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The primary objective of this study, the Gospel of Matthew, is to determine what Matthew believed and preached concerning God and his Christ.
Many, since the apostles died, have believed and claimed that God is a Trinity for centuries now. Are they right? We need approved witnesses to tell us what Jesus preached. Matthew was such a witness. What did Jesus himself believe and teach concerning God and himself? Did Matthew believe Jesus to be GOD (and/or equal to God), or the only begotten son and anointed of God?
- a. Did Matthew believe God to be a triune being, i.e. God in three persons as defined by the Trinity Doctrine?
- b. Was God modal? i.e. a being who manifests himself as Father(OT), son (NT), and the Holy Spirit (NOW)?
- c. Is God a group practice, comprising of Father and Son? Add the “third person” of the Holy Spirit as needed.
I expect Matthew's Gospel to refute all of the above, and to reveal that:
1. God is EXCLUSIVELY the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ and of us all.
2. That the Lord Jesus is the Son and Messiah OF God, and NOT (the Highest) GOD himself.
3. I would expect Matthew's gospel to reveal the Jesus he knew and preached: the Jesus Christ who is the same yesterday, today and forever. The Jesus who never claimed equality with God, the one who is truly EXALTED to his greatest glory and yet remains subject to God.
4. Any claims to the sameness of substance of Christ and the Father citing the Holy Spirit must also by necessity acknowledge that:
- i. all of God's children are likewise born of and into that same Spirit of the Father through Christ, as even as Christ himself, and so that does not a Trinity make.
- ii. Trinitarians would be expected to show, whether Jesus gives the Holy Spirit to the Father or vice versa. Whether we give Jesus the Holy spirit or vice versa? This is to demonstrate our assertion, that the Spirit of God flows from one source in ORIGIN, i.e. the Father, and in a linear direction, from the greater to the smaller. From God Christ receives, and the apostles likewise received through Christ, as we. We do not give the holy spirit to the apostles nor does Christ give the Holy Spirit to the Father! This point is open for challenge, of course, or else it stands.
Scriptures from various parts of the bible may be used to interpret Matthew's Gospel or to address posters' claims.
I lovingly challenge Trinitarians etc to prove their doctrine through Matthew. I and others will attempt to prove our doctrine as well (#1 & 2).
God bless us all and let's begin. May we draw nearer to God in the Beloved and to one another through this process.
The Gospel According to Matthew
Mat 1:1 The record of the genealogy of Jesus the Messiah, the son of David, the son of Abraham: …
Mat 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows: when His mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together she was found to be with child by the Holy Spirit.
Mat 1:23 “BEHOLD, THE VIRGIN SHALL BE WITH CHILD AND SHALL BEAR A SON, AND THEY SHALL CALL HIS NAME IMMANUEL,” which translated means, “GOD WITH US.”
Trinitarians: It is very doubtful that men can give birth to God Almighty. Judge for yourselves. But God by his spirit, can give excellent gifts to men, in this case his only begotten son.Hi Cubes,
Mary gave birth to the Son of God.
He is the servant of God.
God does not serve himself.
Matt 12.15f“15But Jesus, aware of this, withdrew from there. Many followed Him, and (A)He healed them all,
16and (B)warned them not to tell who He was.
17This was to fulfill what was spoken through Isaiah the prophet:
18″©BEHOLD, MY SERVANT WHOM I HAVE CHOSEN;
(D)MY BELOVED IN WHOM MY SOUL is WELL-PLEASED;
(E)I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT UPON HIM,
(F)AND HE SHALL PROCLAIM JUSTICE TO THE GENTILES.
19″(G)HE WILL NOT QUARREL, NOR CRY OUT;
NOR WILL ANYONE HEAR HIS VOICE IN THE STREETS.
20″(H)A BATTERED REED HE WILL NOT BREAK OFF,
AND A SMOLDERING WICK HE WILL NOT PUT OUT,
UNTIL HE LEADS JUSTICE TO VICTORY.
21″(I)AND IN HIS NAME THE GENTILES WILL HOPE.”Hi Nick,
Yes, that was Matthew's testimony of Jesus: the Son of God who also is a servant and Prophet of God.
I asked a while back in one of these threads whether God was anyone's prophet and if so, whose? I don't think I ever got an answer.At least that silence is good!
Hi Cubes,
Would it be safe to say that the Father is God (Exodus3:15). The Son is God (Heb. 1:8). And that the HolySpirit is God (Act 5:3-4).
The Father is the God of His Son. When you were a young adult your father should have been head of the family. Your father and mother were in you. But your father is greater than you “honor your father”. The Son has all that of His Father but He honors His Father.
