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Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 19 2010,12:24) hi LU
you right ,about the worship of Christ ,but he is worshiping his father so in a sense we worshiping the father through him.
terraricca,
Again, I agree with you…we worship Christ because we worship the Father and because Christ is worthy of our worship.God bless,
KathiHi J
Quote (JustAskin @ Jan. 19 2010,10:05) If it weren't for the likes of WJ (as an antagonist) and with the support of Terra I should not have searched and tested my own understanding as deep as I have done.
Thank you! I am honored to be called an “antagonist”, which can be defined as one who opposes false doctrine and lies!
Blessings WJ
BTW, My name is WorshippingJesus! I noticed in your last post you did not mention the scriptures where Jesus was being worshipped and never once discouraged it! Then try to figure out how they could do that when Only God is to be worshipped.
Do a search for yourself and see!
WJ
you right but only if you are on the right side of the fence,and you were on the left side of the fence
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 20 2010,10:35) Hi J Quote (JustAskin @ Jan. 19 2010,10:05) If it weren't for the likes of WJ (as an antagonist) and with the support of Terra I should not have searched and tested my own understanding as deep as I have done.
Thank you! I am honored to be called an “antagonist”, which can be defined as one who opposes false doctrine and lies!Blessings WJ
BTW, My name is WorshippingJesus! I noticed in your last post you did not mention the scriptures where Jesus was being worshipped and never once discouraged it! Then try to figure out how they could do that when Only God is to be worshipped.
Do a search for yourself and see!
Hi WJ,I used to ask that same question or make that same statement until someone pointed out to me that kings were always worshipped as well.
I was hoping you would pop in w.j. PEOPLE NEED TO REALLY READ THE NEW TESTAMENT GOOD. WHAT A LET DOWN FOR CHRIST, AFTER WHAT HE DONE FOR YOU!!!
KATJO
katjo, What you just said is exactly the sort of thing that satan would like people to say.
Think, how was it that Satan came to sin – was it not because he desired Worship from Man … because he had done wonderful work helping in God's creation?
Satan wants us to worship Jesus so he can say: “See, He is being worshipped and you [God] even endorse it and yet you call me a Devil?”
To All,
Can you all submit your own definition of WORSHIP. Perhaps, we are debating using differing ideas of what we mean by Worship.
My definition is:
– An Act, in Word, thought or deed, of ultimate Reverence towards another person or object, viewing that person or object as [a] God
– To effectively, offer up one's spirit or other revered items, as an offering towards such another person or objectPlease note that I take into regard that Glory, Honor, Praise, Respect, and similar words, are not individually the same as Worship but each or all may be included within the “Acts of Worship”.
Glory, Honor, Praise, Respect, and similar words can be given from one person to another where there is a deserving cause but there is only one who deserves Worship and that is God Almighty.
In my opinion, it is not necessary to Bow down while performing an act of worhsip but it can help in the framing of the act.
LU,
Quote Rev 5:13-14
13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
14 And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.
KJVThe Worship is directed at “…HIM (singular – not THEY!) that liveth for ever and ever.” – This is a reference to God the Father.
Both the father and the lamb are Honored, Gloriied, etc. Only the Father is Worshipped.Although Jesus (the Lamb, yes thanks, I did know) also lives for ever this accollade is directed at the Father.
Quote Rev 4:8-11 8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, Holy, Holy, LORD GOD Almighty, WHO WAS, and IS, and IS TO COME.
9 And when those beasts give glory and honor and thanks to HIM that sat on the throne, HE WHO Lives for Ever and Ever.
10 The four and twenty elders fall down before HIM that sat on the throne, and worship HIM WHO Lives for Ever and Ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,
11 “Thou art worthy, O LORD GOD, to receive Glory and Honor and Power: for YOU have created all things, and for YOUR pleasure they are and were created.”
Quote Rev 11:16-17
16 And the twenty-four elders, who were seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and WORSHIPPED God,
17 saying: “We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty, the One who is and who was, because you have taken your great power and
have begun to reign.There are no occassions in Revelation, that I can find, where the Lamb (or any one else except God) is said to be Worshipped.
