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Quote (TimothyVI @ Mar. 17 2011,22:50) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 17 2011,12:55) and you think by now with all their similarities to the human speci ….they might stop eating their own excrement…
Maybe they have a special relationship with God and he tells them to, as He told Ezekial.Ezekiel 4:12-13
12. And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man
Tim
timthe verse that you referenced had taken me back a bit. so had to do a comparison. the verse seems to reference that the cakes be cooked in dung. not suggesting that the manner is anymore enjoyable. the verses b4/after due explain the subject a bit more.
i understand you are required to bring such things to ones attention, however, try to be a bit more unbias when presenting your response.
would not want others to think that you are just doing a search without further study. know what i mean.
do take care tim.
Eze 4:12
(ABP+) AndG2532 a cake baked in hot ashesG1470.1 of barley –G2916 you shall eatG2068 themG1473 baked inG1722 dung,G999.2 [3 of the dungG2874.1 4of a humanG442 1you shall hideG1470 2them in the coals]G1473 beforeG2596 their eyes.G3788 G1473
(Brenton) And thou shalt eat them as a barley cake: thou shalt bake them before their eyes in man's dung.
(ISV) You are to eat it as barley cakes and bake it right in front of them, using dried human dung for cooking fuel.”
(KJV) And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man, in their sight.
(KJV+) And thou shalt eatH398 it as barleyH8184 cakes,H5692 and thou shalt bakeH5746 itH1931 with dungH1561 that cometh outH6627 of man,H120 in their sight.H5869
(YLT) A barley-cake thou dost eat it, and it with dung–the filth of man–thou dost bake before their eyes.
Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 17 2011,12:55) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 15 2011,17:43) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 15 2011,12:18) Hey Stu…. Homo sapians were not primates….If Iam wrong Prove It !!!… If Homo Erectus weren't primates…you obviously have some information that i need to know…
Homo sapiens is a primate species. That is just a fact which does not require proving really because it is a biological classification.You could try arguing to have the Linnean classification system changed but I can't see how you would convince others we are not primates. Our ancestry and morphology does not have us closer to any other types of animal.
Stuart
Greetings Stu…. Being closest only counts when you are throwing hand granades or playing horseshoes…With all do respect to the Linnean theorists….they are wrong…I would love to meet a primate who practices medicine,flies an airplane,sings a song and can converses in multiple languages…and you think by now with all their similarities to the human speci ….they might stop eating their own excrement…
I'm really sorry to tell you that it is you who is wrong, theodorej, and in there is really nothing more that needs to be said. You present no argument that is relevant. No one is claiming that other species of ape have the characteristics that are uniquely human, in fact all species of Ape have their own unique traits. That has no bearing on the question. It is just true that we are closely related.Why do you persist with this? Why is it skin off your nose? Are you embarrassed about the facts of your ancestry? I have to say that this bizarre denial of yours appears to be to be a clear indication that you are either very confused, or ignorant or very insecure in your beliefs.
Stuart
Quote (princess @ Mar. 18 2011,01:49) i know, we orginally came from the ocean. wonderful how everything just came together so nicely. amazing. boom/bang the gang is all here. LOL. truly, Stuart. going for a walk, will think about how that one little cell brought all this about. perhaps it will take only a few steps before i break out in laughter.
keep swinging from branch to branch, perhaps one of these days you will actually stop and realize that you are a materpiece.
much love to you.
So you have nothing to say on the subject of the alleged immorality of your belief system either?Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination.
I don't think it is me who is in need of a quiet reflective walk, quite frankly.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Mar. 19 2011,23:36) Quote (princess @ Mar. 18 2011,01:49) i know, we orginally came from the ocean. wonderful how everything just came together so nicely. amazing. boom/bang the gang is all here. LOL. truly, Stuart. going for a walk, will think about how that one little cell brought all this about. perhaps it will take only a few steps before i break out in laughter.
keep swinging from branch to branch, perhaps one of these days you will actually stop and realize that you are a materpiece.
much love to you.
