The most high god

[KangarooJack]

Quote (JustAskin @ Feb. 19 2010,07:38)

Nick, Its no good – TT is so far gone he is like drunk man, inebriated beyond sentient responsibility. Even his co-trini, WJ, despairs at him!

JA,

I want you to reply to this which I posted earlier today:

JA said:

Quote

He that gives it can also take back (if it where to come to that but it won't because Jesus is the perfect executor) so, the Rulership is never 'truly' Jesus' as a finality.

TO ALL:

How utterly misguided and silly! God can take the kingdom back from Jesus no more than He can break a covenant. The only legal way God could take the kingdom back is if Jesus would sin. Since Jesus will never sin God cannot legally take back the kingdom. But Jesus can give it back of His own volition.

God made a covenant with Israel and they disobeyed. Their disobedience gave God the legal right to take the kingdom from them which He did. Jesus said, “The kingdom shall be taken from you and given to a nation bearing fruits” (Matthew 21).

Now Jesus Himself is the Head over that nation that bears fruits. So if Christ does not sin, then the only legal way the Father can get the kingdom from Him is if Jesus willingly gives it up.

JA does not understand the first thing about God's covenant dealings with men. He is totally ignorant on the subject.

And, oh, let's not forget that if the Father steals back the kingdom from our Head, then He steals it back from us too.  JA probably hasn't thought of this. This is because he is not in our league for his comments reflect his puny view of the fatherhood of God.

thinker

[KangarooJack]

Quote (JustAskin @ Feb. 19 2010,07:41)

TT, “God cannot take the kingdom from Jesus if He does not sin. The only way that God can get the kingdom back is if Jesus yields it to the Father of His own volition.” How much have you drunk today? WJ, please come and remove your drunk pal before he does even more damage to himself by saying even more profane things………….

So God is a covenant breaker?

thinker

[Elizabeth]

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,07:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 18 2010,14:39) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,13:49) Oh Keith, You might not see it proven in scriptures to satisfy the one who has been blinded (I'm not implying anyone here), but it certainly can be backed by scriptures. Kathi Really? Where? Just give me ONE scripture that “unambiguously” is proof that Jesus the Word that was with God and was God had a biggining! Just “One” scripture Kathi! Blessings WJ Keith, Here, you can see that the Lord is a Son and that Son was in the beginning and His years will never come to an end.  A being is not a son unless they had a beginning and they came from another of the same kind.  Note that the Son did this.  It doesn't say that He was just an “it” or the word when he did this.  He is being referred to as the person that was in the beginning yet that person is a son.  Children understand that son's come from someone else and are like the someone else but they are not the one that they are from. Quote Hebrews 1:8 but of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,   and a righteous scepter is the scepter of your kingdom. 1:9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness. So God, your God, has anointed you over your companions with the oil of rejoicing.”   1:10 And, “You founded the earth in the beginning, Lord,   and the heavens are the works of your hands. 1:11 They will perish, but you continue. And they will all grow old like a garment, 1:12 and like a robe you will fold them up and like a garment they will be changed, but you are the same and your years will never run out.” Remember that the verbs in v. 10 are in the active voice and the subject of the passage is “the Son.” Kathi

You are so right.  Jesus had a beginning and did not always existed.  Therefore we know that He our Heavenly Father is above all and it is His Holy Spirit that dwells in all of us, and because of it, we can understand the things of God.  And we have Scriptures to proof it too.
Col. 1:15-17 and Rev. 3:14
and by Jesus own words He said in
John 14:28 .. my Father is greater then I.
John 17:5 “And now O Father glorify Me together with Yourself with the glory I had with you before the World was.  Here we see that He did existed before He became flesh along with John 1:1
Peace and Love Irene

[NickHassan]

Hi TT,
All intellectual theory as if you do not KNOW God.
You should by now.

Perhaps if you stopped thinking for a mo and listened you may hear Him calling

[Lightenup]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 18 2010,15:20)

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,15:07) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,13:55) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,04:45) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,12:38) Kathi said: Quote If some young man said that he was the son of the king, he would be making himself out to be equal to royalty, but he would not be saying that he was equal to the king.  The son and the king are both equal to being royalty, but not equally king.  Get it Then why did Jesus ride into Jerusalem as Israel's King as prophecy foretold? thinker Thinker, Jesus is a king but not a king who is the source of everything in existence like the Father.  Jesus will never be the king who was the source of everything in existence. Kathi, Jesus was THE King of Israel. And He is indeed the source of everything like His own Father: “and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him” Hebrews 5:9 and, “For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself” John 5:26 I once thought that this was speaking about Christ's pre-existence. But I have changed my mind. The word “to have” is the Greek “scheo” which means “to hold.” “For as the Father holds life in Himself, so has He given to the Son to hold life in Himself.” Jesus “holds” life in Himself and He may give that life to men. He is therefore the source of eternal life. “In Him was life….” (John 1:4) thinker Thinker, The Son wasn't the source of eternal life…He was given it to give to others from His Father.  The Father is the source.  You can't be the source of something if you were given it in the first place. Kathi If all things were made by and through Jesus then that indeed makes him the source of all things! Blessings WJ

Keith,

Quote

8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we live, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we live.

