accepting this rite in token of the ratification of the Salem covenant.
(1021.3) 93:6.7 It was following this real and public surrender of his personal ambitions in behalf of the larger plans of Melchizedek that the three celestial beings appeared to him on the plains of Mamre. This was an appearance of fact, notwithstanding its association with the subsequently fabricated narratives relating to the natural destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. And these legends of the happenings of those days indicate how retarded were the morals and ethics of even so recent a time.
(1021.4) 93:6.8 Upon the consummation of the solemn covenant, the reconciliation between Abraham and Melchizedek was complete. Abraham again assumed the civil and military leadership of the Salem colony, which at its height carried over one hundred thousand regular tithe payers on the rolls of the Melchizedek brotherhood. Abraham greatly improved the Salem temple and provided new tents for the entire school. He not only extended the tithing system but also instituted many improved methods of conducting the business of the school, besides contributing greatly to the better handling of the department of missionary propaganda. He also did much to effect improvement of the herds and the reorganization of the Salem dairying projects. Abraham was a shrewd and efficient business man, a wealthy man for his day; he was not overly pious, but he was thoroughly sincere, and he did believe in Machiventa Melchizedek.
After Melchizedek left he continued to work with the prophets in spirit.
Caino
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 06 2013,21:39) The Urantia papers were translated into the English language from the Universe language. BTW, the OT was written in Hebrew, a language that dates to about 1000 bc, long after Moses. And who was quoting God in the creation story created by the Hebrews in Babylon? LOL!
(1319.2) 119:8.9 [This paper, depicting the seven bestowals of Christ Michael, is the sixty-third of a series of presentations, sponsored by numerous personalities, narrating the history of Urantia down to the time of Michael’s appearance on earth in the likeness of mortal flesh. These papers were authorized by a Nebadon commission of twelve acting under the direction of Mantutia Melchizedek. We indited these narratives and put them in the English language, by a technique authorized by our superiors, in the year A.D. 1935 of Urantia time.]*
More has been revealed, I'm so grateful that I found God 28 years ago and have been blessed with the latest revelation of truth.
Colter
I'm glad you found God long ago as well, tell me how is your faith?Do you find yourself having great compassion and Mercy towards others. Do you praise God Almighty often?
Are you charitable?
How has knowing God affected your life? How were you different before?
What was enhanced when you came across the Urantia Book?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 07 2013,14:35) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 06 2013,21:39) The Urantia papers were translated into the English language from the Universe language. BTW, the OT was written in Hebrew, a language that dates to about 1000 bc, long after Moses. And who was quoting God in the creation story created by the Hebrews in Babylon? LOL!
(1319.2) 119:8.9 [This paper, depicting the seven bestowals of Christ Michael, is the sixty-third of a series of presentations, sponsored by numerous personalities, narrating the history of Urantia down to the time of Michael’s appearance on earth in the likeness of mortal flesh. These papers were authorized by a Nebadon commission of twelve acting under the direction of Mantutia Melchizedek. We indited these narratives and put them in the English language, by a technique authorized by our superiors, in the year A.D. 1935 of Urantia time.]*
More has been revealed, I'm so grateful that I found God 28 years ago and have been blessed with the latest revelation of truth.
Colter
I'm glad you found God long ago as well, tell me how is your faith?Do you find yourself having great compassion and Mercy towards others. Do you praise God Almighty often?
Are you charitable?
How has knowing God affected your life? How were you different before?
What was enhanced when you came across the Urantia Book?
Quote I'm glad you found God long ago as well, tell me how is your faith? My faith, which is also a gift from God, is connected; I’m in the fellowship of believers. I strive to continually surrender to the will of the Father, but still find desires which oppose the grace of God. I'm growing.
Quote Do you find yourself having great compassion and Mercy towards others. Do you praise God Almighty often? Yes
Quote Are you charitable? A person with true humility gives responsibly without the need to tell everyone about it. I'm self supporting, as long as I am healthy and can work, I refuse charity.
But more harm is done in the name of helping, in the name of charity, than in any other way. The reason so many Muslim nations have economic problems is becuase their unhealthy charity has created a dependant class of alms seekers, people who come to expect charity becuase it is a decree of Islam.
Quote How has knowing God affected your life? How were you different before? 28 years ago I was a hopeless drug addicted alcoholic with constant thoughts of suicide. I was dishonest, unemployable and had a host of character flaws which plagued my life.
After the spiritual awakening that occurred EVERYTHING in my life changed. The people who knew me before hardly recognize me now. My new friends in faith find it hard to believe that I was what I once was.
I'm not comfortable going further then that because in the kingdom of heaven we don't brag, Jesus practiced “don not let the left hand know what the right is doing”. In other worlds, if we are righteous, we are self forgetful about it. We aren’t like the Pharisees who needed to publically advertise every time they bestowed alms on someone or did a “good deed”.
Quote What was enhanced when you came across the Urantia Book? The UB answered soooooo many questions that I had about God, life, evolution, origin, destiny, faith, meaning, value, truth, the universe and on and on.