So you have nothing to say on the subject of the alleged immorality of your belief system either?Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination.
I don't think it is me who is in need of a quiet reflective walk, quite frankly.
Stuart
Stuart,you protest too much, always ready to throw the baby out with the bath water. shame really.
it must be hard for you to understand that truth can be found in many places, no matter if you believe the religion it is attached to.
everything must be a physical to you, apparently you have not accepted your place in the universe. for some apparent reason you feel the need to smite others.
which is your own, i enjoyed my walk fine thank you, will repeat the process today. perhaps you are in a place where you cannot walk and reflect, tis a pity. i understand how difficult it is for a youngster to learn to walk on his legs instead of all fours. does wonders for the posture. don't give up though, trying to stand upright.
enjoy your day Stuart. don't be so grumpy.
Quote (princess @ Mar. 19 2011,22:52) Quote (TimothyVI @ Mar. 17 2011,22:50) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 17 2011,12:55) and you think by now with all their similarities to the human speci ….they might stop eating their own excrement…
Maybe they have a special relationship with God and he tells them to, as He told Ezekial.Ezekiel 4:12-13
12. And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man
Tim
timthe verse that you referenced had taken me back a bit. so had to do a comparison. the verse seems to reference that the cakes be cooked in dung. not suggesting that the manner is anymore enjoyable. the verses b4/after due explain the subject a bit more.
i understand you are required to bring such things to ones attention, however, try to be a bit more unbias when presenting your response.
would not want others to think that you are just doing a search without further study. know what i mean.
do take care tim.
Eze 4:12
(ABP+) AndG2532 a cake baked in hot ashesG1470.1 of barley –G2916 you shall eatG2068 themG1473 baked inG1722 dung,G999.2 [3 of the dungG2874.1 4of a humanG442 1you shall hideG1470 2them in the coals]G1473 beforeG2596 their eyes.G3788 G1473
(Brenton) And thou shalt eat them as a barley cake: thou shalt bake them before their eyes in man's dung.
(ISV) You are to eat it as barley cakes and bake it right in front of them, using dried human dung for cooking fuel.”
(KJV) And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man, in their sight.
(KJV+) And thou shalt eatH398 it as barleyH8184 cakes,H5692 and thou shalt bakeH5746 itH1931 with dungH1561 that cometh outH6627 of man,H120 in their sight.H5869
(YLT) A barley-cake thou dost eat it, and it with dung–the filth of man–thou dost bake before their eyes.
I'm sorry princess.
All I did was quote Ezekial 4:12 from the King James version of the bible.If there is something that you don't like about it you should take it up with the author.
For the record. I wouldn't eat bread cooked over human dung even if God told me to, any more than I would kill my son if he commanded it.
Tim
tim
unfortunetly taking such matters up with the author would be quite the task. would not think such as one as yourself would use the kjv for reference, i find the translators did such a poor job of it. must likey rushed to give the king his due.
i have heard that atheist know the bible better then most christians, this i find untrue, due to you can read all you want, field work is priceless.
perhaps some atheist were christians at one time, i am leaning towards they were not educated properly towards the whole matter, or have chosen the teaching methods of a tradition either of their own, or accepted as their own.
never do like saying 'oh i have it all figured out', seems to limit ones ability to search any further. let science say they have it all figured out. perhaps science is jealous just a bit; of all their knowledge, they still cannot figure out this god thing, keeps them stumped even today. let them figure this out and maybe, just maybe i will consider and review their findings, study the facts, await for the charts, until then. the odds are in my favor.
i appreciate your confession that you would not kill your son, i believe that carries a jail sentence this day & age, with society rules, the voices in your head are not counted as a character witness.
do take care tim.
