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Quote And how can we be certain that we are of the truth. It is our love that proves this. true enough t8. But, Our love for whom would prove that we are really following Jesus?
Jesus answers:
“By this all will know that YOU are my disciples, if YOU have love among yourselves.”” (John 13:35)Jesus true disciples would have love among themselves, a love that would distinguish them from others.
And I might add another scripture or two or three or four of ( 1 John 2:3-4) as John used the word Commandments= Plural, not only the New Commandment that Messiah added of ( John 13:34-35), as John says that we DO KNOW that we KNOW HIM, if we observe, obey, and do His( YAH'S) Commandments- Plural ), and that those who says I KNOW HIM and does not observe ,obey and do HIS( YAH'S) Commandments-ie Plural again, is a LIAR and the TRUTH is not in him-or that person.( See 1 John 2:3-4).
Also, John says This is the LOVE OF YAH the Father that we do and obey His Commandments- ie Plural again, not commandment- ie -singular form of the word either does he ?
Also, is this not the NEW COVENANT–Jer.31:33; Heb.8:10; Heb.10:16) of His laws and Commandments-Plural written in our hearts or minds ??
Also, John makes it very clear in Revelation 12:17 that it is those that obey and DO the Father's Commandments-ie-Plural again, that satan is angry at and tries to destroy the last days remnant which have the testimony and faith of Yahushua Messiah, and See Also Revelation 14:12, which are they that obey and do the Commandments–ie-Plural again of the word.
Also, blessed are those that DO HIS COMMANDMENTS- ie -Plural of that word again-that they may have right to the tree of Life.( See Revelation 22:14).
Or, did he say, blessed are they that abolish or do away with the Commandments–ie-Plural of the word Commandments as most all traditional christianity believes and teaches lawlessness today ??
Merely faith in Messiah Yahushua without obedience to the Father YAH'S Will ( Matt.7:21) which is His laws and Commandments that is the whole duty of man( Ecc.12:13) is a dead faith or belief, for even the demons have faith or believe and shutter or tremble, however, they do not, nor will they do and obey His- the Father's will of obedience to His and Messiah's Commandments either.
Eliyah C.
Quote (david @ Jan. 31 2006,05:30) Satan the Devil could not silence the early Christians. Instead, he countered the impact of the good news by another means—apostasy. Jesus had foretold this development in his parable of the wheat and the weeds. (Matthew 13:24-30, 36-43) The apostle Peter had also warned that false teachers would arise within the congregation, bringing in destructive sects. (2 Peter 2:1-3) Similarly, the apostle Paul had specifically warned that apostasy would precede the day of Jehovah.—2 Thessalonians 2:1-3. Because this apostasy occured, and so many false ideas and beliefs were introduced, how can one be sure whether they really believe the truth?
One person says: “This is true.”
And with the same conviction, another says: “You're wrong, this is true.”
How can we be certain we are not deceiving ourselves?What do you think?
Hi,
Trinity doctrine was the first fruit of apostasy.How clever of the wolf to change the definition of God from the biblical one to a mysterious triune form.
In one stroke he divided and confused the flock and separated them from the love of God which belongs to the faithful ones.
He insulted the Father by reducing Him to the lesser level of His Son and encouraged men to continue these insults.
He denied the Son and separated God from His own Spirit.
By denying God the Father being God alone he led men into idolatry of false gods.
By denying the Son he closed the door of salvation through the Son to many.
By denying the nature of the Holy Spirit he led men from seeking this wonderful gift with it's needed life giving powers.
By denying the truthful simplicity of the bible he blinded men to the gospel therein and made it a thing of mysteries only to be decoded by experts.
Satan did very well …..and many will doggedly continue to defend his efforts
True enough.
But was the trinity the very first deviation from the truth? It was the major one, but was it actually the first?Hi david,
Good question.
Part of the problem was a bad cop/good cop scenario. The Christians were being wiped out by a severe persecution from Emperor Diocletian and the along comes Emperor Constantine. He seemed a nice enough fellow and he was clever enough to see that to establish himself over other contenders he needed to unite his empire and gain popularity by supporting a form of christianity and even making it compulsory.
Of course in return he demanded and got a seat on the board of directors and arranged church councils and sat as umpire alongside the leaders. The church of the time thus became apostate by agreeing to accept these adulterous compromises with the world.As t8 stated:
Quote Seriously though, I don't think it is wise to argue over dates, sabbaths, genealogies, etc. Also, this topic is about the apostacy. We should stick to the subject. About 4 of the 5 pages were devoted to sabbaths, etc. But I think the “great apostasy” is a topic worthy of discussion. Yet, it really hasn't been discussed too much in this thread.
Hi,
Is this related to Constantine?
The whore “with whom the kings of the earth committed acts of immorality”[ Rev 17.2]?
