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Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2014,20:46) @ 4Thomas If Jesus came from God then he would likely have the nature of God. It is written that although he existed in the form of God, he emptied himself, and came in the flesh.
This was never meant to teach that Jesus is God, but that God was his Father and he came from him, thus possessing the only nature that was in existence before creation.
People get confused over the nature of God and being God. Adam was in nature man. Eve was in nature man (mankind). But Eve is not Adam. Similarly, Jesus may possess the nature of God, but he is not God. He is the glory of God and the son of God.
Think about the word “OF”. It means something that the Trinity Doctrine turns a blind eye to.
If you are teaching the Trinity, then your doctrine leads you to this view.
The Son of God.
The Spirit of God.
…So far we agree, but not the next step.
The Father of God.I believe as we should, that the Father is God.
The Trinity would have us believe that there is one God, the Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
Thus the Father of God, the Son of God, the Spirit of God.
I strongly disagree with that doctrine.
Hi T8God is revealed also as having a nature because he is revealed as having a one and only Son.
Are you saying that God doesn't have a nature?
All things have a nature.
Things of flesh, humans, dogs, monkeys.
Spirit beings, angels, arch angels and the other named angels, i want to try to spell them because my spelling isnt the best.Humans have a nature, female and male
In the beginning was the Eve, and Eve was with Man[Adam], and the Eve was Man [human].
scripture teaches that both adam and eve were named man [human]
Genesis 5:1-2
This is the book of the generations of Adam. When God created man, he made him in the likeness of God. Male and female he created them, and he blessed them and named them Man when they were created.need to go lit me know if you want me to explain what i believe in more detail
Daniel
4Thomas.
You are avoiding my questions.
I see that you are not of the sda,just agree with their teachings.
What is your base?Spiritual Jerusalem is not the whore.
She is sitting on the beast with 7heads.
7 empires. The first was Egypt,the 7th is today,now.
Jerusalem was NOT in the days of Egypt.The 8th is of the 7th; its coming,and its at the door.
The NWO is coming out of todays Roman empire.Jesus is the saviour our Lord,the Son of God.
SO; YOU DONT AGREE THAT:
1. The vatican is the whore.
2.The pope is the antichrist;false prophet.
3.Babylon is not just the catholics/vatican.
4.The mark of the beast is a spiritual mark: but
a physical mark.
5.The mark is sunday worship.
6.That allah is God.YHWH.PLEASE ANSWER.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 18 2014,11:03) 4Thomas. You are avoiding my questions.
I see that you are not of the sda,just agree with their teachings.
What is your base?Spiritual Jerusalem is not the whore.
She is sitting on the beast with 7heads.
7 empires. The first was Egypt,the 7th is today,now.
Jerusalem was NOT in the days of Egypt.The 8th is of the 7th; its coming,and its at the door.
The NWO is coming out of todays Roman empire.Jesus is the saviour our Lord,the Son of God.
SO; YOU DONT AGREE THAT:
1. The vatican is the whore.
2.The pope is the antichrist;false prophet.
3.Babylon is not just the catholics/vatican.
4.The mark of the beast is a spiritual mark: but
a physical mark.
5.The mark is sunday worship.
6.That allah is God.YHWH.PLEASE ANSWER.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,SO; YOU DONT AGREE THAT:
1. The vatican is the whore. > NO
2.The pope is the antichrist;false prophet. >NO
3.Babylon is not just the catholics/vatican. >NO
4.The mark of the beast is a spiritual mark: but
a physical mark.
5.The mark is sunday worship. >NO the early church worshipped on Sunday, there is much proof, it also was the day Jesus raised from the dead [new day of rest], it was the day of Pentecost6.That allah is God.YHWH. >NO
Wakeup, all i'm saying is that SDA people have a solid foundation now they believe that Jesus is God by nature, they believe he is THE one and only true Son of God. I'm very good friends with a SDA pastor.
Colossians 2:16
16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.I dont let anyone judge me about the sabbath above because it was a Shadow of thing to come that are found in christ
Wakeup, its great that Jesus is your Lord and savior
Do you love Jesus with all your heart soul and mind?
Please answerDaniel.
I have a lot on so need to take a break from here very soon
4Thomas.
Thank you for responding.
But the sda teaches all those things Thomas.
So where do you stand?wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 18 2014,10:35) If the sda is that good;
1.Then why do the preach that allah is also God?