Phi 2:5 Have this mind in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phi 2:6 who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on an equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Phi 2:7 but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men;
1Co 15:28 And when all things have been subjected unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subjected to him that did subject all things unto him, that God may be all in all.That God may be all in all. The kingdom of heaven is with in you (luke 17:21). When we are born again then the kingdom becomes within us by the Holy Spirit. God will be all in all through His Holy Spirit. Does this say that the Holy Spirit is a separate person no not at all. The Holy Spirit is what makes the Father, Son, and us one (John 17:22).
Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:God is a Spirit the Holy Spirit has both Father and Son (John4:24).
Hi Kenrch,
You wrote: “God is a Spirit the Holy Spirit has both Father and Son (John4:24).”
Actually what scripture says is that God made Christ a life giving spirit. [1Corn 15:45]
says, “So it is written “The first man Adam became a living being; the last Adam, a life
giving spirit.” We all know Christ is the last Adam.So the Bible is not saying the Holy Spirit has both the Father and the Son. It is saying
that the Father and the Son THEMSELVES have holy spirit or the divine nature within them. This is also how Christ gives us HIS spirit, the holy spirit. This is also Chirst's baptism by fire that John foretold.“And with that he breathed on them and said “Receive the holy spirit.” [John 20:22]
Even though this was before Pentecost, Christ was showing them his ability to confer holy spirit to others. He did not give holy spirit to anyone during his earthly ministry. Later at Penetecost Christ poured out his spirit on all those who were present as described in Acts chapter 2. In this respect, holy spirit is analogous to holy oil in the scriptures. It is said to be poured out, filling people, etc. which would not be indicative of God Himself but His divine power. Something that both He and Christ have.
Remember, there are no caps or lowercase letters in Greek. The translators made the determiniation as to whether the text was speaking of God Himself as The Holy Spirit, (the giver) or His divine nature (the gift), which He gave to Christ and now to us through Jesus, i.e. holy spirit. Often these capitilizations were made according to the theological beliefs of the translator, most of which as we know, were trinitarians.
Great posts everybody. Cubes and Nick, you rock as always!
Blessings,
Semmy
Posted: July 24 2006,17:21
——————————————————————————–
Hi Kenrch,You wrote: “God is a Spirit the Holy Spirit has both Father and Son (John4:24).”
Actually what scripture says is that God made Christ a life giving spirit. [1Corn 15:45]
says, “So it is written “The first man Adam became a living being; the last Adam, a life
giving spirit.” We all know Christ is the last Adam.So the Bible is not saying the Holy Spirit has both the Father and the Son. It is saying
that the Father and the Son THEMSELVES have holy spirit or the divine nature within them. This is also how Christ gives us HIS spirit, the holy spirit. This is also Chirst's baptism by fire that John foretold.Ok the Father and Son have the Same Spirit!
Hi ,
God is spirit.
God lives in Heaven which is His throne.
God's Spirit is as the finger of God [Lk 11], not living within Him surely, but Himself in all His nature infusing His creation.
That Spirit of God was poured in the fullness into Christ such that those who saw Christ saw God revealed in him as well in nature and in power-Jn 14.
That Spirit is now poured into Christ's body sharing that nature and those powers among the parts of that body making them one so that together we make up a temple dwelling of God in the Spirit-Eph 2.21f.
Thus to lie to or to blaspheme the Spirit is to do the same to God.
The Spirit is not just the power of God but the power and the nature.
Acts 10 38
” You know of Jesus of Nazareth, how God anointed him with
the Holy Spirit
and
with Power
and how he went about doing good and healing all those who were oppresssed by the devil
for
God was WITH HIM”Hope this helps.
Hi cubes,
Jesus was filled with the Spirit of God.
Yet here he differentiates between the vessel of the Son of Man and the contents of the vessel, the treasure of the Spirit of God.Matt 12.31f
“(A)Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven.32″(B)Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in Âthis age or in the age to come.”
Quote (kenrch @ July 24 2006,19:50) Hi Cubes, Would it be safe to say that the Father is God (Exodus3:15). The Son is God (Heb. 1:8). And that the HolySpirit is God (Act 5:3-4).
The Father is the God of His Son. When you were a young adult your father should have been head of the family. Your father and mother were in you. But your father is greater than you “honor your father”. The Son has all that of His Father but He honors His Father.
Phi 2:5 Have this mind in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phi 2:6 who, existing in the form of God, counted not the being on an equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Phi 2:7 but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men;
1Co 15:28 And when all things have been subjected unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subjected to him that did subject all things unto him, that God may be all in all.That God may be all in all. The kingdom of heaven is with in you (luke 17:21). When we are born again then the kingdom becomes within us by the Holy Spirit. God will be all in all through His Holy Spirit. Does this say that the Holy Spirit is a separate person no not at all. The Holy Spirit is what makes the Father, Son, and us one (John 17:22).
Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:God is a Spirit the Holy Spirit has both Father and Son (John4:24).
Hi Ken,Here's another way of looking at it and affirming what has been said already by yourself, Semmy & Nick.
- From the Father to Christ:
Jhn 5:26 For as the Father has LIFE in Himself, so He has GRANTED the Son to have LIFE in Himself, 27 and has GIVEN Him authority to execute judgment also, because He is the Son of Man.
- From the Father to us:
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He GAVE His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting LIFE.
- From Christ to us, according to the Father's will:
John 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He GAVE the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
GIVE/GRANT = DIDOMI = 13251) to give
2) to give something to someone
a) of one's own accord to give one something, to his advantage
1) to bestow a gift
b) to grant, give to one asking, let have
c) to supply, furnish, necessary things
d) to give over, deliver
1) to reach out, extend, present
2) of a writing
3) to give over to one's care, intrust, commit
a) something to be administered
b) to give or commit to some one something to be religiously observed
e) to give what is due or obligatory, to pay: wages or reward
f) to furnish, endue
3) to give
a) to cause, profuse, give forth from one's self
1) to give, hand out lots
b) to appoint to an office
c) to cause to come forth, i.e. as the sea, death and Hell are said to give up the dead who have been engulfed or received by them
c) to give one to someone as his own
1) as an object of his saving care
2) to give one to someone, to follow him as a leader and master
3) to give one to someone to care for his interests
4) to give one to someone to whom he already belonged, to return
4) to grant or permit one
a) to commission
Quote (kenrch @ July 24 2006,22:31) Posted: July 24 2006,17:21 ——————————————————————————–
Hi Kenrch,You wrote: “God is a Spirit the Holy Spirit has both Father and Son (John4:24).”
Actually what scripture says is that God made Christ a life giving spirit. [1Corn 15:45]
says, “So it is written “The first man Adam became a living being; the last Adam, a life
giving spirit.” We all know Christ is the last Adam.So the Bible is not saying the Holy Spirit has both the Father and the Son. It is saying
that the Father and the Son THEMSELVES have holy spirit or the divine nature within them. This is also how Christ gives us HIS spirit, the holy spirit. This is also Chirst's baptism by fire that John foretold.Ok the Father and Son have the Same Spirit!
Hi Ken,Do you acknowledge that the Spirit is the Father's to begin with, and that it is he who gives this spirit to his Son? This is one reason why the Father is the True (Highest) God.
Quote Would it be safe to say that the Father is God (Exodus3:15). The Son is God (Heb. 1:8). And that the HolySpirit is God (Act 5:3-4). It would be safest to know the Father is the only True God. But just to finish your sentence …: The Father is God (The Spirit is his own Spirit, as his own grace, mercy, wisdom and power). The Son is [a] God as you've shown; and the children of the Most high are [similiarly] God(s) Ps 82.6, John 10:35. So out of the list, there can be only one God, and that is the Father because all live and are sustained by the Spirit that he gives.
Yes, Yes, Yes Kenrch, Nick and Cubes!
Exactly! Good point Nick about the holy spirit being more than just
“God's active force” as the JW's call it.It is the POWER of God AND His divine nature through which He
filled and empowered Christ who then is able to fill and empower us.
Remember too all of this infusing and filling with holy spirit is for us to
DO something. This is why Christ said we would do even greater works
than he did:“I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing.
He will do even greater things than these because I am going to the Father.” [John 4:12]Our Lord had a limited amount of time in his ministry but said he would do anything we ask
in his name so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. [John 4:13] The whole point
of EVERYTHING we do, is to glorify God the Father because that is just what Jesus' earthly
ministry did. We are now Christ's hands, feet and eyes here on earth. That is why he said
if we had faith in him, we would be doing what he had been doing, exalting the Father.Problems have come because many Christians have forgotten that. They are writing songs such as
Matt Redman's, “I'm coming back to the heart of worship and it's all about YOU JESUS.”
What??? See, this why the power is so lacking for Christians to bring glory to the Father.
They have ignored our Lord's words that “true worshippers would worship the FATHER” [John 4:21]
and cease to glorify God as he did. So there is failure in accomplishing the focus of the
ministry. The Gospel of Jesus Christ IS the glorification, elucidation and exaltation of the Father through him.Cubes, very nice layout and clear presentation of information on the transfer of holy spirit
from one “vessel” to another. Thanks too for the Strong's word study. Very complete.Well, I have seminary homework, (again), guys.