We now know why the earth appears to be 4.8 billion years old, why life exploded onto the scene 550,000,000 years ago. We know what happened to the world, to Lucifer and Satan, and the “prince of this world”. Pre Adamic history, Who Adam and Eve were and how Cain found a wife in Nod. The garden of Eden, Dilmun in the Persian Gulf, human migration world wide, plate tectonics, life after death, Who Jesus was, the Trinity, Triunity, and Triodity, Paradice and much more.
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 07 2013,22:58) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 07 2013,14:35) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 06 2013,21:39) The Urantia papers were translated into the English language from the Universe language. BTW, the OT was written in Hebrew, a language that dates to about 1000 bc, long after Moses. And who was quoting God in the creation story created by the Hebrews in Babylon? LOL!
(1319.2) 119:8.9 [This paper, depicting the seven bestowals of Christ Michael, is the sixty-third of a series of presentations, sponsored by numerous personalities, narrating the history of Urantia down to the time of Michael’s appearance on earth in the likeness of mortal flesh. These papers were authorized by a Nebadon commission of twelve acting under the direction of Mantutia Melchizedek. We indited these narratives and put them in the English language, by a technique authorized by our superiors, in the year A.D. 1935 of Urantia time.]*
More has been revealed, I'm so grateful that I found God 28 years ago and have been blessed with the latest revelation of truth.
Colter
I'm glad you found God long ago as well, tell me how is your faith?Do you find yourself having great compassion and Mercy towards others. Do you praise God Almighty often?
Are you charitable?
How has knowing God affected your life? How were you different before?
What was enhanced when you came across the Urantia Book?
Quote I'm glad you found God long ago as well, tell me how is your faith? My faith, which is also a gift from God, is connected; I’m in the fellowship of believers. I strive to continually surrender to the will of the Father, but still find desires which oppose the grace of God. I'm growing.
Quote Do you find yourself having great compassion and Mercy towards others. Do you praise God Almighty often? Yes
Quote Are you charitable? A person with true humility gives responsibly without the need to tell everyone about it. I'm self supporting, as long as I am healthy and can work, I refuse charity.
But more harm is done in the name of helping, in the name of charity, than in any other way. The reason so many Muslim nations have economic problems is becuase their unhealthy charity has created a dependant class of alms seekers, people who come to expect charity becuase it is a decree of Islam.
Quote How has knowing God affected your life? How were you different before? 28 years ago I was a hopeless drug addicted alcoholic with constant thoughts of suicide. I was dishonest, unemployable and had a host of character flaws which plagued my life.
After the spiritual awakening that occurred EVERYTHING in my life changed. The people who knew me before hardly recognize me now. My new friends in faith find it hard to believe that I was what I once was.
I'm not comfortable going further then that because in the kingdom of heaven we don't brag, Jesus practiced “don not let the left hand know what the right is doing”. In other worlds, if we are righteous, we are self forgetful about it. We aren’t like the Pharisees who needed to publically advertise every time they bestowed alms on someone or did a “good deed”.
Quote What was enhanced when you came across the Urantia Book? The UB answered soooooo many questions that I had about God, life, evolution, origin, destiny, faith, meaning, value, truth, the universe and on and on.
We now know why the earth appears to be 4.8 billion years old, why life exploded onto the scene 550,000,000 years ago. We know what happened to the world, to Lucifer and Satan, and the “prince of this world”. Pre Adamic history, Who Adam and Eve were and how Cain found a wife in Nod. The garden of Eden, Dilmun in the Persian Gulf, human migration world wide, plate tectonics, life after death, Who Jesus was, the Trinity, Triunity, and Triodity, Paradice and much more.
Colter
I didn't take your story as any form of bragging because it is a testimony.So you didn't believe you had enough info or were you just that hungry to know more about God?
If you simply were tht hungry to know things about God, are you still that hungry?
If so you should consider reading the Quran even if it's to look up topics during a discussion because it is better to understand than to simply assume, right?
Quote I didn't take your story as any form of bragging because it is a testimony. So you didn't believe you had enough info or were you just that hungry to know more about God?
If you simply were tht hungry to know things about God, are you still that hungry?
If so you should consider reading the Quran even if it's to look up topics during a discussion because it is better to understand than to simply assume, right?
The UB is from Christ Michael, who is Lord and God, it is the 5th epochal revelation to our world. Muhammad didn't understand Jesus, he did not believe in the resurrection. The Muslims were also influenced by the corrupt Old Testament writings of the Jews who had wrong ideas about a Jewish Messiah, a priest/prophet/king who would take up the seat of David and run the world from Israel.
So those Jewish converts who believed in Jesus as Messiah, who did not realize the kingdom is spiritual, who still clung to the old wrong ideas of the Jews, they came up with a new wrong idea to fit the old failed expectations; that Jesus would “soon return” as Messiah and THEN start the Israel party again.
Jesus didn't do anything the Jewish Messiah was expected to do. Israel was dead for 2,000 years and only exists today as a museum to the failed expectations of an arrogant, self important, fictional race of people. After the terrible things that occurred to the Jews in WWII, sympathetic Western nations sought to return the Zionist to their homeland. Misinformed Christians saw this as proof of the return of an ill-conceived Messiah.
The Kingdom of heaven is spiritual, it is present, it is for all mankind, not one chosen people and it’s adopted children.