Kathi

[KangarooJack]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 19 2010,07:20)

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,15:07) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,13:55) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,04:45) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,12:38) Kathi said: Quote If some young man said that he was the son of the king, he would be making himself out to be equal to royalty, but he would not be saying that he was equal to the king.  The son and the king are both equal to being royalty, but not equally king.  Get it Then why did Jesus ride into Jerusalem as Israel's King as prophecy foretold? thinker Thinker, Jesus is a king but not a king who is the source of everything in existence like the Father.  Jesus will never be the king who was the source of everything in existence. Kathi, Jesus was THE King of Israel. And He is indeed the source of everything like His own Father: “and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him” Hebrews 5:9 and, “For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself” John 5:26 I once thought that this was speaking about Christ's pre-existence. But I have changed my mind. The word “to have” is the Greek “scheo” which means “to hold.” “For as the Father holds life in Himself, so has He given to the Son to hold life in Himself.” Jesus “holds” life in Himself and He may give that life to men. He is therefore the source of eternal life. “In Him was life….” (John 1:4) thinker Thinker, The Son wasn't the source of eternal life…He was given it to give to others from His Father.  The Father is the source.  You can't be the source of something if you were given it in the first place. Kathi If all things were made by and through Jesus then that indeed makes him the source of all things! Blessings WJ

The sun is no good to us without the beams that come down from it to give us life.

thinker

[KangarooJack]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 19 2010,07:45)

Hi TT, All intellectual theory as if you do not KNOW God. You should by now. Perhaps if you stopped thinking for a mo and listened you may hear Him calling

Nick,

Did God reveal that He keeps His oaths or not?

thinker

[JustAskin]

TT,

WILL NOT — Not CANNOT.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,15:21)

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,07:07) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,13:55) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,04:45) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,12:38) Kathi said: Quote If some young man said that he was the son of the king, he would be making himself out to be equal to royalty, but he would not be saying that he was equal to the king.  The son and the king are both equal to being royalty, but not equally king.  Get it Then why did Jesus ride into Jerusalem as Israel's King as prophecy foretold? thinker Thinker, Jesus is a king but not a king who is the source of everything in existence like the Father.  Jesus will never be the king who was the source of everything in existence. Kathi, Jesus was THE King of Israel. And He is indeed the source of everything like His own Father: “and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him” Hebrews 5:9 and, “For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself” John 5:26 I once thought that this was speaking about Christ's pre-existence. But I have changed my mind. The word “to have” is the Greek “scheo” which means “to hold.” “For as the Father holds life in Himself, so has He given to the Son to hold life in Himself.” Jesus “holds” life in Himself and He may give that life to men. He is therefore the source of eternal life. “In Him was life….” (John 1:4) thinker Thinker, The Son wasn't the source of eternal life…He was given it to give to others from His Father.  The Father is the source.  You can't be the source of something if you were given it in the first place. “For AS the Father holds life IN HIMSELF, so Has He given to the Son to hold life IN HIMSELF.” There is no equivocation. The expression “in Himself” are equal terms in reference to the Father and the Son. In the new covenant age Jesus is the source of all things. Whatever was true before this does not apply today. thinker

Jack

True! And it was given to him in the days of his flesh!

Before he left his Glory that he shared with the Father. Phil 2:6

WJ

[terraricca]

HI ALL

need explanation;the scriptures says “no man can see God and live” is this true??
if it is true,how did he create man in the first place

if Christ was God how come he could come to men and not kill them???

if Christ was God why would he call on someone else for help???

if he is not God then he obviously had a beginning,because only God as no beginning,right

any comments???

[JustAskin]

Why would god take the kingdom back if Jesus is doing good.
If Jesus were doing bad then God WOULD take it back.

Your text makes it look like GOD CANNOT – ha – you are the FOOL – always have been. What can God NOT DO but that he won't do WRONG!

WILL NOT – Not CANNOT!!!

[JustAskin]

TT wrote:”So God is a covenant breaker?”