Quote Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination. Stuart,
repeatative ranting does not bring a solution to your search. personally each time u post something of this nature, i skip over it, however giving evolution one would think they could move on, perhaps u have not made it past this point, once again it is your own.
getting past all the ifs/ands/buts, u speak of behavior, per your view when humans act like animals, it is just genetic or how we have evolved, we can't help it. shows only the view of yourself & worth. no matter what ur life
brings u select what you choose to believe in. just as others do.each individuals decisions in life affect other, u cannot deny the simple science of an action causes a reaction. have to go Stuart, would most likely bore you with the rest, took the morning to practice basketball, ryan is back from fishing.
tc
Quote (princess @ Mar. 20 2011,00:28) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 19 2011,23:36) Quote (princess @ Mar. 18 2011,01:49) i know, we orginally came from the ocean. wonderful how everything just came together so nicely. amazing. boom/bang the gang is all here. LOL. truly, Stuart. going for a walk, will think about how that one little cell brought all this about. perhaps it will take only a few steps before i break out in laughter.
keep swinging from branch to branch, perhaps one of these days you will actually stop and realize that you are a materpiece.
much love to you.
So you have nothing to say on the subject of the alleged immorality of your belief system either?Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination.
I don't think it is me who is in need of a quiet reflective walk, quite frankly.
Stuart
Stuart,you protest too much, always ready to throw the baby out with the bath water. shame really.
it must be hard for you to understand that truth can be found in many places, no matter if you believe the religion it is attached to.
everything must be a physical to you, apparently you have not accepted your place in the universe. for some apparent reason you feel the need to smite others.
which is your own, i enjoyed my walk fine thank you, will repeat the process today. perhaps you are in a place where you cannot walk and reflect, tis a pity. i understand how difficult it is for a youngster to learn to walk on his legs instead of all fours. does wonders for the posture. don't give up though, trying to stand upright.
enjoy your day Stuart. don't be so grumpy.
I probably do find it hard to believe facts can be found in different ways, because I think humans really only determine facts in one or two ways. But I acknowledge that one's own truth can be attained by all sorts of different “ways of knowing”. To deny that would make me an officer of the thought police.One's truth is not necessarily the body of facts that people should agree on widely. You can take your own truth for a walk as can I and we might come to different conclusions. If I believe something that really seems to be crazy then I do not expect you to respect that apparently crazy belief. I expect you to challenge my idea and have me either defend it or acknowledge that it is not something others should necessarily find convincing.
However, christianity is prima facie a crazy belief and yet christians appear not expect to be called on it. There are even scriptures written by Saul of Tarsus where he prepares you for a victim mentality and close-mindedness by telling you people will find your belief system crazy. So when I call you on your crazy-looking belief system, how do you respond? Do you admit that it appears crazy? Do you do anything about that? What about the topic of the thread which alleges that it is also an immoral way to think? Do you place your hands over your ears and shout “blah blah I can't hear you” like St Paul apparently did?
Is it grumpiness to make an effort to make the world a more ethical place by suggesting people should rethink their religion and perhaps modify it or abandon it if they agree?
Do you disagree people should rethink? If so, why?
Stuart
Quote (princess @ Mar. 21 2011,04:43) Quote Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination. Stuart,
repeatative ranting does not bring a solution to your search. personally each time u post something of this nature, i skip over it, however giving evolution one would think they could move on, perhaps u have not made it past this point, once again it is your own.
getting past all the ifs/ands/buts, u speak of behavior, per your view when humans act like animals, it is just genetic or how we have evolved, we can't help it. shows only the view of yourself & worth. no matter what ur life
brings u select what you choose to believe in. just as others do.each individuals decisions in life affect other, u cannot deny the simple science of an action causes a reaction. have to go Stuart, would most likely bore you with the rest, took the morning to practice basketball, ryan is back from fishing.