Spiritual immorality is unfaithfulness to your husband, which for the church is Christ.Hi,
1Cor 6.15f
“Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ. Shall I take the members of Christ and make them members of a harlot? May it never be! Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a harlot is one body with her?
For He says
'The two will become one flesh'
But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one Spirit with him”So in the spiritual realm it is also true. God is a jealous God. He has made us bride to Christ and we have no part of the whore of Babylon. We do not teach what she teaches because it offends God. We do not share at her table because she is offensive to God.
We need to demand of our God that He bless us with all He has to give as he is our Father and wants to bless us, but without His eyes and His mind we cannot even see truth.
Quote true enough t8. But, Our love for whom would prove that we are really following Jesus? There is a beter way than love among yourselves
Matthew 5 I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
This is an easier way to tell the difference between real Christians and the pretenders.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 30 2006,23:55) Hi,
Is this related to Constantine?
The whore “with whom the kings of the earth committed acts of immorality”[ Rev 17.2]?
Spiritual immorality is unfaithfulness to your husband, which for the church is Christ.
Did Constantine and the Bishop of Rome change the Sabbath to keep peace with the pagans who worshiped on Sunday?Quote Quote
true enough t8. But, Our love for whom would prove that we are really following Jesus?There is a beter way than love among yourselves
Matthew 5 I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
This is an easier way to tell the difference between real Christians and the pretenders
Ya, it's a good way. It's just that there's no scripture that specifically says:
By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you love your enemies.The Bible does say to love your enemies.
But with regard to telling who Jesus disciples are, He specifically said:
By “THIS” all will know that you are my disciples, if you have “LOVE AMONG YOURSELVES.”Really, in war, Catholic kills their Catholic brothers in other countries. Protestants, Muslims do the same. A true Christian would be markedly different. They have love among themselves. This, Jesus said would be a distinguishing factor. But of course they would also have love for their enemies.
They are both good ways. But one, Jesus mentions as a way to distinguish.
Hi,
The signs that are meant to follow believers are rarely visible within the orthodox 'church'. The Spirit is unknown and relegated to a first century phenomenon. Men do not expect to know the power of God in their lives anymore. Perhaps it is because that church is not obedient to the Lord and does not teach entry into the body of Christ but into it's own denominational fellowships? Powerless religion is what we were warned about in the endtimes.What a powerful topic brother and I am sure is was given by the unction of the Holy Spirit.
I have been in hot debate over this same topic in discussion groups I belong to. I believe that falling away spoken of in Thess. is from the word of God.
I believe the world has been decieved into believing that their is not a perfect translation, an infallible word of God in existance today. I believe this is one of his greatest lies to steal the souls of men.
The word of God is like a well of pure water. As long as the water remains pure, men can be led into all truth. Yet, the enemy sneaks in and adds a few drops of poison [changes a word or two] but not enough to kill or change the taste, for the enemy wants to kill all of man and if he would add too much poison at one time, the death of one man would arrouse suspicion. The enemy continues adding his poison over the years and decades and centuries, making men sick unto death.
Jesus said his sheep will know his voice and Jesus is the word. If man is decieved and does not stand on the infallible word of God, could this not bring apostacy?
There is no other bible translation that is under more attack then the King James bible. In the coming days, you are going to hear lies saying that King James was a homosexual, which is a lie, for he was a happily married man with 9 children. You are going to hear that it was Francis Becon and Shakesphere wrote the King James bible and that Becon was involve, along with King James, with the Masonic Order. Why do you think they want to get rid of the King James do badly. It is not so difficult to figure out. It is the infallible word of God. Here is an excellent site that has allot of info on the massive attacks taking place to erraddicate the KJ translation.
Hi H,
Why would you deny the Spirit among us to discern truth from all the translations? The Spirit wrote the Word through men and is among us to test all things. Those who promote the perfection of one version against another raise the doubt that they surely do not share this Spirit?Quote In the coming days, you are going to hear lies saying that King James was a homosexual,
wondering why we're going to be hearing these things.Hey heiscomingintheclouds,
Wondering what you think of this verse in the King James Bible:Psalm 83:18 (King James Version)
“That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, art the most high over all the earth.”Brothers. Who does the scriptures say Jesus is?
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Do you not understand the importance of words? All things were spoken into existance. Jesus is the word. When he quoted scripture, what did he say? IT IS WRITTEN.
Can you honestly tell me you don't believe that God has a perfect bible translation? And if not, why? I believe this is one of Satan's greatest lies.
IF he can convince man that there is no perfect bible translation, then man will rely on his feelings rather then the word of God in trying to understand God.I am not saying if a person who has another translation is going to hell, I am saying that if a bible translation is corrupt, it can cause false doctrines and false religions and it has done so. Let me ask you this. Do you believe fasting is important to the faith? Why was it not found in the NIV?
Have you not heard the words
Galatians 5:9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.Have you not heard the words
Rev. 21:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.Jesus is the word of God and all who hear his voice will know his word.
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