Is your first language English?

God has not broken any covenant? YOU state that God CANNOT take the kingdom back from his Son. I am saying that your terminology is incorrect.

You cannot say that “GOD CANNOT” – you should say “God WOULD NOT”

Stop being angry and read what you see rather than what you THINK you see through your drunk blurred eyes.

[Lightenup]

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 18 2010,15:51)

HI ALL need explanation;the scriptures says “no man can see God and live” is this true?? if it is true,how did he create man in the first place if Christ was God how come he could come to men and not kill them??? if Christ was God why would he call on someone else for help??? if he is not God then he obviously had a beginning,because only God as no beginning,right any comments???

Hi terraricca,

Explanation: The Most High God cannot be seen and the seer live. The Most High God cannot become a man. The Most High God cannot die. Those statements are true, imo. That is why a literal Son was begotten who is of the same nature as His Father, yet, the Son can do all of the above. They are two different persons within one Godhead.

Only the Most High God had no beginning.

Kathi

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,15:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 18 2010,14:39) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,13:49) Oh Keith, You might not see it proven in scriptures to satisfy the one who has been blinded (I'm not implying anyone here), but it certainly can be backed by scriptures. Kathi Really? Where? Just give me ONE scripture that “unambiguously” is proof that Jesus the Word that was with God and was God had a biggining! Just “One” scripture Kathi! Blessings WJ Keith, Here, you can see that the Lord is a Son and that Son was in the beginning and His years will never come to an end.  A being is not a son unless they had a beginning and they came from another of the same kind.  Note that the Son did this.  It doesn't say that He was just an “it” or the word when he did this.  He is being referred to as the person that was in the beginning yet that person is a son.  Children understand that son's come from someone else and are like the someone else but they are not the one that they are from. Quote Hebrews 1:8 but of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,   and a righteous scepter is the scepter of your kingdom. 1:9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness. So God, your God, has anointed you over your companions with the oil of rejoicing.”   1:10 And, “You founded the earth in the beginning, Lord,   and the heavens are the works of your hands. 1:11 They will perish, but you continue. And they will all grow old like a garment, 1:12 and like a robe you will fold them up and like a garment they will be changed, but you are the same and your years will never run out.” Remember that the verbs in v. 10 are in the active voice and the subject of the passage is “the Son.” Kathi

Kathi

Sorry! The verses you quote is post incarnation and in no way do they show the Son having a beginning!

Notice verse 9 says “You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness” and BECAUSE of this the Father anointed him! His loving righteousness and hating lawlessness could not be refering to anytime but when he was in the flesh!

Do you see how you are forcing the text to fit your view and not letting the text speak for itself? Try again!

I noticed you have had to trash the Idea that Jesus is the Word in John 1:1 even though it is that “Word” that came in the likeness of sinful flesh (John 1:14) and the Word that John spoke of in 1 John 1:1-3, and Rev 19:13

Blessings Keith

[terraricca]

kat
you do not answer to all questions,you are selective .you covering to protect your trinity believes

if he is not God then he obviously had a beginning,because only God as no beginning,right??

[KangarooJack]

Quote (JustAskin @ Feb. 19 2010,07:52)

Why would god take the kingdom back if Jesus is doing good. If Jesus were doing bad then God WOULD take it back. Your text makes it look like GOD CANNOT – ha – you are the FOOL – always have been. What can God NOT DO but that he won't do WRONG! WILL NOT – Not CANNOT!!!

God said that His word CANNOT return to Him void. He CANNOT break an oath. I trust that you are a better father then what you think God is to Christ and to us.

13 For when God made a promise to Abraham, because He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself, 14 saying, “Surely blessing I will bless you, and multiplying I will multiply you.” 15 And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise. 16 For men indeed swear by the greater, and an oath for confirmation is for them an end of all dispute. 17 Thus God, determining to show more abundantly to the heirs of promise the immutability of His counsel, confirmed it by an oath, 18 that by two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we might have strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us.
19 This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which enters the Presence behind the veil, 20 where the forerunner has entered for us, even Jesus, having become High Priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek. Hebrews 6:15-20

Summary:

1. God made a promise to Abraham and confirmed it by an oath.

2. The oath of God gives us a “srtrong consolation” because it is impossible for God to lie, that is, it is impossible for God to renig on His oath.

3. This hope that God cannot go back on His oaths is an “anchor for the soul.”

Tell us what disappointments came to you that have caused you to believe that a loving God and Father can break his oath?