tc
I think I realise already that you have nothing to say on the question of the immorality of christianity, yet you still appear to be motivated to reply with posts that do not address the issue.Are you proud of believing that you can be absolved of your responsibility for wrongdoing by a human sacrifice?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Mar. 21 2011,17:03) Quote (princess @ Mar. 21 2011,04:43) Quote Looks like no one can even defend it against the most grave accusations. Here we have christians quite happy to tell others how they should behave because they claim to know the body f actions that are the right things to do in the name of their god, which is supposedly the very origins of the idea of right moral action, and yet no one can defend christianity against the most basic demonstration that it is inherently an ethical abomination. Stuart,
repetitive ranting does not bring a solution to your search. personally each time u post something of this nature, i skip over it, however giving evolution one would think they could move on, perhaps u have not made it past this point, once again it is your own.
getting past all the ifs/ands/buts, u speak of behavior, per your view when humans act like animals, it is just genetic or how we have evolved, we can't help it. shows only the view of yourself & worth. no matter what ur life
brings u select what you choose to believe in. just as others do.each individuals decisions in life affect other, u cannot deny the simple science of an action causes a reaction. have to go Stuart, would most likely bore you with the rest, took the morning to practice basketball, ryan is back from fishing.
tc
I think I realize already that you have nothing to say on the question of the immorality of christianity, yet you still appear to be motivated to reply with posts that do not address the issue.Are you proud of believing that you can be absolved of your responsibility for wrongdoing by a human sacrifice?
Stuart
Stuart,perhaps old school teachings should be applied, the basis for chritianity is the blood of jesus is what removes sins.
the blood of either or depends on which u believe, jesus being god or human. this debate still continues today.so it would be best suited to ask a christian, are you proud to admit that the blood of jesus saves u from your sins.
really Stuart, this thread was created for what reason? to have christian defend their belief, because you ask. it is well known that any answer given to you is not suffice, so why would a individual explain it to you, all to suffer the same responses from you. millstone behavior at its best.
christianity as a whole is not a bad thing Stuart, you want to discredit them, u consider it 'to rethink', most know that this is not ur intentions. u don't like christians, nor anyone that has a god belief, you do know that the majority of the world has a god belief, so your work is cut out for you. perhaps you should turn your focus on another group of god believers or are the christians just easier for you.
however, it is your own. no one can change this but yourself. just because you do not believe in the same does not mean you cannot understand or learn from what is offered time to time. once again, your fear is what deters you from learning, or it could be your fear is that u know u could be the same. once again it is your own.
immorality comes in many colors and fashions Stuart.
u want others to 'rethink', why do u ask others what you cannot give yourself.do take care Stuart.
**Stuart, you post could have changed a bit, i performed a spell check b4 posting.
Quote I expect you to challenge my idea and have me either defend it or acknowledge that it is not something others should necessarily find convincing. Stuart, what challenge can i bring to you, what physical proof can i show you. you ask for such things that you will not accept. i have never ask you to place your sins on the blood of anything, i have never ask you to recite the sinners prayer, i have not ask much from you. only to think, not micro manage the whole matter.
when you bring up the negatives, i will always be ready with the positive. u will not deter me from knowing that i am a princess, a woman, created, designed, unique. i will not accept anything less. this being understood, i believe in spirit, that to attain the innocence that we all were given, i do not believe we are born sinners, i believe that we deter from our innocence by our own hand.
when you came to the decision in your life that you do not kill people, where did your decision come from, was it while you were young, taught by your parents, even this being the case, at one time you took the decision for being your own. why?
when others have come to the decision that is alright to kill, having the same as you did. when did this person come to this decision & why.we can micro manage all we want, it still comes down to the basics Stuart. for it is where it started in the first place.
learn what you can, when it is a truth, you know. when it is not, you know.
i am not blind to what you present, nor can i say i just don't understand what he is thinking, well at times, i do get the just of it though. for you not to be able to bring forth understanding not acceptance on matters is what has me a bit taken back.
christians have it easy, one verse says work with the unsaved, then when it is enough, you are able to shake your cloak on the matter. so why would not one take this upon themselves, it is the best of both worlds. however, is this not a universal rule. everyone wants the best of both worlds. choosing when we stop, or continue, which does bring on decision making skills, however ones cannot even agree to when the decision is to be made.