As for Muhammad I think he had great spiritual insights, he was a leader to his people, but Islam is an evolved religion like so many others. As it further attempts to overtake the truth of Jesus the Christ, it's going to get very messy on this world.
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 08 2013,22:09) Quote I didn't take your story as any form of bragging because it is a testimony. So you didn't believe you had enough info or were you just that hungry to know more about God?
If you simply were tht hungry to know things about God, are you still that hungry?
If so you should consider reading the Quran even if it's to look up topics during a discussion because it is better to understand than to simply assume, right?
The UB is from Christ Michael, who is Lord and God, it is the 5th epochal revelation to our world. Muhammad didn't understand Jesus, he did not believe in the resurrection. The Muslims were also influenced by the corrupt Old Testament writings of the Jews who had wrong ideas about a Jewish Messiah, a priest/prophet/king who would take up the seat of David and run the world from Israel.
So those Jewish converts who believed in Jesus as Messiah, who did not realize the kingdom is spiritual, who still clung to the old wrong ideas of the Jews, they came up with a new wrong idea to fit the old failed expectations; that Jesus would “soon return” as Messiah and THEN start the Israel party again.
Jesus didn't do anything the Jewish Messiah was expected to do. Israel was dead for 2,000 years and only exists today as a museum to the failed expectations of an arrogant, self important, fictional race of people. After the terrible things that occurred to the Jews in WWII, sympathetic Western nations sought to return the Zionist to their homeland. Misinformed Christians saw this as proof of the return of an ill-conceived Messiah.
The Kingdom of heaven is spiritual, it is present, it is for all mankind, not one chosen people and it’s adopted children.
As for Muhammad I think he had great spiritual insights, he was a leader to his people, but Islam is an evolved religion like so many others. As it further attempts to overtake the truth of Jesus the Christ, it's going to get very messy on this world.
Colter
Here's the thing colter, If the Urantia Book is valid it would not contain within totally wrong information, right?The Urantia Book says this:
Paper 82 – The Evolution of Marriage
… Old Testament deals with women as a form of property; the Koran teaches their inferiority. Man had the right to lend his wife to a friend …Paper 87 – The Ghost Cults
… from the evil eye.” (962.6) 87:5.5 The Koran contains a whole chapter devoted to the evil eye and magic spells, and …Both of these are completely wrong and can easily be shown to be wrong as neither is in th Quran so the question is does it mean anything to you when the Urantia Book is COMPLETELY wrong? This is what I am saying they didn't even take time to check to see if they were correct.
But look:
Paper 94 – The Melchizedek Teachings in the Orient
… way in northern India before the onslaught of a militant Islam with its clear-cut concept of Allah as the supreme God of the universe. … It became Brahmanized and later abjectly surrendered to Islam, while throughout much of the rest of the Orient it degenerated into a …(1051.4) 95:7.6 The strength of Islam has been its clear-cut and well-defined presentation of Allah as the one and only Deity; its weakness, the association of military force with its promulgation, together with its degradation of woman. But it has steadfastly held to its presentation of the One Universal Deity of all, “who knows the invisible and the visible. He is the merciful and the compassionate.” “Truly God is plenteous in goodness to all men.” “And when I am sick, it is he who heals me.” “For whenever as many as three speak together, God is present as a fourth,” for is he not “the first and the last, also the seen and the hidden”?
Now when you tak out the erroneous ideas such as the things Islam doesn't teach such as the degradation of women or Military force used as an offense the truth becomes clear. The Quran says this about fighting:
And fight in the Way of Allah those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allah likes not the transgressors.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #190)
Surah 9:36 The number of months in the sight of Allah is twelve (in a year)- so ordained by Him the day He created the heavens and the earth; of them four are sacred: that is the straight usage. So wrong not yourselves therein, and fight the Pagans all together as they fight you all together. But know that Allah is with those who restrain themselves.
No where does the urantia call Islam a backwards religion at least I didn't recall reading that can you show me that?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 08 2013,23:27) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 08 2013,22:09) Quote I didn't take your story as any form of bragging because it is a testimony. So you didn't believe you had enough info or were you just that hungry to know more about God?
If you simply were tht hungry to know things about God, are you still that hungry?
If so you should consider reading the Quran even if it's to look up topics during a discussion because it is better to understand than to simply assume, right?
The UB is from Christ Michael, who is Lord and God, it is the 5th epochal revelation to our world. Muhammad didn't understand Jesus, he did not believe in the resurrection. The Muslims were also influenced by the corrupt Old Testament writings of the Jews who had wrong ideas about a Jewish Messiah, a priest/prophet/king who would take up the seat of David and run the world from Israel.
So those Jewish converts who believed in Jesus as Messiah, who did not realize the kingdom is spiritual, who still clung to the old wrong ideas of the Jews, they came up with a new wrong idea to fit the old failed expectations; that Jesus would “soon return” as Messiah and THEN start the Israel party again.
Jesus didn't do anything the Jewish Messiah was expected to do. Israel was dead for 2,000 years and only exists today as a museum to the failed expectations of an arrogant, self important, fictional race of people. After the terrible things that occurred to the Jews in WWII, sympathetic Western nations sought to return the Zionist to their homeland. Misinformed Christians saw this as proof of the return of an ill-conceived Messiah.