2.Why do some pray in mosques?Wakeup, you need to get your facts straight before making such statements.
I have looked and looked and found only a few sites talking about what you are saying (that Adventists call Allah God or worship in Mosques.)
From what I have seen, the few pastors who say this are meaning that the 'word' for “God” in Arabic is “Allah”, which is a fact! Even Arabic speaking Christians have “Allah” for “God” in their Bibles.
Also, Muslims believe in the God of the Scriptures, though they have errors of belief. But so do Christians!!
Also, you have to understand that Adventists are ALL about EVANGELIZING (Spreading the word, reaching the unreachable).
Even Paul says in 1Cor 9:20…” I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them. To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews………….To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some!”
Of course by doing that, many could go against them, through misunderstanding. But who's will are we doing? Do we do things to be liked by the world?
I do not speak for the Adventists because I am not one, but I will be!
Quote
5. Babylon is the catholic church,which contradicts
revelation?(18:4).
For Jesus is not coming just to destroy
the vatican, catholics, and sunday worshippers: but the
world system of things.
Babylon is the world.The angel said: come out of her my people.
Is he only speaking to christian catholics and all sunday worshippers?, OR TO THE WHOLE WORLD?
For babylon is the world system of things.
The angel is speaking to all people of the world.Again, Wakeup, please do your homework BEFORE making these statements.
From what I have heard, the Adventists believe that the Second Beast is the US and other European Nations. That at the return of Christ, EVERYTHING will be burnt with fire and destroyed, whilst the remnant will rise to meet Jesus in the air to go to Heaven.
Again, don't quote me on that because I may have it wrong, but something similar to that!
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 18 2014,16:06) 4Thomas. Thank you for responding.
But the sda teaches all those things Thomas.
So where do you stand?wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,I'm not a SDA member
Most SDA churches Love's Jesus with all their heart soul and mind – so they are built on Christ –
– let Christ be the judge of them, don't Judge them.
You should be encouraging 2besee for he has found Christ and has a greater Love for him, Love for Jesus has assured his salvation. Praise be to Jehovah.
Wakeup, every Church or organisation has good and bad. The weeds and the wheat grow together.
Jesus wants unity between Churches and i'm all for unity for those who love him.
You still havn't answered my question, do you love Jesus, **the** one and only-begotten God – “your Lord” with all your heart soul and mind Please answer
Love in Jesus and his name – who is Jehovah [the Son]
DanielQuote (4Thomas @ Feb. 19 2014,09:51) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 18 2014,16:06) 4Thomas. Thank you for responding.
But the sda teaches all those things Thomas.
So where do you stand?wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,I'm not a SDA member
Most SDA churches Love's Jesus with all their heart soul and mind – so they are built on Christ –
– let Christ be the judge of them, don't Judge them.
You should be encouraging 2besee for he has found Christ and has a greater Love for him, Love for Jesus has assured his salvation. Praise be to Jehovah.
Wakeup, every Church or organisation has good and bad. The weeds and the wheat grow together.
Jesus wants unity between Churches and i'm all for unity for those who love him.
You still havn't answered my question, do you love Jesus, **the** one and only-begotten God – “your Lord” with all your heart soul and mind Please answer
Love in Jesus and his name – who is Jehovah [the Son]
Daniel
4Thomas.I dont only love Him: I worship Him.
He is my life saver.I also make sure I dont teach error on His behalf. To Love Christ but teach error about Him is not love.
But just lip service.Why is the word *Judge* so easilly splashed everytime
I try to correct some wrong doctrine?1.Do you agree that the sda always focuses on the
SABATH AND THE TEN COMMANDMENTS?2.Have you noticed that the JW'S always focuses on the
name JEHOVAH. Because they call themsleves by that
name.3.There must be a true church.
As you say none of them are fool proof,and we have
learned to accept that. Jesus will sort them out when
He comes.NOT SO; We must present our selves foolproof
when He comes. We have only one HS teacher.Not many.4.The idea is to present ourselves blameless.
Teaching sound doctrine.Titus 1:13 This witness is true. ***Wherefore rebuke them sharply***, that they may be *sound in the faith*;
Titus 2:1 But speak thou the things which become **sound doctrine**:
Titus 2:2 That the aged men be sober, grave, temperate, sound in faith, in charity, in patience.
Titus 2:8 Sound speech, that **cannot be condemned**; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 19 2014,12:49) Quote (4Thomas @ Feb. 19 2014,09:51) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 18 2014,16:06) 4Thomas. Thank you for responding.