we gain our knowledge from the inside, and proceed to the outside. some choose to do good, they are not affiliated with any denomination. only for ones to tell me that good is not good if it does not come from their god, then it really is not good. this subject matter can also apply for ones that do bad, vise versa.
this is where the covering the ears and singing come into play.i do not disagree that one should not do things to appease a god that demanded blood. coming to the acceptance that i was created by another, means that everything i needed to live had been given in the beginning. trying to revive that person is what i am working to wards.
for instance, my older sister has been handicapped from the beginning, no walking, no speech, no control of her muscles. let's go the christian route, since my father/mother had relationship out of marriage, she is their punishment for their sins. or did the doctor have a bit much at the christmas party and when using the forceps added too much pressure on the temple during birth, or should i take your route and just give it to natural selection.
which ever way it is Stuart, does not change that she is still the same today as she was then. so tell me, which do you believe in regards to my sister.
or perhaps you could help me out with this one, give me the odds. during my walk yesterday, i took a different route, the walking trail gets busy on the weekends, and i don't get much of a good workout, most people are friendly on the trail and it is like stop and go traffic, just wanted to think a bit, limit the distractions. plus patterns are easily established, which is unsafe in many ways.
here i want to be left alone, as i am walking i see a elderly woman trying to take out her trash, can tell she is having a hard time of it. so i stop, i always introduce myself, due to society helping or accepting help from total strangers is now questioned, which i fully understand. i offer my help to carry her trash out, she tells me that i must be an angel sent from heaven, Stuart, its taking out the trash. mind you she just couldn't have the trash taken out, she need it in a specific place, i tied the bag shut, then she proceeds to say, when you leave it there i can place other things in it, so had to untie the trash bag. i explained to her that if she is in need of anything else, of course its spring she would like to have her walls washed, mind you wall washing is not one of my favorite things to do, however i opened the door, blessed be her walls are painted with a semi gloss, make it much easier to wash, she began to tell me that she had lost her husband in december, and that she was going to get carpet installed throughout her home, what idiot would suggest such a thing to her, she uses support devises for walking.
i gave her my number to call when she needs me. told her where i live, and that i have a son that could perform her yard work. now here we go, of course she offers to pay me for any services given, what amount of monies does one place on such things.Stuart, she was smaller then me, even her hands and in my world that is a feature only found in children.
was it for her that i just happened to changed my route, in my thoughts at the time i did not want to be bothered.
things of this nature Stuart, are what you miss. even though she may not call, that is of no matter. to her, a angel was sent to her, a person showed that some do take the time to just listen and understand and offer what one has to offer even if it washing walls. giving without receiving is a great gift to have. do i need a book to tell me this is right, no it is part of me, that brings no chaos or second guessing to it.this is where you step in and calculate the possibilities, run the psych eval, my upbringing, education ect. ect. the best part of it Stuart, no matter what data you collect, does not change the fact, that we met, were able to give each other a little of what we both needed.
this is my life Stuart, this is what i believe in. i do not need either christian or atheist to tell me what is me.
as i find with the woman i met, i find with you also, giving a bit of each other. you and i were meant to be. i have come to accept that you will be in my thoughts, no matter if we speak again, or not, does not change the fact.
that a person can come to care for someone that is totally different in every way imaginable, by the book, i should shun you, curse you. my spirit says different.this is what you are dealing with Stuart, so yes christianity has a terrible reputation for immorality, with knowing that a few others can and have kept up with them. should any one be a priori, no question everything. however, don't complicate the matter.