The Kingdom of heaven is spiritual, it is present, it is for all mankind, not one chosen people and it’s adopted children.
As for Muhammad I think he had great spiritual insights, he was a leader to his people, but Islam is an evolved religion like so many others. As it further attempts to overtake the truth of Jesus the Christ, it's going to get very messy on this world.
Colter
Here's the thing colter, If the Urantia Book is valid it would not contain within totally wrong information, right?The Urantia Book says this:
Paper 82 – The Evolution of Marriage
… Old Testament deals with women as a form of property; the Koran teaches their inferiority. Man had the right to lend his wife to a friend …Paper 87 – The Ghost Cults
… from the evil eye.” (962.6) 87:5.5 The Koran contains a whole chapter devoted to the evil eye and magic spells, and …Both of these are completely wrong and can easily be shown to be wrong as neither is in th Quran so the question is does it mean anything to you when the Urantia Book is COMPLETELY wrong? This is what I am saying they didn't even take time to check to see if they were correct.
But look:
Paper 94 – The Melchizedek Teachings in the Orient
… way in northern India before the onslaught of a militant Islam with its clear-cut concept of Allah as the supreme God of the universe. … It became Brahmanized and later abjectly surrendered to Islam, while throughout much of the rest of the Orient it degenerated into a …(1051.4) 95:7.6 The strength of Islam has been its clear-cut and well-defined presentation of Allah as the one and only Deity; its weakness, the association of military force with its promulgation, together with its degradation of woman. But it has steadfastly held to its presentation of the One Universal Deity of all, “who knows the invisible and the visible. He is the merciful and the compassionate.” “Truly God is plenteous in goodness to all men.” “And when I am sick, it is he who heals me.” “For whenever as many as three speak together, God is present as a fourth,” for is he not “the first and the last, also the seen and the hidden”?
Now when you tak out the erroneous ideas such as the things Islam doesn't teach such as the degradation of women or Military force used as an offense the truth becomes clear. The Quran says this about fighting:
And fight in the Way of Allah those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allah likes not the transgressors.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #190)
Surah 9:36 The number of months in the sight of Allah is twelve (in a year)- so ordained by Him the day He created the heavens and the earth; of them four are sacred: that is the straight usage. So wrong not yourselves therein, and fight the Pagans all together as they fight you all together. But know that Allah is with those who restrain themselves.
No where does the urantia call Islam a backwards religion at least I didn't recall reading that can you show me that?
Many in your religion disagree with you:The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam
True the UB does not call Islam a backwards religion, sensitive and defensive Muslims are embraced by the behavior of a great many Muslims stuck in the 6th century.
Colter
(1011.17) 92:6.19 Islam is the religio-cultural connective of North Africa, the Levant, and southeastern Asia. It was Jewish theology in connection with the later Christian teachings that made Islam monotheistic. The followers of Mohammed stumbled at the advanced teachings of the Trinity; they could not comprehend the doctrine of three divine personalities and one Deity. It is always difficult to induce evolutionary minds suddenly to accept advanced revealed truth. Man is an evolutionary creature and in the main must get his religion by evolutionary techniques.
Ironic because the book of Urantia clearly says this:
(65.3) 5:3.1 Though the Paradise Deities, from the universe standpoint, are as one, in their spiritual relations with such beings as inhabit Urantia they are also three distinct and separate persons. There is a difference between the Godheads in the matter of personal appeals, communion, and other intimate relations. In the highest sense, we worship the Universal Father and him only. True, we can and do worship the Father as he is manifested in his Creator Sons, but it is the Father, directly or indirectly, who is worshiped and adored.
This points out clearly that Islam Worships God in the HIGHEST SENSE and with tha being made clear to you why would you not understand to Worship in less than the highest sense is to shirk from the truest form of Worship.
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,00:26) Many in your religion disagree with you: The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam
True the UB does not call Islam a backwards religion, sensitive and defensive Muslims are embraced by the behavior of a great many Muslims stuck in the 6th century.
Colter
The only verse in the Quran that was on that page was the verse below Surah 68 Verse 51Surah 68
50 Then his Lord chose him and made him of the righteous.
51 And verily, those who disbelieve would almost make you slip with their eyes (through hatred) when they hear the Reminder (the Qur'an), and they say: “Verily, he (Muhammad صلى الله عليه وسلم) is a madman!”
This is not in reference to any special “evil eye”
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,00:26) The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam Colter
This is why I asked you to read the Quran for your self, because this link is extremely misleading:Indeed, the Muslim men and Muslim women, the believing men and believing women, the obedient men and obedient women, the truthful men and truthful women, the patient men and patient women, the humble men and humble women, the charitable men and charitable women, the fasting men and fasting women, the men who guard their private parts and the women who do so, and the men who remember Allah often and the women who do so – for them Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward.
( سورة الأحزاب , Al-Ahzab, Chapter #33, Verse #35)
The believing men and believing women are allies of one another. They enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong and establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Those – Allah will have mercy upon them. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.
