- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Hi W,
Peter, John and Martha also refused to deny they are God.
Perhaps we need to look further into these matters too?Quote Hi W,
Peter, John and Martha also refused to deny they are God.
Perhaps we need to look further into these matters too?Thomas and Jesus had no problem calling him Lord and God.
Why do you?
Quote Hi W,
Proclaim the truth.
Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
No buts.NH
Sorry.
Will not deny the Honour to the Son as the Father.
Hi w,
May you find fulfillment in your religion.
But if you want eternal life-it is in the Son of God.Quote Hi w,
May you find fulfillment in your religion.
But if you want eternal life-it is in the Son of God.NH
True
Think about it!
Quote Hi W,
You deny the Son saying he is God himself.————–
NH
No I honour the Son as I honour the Father!
Post By Is 1:18John 20:28
Then He said to Thomas, “Reach here with your finger, and see My hands; and reach here your hands and put it into My side; and do not be unbelieving, but believing.” Thomas answered and said to Him, 'My Lord and my God' “
The Greek reads,
ho kurios mou kai ho theos mou
Which literally translated to English reads:-
“Answered Thomas and he said to him, the Lord of me and the God of me”
This was not an exclamation but an address, as the nominative was used for the vocative (“Thomas said to Him” ). Let's assume you are correct. You would think that if Thomas, in his astonishment, had uttered a highly-blasphemous statement he would have been severely chastened by Yahshua. It wasn't His style to hold back, and on occasions he was cuttingly-blunt with his beloved apostles. So what was Yahshua's response to this supposed ejaculation of profanity?
“Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed” (John 20:29).
Did He just let it slide? Unlikely. Very unlikely.
It seems that Thomas was utterly persuaded of His deity and did not hesitate to address the risen Yahshua as “Lord and God”. And it’s little wonder that Thomas spoke this way as Yahshua had earlier claimed that he would raise Himself from the dead:
John 2:18-20
18 The Jews then said to Him, “What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?”
19 Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”
20 The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”
21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body.
22 So when He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He said this; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had spoken.John 10:17-18
17 “For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again.
18 ” No one has taken it away from Me, but I lay it down on My own initiative I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again This commandment I received from My Father.”A claim that was remember and repeated by others:
Matthew 26:61
and said, “This man stated, 'I am able to destroy the temple of God and to rebuild it in three days.'”Matthew 27:40
and saying, “You who are going to destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, save Yourself! If You are the Son of God, come down from the cross.”Mark 14:58
“We heard Him say, 'I will destroy this temple made with hands, and in three days I will build another made without hands.'”Mark 15:29
Those passing by were hurling abuse at Him, wagging their heads, and saying, “Ha! You who are going to destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days,And (crucially) He followed through on this claim.
Excellent Post Is 1:18.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 23 2007,01:25) Quote Hi W,
Your refusal to listen to Jesus does raise some questions about how he is your Lord?NH
Why do you say this?
Did Jesus say he was not God. Did he refute their words?
IMO, he did refute them by reiterating and emphasizing exactly what he said, which was different from what they said.A friend was telling me about an email she'd received from another friend which created a bit of confusion and upset before it was sorted out. We'd been talking about how misleading conversations on the phone can be at times when one doesn't quite catch a word…:
She told me about an incident where she sent a heartfelt email to another girlfriend who responded by referring to their “symbiotic friendship.” My friend for whatever reason read this as a “symbolic friendship” and was quite upset. What do you mean we have a symbolic friendship?, she wanted to know from the other person.
The other woman reiterated again that she meant they had a symbiotic friendship in that they are an encouragement to each other, etc. And this saved the day.
To me, what Jesus did was similar. It was a gentle correction of the facts but a setting straight of the record just the same, if it would be received as such. Which I do.
Hi,
The Pharisees and scribes took a negative attitude to Christ. They ignored the miracles that God performed through him that established him as a man of God. Their control and power base was threatened and their personal impotence was exposed by God's choice of an outwardly simple man to be His Messiah and King.Just as Saul hated and tried to kill David so were they incapable of loving and accepting God's choice and they despised him because they didn't love God and their love of scripture was superficial.
Luke 20:2
and they spoke, saying to Him, “Tell us by what authority You are doing these things, or who is the one who gave You this authority?”
Luke 5:24
“But, so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins,”–He said to the paralytic–“I say to you, get up, and pick up your stretcher and go home.”
Luke 9:1
And He called the twelve together, and gave them power and authority over all the demons and to heal diseases.
Luke 7:8
“For I also am a man placed under authority, with soldiers under me; and I say to this one, 'Go!' and he goes, and to another, 'Come!' and he comes, and to my slave, 'Do this!' and he does it.”
Authority is real and definable.So who gave authority to men to teach, from outside of the direct teaching of scripture, that God is a trinity?
Matt 19
20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.He did not teach it .
He did not command it.What gives?
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 23 2007,15:25) Quote Hi W,
Your refusal to listen to Jesus does raise some questions about how he is your Lord?NH
Why do you say this?
Did Jesus say he was not God. Did he refute their words?
Yes, Jesus said he was the son of God and said that they were gods and then said why make a fuss over the fact that I am the son of God.Many somehow think that he was claiming to be God, but he responded by saying “ye are gods”. If read carefully scripture in no way teaches that Jesus is the Most High God, for that is the Father alone.
I'm quite certain that if those religious leaders were willing to do almost anything to have Jesus put to death. They weren't particularly lawful in their trial of him. I'm sure they would have done anything.
If there was any hint of Jesus claiming to be God himself, don't you think they would have jumped all over that.
