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Peace
Very well put
I do agree with you that Jesus was God but not completely and he will give back everything he was given so The Father may be All in All.jesus as we mere man know him only when god's spirit placed the spirit seed in mary that is correct.
i was now thinking, that jesus was refered to as THE WORD and God created al through him. no mention of the HOLY SPIRIT. yet th holy spirit of/from god is what does all his things. also holy spirit is called THE WORD. so iit is my understanding then that they are allone with god as jesus said and there wills are the same but they are not t obe worshiped or equaled in that respect because its from the father figure that things are, that is why he is only to be worshiped. so in fact the two others are part of god himself. i really think that these connections speak truth and show the complexity and greatness how god works.
all this time i only accepted that god is fahter jesus is son nad thats that. but to analize it and see the nature of all on connection to one another really does come to sight.
i still think that even if one thinks they are connected that way or if one thinks as the illistrtion of actual son is fine too. if one only worships the father as the almighty and all things are from him and jesus for his role and salvation is all the same outcome.
christ came and started a new covenant, christianity was born and all those within that realm being done whole heart and mind your doing his will.
i have now felt inside that having this new aspect or insight has made my heart rejoice more. true love is coming forth from me and is leading my being towards love and compassion. i feel that i am actually living for god as one should.
this feels good, i don't feel so alone or doomed or burdened on lifes woes that come to me.
peace to all
Quote (karmarie @ Dec. 27 2009,12:12) Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 28 2009,06:32) I will give a weak example from the physical realm that only gives a poor glimpse of how He is able to be one. Take H2O. It is found in three distinct states. Liquid, steam and ice, all H2O.
I agree with this bit here, or like light from the sun, all being from the same source, so all able to be called HTO or Sun.How each individual percieves God Son Holy Spirit is different too, and also can be influenced by things like reading which can all confuse ones perspective.
So, H2O PROVES a Trinitarian god?Quote (Constitutionalist @ Dec. 29 2009,04:05) Quote (karmarie @ Dec. 27 2009,12:12) Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 28 2009,06:32) I will give a weak example from the physical realm that only gives a poor glimpse of how He is able to be one. Take H2O. It is found in three distinct states. Liquid, steam and ice, all H2O.
I agree with this bit here, or like light from the sun, all being from the same source, so all able to be called HTO or Sun.How each individual percieves God Son Holy Spirit is different too, and also can be influenced by things like reading which can all confuse ones perspective.
So, H2O PROVES a Trinitarian god?
yes CON that is exactly what was said.you read what it said, it said it was a weak example. noone can fully comprehend or challange god's exsistance or the methods he chooses to use, thats the point. but it is a example to look at for those who are not even trying to see the closer ties they have.
it just shows a way that someting can be the same but in different quality.
it s not a awesome pefect example nor was it even trying to be one.
i did not write it. sbub your nose at it , i don't care
Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 27 2009,05:55) Quote (david @ Dec. 27 2009,19:05) Quote The preposition “through” in John 1:3 means “by DIRECT agency” because it says that not one thing came into being without Him. The Word was not the first thing created and then the intermediate agent in the rest of creation. He was the immediate or direct agent in creation because not one thing came into being without Him. –thinker.
There is a host of scriptures that speak of Jesus as being the firstborn of creation, etc. (But we've all had that discussion a hundred times.)
I have a question for you thinker. Did Jesus use God's holy spirit to create everything?
i think that firstborn can relate to being the first of something. doesn't mean they had to be created first, but was before all came to be. don't think there is a scripture that says the holy spirit or jesus were created or made. that they are eternal and have always been.Quote don't think there is a scripture that says the holy spirit or jesus were created or made. that they are eternal and have always been. Don't think, read and believe.
And Ya`akov begat Yosef the husband of Miryam, of whom was born [gennaō] [YNG/begotten] Yeshua, who is called Messiah. Matthew 1:16
Gennaō: 1) Of women giving birth to children, a) of Yahweh making Yeshua his son, b) of Yahweh making men his sons through faith in Yeshua's work. Begat / Be Born / Bear / Gender / Bring Forth / Be Delivered. From Genos: 1) kindred, a) offspring.
Now when Yeshua was born [gennaō] in Beit-Lechem of Yehudah in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Yerushalayim, Matthew 2:1
And the angel answered and said unto her, The Ruach HaKodesh shall come upon thee, and the power of Ha`Elyon shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born [gennaō] of thee shall be called the Son of 'Elohim. Luke 1:35
For unto you is born [gennaō] this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is the annointed the Lord. Luke 2:11
Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Yeshua answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born [gennaō], and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice. John 18:37
Pilate therefore said to him, “Are you a king then?” Yeshua answered, “You say that I am a king. For this reason I have been born, and for this reason I have come into the world, that I should testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth listens to my voice.” HNV
Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 28 2009,09:19) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Dec. 29 2009,04:05) Quote (karmarie @ Dec. 27 2009,12:12) Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 28 2009,06:32) I will give a weak example from the physical realm that only gives a poor glimpse of how He is able to be one. Take H2O. It is found in three distinct states. Liquid, steam and ice, all H2O.