( سورة التوبة , At-Taubah, Chapter #9, Verse #71)
Indeed, those who [falsely] accuse chaste, unaware and believing women are cursed in this world and the Hereafter; and they will have a great punishment
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #23)
and those who accuse chaste women and then do not produce four witnesses – lash them with eighty lashes and do not accept from them testimony ever after. and those are the defiantly disobedient,
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #4)
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2013,01:02) (1011.17) 92:6.19 Islam is the religio-cultural connective of North Africa, the Levant, and southeastern Asia. It was Jewish theology in connection with the later Christian teachings that made Islam monotheistic. The followers of Mohammed stumbled at the advanced teachings of the Trinity; they could not comprehend the doctrine of three divine personalities and one Deity. It is always difficult to induce evolutionary minds suddenly to accept advanced revealed truth. Man is an evolutionary creature and in the main must get his religion by evolutionary techniques. Ironic because the book of Urantia clearly says this:
(65.3) 5:3.1 Though the Paradise Deities, from the universe standpoint, are as one, in their spiritual relations with such beings as inhabit Urantia they are also three distinct and separate persons. There is a difference between the Godheads in the matter of personal appeals, communion, and other intimate relations. In the highest sense, we worship the Universal Father and him only. True, we can and do worship the Father as he is manifested in his Creator Sons, but it is the Father, directly or indirectly, who is worshiped and adored.
This points out clearly that Islam Worships God in the HIGHEST SENSE and with tha being made clear to you why would you not understand to Worship in less than the highest sense is to shirk from the truest form of Worship.
I never said that Muslims don't worship God in the highest sense or that a sincere, believing Muslim, would not be saved.Only that Muslims reject the divinity of the Son, the resurrection of the Son and his rightful office.
Colter
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2013,01:21) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,00:26) The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam Colter
This is why I asked you to read the Quran for your self, because this link is extremely misleading:Indeed, the Muslim men and Muslim women, the believing men and believing women, the obedient men and obedient women, the truthful men and truthful women, the patient men and patient women, the humble men and humble women, the charitable men and charitable women, the fasting men and fasting women, the men who guard their private parts and the women who do so, and the men who remember Allah often and the women who do so – for them Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward.
( سورة الأحزاب , Al-Ahzab, Chapter #33, Verse #35)
The believing men and believing women are allies of one another. They enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong and establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Those – Allah will have mercy upon them. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.
( سورة التوبة , At-Taubah, Chapter #9, Verse #71)
Indeed, those who [falsely] accuse chaste, unaware and believing women are cursed in this world and the Hereafter; and they will have a great punishment
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #23)
and those who accuse chaste women and then do not produce four witnesses – lash them with eighty lashes and do not accept from them testimony ever after. and those are the defiantly disobedient,
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #4)
I have a Koran, these facts aren’t new to me, and the modern world has witnesses all to much of Islam and it's 6th century treatment of women. Muslims are dishonest about the full extent of what is in the Koran, they tend to focus on the positive when challenged. I knew you would do that, they all do.What does the Koran say about women?
Tuesday, 16 August 2011 15:43 Acharya S Contributing Writers – Acharya S/D.M. Murdock
Following are pertinent quotes from the Koran/Quran regarding women, from the Dawood translation with the side-by-side Arabic. Below is also a summary of the koranic view of women, as well as relevant videos by Muslim authorities, expressing a very typical attitude towards women. Please note that millions of children worldwide are forced to learn these koranic scriptures by memory. Note also that women are likewise repeatedly addressed in the hadiths or Islamic sayings and deeds of the Muslim prophet Mohammed/Muhammad. The various hadiths that are supposed to be followed by Muslims are called “sunnah.”
Women in the Koran
“They ask you about menstruation. Say: 'It is an indisposition. Keep aloof from women during their menstrual periods and do not approach them until they are clean again; when they are clean, have intercourse with them whence God enjoined you….'” Quran 2:222, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Women are your fields: go, then, into your fields whence you please.” Quran 2:223, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and forsake them in beds apart, and beat them.” Quran 4:34, “Women,” Dawood, p. 83
“A male shall inherit twice as much as a female.” Quran 4:11, “Women,” Dawood, p. 77
“Call in two male witnesses from among you, but if two men cannot be found, then one man and two women whom you judge fit to act as witnesses…” Quran 2:282, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 47
“Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women.” Quran 2:228, Dawood, p. 35
“If you fear that you cannot treat [orphan girls] with fairness, then you may marry other women who seem good to you: two, three, or four of them. But if you fear that you cannot maintain equality among them, marry one only or any slave-girl you may own.” Quran 4:3, “Women,” Dawood, p. 76
“If you are in doubt concerning those of your wives who have ceased menstruating, know that their waiting period shall be three months. The same shall apply to those [of your wives] who have not yet menstruated.” Quran 65:4, “Divorce,” Dawood, p. 557 [Dawood notes: “On account of their young age. Child marriages were common.”]
“[Forbidden to you are] married women, except those whom you own as slaves.” Quran 4:24, “Women,” Dawood, p. 81
“You shall not wed pagan women, unless they embrace the Faith. A believing slave-girl is better than an idolatress, although she may please you. Nor shall you wed idolaters, unless they embrace the Faith.” Quran 2:221, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34.
