- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (Stu @ Feb. 08 2010,17:19) You could just make your point and link to the rest of the text. We have suggested that to you before, but you appear to be a slow learner.
You certainly don't have the wit to write all this stuff yourself.
Stuart
I personally like it when the text is quoted in the post (as long as it is legal) and a link and/or a citation is made. That's my opinion.Quote (Stu @ Feb. 08 2010,21:34) Quote Thus, militant atheism is driven by a hatred and hostility toward “any kind” of religion — without distinction. This high level of hostility blinds them to the good religion has done, or is doing, and fails to acknowledge that there is a wide variety of religion expressions ranging from extremist groups, on one side of the belief continuum, to very sincere, loving and service-oriented groups on the other side. Unfortunately, it is this kind of rage that has led to extreme forms of militant atheism in the past that led to the persecution of religions and the killing of a great many, as it has occurred in Communist countries.
You would have to say what religion actually is, to say whether it has done any good or not. People do acts of goodwill and kindness, and those acts are possible regardless of the religious beliefs of those doing them, so actually to say that ‘religion does good’ is a bit of a myth.
Murders of people under communist regimes were not in the name of atheism, but in the name of the totalitarian regime. They were communist murders.Stuart
Communism is a form of Atheism it has been the most murderous regimes on the planet. There is no such thing as a religous communist.Even many of the African dictatorships are atheist.
Those murderous atheist oppressed the church and anyone else who got in their way
The Soviet Union had a long history of state atheism,[4] in which social success largely required individuals to reject theism and stay away from churches; this attitude was especially militant under Joseph Stalin.[5][6][7] The Soviet Union attempted to suppress religion over wide areas of its influence, including places like central Asia.[8] The Socialist People's Republic of Albania under Enver Hoxha went so far as to officially ban the practice of every religion.[9]
During the French Revolution, for the first time in history, a society delved into the prospect of an atheist state.[10] After the Revolution, Jacques Hébert, a radical revolutionary journalist, and Anacharsis Cloots, a politician, both anticlerical, had successfully campaigned for the proclamation of the atheistic [11] Cult of Reason, which was adopted by the French Republic on November 10, 1793, though abandoned May 7, 1794 in favor its deistic replacement as the state religion, the Cult of the Supreme Being.[12] Cloots maintained that “Reason” and “Truth” were “supremely intolerant” and that the daylight of atheism would make the lesser lights of religious night disappear.[12] The state then further pushed its campaign of dechristianization[13], which included removal and destruction of religious objects from places of worship and the transformation of churches into “Temples of the Goddess of Reason”, culminating in a celebration of Reason in Notre Dame Cathedral.[14][15][16]
Counterrevolution against the anticlerical aspects of the Revolution led to a civil war in the Vendée where republicans suppressed the Catholic and royalist uprising in what some call the first modern genocide.[10][17]
Unlike later establishments of anti-theism by “communist” regimes, the French Revolutionary experiment was short (7 months), incomplete and inconsistent.[13] Although brief, the French experiment was particularly notable for the influence upon atheists Ludwig Feuerbach (who called religion an opiate before Marx[18]), Sigmund Freud and Karl Marx.[10] Using the ideas of Feuerbach, Marx and Freud, “communist” regimes later treated religious believers as subversives or abnormal, often relegated to psychiatric hospitals and reeducation.[10]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_atheism
Bloody murderous Atheist showing no compassion for human beings.
Communism does not equate to atheism. Most atheists are not communists, although it is likely that most modern communists are atheists. Religion is basically the antithesis to communism because communism cannot truly exist with opposing ideologies. It is really no different than certain Muslim countries being intolerant of other religions — its all about enforcing one ideology over another.
Atheism, by itself, is not an ideology. It is the lack of belief in any gods. That's it. Anything beyond that is not atheism, but some other ideology that stands on its own.
Quote (kejonn @ Feb. 09 2010,09:58) Communism does not equate to atheism. Most atheists are not communists, although it is likely that most modern communists are atheists. Religion is basically the antithesis to communism because communism cannot truly exist with opposing ideologies. It is really no different than certain Muslim countries being intolerant of other religions — its all about enforcing one ideology over another. Atheism, by itself, is not an ideology. It is the lack of belief in any gods. That's it. Anything beyond that is not atheism, but some other ideology that stands on its own.
Atheism is an ideaology and atheist parents have the idea that religion should not be taught in schools.Quote (bodhitharta @ Feb. 09 2010,16:20) Atheism is an ideaology and atheist parents have the idea that religion should not be taught in schools.
Sorry, but you are wrong as usual. Can you tell me what all atheists have in common besides lack of belief in any gods? If you cannot, then you cannot say atheism is an ideology. No more than saying non-stamp collecting is a hobby.As for the other, it makes quite a bit of sense. Why should religion be taught in school? Religion has nothing to back it but beliefs without evidence, so religion should not be taught where children are trying to learn about facts and application.
If one wants religion taught in school, they should find a private school that teaches such things. Public funding should not go towards teaching of imaginary things.
Quote (kejonn @ Feb. 10 2010,11:26) Quote (bodhitharta @ Feb. 09 2010,16:20) Atheism is an ideaology and atheist parents have the idea that religion should not be taught in schools.
Sorry, but you are wrong as usual. Can you tell me what all atheists have in common besides lack of belief in any gods? If you cannot, then you cannot say atheism is an ideology. No more than saying non-stamp collecting is a hobby.As for the other, it makes quite a bit of sense. Why should religion be taught in school? Religion has nothing to back it but beliefs without evidence, so religion should not be taught where children are trying to learn about facts and application.