At least I received my CLERGY parking placard today so I get to use the reserved spots! Bless everybody here,
Semmy
Brilliant Cubes,
You wrote:
It would be safest to know the Father is the only True God. But just to finish your sentence …: The Father is God (The Spirit is his own Spirit, as his own grace, mercy, wisdom and power). The Son is [a] God as you've shown; and the children of the Most high are [similiarly] God(s) Ps 82.6, John 10:35. So out of the list, there can be only one God, and that is the Father because all live and are sustained by the Spirit that he gives.
Excellent summary of the point.
Semmy
Thanks, Semmy. Homework. Ughh… but that's why you've got the packing spot and I don't! Be of good cheer and do something fun on your breaks.
Hi kenrch,
You ask:
“Would it be safe to say that the Father is God (Exodus3:15). The Son is God (Heb. 1:8). And that the HolySpirit is God (Act 5:3-4).”
Yes and no.
This is the false logic that led to the befuddled minds of the second century they are all in one being and to denty the existence of the Son of God which in turn denies God is the Father and God of Jesus. 2000 years on their teachings are still top of the hit parade and they follow their blind leaders into Satan's ditches.Their leaders, out of fear of being termed polytheists, still use the term God to mean only God, the Father and yet there are many gods according to scripture. Thus they claim any refernece to Jesus as divine as saying he is part of our God. From God's point of view there are no other Gods. For us there are no other Gods but the Father.
But any being greater than men can be termed a god . Even men with divine responsibilities are called gods in scripture so it depends on the point of view.
The divine origins of Jesus were shed when he partook of flesh[Phil2] to become exactly like us[except for sin] We are not divine beings so to become like us he cannot have been on earth either. Peter and John and James were privileged to see that glory restored for a time on the mountain, but he did not receive it again till he returned to heaven.
Hi cubes,
Jesus taught about God and quoted God.
If he was that God why would he quote God?
Why would he not just speak in the first person?Matt 15 3-4
“3And He answered and said to them, “Why do you yourselves transgress the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition?4″For God said, '(A)HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER,' and, '(B)HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH.'”
Hi cubes,
Why does Jesus differentiate between himself and Father if they are the same in being?
He shows us the same as Paul did in 1Cor 8 that the Father is our God and Jesus is our Lord.Matt 23.9-10
“9”Do not call anyone on earth your father; for (A)One is your Father, He who is in heaven.10″Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ.”
Hi Cubes,
If Jesus is coequal to the Father in a trinity why would Matthew show that Jesus had to appeal to the Father to send angels to his aid?
Matt 26.53
” Or do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father, and He will at once put at my disposal more than 12 legions of angels?”Hi cubes,
Matthew shows Jesus praying to the Father God and saying that his Father is Lord of heaven and earth and that all he has has come from the Father.
No equal trinity nonsense here.
Matt 11. 25f
“(A)At that time Jesus said, “I praise You, (B)Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that ÂYou have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants.
26″Yes, (D)Father, for this way was well-pleasing in Your sight.27″(E)All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father (F)except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him”
Matthew 2
Here is a major Trinity flaw:
If the Trinity holds that to them also there is but one GOD as the word teaches, I am happy to oblige. The bible says that God is unchanging [has no shadow of turning in him] is eternal, a consuming fire. God at all times is complete and …completely GOD we would all agree.
Let's hold that thought for a moment:
- Trinitarians say that God came to be born by humans.
- God then had to be protected from his rival Herod who sought to DESTROY him.
- God then had to go into hiding in Egypt for a while till things calmed down.
- It was never really safe for God to return home so he took up permanent residence in Galilee until his mission here was finished.
What's worse, Matthew does not appear to recognize GOD for if he did, he would not ascribe to him prophecies that relate to [hu]men:
Matt 2:66 'But you, Bethlehem, in the land of Judah,
Are not the least among the rulers of Judah;
For out of you shall come a Ruler
Who will shepherd My people Israel.'”*
(Is 9:6… a child is born and GIVEN)
Matt 2:14 When he arose, he took the young Child and His mother by night and departed for Egypt, 15 and was there until the death of Herod, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, “Out of Egypt I called My Son.”*
(Moses had to be hidden, protected, later raised in the house of Pharoah (Egypt); his mother was there to nurse him as was Jesus'. God later called his children from Egypt… Jesus likewise was called out of Egypt and commissioned to bring many children to salvation).
Matt 2:17 Then was fulfilled what was spoken by Jeremiah the prophet, saying:18 “A voice was heard in Ramah,
Lamentation, weeping, and great mourning,
Rachel weeping for her children,
Refusing to be comforted,
Because they are no more.”*Many baby boys were killed during the infancy of Moses as in that of Yeshua.
All in all, I see God in heaven being God and unchanging. I see his servants on the earth carrying out his will by his spirit, attesting that it is he who is God and no other. (Rev 15:3f)
That's the message Matthew conveys here to me.
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