“Enjoin believing women to turn their eyes away from temptation and to preserve their chastity; not to display their adornments (except such as are normally revealed); to draw their veils over their bosoms and not to display their finery except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their step-sons, their brothers, their brothers' sons, their sisters' sons, their women-servants, and their slave-girls; male attendants lacking in natural vigour, and children who have no carnal knowledge of women. And let them not stamp their feet when walking so as to reveal their hidden trinkets.” Quran 24:31, “Light,” Dawood, p. 352
“Wives of the Prophet, you are not like other women. If you fear God, do not be too complaisant in your speech, lest the lecherous-hearted should lust after you. Show discretion in what you say. Stay in your homes and do not display your finery as women used to in the days of ignorance.” Quran 33:32-3, Dawood, p. 421 [The “days of ignorance” refer to pre-Islamic times.]
Summary of Koranic quotes regarding women
Menstruating women are unclean, and men must stay away from them. Women are men's “fields,” and men can have sex with them whenever they want. Men are superior to women and have authority over them, while women must obey men or risk being beaten. A woman is worth one-half of a man, and men are above women. Muslim men may marry up to four wives, including prepubescent girls, and can own sex slaves. Muslims are not allowed to marry non-Muslims, unless the latter convert to Islam. Women must cover themselves and be seen only by relatives, eunuchs, slaves and children who have not yet had sex with women.”
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,04:05) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2013,01:21) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,00:26) The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam Colter
This is why I asked you to read the Quran for your self, because this link is extremely misleading:Indeed, the Muslim men and Muslim women, the believing men and believing women, the obedient men and obedient women, the truthful men and truthful women, the patient men and patient women, the humble men and humble women, the charitable men and charitable women, the fasting men and fasting women, the men who guard their private parts and the women who do so, and the men who remember Allah often and the women who do so – for them Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward.
( سورة الأحزاب , Al-Ahzab, Chapter #33, Verse #35)
The believing men and believing women are allies of one another. They enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong and establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Those – Allah will have mercy upon them. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.
( سورة التوبة , At-Taubah, Chapter #9, Verse #71)
Indeed, those who [falsely] accuse chaste, unaware and believing women are cursed in this world and the Hereafter; and they will have a great punishment
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #23)
and those who accuse chaste women and then do not produce four witnesses – lash them with eighty lashes and do not accept from them testimony ever after. and those are the defiantly disobedient,
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #4)
I have a Koran, these facts aren’t new to me, and the modern world has witnesses all to much of Islam and it's 6th century treatment of women. Muslims are dishonest about the full extent of what is in the Koran, they tend to focus on the positive when challenged. I knew you would do that, they all do.What does the Koran say about women?
Tuesday, 16 August 2011 15:43 Acharya S Contributing Writers – Acharya S/D.M. Murdock
Following are pertinent quotes from the Koran/Quran regarding women, from the Dawood translation with the side-by-side Arabic. Below is also a summary of the koranic view of women, as well as relevant videos by Muslim authorities, expressing a very typical attitude towards women. Please note that millions of children worldwide are forced to learn these koranic scriptures by memory. Note also that women are likewise repeatedly addressed in the hadiths or Islamic sayings and deeds of the Muslim prophet Mohammed/Muhammad. The various hadiths that are supposed to be followed by Muslims are called “sunnah.”
Women in the Koran
“They ask you about menstruation. Say: 'It is an indisposition. Keep aloof from women during their menstrual periods and do not approach them until they are clean again; when they are clean, have intercourse with them whence God enjoined you….'” Quran 2:222, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Women are your fields: go, then, into your fields whence you please.” Quran 2:223, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and forsake them in beds apart, and beat them.” Quran 4:34, “Women,” Dawood, p. 83
“A male shall inherit twice as much as a female.” Quran 4:11, “Women,” Dawood, p. 77
“Call in two male witnesses from among you, but if two men cannot be found, then one man and two women whom you judge fit to act as witnesses…” Quran 2:282, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 47
“Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women.” Quran 2:228, Dawood, p. 35
“If you fear that you cannot treat [orphan girls] with fairness, then you may marry other women who seem good to you: two, three, or four of them. But if you fear that you cannot maintain equality among them, marry one only or any slave-girl you may own.” Quran 4:3, “Women,” Dawood, p. 76
“If you are in doubt concerning those of your wives who have ceased menstruating, know that their waiting period shall be three months. The same shall apply to those [of your wives] who have not yet menstruated.” Quran 65:4, “Divorce,” Dawood, p. 557 [Dawood notes: “On account of their young age. Child marriages were common.”]
“[Forbidden to you are] married women, except those whom you own as slaves.” Quran 4:24, “Women,” Dawood, p. 81
“You shall not wed pagan women, unless they embrace the Faith. A believing slave-girl is better than an idolatress, although she may please you. Nor shall you wed idolaters, unless they embrace the Faith.” Quran 2:221, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34.
“Enjoin believing women to turn their eyes away from temptation and to preserve their chastity; not to display their adornments (except such as are normally revealed); to draw their veils over their bosoms and not to display their finery except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their step-sons, their brothers, their brothers' sons, their sisters' sons, their women-servants, and their slave-girls; male attendants lacking in natural vigour, and children who have no carnal knowledge of women. And let them not stamp their feet when walking so as to reveal their hidden trinkets.” Quran 24:31, “Light,” Dawood, p. 352
“Wives of the Prophet, you are not like other women. If you fear God, do not be too complaisant in your speech, lest the lecherous-hearted should lust after you. Show discretion in what you say. Stay in your homes and do not display your finery as women used to in the days of ignorance.” Quran 33:32-3, Dawood, p. 421 [The “days of ignorance” refer to pre-Islamic times.]
