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Hi W,
You may find interest here.
The problem is the apostasy happened soon after Paul died.
Acts 20
” 29For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.30Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.”
Now apostasy is orthodoxy!Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 19 2006,04:47) Hi W,
You may find interest here.
The problem is the apostasy happened soon after Paul died.
Acts 20
” 29For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.30Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.”
Now apostasy is orthodoxy!
Hi Nick,Grievous wolves did enter the Church but Gods word is true and His word calls the Church the pillar and ground of truth.
Every pope could fall, as did Peter when he denied the Lord. Yet the Lord will not allow the teachings to fail otherwise scripture would not hold true! The Lord did not even allow the Jews teachings to fail.Mat 23:2 Saying: The scribes and the Pharisees have sitten on the chair of Moses.
Mat 23:3 All things therefore whatsoever they shall say to you, observe AND DO: but according to their works do ye not. For they say, and do not.So who has the power to bind on earth and in heaven who is the pillar and ground of truth, I certainly am not, who can say they are, raise your hand….
Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Mat 16:19 AND I WILL GIVE UNTO THEE [PETER] the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.The gates of hell will not prevail against the Church but it can prevail against people in the Church.
To deny these scriptures is like denying that the word is truth, and there are many more scriptures that can be used to prove the teaching Church but first you need to understand the Trinity.Love and blessings in the name of Jesus
Hi SS,
You say
“His word calls the Church the pillar and ground of truth.”Are we meant to read CATHOLIC church for church?
Where is this written?
“Mat 23:2 Saying: The scribes and the Pharisees have sitten on the chair of Moses.”
Are you saying there is a chair of Peter too, or was not James rather the leader and John,…
Are we meant to read CATHOLIC church for church?Matt 18
” 18Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. “Are these men all Peters too?
Wake up SS.
Following men is folly.
“To deny these scriptures is like denying that the word is truth, and there are many more scriptures that can be used to prove the teaching Church but first you need to understand the Trinity.”
? The teaching Catholic church?
But her words show contempt for those of Jesus raising their traditions to be equal with the Word as shown in the documents of Vat2.
“The words of the holy Fathers witness to the presence of this
living tradition, whose wealth is poured into the practice and life
of the believing and praying Church. Through the same tradition
the Church's full canon of the sacred books is known, and the
sacred writings themselves are more profoundly understood and
unceasingly made active in her; and thus God, who spoke of old,
uninterruptedly converses with the bride of His beloved Son; and
the Holy Spirit, through whom the living voice of the Gospel
resounds in the Church, and through her, in the world, leads unto
all truth those who believe and makes the Word of Christ dwell
abundantly in them (see Col. 3:16).”Rather we should seek the Spirit and abide in the Word.
1Jn 2
” 27But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him”Hi SS,
Looking at Peter“Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Mat 16:19 AND I WILL GIVE UNTO THEE [PETER] the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.:”So at the end of all things where do we find the stone that is Peter?
Above all others as a superior foundation of the new Jerusalem?Rev 21
” 10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,11Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve APOSTLES of the Lamb.”
No, just one of the apostles.
What of the church that Jesus left-was Peter exalted as a king over the other apostles?
No just one of the pillars
Gal 2
” 9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision”And was his teaching infallible? Not according to Paul
Gal 2
“11But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.12For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? “
So what of this worship of the pope/man that is perpetrated in catholicism?
Surely Peter was just the first stone ready to be laid in the temple of the Lord.
The first to manifest the Spirit within.Eph 2
” 20And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;21In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.”
And we too are to be laid as stones too on the foundation stone of Jesus as Peter himself told us in 1 Peter 2
“4To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
5Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
6Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
7Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
8And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
9But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;”
We are not to worship at the feet of Peter but to worship our God and his God as Jesus told us.
Hi,
I am sure the great apostasy was when the roman empire got involved in the teachings of the church and the trinity doctrine appeared-1800 years ago.So many great threads, so little time.
Thanks for bumping some of these topics, Nick.
Goodnight all,
MandyHi all
I was bored, and so I was browsing through some of these topics.
The great apostasy, also referred to as the great falling away, happened first during the
Roman persecution until 313 A.D. when Constantine stopped it. And began again in 565 A.D.
when Antichrist came to power. In 1834 A.D., the Vatican finally abolished torture.
It is estimated that the Catholic Church is responsible for about 50 Million death, if that is true,
and taking into account that Antichrist ruled for 1260 years I believe it is, than how many should
we think fell away over the years for fear of torture and death? Two, three, or four times as many?
Think about it!
IM4TruthQuote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,06:54) Hi,
I am sure the great apostasy was when the roman empire got involved in the teachings of the church and the trinity doctrine appeared-1800 years ago.
Absolutely !! The apostacy manefested its self at Nicea….When the Roman church sought to DeJudeize itself ..We must not forget the duality of scripture….Which means another apostacy is eminent…If it has not taken place already….
Quote (theodorej @ April 03 2008,09:49) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,06:54) Hi,
I am sure the great apostasy was when the roman empire got involved in the teachings of the church and the trinity doctrine appeared-1800 years ago.
Absolutely !! The apostacy manefested its self at Nicea….When the Roman church sought to DeJudeize itself ..
Agreed..that was definitely the alpha of the great apostacyHi Nick!
I see there are 20 pages but I want to respond to your initual post.
The apostasy in my Bible is referred to as the great falling away from the truth.
Apostasy is not nessesarly rejecting truth, it is giving up truth under threat of torture or death.
The persecution under the Romans had nothing to do with giving up truth, they didn't care what
anyone believed as long as you would worship the emperor.
But the image of the beast, the beast was Rome, the image was the Pope and his Church, he is called the image of Rome, because he structured his way of ruling after the Roman government, he forced people to believe his doctrine or die.
And yes, the Pope set himself up in the spiritual temple of God, the Saints, obey him, exept his doctrine or die.
It is estimated that the Popes are responsible for the death of 50 million Saints.
And if that many died for their faith, how many should we guess gave up their faith out
of fear of torture and death? Two, three times as many, or more?
He was worshiped and feared by the whole world, he is no longer feared now, because the Pope no
longer rules. His reign lasted from 565 A.D. till 1825 A.D.
And yes, the pope is the Antichrist.IM4Truth
I find it rather sad that prophecy does not get any attention. Why have you Nick not come back and discuss what my Husband said? Is it more important to talk about Satan? Or the trinity which has gone around and around? Oh, well my Husband tried this before and stopped posting. Will it happen again?
IreneHi Irene,
I hope Georg doesn't stop posting. It could be that there are not enough of us who understand prophesy to comment on it. Like I said, for me, it's like Georg is bringing steak to the table and I'm showing up with chips-n-dip!
I cannot add anything because I don't fully understand it.Is there any other topic he is interested in?
Love to you both,
MandyQuote (Irene @ July 01 2008,00:33) And yes, the pope is the Antichrist.
But isn't the Antichrist supposed to be able to bring all the people together? There are not enough people on the earth who embrace the Pope for this to happen? Right?Quote (gollamudi @ July 01 2008,17:56) I also feel we should not put Pope in the place of Anti-christ.
Oh, I don't know if he is or isn't. I've just always understood the anti-christ as being someone who would be a smooth talker and who would bring peace and would be able to convince the nations. The Pope's are very old, feeble-looking men to me.Anyone for dip?
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