One of the major problems seems to be that people will read something and extract those bits that they WANT to say what they WANT to think:
Quote Rev 5:13-14
13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
What is being said in the quote above: God and the Lamb are being Glorified, etc… ok, clear, succint.and what is being said here?:
Quote
14 And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.That it is “HIM”…
LU, how did you manage to associate the 'HIM' in vs 14 with the 'the Lamb' in vs 13?
Quote (Everlasting father Jesus @ Jan. 21 2010,19:23) Even King James was worshipped
YeaBut if they were worshipping them as “Their ONLY LORD and Master” then they were committing Idolatry! Jesus said you can only serve “One Master”.
I challenge you to show me any of the apostles commiting this act on any other than the Father and Jesus in the NT.
WJ
WJ,
Response to your query regarding why I didn't respond to Jesus being worshipped.
I have no idea. Jesus clearly stated to satan that it is God who should be worshipped and would certainly have known about other occasions where Worship was refused on account of it not being targetted at the One and Only God Almighty.
I have seen renderings that show that the occasions were not events of worship but high honor, for instance, one place it says:
“and he bowed down and worshipped him saying 'Master,…'”It seems to me that this was not Worship but simply the manner inwhich people inthose times approached a lorded individual. The Bible translaters chose to select the word Worship instead of Honor for their own reasons.
Indeed, would the SINLESS servant of God really accept WORSHIP knowing that even Satan was looking on desiring for him to receive onto himself that which is for God alone? I think definitely not!
Again, if we are to worship God alone and it is maintained that Jesus was God and therefore worthy to accept Worship, then I say:
“As what did he die – For what did he die”?In any case, does the simply act of approaching an honored person and saying something like “Good Master, I really need your help” identify an act of worship? The angels, quite rightly refused any act that could even remotely be viewed as worship (small 'w') towards them.
How many people approach a priest, Holy person, a monarch, a president, etc and pay due reverence by kirtsying (women) or bowing their head – is this worship – or honor?
Perhaps, Jesus did not view it as worship – and who should know a better definition?
– What is WORSHIP anyway?
– How Does one WORSHIP?We are all going around spouting the word but can someone state what it is – I have given my thoughts in another Posting today.
WJ
you got it wrong,
and now because you are asking that question i know you do not have the spirit you say to possess,
you are only in your own mind intending to prove your trinity,
and so are driven by your own intention and intellect,not the spirit of Christ.because if you would be driven by the spirit of Christ you should have understand it.
there is no trinity.and Christ is not God.Is there any significance in the fact that the bible verses do not state 'how' Jesus was worshipped. They only state something like:
“and he bowed down and worshipped him”. But WHAT was the act of worship – What did they say that constituted words of WorshipMatthew 8:2 “A man with leprosy came and knelt before him and said, “Lord, if you are willing, you can make me clean.” is this worship or a petition?
John 9:38: “Then the man said, “Lord, I believe,” and he worshiped him. ” What did the man do as an act of worship.
However, in Revelation we are given an insight into an act of worship of the father:
Rev 4:10: “the twenty-four elders fall down before him who sits on the throne, and worship him who lives for ever and ever. They lay their crowns before the throne and say:
“You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being.”Here we see that the elders are offering God their Crowns in the act of worship – the Sacrifice, the offering of a revered item in an act of extreme and ultimate reverence.
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 22 2010,11:36) WJ
you got it wrong,
and now because you are asking that question i know you do not have the spirit you say to possess,
you are only in your own mind intending to prove your trinity,
and so are driven by your own intention and intellect,not the spirit of Christ.because if you would be driven by the spirit of Christ you should have understand it.
there is no trinity.and Christ is not God.
tI didn't ask a question!
More accusations from you though!
Why not reply to my post and show me where the Apostles or followers of Jesus worshipped anyone else in the NT other than the Father and Jesus!
WJ
terrica you can tell w.j. he does not have the spirit when you couldnt even say you had christ in your heart(you dont have the holy spirit until you ask him in) you asked me what the holy spirit felt like? You cant say Jesus is Lord without the Holy Spirit(scriptual)!! Is He your Lord?
katjo
WJ
if you would understand the spirit of God s plan you would understand the scriptures the way they meant to be understood by the righteous of God,and you would not show to all what you do not understand.this is not personal,this is responding to what i see.
terraica waiting on a response!
katjo
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