Summary of Koranic quotes regarding women
Menstruating women are unclean, and men must stay away from them. Women are men's “fields,” and men can have sex with them whenever they want. Men are superior to women and have authority over them, while women must obey men or risk being beaten. A woman is worth one-half of a man, and men are above women. Muslim men may marry up to four wives, including prepubescent girls, and can own sex slaves. Muslims are not allowed to marry non-Muslims, unless the latter convert to Islam. Women must cover themselves and be seen only by relatives, eunuchs, slaves and children who have not yet had sex with women.”
Colter
As I said before you are certainly not understanding these versesRegarding mentruation obviously it is unclean to have sex during that time, their body is cleansing itself andmost women are having cramps and feel very uncomfortable and messy this is what th verse means. Other than that of course you can make love to your wife when you w
ant thisdoes not mean aganst her will as you seem to suggest.There are no “sex slaves” so once again you misunderstand
Covering your private parts is not degrading it is modesty. how do you consider a woman not showing her breast, but and vagina degrading?
In regards to values:
Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property). As to those women on whose part you see ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #34)
The Urantia book:
(937.1) 84:5.4 But man did not consciously nor intentionally seize woman’s rights and then gradually and grudgingly give them back to her; all this was an unconscious and unplanned episode of social evolution. When the time really came for woman to enjoy added rights, she got them, and all quite regardless of man’s conscious attitude. Slowly but surely the mores change so as to provide for those social adjustments which are a part of the persistent evolution of civilization. The advancing mores slowly provided increasingly better treatment for females; those tribes which persisted in cruelty to them did not survive.
This is proof that there i no cruelty or degradation sponsored by The Quran or in Islam but those who like the Taliban or cultural offshoots in somecountries do in-fact do not survive. Islam is thriving
(938.1) 84:5.11 Woman is man’s equal partner in race reproduction, hence just as important in the unfolding of racial evolution; therefore has evolution increasingly worked toward the realization of women’s rights. But women’s rights are by no means men’s rights. Woman cannot thrive on man’s rights any more than man can prosper on woman’s rights.
The Quran:
And for women are rights over men similar to those of men over women.” [Noble Quran 2:228]
Urantia book
(938.3) 84:5.13 Civilization never can obliterate the behavior gulf between the sexes. From age to age the mores change, but instinct never. Innate maternal affection will never permit emancipated woman to become man’s serious rival in industry. Forever each sex will remain supreme in its own domain, domains determined by biologic differentiation and by mental dissimilarity.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2013,05:14) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,04:05) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2013,01:21) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 09 2013,00:26) The degradation of women in the Koran/Islam Colter
This is why I asked you to read the Quran for your self, because this link is extremely misleading:Indeed, the Muslim men and Muslim women, the believing men and believing women, the obedient men and obedient women, the truthful men and truthful women, the patient men and patient women, the humble men and humble women, the charitable men and charitable women, the fasting men and fasting women, the men who guard their private parts and the women who do so, and the men who remember Allah often and the women who do so – for them Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward.
( سورة الأحزاب , Al-Ahzab, Chapter #33, Verse #35)
The believing men and believing women are allies of one another. They enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong and establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Those – Allah will have mercy upon them. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.
( سورة التوبة , At-Taubah, Chapter #9, Verse #71)
Indeed, those who [falsely] accuse chaste, unaware and believing women are cursed in this world and the Hereafter; and they will have a great punishment
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #23)
and those who accuse chaste women and then do not produce four witnesses – lash them with eighty lashes and do not accept from them testimony ever after. and those are the defiantly disobedient,
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #4)
I have a Koran, these facts aren’t new to me, and the modern world has witnesses all to much of Islam and it's 6th century treatment of women. Muslims are dishonest about the full extent of what is in the Koran, they tend to focus on the positive when challenged. I knew you would do that, they all do.What does the Koran say about women?
Tuesday, 16 August 2011 15:43 Acharya S Contributing Writers – Acharya S/D.M. Murdock
Following are pertinent quotes from the Koran/Quran regarding women, from the Dawood translation with the side-by-side Arabic. Below is also a summary of the koranic view of women, as well as relevant videos by Muslim authorities, expressing a very typical attitude towards women. Please note that millions of children worldwide are forced to learn these koranic scriptures by memory. Note also that women are likewise repeatedly addressed in the hadiths or Islamic sayings and deeds of the Muslim prophet Mohammed/Muhammad. The various hadiths that are supposed to be followed by Muslims are called “sunnah.”