I agree with this bit here, or like light from the sun, all being from the same source, so all able to be called HTO or Sun.How each individual percieves God Son Holy Spirit is different too, and also can be influenced by things like reading which can all confuse ones perspective.
So, H2O PROVES a Trinitarian god?
yes CON that is exactly what was said.you read what it said, it said it was a weak example. noone can fully comprehend or challange god's exsistance or the methods he chooses to use, thats the point. but it is a example to look at for those who are not even trying to see the closer ties they have.
it just shows a way that someting can be the same but in different quality.
it s not a awesome pefect example nor was it even trying to be one.
i did not write it. sbub your nose at it , i don't care
I can totally comprehend H2O in any of its states, Water when it expands becomes ice, when it condenses becomes vapour [steam]. The density of water is dependent on its temperature.Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 29 2009,03:18) i have now felt inside that having this new aspect or insight has made my heart rejoice more. true love is coming forth from me and is leading my being towards love and compassion. i feel that i am actually living for god as one should. this feels good, i don't feel so alone or doomed or burdened on lifes woes that come to me.
peace to all
peace2all,
Jesus Christ is God in the flesh. The Bible is very clear about this. I rejoice that your eyes have been opened to this truth. Those who deny that Jesus is God in the flesh do so because to them God Himself cannot become immanent (near to us). They think that God had to send a mere man to do what God Himself could not do.God can personally become near to us and He did become near to us. Jesus was “Immanuel” (God Himself with us).
This is why the burdens are being lifted from you because you know in yourself that God Himself became with us and in Himself took your burdens. Jesus said,
“28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls Matthew” (11:28-29)
Jesus said that He Himself would carry your burdens and give you rest. Only God could make such a claim!
My heart is rejoicing because of you! WJ and I will be here to encourage you and to meet the onslaughts of Christ's enemies.
bless you,
your brother Jack
thanks jack.
i don't think that those are enemies of christ but just are holding a view that they see to fit. i think thats ok too as long as only the father is worshiped as GOD and the son is put in what position GOD had chose for his relationship..i don't think that its a issue that leads one astray or changes there view on both. just all the fighting and argueing seems now pointless and we should be united togther in the core value we both have. which is the father is worshiped as GOD and the son is held to his own positon and worship in faith as our way to god and his kingdom.
my eyes have been opened from different views from not just one religion, but really one faith.
thats my take on it, we all want and do the same thing.
i haven't seen or heard the triune view as that one worships all the same, there still is order and positions of each and how they are to be worshiped, just that it give a history and backing t othem all not just saying god is god and jesus is son
Jack,my name is Ron by the way.
its not as if that view is making false gods or more than the GOD . seems more like the history of their relationship adn how it is formed and in union.
now i'm at the point which place of worship i should go to, to continue my journey. i see that most branches ,methodist,baptists,luthern or whatever are all pretty close.
does anyone know of methodists. i read about them on wikipedia and it sems to all sound good. i'm not familiar with whats out there. anyone have any insight.
should one try to go to a few and see what feels right?
thanks
Hi WJ and thethinker:
Jesus is not the creator. He is, however, building the Holy Temple of God.
Quote Hbr 1:1 ¶ God 2316, who at sundry times 4181 and 2532 in divers manners 4187 spake 2980 in time past 3819 unto the fathers 3962 by 1722 the prophets 4396,
Hbr 1:2 Hath 2980 0 in 1909 these 5130 last 2078 days 2250 spoken 2980 unto us 2254 by 1722 [his] Son 5207, whom 3739 he hath appointed 5087 heir 2818 of all things 3956, by 1223 whom 3739 also 2532 he made 4160 the worlds 165;Quote Hbr 3:4 For 1063 every 3956 house 3624 is builded 2680 by 5259 some 5100 [man]; but 1161 he that built 2680 all things 3956 [is] God 2316. Hbr 3:5 And 2532 Moses 3475 verily 3303 [was] faithful 4103 in 1722 all 3650 his 846 house 3624, as 5613 a servant 2324, for 1519 a testimony 3142 of those things which were to be spoken after 2980 ;
Hbr 3:6 But 1161 Christ 5547 as 5613 a son 5207 over 1909 his own 846 house 3624; whose 3739 house 3624 are 2070 we 2249, if 1437 4007 we hold fast 2722 the confidence 3954 and 2532 the rejoicing 2745 of the hope 1680 firm 949 unto 3360 the end 5056.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (peace2all @ Dec. 29 2009,05:38) thanks jack.