If one wants religion taught in school, they should find a private school that teaches such things. Public funding should not go towards teaching of imaginary things.
You just proved my point atheists don't believe that PUBLIC money should be used to promote religion although religious people are part of the public(actually the majority of the public) which means most tax dollars come from theistsQuote (kejonn @ Feb. 09 2010,09:58) Communism does not equate to atheism.
Communism is the belief in a society without different classes and not really about God or religion. The USSR however, tried to remove God and religion from society, but it had ceased being a truly communist state before that.I need to check this out, but my current understanding is if you wanted privilege, you joined the “Party”. The first question on that entry form, was “Do you believe in God”. If you answered 'yes', you were disqualified. Disqualified from what? Read the following quote from Wikipedia.
Quote Among those perks were shopping at well-stocked stores, access to foreign merchandise, preference in obtaining housing, access to dachas and holiday resorts, being allowed to travel abroad, sending their children to prestigious universities, and obtaining prestigious jobs (as well as party membership itself) for their children. It became virtually impossible to join the Soviet ruling and managing elite without being a member of the Communist Party. – Wikipedia Quote In 1986, the Communist Party of the Soviet Union had over 19 million members or approximately 10% of the USSR's adult population. – Wikipedia
The USSR's version of communism and belief in atheism was a failure. The USSR was in serious trouble at times including a time when one-third of Russians worked in agriculture, they didn't have enough food to feed themselves. In response, the USA exported wheat to Russia (their supposed enemy) to help fill this deficit. The deal was forged by Henry Kissinger and President Nixon. In other words a nation that allowed faith and had a people that had a majority belief in God, had to help an atheistic run country. I do not know of any such time when vice versa was applicable.It happened in World War II:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Front_%28World_War_II%29
After Germany's initial success at the Battle of Kiev, Adolf Hitler saw the Soviet Union as militarily weak and ripe for immediate conquest. On October 3, 1941, he announced, “We have only to kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down.” Thus, Germany expected another short Blitzkrieg and made no serious preparations for prolonged warfare. However, following the decisive Soviet victory at the Battle of Stalingrad and the resulting dire German military situation, Hitler and Nazi propaganda proclaimed the war to be a German defense of Western civilization against destruction by the vast “Bolshevik hordes” that were pouring into Europe.
The war was fought between the German Reich, its allies and Finland, against the Soviet Union. The conflict began on 22 June 1941 with the Operation Barbarossa Offensive, when Axis forces crossed the borders, described in the German-Soviet Nonaggression Pact, thereby invading the Soviet Union. The war ended on 9 May 1945, when Germany's armed forces surrendered unconditionally following the Berlin Offensive, a strategic operation executed by the Red Army, also known as the Battle of Berlin.
This was an example of an atheistic nation liberating several 'religious' occupied countries, not least the obsessively Catholic Poland.
Stuart
Quote (bodhitharta @ Feb. 09 2010,19:11) You just proved my point atheists don't believe that PUBLIC money should be used to promote religion although religious people are part of the public(actually the majority of the public) which means most tax dollars come from theists
Should Wicca be taught in schools? There are Wiccans in the public. There are alcoholics in the public. Should knowing how much liquor you can drink be taught in school? There are homosexuals in school, and they ARE trying to teach some things in some schools about it that are quite seedy, unfortunately.Do you see the slippery slope you place yourself on when you have this approach?
No, if you want religion taught, teach it in the home or church or mosque. Not in publicly funded schools.
Tax dollars also come from atheists, agnostics, etc. Should schools teach there might not be a god?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Feb. 10 2010,12:11) Quote (kejonn @ Feb. 10 2010,11:26) Quote (bodhitharta @ Feb. 09 2010,16:20) Atheism is an ideaology and atheist parents have the idea that religion should not be taught in schools.
Sorry, but you are wrong as usual. Can you tell me what all atheists have in common besides lack of belief in any gods? If you cannot, then you cannot say atheism is an ideology. No more than saying non-stamp collecting is a hobby.As for the other, it makes quite a bit of sense. Why should religion be taught in school? Religion has nothing to back it but beliefs without evidence, so religion should not be taught where children are trying to learn about facts and application.
If one wants religion taught in school, they should find a private school that teaches such things. Public funding should not go towards teaching of imaginary things.
You just proved my point atheists don't believe that PUBLIC money should be used to promote religion although religious people are part of the public(actually the majority of the public) which means most tax dollars come from theists
In the US it would be just a matter of theists mounting enough of a popular campaign to change the constitution: you would think that would be easy with supposedly nearly 90% of the population being god-deluded.But they couldn't have that could they, because if you allow one god to be promoted by taxpayer money then it is only just that you promote anyone's god that way.
The theist owes a lot to the secular requirements. Without them they would be up for paying for any old crackpot to promote his or her religious fantasy.
Why should schools not be expected to work on the principle that unsupported fantasy assertions have no place? After all, that is the basis of the subjects of science, history, geography, physical education and mathematics, to name just five.
Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Feb. 09 2010,19:15) In other words a nation that allowed faith and had a people that had a majority belief in God, had to help an atheistic run country. I do not know of any such time when vice versa was applicable.
Not much to disagree with in the first part of your post, so I address this.The communism that emerged in the 20th century was a type that would not tolerate the presence of opposing ideologies, so atheism fits in quite well. After all, there is no dogma in place to combat against. Its like trying to sell a vacuum to someone who does not already have one.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