Women in the Koran
“They ask you about menstruation. Say: 'It is an indisposition. Keep aloof from women during their menstrual periods and do not approach them until they are clean again; when they are clean, have intercourse with them whence God enjoined you….'” Quran 2:222, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Women are your fields: go, then, into your fields whence you please.” Quran 2:223, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34
“Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and forsake them in beds apart, and beat them.” Quran 4:34, “Women,” Dawood, p. 83
“A male shall inherit twice as much as a female.” Quran 4:11, “Women,” Dawood, p. 77
“Call in two male witnesses from among you, but if two men cannot be found, then one man and two women whom you judge fit to act as witnesses…” Quran 2:282, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 47
“Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women.” Quran 2:228, Dawood, p. 35
“If you fear that you cannot treat [orphan girls] with fairness, then you may marry other women who seem good to you: two, three, or four of them. But if you fear that you cannot maintain equality among them, marry one only or any slave-girl you may own.” Quran 4:3, “Women,” Dawood, p. 76
“If you are in doubt concerning those of your wives who have ceased menstruating, know that their waiting period shall be three months. The same shall apply to those [of your wives] who have not yet menstruated.” Quran 65:4, “Divorce,” Dawood, p. 557 [Dawood notes: “On account of their young age. Child marriages were common.”]
“[Forbidden to you are] married women, except those whom you own as slaves.” Quran 4:24, “Women,” Dawood, p. 81
“You shall not wed pagan women, unless they embrace the Faith. A believing slave-girl is better than an idolatress, although she may please you. Nor shall you wed idolaters, unless they embrace the Faith.” Quran 2:221, “The Cow,” Dawood, p. 34.
“Enjoin believing women to turn their eyes away from temptation and to preserve their chastity; not to display their adornments (except such as are normally revealed); to draw their veils over their bosoms and not to display their finery except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands' fathers, their sons, their step-sons, their brothers, their brothers' sons, their sisters' sons, their women-servants, and their slave-girls; male attendants lacking in natural vigour, and children who have no carnal knowledge of women. And let them not stamp their feet when walking so as to reveal their hidden trinkets.” Quran 24:31, “Light,” Dawood, p. 352
“Wives of the Prophet, you are not like other women. If you fear God, do not be too complaisant in your speech, lest the lecherous-hearted should lust after you. Show discretion in what you say. Stay in your homes and do not display your finery as women used to in the days of ignorance.” Quran 33:32-3, Dawood, p. 421 [The “days of ignorance” refer to pre-Islamic times.]
Summary of Koranic quotes regarding women
Menstruating women are unclean, and men must stay away from them. Women are men's “fields,” and men can have sex with them whenever they want. Men are superior to women and have authority over them, while women must obey men or risk being beaten. A woman is worth one-half of a man, and men are above women. Muslim men may marry up to four wives, including prepubescent girls, and can own sex slaves. Muslims are not allowed to marry non-Muslims, unless the latter convert to Islam. Women must cover themselves and be seen only by relatives, eunuchs, slaves and children who have not yet had sex with women.”
Colter
As I said before you are certainly not understanding these versesRegarding mentruation obviously it is unclean to have sex during that time
, their body is cleansing itself andmost women are having cramps and feel very uncomfortable and messy this is what th verse means. Other than that of course you can make love to your wife when you want thisdoes not mean aganst her will as you seem to suggest.There are no “sex slaves” so once again you misunderstand
Covering your private parts is not degrading it is modesty. how do you consider a woman not showing her breast, but and vagina degrading?
In regards to values:
Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property). As to those women on whose part you see ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #34)
The Urantia book:
(937.1) 84:5.4 But man did not consciously nor intentionally seize woman’s rights and then gradually and grudgingly give them back to her; all this was an unconscious and unplanned episode of social evolution. When the time really came for woman to enjoy added rights, she got them, and all quite regardless of man’s conscious attitude. Slowly but surely the mores change so as to provide for those social adjustments which are a part of the persistent evolution of civilization. The advancing mores slowly provided increasingly better treatment for females; those tribes which persisted in cruelty to them did not survive.
This is proof that there i no cruelty or degradation sponsored by The Quran or in Islam but those who like the Taliban or cultural offshoots in somecountries do in-fact do not survive. Islam is thriving
(938.1) 84:5.11 Woman is man’s equal partner in race reproduction, hence just as important in the unfolding of racial evolution; therefore has evolution increasingly worked toward the realization of women’s rights. But women’s rights are by no means men’s rights. Woman cannot thrive on man’s rights any more than man can prosper on woman’s rights.
The Quran:
And for women are rights over men similar to those of men over women.” [Noble Quran 2:228]
Urantia book
(938.3) 84:5.13 Civilization never can obliterate the behavior gulf between the sexes. From age to age the mores change, but instinct never. Innate maternal affection will never permit emancipated woman to become man’s serious rival in industry. Forever each sex will remain supreme in its own domain, domains determined by biologic differentiation and by mental dissimilarity.
You are either intellectually dishonest or stupid? The Koran teaches how to treat “slave girls”. This presupposes that Muslims had them
——->”[Forbidden to you are] married women, except those whom you own as slaves.”<——–
49:4.4 ….. Sex equality prevails on all advanced worlds; male and female are equal in mind endowment and spiritual status. We do not regard a planet as having emerged from barbarism so long as one sex seeks to tyrannize over the other. This feature of creature experience is always greatly improved after the arrival of a Material Son and Daughter.
52:2.7 ….On some planets the male may rule the female; on others the reverse prevails. During this age normal worlds establish full equality of the sexes, this being preliminary to the fuller realization of the ideals of home life. This is the dawn of the golden age of the home. The idea of tribal rule gradually gives way to the dual concept of national life and family life.
Caino
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