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Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 07 2008,14:01) Hi tow,
You will see these thing happen if you are welcomed into the millenial kingdom of Jesus Christ.
The lion will lie down with the lamb and the infant will play in the asp's lair.
But you will need to repent and be born again.
Hey, did you note that the lion and the lamb thing is taken from Tanakh? Before Jesus, and speaking of the messianic age. And notice also that the same passages speak of gathering the Jews, not the Gentiles. Also, in Isa 65, it speaks of a new heaven and new earth, which Rev 21 says comes at the end.Su much for the millenial kingdom.
Hi tow,
Isaiah was addressing the chosen people and a remnant, a residue of them will see the time of Christ. The gentiles were not being addressed.
First the earth has to be restored to order without the destructive influence of Satan during the 1000 year reign. There will still be natural men living then as well as the sons of God in their heavenly bodies ruling with Christ[1Cor12, 2 Tim2.11f]
Then there will be a rebellion as shown in Ps 2 and Rev 20 when Satan is released and those dregs of humanity still influenced by sin will be destroyed.
Then there is the second resurrection of natural men and their judgement.
Then the new purified earth will welcome the fulness of Kingdom of God among men.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 07 2008,14:35) Hi tow,
Isaiah was addressing the chosen people and a remnant, a residue of them will see the time of Christ. The gentiles were not being addressed.A chosen people AND a remnant?
Quote First the earth has to be restored to order without the destructive influence of Satan during the 1000 year reign. There will still be natural men living then as well as the sons of God in their heavenly bodies ruling with Christ[1Cor12, 2 Tim2.11f] So the messianic age is just a temporary thing? Shame on G-d for telling the Jews all those years that the messianic age was the world to come.
Quote Then there will be a rebellion as shown in Ps 2 and Rev 20 when Satan is released and those dregs of humanity still influenced by sin will be destroyed. Hey, didn't they make a movie out of this? Cool that these dregs will be destroyed. Christians are all about destroying sinners. Society won't let them kill sinners any more (its illegal) but one day they'll get to see sinners die again!
I know you are looking forward to that.
Quote Then there is the second resurrection of natural men and their judgement.
Then the new purified earth will welcome the fulness of Kingdom of God among men.
So there will be two new heavens and earths? The first one of the messianic age, and the last one in Rev 21? Man, your god has to do it three times to get it right.Hi tow,
Read again
“and a remnant, a residue “
Indeed the millenial kingdom is a temporary affair, it lasts a mere seventh day of rest[Heb 4], a thousand year time of peace and restoration. At the end of this time the fire from heaven will come down and destroy the nations arraigned against God and His Son on the seat of David in Jerusalem and they will be destroyed.Rev 20
1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Then the kingdom will be handed back to God.
1Cor 15
22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
There is no new heaven and earth at the second coming of Christ but the battered earth and it's survivors, after the time of tribulation, will be the same as now.
Then what is this new heaven and new earth in Isa 65? Just a farce? I thought you believed in your OT?
Hi Tow,
Is 65
1I am sought of them that asked not for me; I am found of them that sought me not: I said, Behold me, behold me, unto a nation that was not called by my name.2I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people, which walketh in a way that was not good, after their own thoughts;
3A people that provoketh me to anger continually to my face; that sacrificeth in gardens, and burneth incense upon altars of brick;
4Which remain among the graves, and lodge in the monuments, which eat swine's flesh, and broth of abominable things is in their vessels;
5Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.
6Behold, it is written before me: I will not keep silence, but will recompense, even recompense into their bosom,
7Your iniquities, and the iniquities of your fathers together, saith the LORD, which have burned incense upon the mountains, and blasphemed me upon the hills: therefore will I measure their former work into their bosom.
8Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.
9And I will bring forth a seed out of Jacob, and out of Judah an inheritor of my mountains: and mine elect shall inherit it, and my servants shall dwell there.
10And Sharon shall be a fold of flocks, and the valley of Achor a place for the herds to lie down in, for my people that have sought me.
11But ye are they that forsake the LORD, that forget my holy mountain, that prepare a table for that troop, and that furnish the drink offering unto that number.
12Therefore will I number you to the sword, and ye shall all bow down to the slaughter: because when I called, ye did not answer; when I spake, ye did not hear; but did evil before mine eyes, and did choose that wherein I delighted not.
13Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, my servants shall eat, but ye shall be hungry: behold, my servants shall drink, but ye shall be thirsty: behold, my servants shall rejoice, but ye shall be ashamed:
14Behold, my servants shall sing for joy of heart, but ye shall cry for sorrow of heart, and shall howl for vexation of spirit.
15And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord GOD shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name:
16That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.
17For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
18But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
19And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
20There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
21And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
22They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
23They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.
24And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.
25The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.
It is true in prophecy both as a new relationship between God and His people without the curses in effect and also it is true as a reflection of the new heavens and earth of Rev21. Would you prescribe the detail of wisdom of God?
So just as the GT says the Torah is old and outdated, merely a shadow, the new heaven and new earth is but a reflection, a poor replica, of the same in Rev 21? You surely like to rob the Tanakh, and also the Jews, of their whole future.
So what IS the new heaven and new earth in Isa 65 then Nick? Are you staying with the idea that it is merely a reflection?
Hi tow,
What do you think?
Do you believe this morsel of the OT?It can mean both in my opinion.
It is truthNo, it can't mean both. Its either/or. And what I believe is not relevant. You say you believe in OT> 100% so it is you who has to come up with an answer.
Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 08 2008,08:32) No, it can't mean both. Its either/or. And what I believe is not relevant. You say you believe in OT> 100% so it is you who has to come up with an answer.
Hi tow,
Are you a prophet to discern for us the wisdom of God?
You have said you are not but now define the meanings?
I do not understand.I know you don't understand. That is because you choose not to understand. Its part of “blind faith”.
Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 08 2008,08:32) No, it can't mean both. Its either/or. And what I believe is not relevant. You say you believe in OT> 100% so it is you who has to come up with an answer.
Hi tow,
Is your approach to scripture always EITHER | OR?If it is you will miss a lot of truth in ALSO | AND.
You will never see the Two comings of the Son of God, the Christ.
You will also miss the many early and late fulfillments in scripture such as you showed with ps 2.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 07 2008,15:43) Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 08 2008,08:32) No, it can't mean both. Its either/or. And what I believe is not relevant. You say you believe in OT> 100% so it is you who has to come up with an answer.
Hi tow,
Is your approach to scripture always EITHER | OR?Yes, contradictions must be reconciled. Either/or.
Quote If it is you will miss a lot of truth in ALSO | AND. Not when they are different.
Quote You will never see the Two comings of the Son of God, the Christ. You are right. And neither will you. Now we're even.
Quote You will also miss the many early and late fulfillments in scripture such as you showed with ps 2.
Psalm 2 already happened in the days of King David. I wasn't there however. Were you?Hi Tow,
The NT does not disagree with The OT.
It enlarges and explains it.So far you have had no problem ditching it when it disagrees with you.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 07 2008,18:18) Hi Tow,
The NT does not disagree with The OT.
It enlarges and explains it.Show me. Seriously. All you ever supply is conjecture and opinion. Show me you know the book you worship.
Quote So far you have had no problem ditching it when it disagrees with you.
And you have no problem with disagreeing with historians who record Christians killing Jews and even other Christians, all in the name of their god.Seriously, why is what I do less acceptable than what you do?
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