i don't think that those are enemies of christ but just are holding a view that they see to fit. i think thats ok too as long as only the father is worshiped as GOD and the son is put in what position GOD had chose for his relationship..i don't think that its a issue that leads one astray or changes there view on both. just all the fighting and argueing seems now pointless and we should be united togther in the core value we both have. which is the father is worshiped as GOD and the son is held to his own positon and worship in faith as our way to god and his kingdom.
my eyes have been opened from different views from not just one religion, but really one faith.
thats my take on it, we all want and do the same thing.
i haven't seen or heard the triune view as that one worships all the same, there still is order and positions of each and how they are to be worshiped, just that it give a history and backing t othem all not just saying god is god and jesus is son
peace2all,One cannot worship the Father without worshiping the Son. The Father committed all judgment to the Son in order that “all men should honor the Son EVEN AS they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who who sent Him” (John 5:22-23).
WJ and I have have warned many here over and over again but they will not listen.
Anyway, my heart rejoices regarding you though we see those differently who reject Christ.
thinker
Marty said:
Quote Hi WJ and thethinker: Jesus is not the creator. He is, however, building the Holy Temple of God.
Marty,
The Father Himself disagrees with you. He attributes the creation TO THE SON saying,You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Heb. 1:10
This is the Father's own testimony!
thinker
Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 29 2009,03:13) holy spirit is called THE WORD.
Hi Peace to all,Your eyes are truly beginning to open!
That is exactly who John 1:1 is referring to as “The Word”(HolySpirit)!God bless you
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Dec. 29 2009,10:18) Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 29 2009,03:13) holy spirit is called THE WORD.
Hi Peace to all,Your eyes are truly beginning to open!
That is exactly who John 1:1 is referring to as “The Word”(HolySpirit)!God bless you
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
ED J,
The Word is not the Holy Spirit. The Word became flesh the Holy Spirit did not. The Holy Spirit is under the authority of Christ (John 16).thinker
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 29 2009,08:47) hi p2
the clubs are open to anyone make your pick and keep your mouth shut.
what ?Quote (thethinker @ Dec. 29 2009,10:06) Marty said: Quote Hi WJ and thethinker: Jesus is not the creator. He is, however, building the Holy Temple of God.
Marty,
The Father Himself disagrees with you. He attributes the creation TO THE SON saying,You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Heb. 1:10
This is the Father's own testimony!
thinker
Hi thethinker:Jesus did not exist as a sentient person in the beginning but God made all things with him in mind, and so this verse of scripture can either mean that God created all things with him in mind or it can mean in the sense that he is building the Holy Temple of God, and from the beginning God has forseen this. I tend to think that it refers to the latter because this is being spoken to him at the time he is being exalted to the head of the church.
Hebrews 1:2 states that God created all thing through him:
Quote Hbr 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world. Here in Job God states that “He” (Jehovah) laid the foundations of the earth:
Quote Job 38:1 Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind and said: Job 38:2 “Who is this that darkens counsel by words without knowledge?
Job 38:3 “Dress for action [fn] like a man; I will question you, and you make it known to me.
Job 38:4 “Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell me, if you have understanding.
Job 38:5 “Who determined its measurements–surely you know! Or who stretched the line upon it?
Job 38:6 “On what were its bases sunk, or who laid its cornerstone,
Genesis 1 also states that God created the heaven and the earth and all of the host thereof.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (thethinker @ Dec. 29 2009,10:42) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 29 2009,10:18) Quote (peace2all @ Dec. 29 2009,03:13) holy spirit is called THE WORD.
Hi Peace to all,Your eyes are truly beginning to open!
That is exactly who John 1:1 is referring to as “The Word”(HolySpirit)!God bless you
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
ED J,
The Word is not the Holy Spirit. The Word became flesh the Holy Spirit did not. The Holy Spirit is under the authority of Christ (John 16).thinker
they both seem to be coming forth from god himself. there is no creation or begining of them both in the bible that i can see. they are connected of part of god from what i see.jesus was not jesus of god's son before the holy spirit, god's spirit made the spirit seed in mary.
what was he before. only called the word. but that the word was god also. holy spirit is called the word too. all of god's creations and actions and essence of what he is is what the holy spirit or god's spirit is.
so it really seems to me that they are all connceted not as specific individuals completely different as difference substance or knowledge but part of or extension of whatever god chosses to do with them in achieving his will.
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