Quote (TimothyVI @ Mar. 17 2011,22:50) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 17 2011,12:55) and you think by now with all their similarities to the human speci ….they might stop eating their own excrement…
Maybe they have a special relationship with God and he tells them to, as He told Ezekial.Ezekiel 4:12-13
12. And thou shalt eat it as barley cakes, and thou shalt bake it with dung that cometh out of man
Tim
Thank you Tim….. I had no Idea there was scripture addressing this repulsive behavior…..My next question is for what purpose
Surely you are not comparing this isolated situation in scripture with the behavioral habits of primates…Quote (Stu @ Mar. 19 2011,23:31) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 17 2011,12:55) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 15 2011,17:43) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 15 2011,12:18) Hey Stu…. Homo sapians were not primates….If Iam wrong Prove It !!!… If Homo Erectus weren't primates…you obviously have some information that i need to know…
Homo sapiens is a primate species. That is just a fact which does not require proving really because it is a biological classification.You could try arguing to have the Linnean classification system changed but I can't see how you would convince others we are not primates. Our ancestry and morphology does not have us closer to any other types of animal.
Stuart
Greetings Stu…. Being closest only counts when you are throwing hand granades or playing horseshoes…With all do respect to the Linnean theorists….they are wrong…I would love to meet a primate who practices medicine,flies an airplane,sings a song and can converses in multiple languages…and you think by now with all their similarities to the human speci ….they might stop eating their own excrement…
I'm really sorry to tell you that it is you who is wrong, theodorej, and in there is really nothing more that needs to be said. You present no argument that is relevant. No one is claiming that other species of ape have the characteristics that are uniquely human, in fact all species of Ape have their own unique traits. That has no bearing on the question. It is just true that we are closely related.Why do you persist with this? Why is it skin off your nose? Are you embarrassed about the facts of your ancestry? I have to say that this bizarre denial of yours appears to be to be a clear indication that you are either very confused, or ignorant or very insecure in your beliefs.
Stuart
Hi stu…. Well you have certainly nailed it…..Ignorance is something I have learned to live with while dealing with my insecurity,however,the confusion in my life comes from dialog with interlectual vandals that spew irelevent nosensical theories and insist they are factual by presenting yet another theory……where is the proof??? In addition it is no skin off my nose….it is just an opportunity to have inteligent dialog..Indulge me….Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 22 2011,11:03) Hi stu…. Well you have certainly nailed it…..Ignorance is something I have learned to live with while dealing with my insecurity,however,the confusion in my life comes from dialog with interlectual vandals that spew irelevent nosensical theories and insist they are factual by presenting yet another theory……where is the proof??? In addition it is no skin off my nose….it is just an opportunity to have inteligent dialog..Indulge me….
How do you “prove” that Monet was an impressionist?Stuart
princess
Quote so it would be best suited to ask a christian, are you proud to admit that the blood of jesus saves u from your sins.
OK. It’s not the question I was asking, but are you? If so, how is it moral?Quote christianity as a whole is not a bad thing Stuart,
That’s what is up for discussion. Can you do more than just claim it is not a bad thing? Can you justify it in ethical terms?Quote you want to discredit them, u consider it 'to rethink', most know that this is not ur intentions.
I want people to have full knowledge of what they believe. I think christianity is immoral. I am prepared to be convinced that position is wrong but so far no one in this thread has been convincing. If christians here are unable to convince me that their belief system is moral I think that should be cause for them to have a rethink.Quote u don't like christians, nor anyone that has a god belief, you do know that the majority of the world has a god belief, so your work is cut out for you. perhaps you should turn your focus on another group of god believers or are the christians just easier for you.
This is a far cry from previous attempts at my conversion, isn’t it. Are we up to dusting off shoes already? If so, that was quick!My opinion always has been that we should love christians but oppose the christianity that makes them say silly things. It looks like you can add that christianity makes them believe in immoral ideas, too. Love the christian nonetheless.
Quote however, it is your own. no one can change this but yourself. just because you do not believe in the same does not mean you cannot understand or learn from what is offered time to time. once again, your fear is what deters you from learning, or it could be your fear is that u know u could be the same. once again it is your own.
And what exactly do you think it is that I fear?Quote immorality comes in many colors and fashions Stuart.
u want others to 'rethink', why do u ask others what you cannot give yourself.