Think about this:
Someone claims to be a great scientist and they also claim to be King of the universe. And if you wanted to discredit this person, and have him arrested or put away, are you simply going to say: “he said he was a scientist.” Or are you going to mention the much grander statement of him being king of the universe? Of course, you're going to jump all over that statement.If there was any one who believed that Jesus was claiming to be the most high almighty God, you had better believe the pharisees would have found that man. They wouldn't have ignored this. They wouldn't has simply accuse him of being, as Jesus said, God's son. They would have accused him of the much stonger charge, of being God himself….had he ever made that claim….which he obviously, logically, didn't.
I have a question. Did I just disprove the trinity claim? Because I think I did.
True david.
Matthew 26:63-65
63 But Jesus remained silent.
The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God.”64 “Yes, it is as you say,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”
65 Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy.
Where is the much grander blasphemy charge that Jesus claimed to be the Almighty God?
Surely in a court the prosecutors would go for the jugular.
I've asked Is 1:18 about this on page 540 of the trinity thread. I really would like an actual answer from someone who believes that Jesus taught he was God Almighty.
–They were people who were desparate to have Jesus put to death.
–They were willing to falsify the truth and to step outside of proper procedure to accomplish their goals.
–Yet, remarkably, they didn't accuse Jesus of saying he himself was God Almighty, a charge they surely would have thrown against him if there was the slightest indication he claimed such.There is only one possible explanation from this, other than the Bible being tampered with–Jesus never claimed to be God Almighty.
Again, I say this: I think I've just disproved the trinity. I don't see any possible conceivable way that the pharisees wouldn't have made that charge if it was at all true.
Is it acknowledged that Jesus who was made flesh took instruction from his earthly father who was rendered the face of God, and called the lord king?
Or do you wish to consider further that Jesus was supernatural AND WAS GOD?
This being important as we are to follow Jesus
Do we follow the instructions to not deny the prophets and fathers that without them we shall not be perfected?
God has made a more perfect way
It is not becoming of Christ to be fatherless; and say he is God
As David said this concerning himself that by the prepared Body a saceifice, he shall not be left in prison Psa 40:7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book [it is] written of me,
Psa 40:8 I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law [is] within my heart.
Psa 40:9 I have preached righteousness in the great congregation: lo, I have not refrained my lips, O LORD, thou knowest.
Psa 40:10 I have not hid thy righteousness within my heart; I have declared thy faithfulness and thy salvation: I have not concealed thy lovingkindness and thy truth from the great congregation.
Psa 40:11 Withhold not thou thy tender mercies from me, O LORD: let thy lovingkindness and thy truth continually preserve me.The first body that received the promise went to prison judgment and saw corruption the dust
Jesus comes in volume of book Hbr 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
Hbr 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second…. The first must return to the dust the father…saw corruption…The second a new creation a prepared body incorruptibleMay we question Jesus who is in a prepared body incorruptible?
Hbr 10:5 ¶ Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:Jhn 8:25 Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even [the same] that I said unto you from the beginning.
Promise to David effect of vision a new prepared body on earth
Walking because of his father David’s heart desire was heard from God holding the convent of New Life
Jhn 8:26 I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.
Jhn 8:27 They understood not that he spake to them of the Father.Offensive? But the only way Jesus can claim to be his father is by resurrection of life; misquoted leaving still one God above Jesus to be all in all.
Is Jesus David the first begotten Son of Man sent from God in a new prepared body?
As he announces he is the resurrection of life at a time that the world would not even have known a crucifixion was up aheadBut first you must lift up the Son of Man, Son of Man= David as the father- roots of Jesse
Then Jesus said then shall you know I am him then!
Jhn 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of *man, then shall ye know that I am [he], and [that] I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath *taught me, I speak these things.Subject King David resurrection of life
Act 13:36 For David, after he had served his own generation by the will of God, fell on sleep, and was laid unto his fathers, and saw corruption:
Selah It is Done Act 13:37 But he, whom God raised again,” saw no corruption.”Foundations will be destroyed if we do mot understand first how Jesus was the Son of Man; Son of Man is Son of a man
To becoming glorified to Son of God when the Holy Spirit descended down and he moved out to do his father in heavens work, after hearing a voice that announced this is my Son
Lo volume of book He dose away with the first to make way for the second
Hbr 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second
Again the first a soul taken from prison and judgment and made an offering to justify many
Rev 19:12 His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. Psa 40:7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book [it is] written of me,
Psa 40:8 I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law [is] within my heart…Said DavidIsa 53:8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
Isa 53:9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither [was any] deceit in his mouth.
Isa 53:10 ¶ Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put [him] to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see [his] seed, he shall prolong [his] days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
Selah volume of book
Isa 53:11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, [and] shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
Selah co inheritors of God with christ
Isa 53:12 Therefore will I divide him [a portion] with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin ofcharity
Isa 53:10 ¶ Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put [him] to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see [his] seed, he shall prolong [his] days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
God bruises David his faithful servant
2Sa 24:1 ¶ And again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.David heart is not accusing God for the bruising
2Sa 24:10 ¶ And David's heart smote him after that he had numbered the people. And David said unto the LORD, I have sinned greatly in that I have done: and now, I beseech thee, O LORD, take away the iniquity of thy servant; for I have done very foolishly.2Sa 24:17 And David spake unto the LORD when he saw the angel that smote the people, and said, Lo, I have sinned, and I have done wickedly: but these sheep, what have they done? let thine hand, I pray thee, be against me, and against my father's house.
2Sa 24:18 ¶ And Gad came that day to David, and said unto him, Go up, rear an altar unto the LORD in the threshingfloor of Araunah the Jebusite.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
