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Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:21) DK, would being disfellowshiped even be biblical? Are we not supposed to forgive 70X7?
Hmmn..I think it is…when done how the bible says to do it..but I don't think they do…so there is the problem..Basically, In the bible excommunicating refers to removing ones from the congregation who sin grossly and unreprentedly against GOD..I can understand the counsel give at this scripture..
1 Cor 5:11-13…but The bible tells us to treat them in light of 1 Cor 15:33..
But JW's take… 1 John 2:18, 19…2 John 9-11…..and you those scriptures which are clearly talking about Anti-Christ and say that we are not to talk to anybody they kick out the congregation for no matter the reason..
EVEN IF ITS FOR JUST DISAGREEING WITH THE TEACHINGS
The kicker is this…they say that you can't talk to them until they let them back in…even if they have given up their sinful course but have not been let back in yet..
And to make matters worse..they say you are not allowed to pray with such ones, share GOD's word with them, or encourage them spiritually…
So you can see why I say this is unscriptural
Not that any of this would happen with Dirty knections.
If he was doing anything wrong, he'd be asked to quite it. If he persisted, maybe he'd be reproved. People only really get disfellowshiped when they are unrepentant, and willfully practice sin.
Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:23) Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:10) JW's believe that in 1919 Jesus looked down and chose the Anointed JW
OK, OK, and tell me HOW they are able to know this? Good grief. Is this biblical – being able to predict the movements of God and Jesus?
..Glad you asked…They say it is evident by the advancement and growth of the organization since that time..
Quote (david @ June 30 2008,13:27) 2 JOHN 9-10
“Everyone that pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God. He that does remain in this teaching is the one that has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to YOU and does not bring this teaching, never receive him into YOUR homes or say a greeting to him.”
Gosh, David, this would be difficult to determine who is “pushing ahead” and who isn't though? Right? I mean, so far DK has shown some good fruit here…..It should be noted that it's for the protection of the congregation and the wellfare of the individual that he is disfellowshipped. He can be re-instated if he wants to be.
But, he cannot be allowed to persuade others on the same course he is on.
1 CORINTHIANS 15:33
“Do not be misled. Bad associations spoil useful habits.”Quote (david @ June 30 2008,13:29) Not that any of this would happen with Dirty knections. If he was doing anything wrong, he'd be asked to quite it. If he persisted, maybe he'd be reproved. People only really get disfellowshiped when they are unrepentant, and willfully practice sin.
true to a point…there are times when if something has become public knowledge and will bring reproach on the congregation when action will be taken no matter whatQuote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:31) Quote (david @ June 30 2008,13:27) 2 JOHN 9-10
“Everyone that pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God. He that does remain in this teaching is the one that has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to YOU and does not bring this teaching, never receive him into YOUR homes or say a greeting to him.”
Gosh, David, this would be difficult to determine who is “pushing ahead” and who isn't though? Right? I mean, so far DK has shown some good fruit here…..
remember this scripture is talking about Anti-Christs..Paul said they were people who, “denied Christ as coming in the flesh'Quote Gosh, David, this would be difficult to determine who is “pushing ahead” and who isn't though? Right? I mean, so far DK has shown some good fruit here….. Yes, on here. My main problem is that he is essentially lying to people back home, in his congregation. He's pretending everything is well, when he thinks they are part of the whore of babylon.
If I stepped into the Catholic church (a group I think is very unscriptural in their beliefs) and attended their services, I would feel hypocritical or something to associate with them and say I'm one of their brothers when I felt they were all misguided fools.
Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:33) Quote (david @ June 30 2008,13:29) Not that any of this would happen with Dirty knections. If he was doing anything wrong, he'd be asked to quite it. If he persisted, maybe he'd be reproved. People only really get disfellowshiped when they are unrepentant, and willfully practice sin.
true to a point…there are times when if something has become public knowledge and will bring reproach on the congregation when action will be taken no matter what
i.e. pedophilia, rape, murder and so forthQuote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:30) Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:23) Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:10) JW's believe that in 1919 Jesus looked down and chose the Anointed JW
OK, OK, and tell me HOW they are able to know this? Good grief. Is this biblical – being able to predict the movements of God and Jesus? ..Glad you asked…They say it is evident by the advancement and growth of the organization since that time..