I have rethought my position on abortion. I used to be opposed to it, but I realised my reasoning was immoral.Stuart
Stuart
i can understand why you have never recieved the answers you ask for. your knowledge of christianity is not what you portray it to be. perhaps you should brush up a bit, then proceed with your pilgrimage. until you establish this, please refrain from conversing with a christian. basic 101 know your audience.
now moving on, you call out a christian for the history of christianity, so in good turn, you are being called out on abortion, so the history of abortion lies on your shoulders to accept.
so, when the doctor who is removing a second trimester fetus from the womb, piece by piece, you stand over them pat the doctor on the shoulder and say, the fetus is not life, oh look an arm or is it a leg, don't forget to comfort the woman who made the decision so late in the pregnacy, rub her hand and say almost done, just have to stir the brain matter up a bit so the head can fit through, just take a moment. while your here, can we take your placenta and use it for science, perhaps stem cell research, oh you would, great, just need to move the parts of this unhuman thing, and you can sign the papers.
or perhaps, you are the endearing soul that comforts a teen saying i know this is a hard decision to make, but it is the right thing to do, now, do you have the hundreds of dollars that is needed.
if you are going to choice lay all of the history on christianity on christians, then i am choosing to lay all history of abortion on you.
i know you like to play by your rules Stuart, however, your rules really are not fair play.
Quote My opinion always has been that we should love christians but oppose the christianity that makes them say silly things. It looks like you can add that christianity makes them believe in immoral ideas, too. Love the christian nonetheless is this platitude, copycatting, or just mockery. personally i find it to be amusing.
really Stuart, you need to step up your game, you are becoming to predictable.Quote (princess @ Mar. 22 2011,23:01) Stuart i can understand why you have never recieved the answers you ask for. your knowledge of christianity is not what you portray it to be. perhaps you should brush up a bit, then proceed with your pilgrimage. until you establish this, please refrain from conversing with a christian. basic 101 know your audience.
now moving on, you call out a christian for the history of christianity, so in good turn, you are being called out on abortion, so the history of abortion lies on your shoulders to accept.
so, when the doctor who is removing a second trimester fetus from the womb, piece by piece, you stand over them pat the doctor on the shoulder and say, the fetus is not life, oh look an arm or is it a leg, don't forget to comfort the woman who made the decision so late in the pregnacy, rub her hand and say almost done, just have to stir the brain matter up a bit so the head can fit through, just take a moment. while your here, can we take your placenta and use it for science, perhaps stem cell research, oh you would, great, just need to move the parts of this unhuman thing, and you can sign the papers.
or perhaps, you are the endearing soul that comforts a teen saying i know this is a hard decision to make, but it is the right thing to do, now, do you have the hundreds of dollars that is needed.
if you are going to choice lay all of the history on christianity on christians, then i am choosing to lay all history of abortion on you.
i know you like to play by your rules Stuart, however, your rules really are not fair play.
And now shall we read the similarly gruesome details which describe the loud grinding sound of the circular saw through bone and the blood-spurting slicing through human skin and flesh that is used by a heart surgeon to get access to the human heart he is to fix thereby saving a real, breathing, caring, loving adult human?Can we move from that scene to the christian theocracy in which another surgeon is comforting a woman who has been sentenced to death by the local cardinal because she has an ectopic pregnancy and will be killed by it because abortion has been outlawed? What shall we say to her children? Will we tell them that the foetus she carries is perfectly normal but because of where it happened to implant it could never have been a little brother or sister, and because abortion is evil their mother will unfortunately have to die painfully of peritonitis or some other condition related to the rupture of her fallopian tube?
So you might say OK then, abortion is justified in this case.
Well then, if abortion is OK in this case, why is it not OK in other cases?
If it was a baby that had been born then we are dealing with an autonomous individual with rights that do not have any conflict with the rights of any other humans. But that is not the case with pregnancy. If the foetus has an absolute right to life then the mother does not.
Who would you be to remove the right of medical consent from another living, caring, loving and loved human, regardless of whatever “potential” you think exists in a foetus?
Stuart
How are you all doing.
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