But the sda teaches all those things Thomas.
So where do you stand?wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,I'm not a SDA member
Most SDA churches Love's Jesus with all their heart soul and mind – so they are built on Christ –
– let Christ be the judge of them, don't Judge them.
You should be encouraging 2besee for he has found Christ and has a greater Love for him, Love for Jesus has assured his salvation. Praise be to Jehovah.
Wakeup, every Church or organisation has good and bad. The weeds and the wheat grow together.
Jesus wants unity between Churches and i'm all for unity for those who love him.
You still havn't answered my question, do you love Jesus, **the** one and only-begotten God – “your Lord” with all your heart soul and mind Please answer
Love in Jesus and his name – who is Jehovah [the Son]
Daniel
4Thomas.I dont only love Him: I worship Him.
He is my life saver.I also make sure I dont teach error on His behalf. To Love Christ but teach error about Him is not love.
But just lip service.Why is the word *Judge* so easilly splashed everytime
I try to correct some wrong doctrine?1.Do you agree that the sda always focuses on the
SABATH AND THE TEN COMMANDMENTS?2.Have you noticed that the JW'S always focuses on the
name JEHOVAH. Because they call themsleves by that
name.3.There must be a true church.
As you say none of them are fool proof,and we have
learned to accept that. Jesus will sort them out when
He comes.NOT SO; We must present our selves foolproof
when He comes. We have only one HS teacher.Not many.4.The idea is to present ourselves blameless.
Teaching sound doctrine.Titus 1:13 This witness is true. ***Wherefore rebuke them sharply***, that they may be *sound in the faith*;
Titus 2:1 But speak thou the things which become **sound doctrine**:
Titus 2:2 That the aged men be sober, grave, temperate, sound in faith, in charity, in patience.
Titus 2:8 Sound speech, that **cannot be condemned**; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.
wakeup.
Thanks Wakeup,What I mean is we should be praising God that 2besee, now Loves Jesus with all his heart soul and mind – he is humble enough to admit this. 2besee understands that the SDA's dont have everything completely right that why he made the following statement
Daniel, I went to church today (first time in ages), the Seventh Day Adventists, the place I love to go, where God drew me years ago. I don't agree with everything, but I do agree with one thing mainly – God's spirit is there, I feel God there, and I always learn something.
It is impossible to allign all the different Churches to a complete unity -BUT- we should have unity that Jesus is *THE* one and only true Son of God by nature.
There is a time that will come when most of the world will reject Jesus as the messiah and when the false messiah trys to take his place we must at least have unity on the solid foundation of Christ.If someone doesnt eat meet or blood or teaches one day more holy than another, let God look into there hearts because, even if they have the wrong day their heart maybe honoring the Lord much more.
See its a sin to do something we think is wrong even if its not REALLY wrong. So lets focus our time on bring people to *the* Son of God.
Wakeup, do you worship the Son just as you Worship the Father?
I also worship God in the *one* spirit, the Holy Spirit where both the Father and Son dwell. The spirit nature that comes from the unbegotten Father to the begotten Son and in unity of Love and Life – is expressed as the person of the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete. The Jews didn't understand this because they didn't understand how Jesus was truly the one and only Son by substance FROM and OF the Father.
John 4
23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”Sometimes i'm not that clear at explaining myself so I hope you get the idea with what i'm saying. [my English isn't the best I know
]Blessings
Daniel4Thomas.
I know that you and Besee have faith in God and His Son.
I am not denying that.
I am just reminding you both;that the very elect can be deceived by the false prophet if possible.
This means that the false prophet when he comes,
He will be that good in deceiving the many.Therefore watch them that are preaching not according to scripture.
Dont protect any denomination,but the Word of God.
Which are the scriptures.The false prophet is here,but has not shown himself as yet.
His way is already prepared. All technology is ready to be used, and *the church preachings are leaning towards him*.He will do great lying wonders.
Christ will only come after he sits in the temple build by the jews. He will force every on on earth to receive his mark
in the right hand or in the forehead.Be strong to the end.wakeup.
Quote (4Thomas @ Feb. 20 2014,12:02) he has found Christ and has a greater Love for him, “she”, ha ha.
Thanks again Daniel.
Quote (4Thomas @ Feb. 18 2014,11:29) Hi T8 God is revealed also as having a nature because he is revealed as having a one and only Son.