God CANNOT take the kingdom from Jesus any more than He can lie! God made a covenant to Jesus (Galatians 3:17)

If Jesus does not sin then God CANNOT take the kingdom from Him. The only way the Father can get back the kingdom is if Jesus yields it up of His own volition. If God took it back by force then He would be a covenant breaker and a liar. We would have no consolation and no hope as an “anchor for our souls”.

Again, what happened to you to cause you to think such awful things about God?

thinker

[NickHassan]

Hi TT,
The promise to Abraham was fulfilled in Christ.
The kingdom will have no end.

You can enjoy that inheritance too if you repent of this manmade trinity god and come to the Son of God.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,15:45)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 18 2010,15:20) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,15:07) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,13:55) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,04:45) Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 18 2010,12:38) Kathi said: Quote If some young man said that he was the son of the king, he would be making himself out to be equal to royalty, but he would not be saying that he was equal to the king.  The son and the king are both equal to being royalty, but not equally king.  Get it Then why did Jesus ride into Jerusalem as Israel's King as prophecy foretold? thinker Thinker, Jesus is a king but not a king who is the source of everything in existence like the Father.  Jesus will never be the king who was the source of everything in existence. Kathi, Jesus was THE King of Israel. And He is indeed the source of everything like His own Father: “and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him” Hebrews 5:9 and, “For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself” John 5:26 I once thought that this was speaking about Christ's pre-existence. But I have changed my mind. The word “to have” is the Greek “scheo” which means “to hold.” “For as the Father holds life in Himself, so has He given to the Son to hold life in Himself.” Jesus “holds” life in Himself and He may give that life to men. He is therefore the source of eternal life. “In Him was life….” (John 1:4) thinker Thinker, The Son wasn't the source of eternal life…He was given it to give to others from His Father.  The Father is the source.  You can't be the source of something if you were given it in the first place. Kathi If all things were made by and through Jesus then that indeed makes him the source of all things! Blessings WJ Keith, Quote 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we live, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we live. Kathi

Kathi

Same thing!

Who is Paul speaking of in this verse?…

For of him, and “THROUGH WHOM AND TO WHOM ARE ALL THINGS” to whom be glory for ever. Amen.  Rom 11:36

Compare with the language in the verse you quote…

…and one Lord, Jesus Christ, “through whom are all things and through whom we live. 1 Cor 8:6

If you say that Rom 11:36 is the Father, then your point about Jesus is a moot point seeing that if all things can be through the Father and yet he is the source then it also means that Jesus is the source!

Blessings WJ

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
Jesus is the source for US.
Join US

Despite the claims of BD and others Jesus is the way.

[Elizabeth]

Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 19 2010,07:45)

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 19 2010,07:33) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 18 2010,14:39) Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 18 2010,13:49) Oh Keith, You might not see it proven in scriptures to satisfy the one who has been blinded (I'm not implying anyone here), but it certainly can be backed by scriptures. Kathi Really? Where? Just give me ONE scripture that “unambiguously” is proof that Jesus the Word that was with God and was God had a beginning! Just “One” scripture Kathi! Blessings WJ Keith, Here, you can see that the Lord is a Son and that Son was in the beginning and His years will never come to an end.  A being is not a son unless they had a beginning and they came from another of the same kind.  Note that the Son did this.  It doesn't say that He was just an “it” or the word when he did this.  He is being referred to as the person that was in the beginning yet that person is a son.  Children understand that son's come from someone else and are like the someone else but they are not the one that they are from. Quote Hebrews 1:8 but of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,   and a righteous scepter is the scepter of your kingdom. 1:9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness. So God, your God, has anointed you over your companions with the oil of rejoicing.”   1:10 And, “You founded the earth in the beginning, Lord,   and the heavens are the works of your hands. 1:11 They will perish, but you continue. And they will all grow old like a garment, 1:12 and like a robe you will fold them up and like a garment they will be changed, but you are the same and your years will never run out.” Remember that the verbs in v. 10 are in the active voice and the subject of the passage is “the Son.” Kathi You are so right.  Jesus had a beginning and did not always existed.  Therefore we know that He our Heavenly Father is above all and it is His Holy Spirit that dwells in all of us, and because of it, we can understand the things of God.  And we have Scriptures to proof it too. Col. 1:15-17 and Rev. 3:14 and by Jesus own words He said in John 14:28 .. my Father is greater then I. John 17:5 “And now O Father glorify Me together with Yourself with the glory I had with you before the World was.  Here we see that He did existed before He became flesh along with John 1:1 Peace and Love Irene

But these Scriptures do show that Jesus had a beginning…
Co. 1:15 firstborn o all creation and Rev, firstborn, so He did not always existed.
Irene

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