Wow. That sounds a bit presumptuous, doesn't it? I have to say, the JW's have moxie!
Quote (david @ June 30 2008,13:34) Quote Gosh, David, this would be difficult to determine who is “pushing ahead” and who isn't though? Right? I mean, so far DK has shown some good fruit here….. Yes, on here. My main problem is that he is essentially lying to people back home, in his congregation. He's pretending everything is well, when he thinks they are part of the whore of babylon.
If I stepped into the Catholic church (a group I think is very unscriptural in their beliefs) and attended their services, I would feel hypocritical or something to associate with them and say I'm one of their brothers when I felt they were all misguided fools.
Propaganda…Mark 3:32-36…32A crowd was sitting around him, and they told him, “Your mother and brothers are outside looking for you.”
33″Who are my mother and my brothers?” he asked.
34Then he looked at those seated in a circle around him and said, “Here are my mother and my brothers! 35Whoever does God's will is my brother and sister and mother.”
I don't know each and every persons personal belief…If they are trying to do what Jesus said in the above scripture…I don't have a problem with them..JW or not…
Mandy…I can agree to disagree can't I?
Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:36) Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:30) Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:23) Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:10) JW's believe that in 1919 Jesus looked down and chose the Anointed JW
OK, OK, and tell me HOW they are able to know this? Good grief. Is this biblical – being able to predict the movements of God and Jesus? ..Glad you asked…They say it is evident by the advancement and growth of the organization since that time..
Wow. That sounds a bit presumptuous, doesn't it? I have to say, the JW's have moxie! …remember…this is the leadership making these claims…I don't think the average rank and file JW knows enugh of the history to challenge the claimsQuote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:38) Mandy…I can agree to disagree can't I?
Well, according to David you better not do it in public!
yes, the “brothers” scripture.
Paul once said that he was “in dangers among false brothers.” (2 cor 11:26)
I just fear this might be what you are.
And I have very little evidence to the contrary.Gal 2:4 also mentions “the false brothers brought in quietly…”
It appears there can be “false brothers” in the congregation and that these ones are a “danger” to our spirituality. (2 cor 11:26)
Quote Well, according to David you better not do it in public! Mandy, I'm not a democrat or a republican, but if I was a democrat and I joined the republican party and became involved, and a representative of that party, how would it go if I made my true feelings known?
Quote (Not3in1 @ June 30 2008,13:42) Quote (dirtyknections @ June 30 2008,13:38) Mandy…I can agree to disagree can't I?
Well, according to David you better not do it in public!
…1 Corinthians 4:3-5…3I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. 4My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me. 5Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.
Wikipedia says:
“If a baptised Witness begins to teach doctrines contrary to Witness doctrines it is grounds for disfellowshipping for apostasy. This action is taken after the elders try to reason with him.”
This is the reason I kept questioning whether he was or at least, would remain a witness of Jehovah. On this forum, he is of course very open with his beliefs and criticisms. While I believe he does speak his mind at home, I don't think it could be anywhere this level.
Wikipedia also states:
“Disfellowshipping is not necessarily permanent. If a disfellowshipped person repents of his former conduct, he may be reinstated into the congregation.”Quote (david @ June 30 2008,14:26) Wikipedia says: “If a baptised Witness begins to teach doctrines contrary to Witness doctrines it is grounds for disfellowshipping for apostasy. This action is taken after the elders try to reason with him.”
This is the reason I kept questioning whether he was or at least, would remain a witness of Jehovah. On this forum, he is of course very open with his beliefs and criticisms. While I believe he does speak his mind at home, I don't think it could be anywhere this level.
Wikipedia also states:
“Disfellowshipping is not necessarily permanent. If a disfellowshipped person repents of his former conduct, he may be reinstated into the congregation.”
refer to the post above “brother”David…lemme give it to you again
1 Corinthians 4:3-5…3I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. 4My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me. 5Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.
That is my only comment to you from now on on this topic
Quote (david @ June 30 2008,14:26) While I believe he does speak his mind at home
Well no wonder he is here, then. He cannot “speak his mind at home….”. How sad. It sounds like JW's demand complete compliance then? What kind of religion is this? It certainly is unlike any Christian church I have known or been a part of.
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