Are you saying that God doesn't have a nature?
Quite the opposite.God has a nature. That nature is divine nature.
But God shares his nature and just as he is spirit, so are angels for example.
Paul even teaches us that we can participate in divine nature.
The point that needs to be grasped is this. While God has divine nature, not all who have divine nature are God himself. So if the son is divine, that is no proof that he is God, rather that he is the son of God.
Likewise, Adam's nature is 'adam' as that word is the Hebrew word for mankind/man. So Adam obviously is adam, in other words has the nature of man. But Eve is also adam and so are you, but Eve is obviously not Adam.
Eve is adam. Eve is not Adam.
When you can grasp that and apply this truth elsewhere, it clears up a lot of misunderstanding.
Jesus is divine, Jesus is not the Divine. Or Jesus is theos, but Jesus is not the Theos.
Quote (t8 @ Feb. 21 2014,10:15) Quote (4Thomas @ Feb. 18 2014,11:29) Hi T8 God is revealed also as having a nature because he is revealed as having a one and only Son.
Are you saying that God doesn't have a nature?
Quite the opposite.God has a nature. That nature is divine nature.
But God shares his nature and just as he is spirit, so are angels for example.
Paul even teaches us that we can participate in divine nature.
The point that needs to be grasped is this. While God has divine nature, not all who have divine nature are God himself. So if the son is divine, that is no proof that he is God, rather that he is the son of God.
Likewise, Adam's nature is 'adam' as that word is the Hebrew word for mankind/man. So Adam obviously is adam, in other words has the nature of man. But Eve is also adam and so are you, but Eve is obviously not Adam.
Eve is adam. Eve is not Adam.
When you can grasp that and apply this truth elsewhere, it clears up a lot of misunderstanding.
Jesus is divine, Jesus is not the Divine. Or Jesus is theos, but Jesus is not the Theos.
T8.Yes I agree.
Just as we are born with our word.
So is God from everlasting with his Word;inside Him.
He just brought forth His Word When He started creating.
But before the beginning; His word was still inside Him.God is all mighty;so his own Word must be all mighty.
God operates with His Word.wakeup.
Please consider this scripture.
Matthew 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
wakeup.
Wakeup, do you mind telling us in your own words what you disagree with regarding the seventh day adventists?
Youtube videos mean nothing much really, who knows who made them, only opinion. Have you ever been there yourself, so you can give a fair judgment?
I have not watched the video.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 27 2014,11:58) Please consider this scripture. Matthew 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
wakeup.
Could this not apply to you also, or anyone on this forum?Yes 2besee. It could apply to anyone. It would need to be quoted in conjunction with other verses in order to make a statement.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 21 2014,16:53) Quote (t8 @ Feb. 21 2014,10:15) Quote (4Thomas @ Feb. 18 2014,11:29) Hi T8 God is revealed also as having a nature because he is revealed as having a one and only Son.
Are you saying that God doesn't have a nature?
Quite the opposite.God has a nature. That nature is divine nature.
But God shares his nature and just as he is spirit, so are angels for example.
Paul even teaches us that we can participate in divine nature.
The point that needs to be grasped is this. While God has divine nature, not all who have divine nature are God himself. So if the son is divine, that is no proof that he is God, rather that he is the son of God.
Likewise, Adam's nature is 'adam' as that word is the Hebrew word for mankind/man. So Adam obviously is adam, in other words has the nature of man. But Eve is also adam and so are you, but Eve is obviously not Adam.
Eve is adam. Eve is not Adam.
When you can grasp that and apply this truth elsewhere, it clears up a lot of misunderstanding.
Jesus is divine, Jesus is not the Divine. Or Jesus is theos, but Jesus is not the Theos.
T8.Yes I agree.
Just as we are born with our word.
So is God from everlasting with his Word;inside Him.
He just brought forth His Word When He started creating.
But before the beginning; His word was still inside Him.God is all mighty;so his own Word must be all mighty.
God operates with His Word.wakeup.
Without getting a lawyer to look that over, I agree with this on the outset.The Logos was part of God or in him. He expressed it/brought it forth and the Logos was with Him (God) in the beginning. Even before there was a universe.
This is why we read that God created all things through his Word and God created all things through Jesus Christ.
John 1:1-2
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning.
&
Colossians 1:15-17
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities– all things have been created through Him and for Him. 17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.Don't know what the vids are about, but Russia will invade soon. Hope you are all ready.
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