Preexistence

[gollamudi]

Quote (Lightenup @ July 23 2008,04:59)

Quote (gollamudi @ July 22 2008,01:58) Hi Sis Kathi, You mean to say that the Lamb was not slain before the foundations of the world in the Master plan of God Almighty? God sees the end from the beginning. Is it so difficult to God to have a book  in the name of Lamb who will take birth in due time through a woman as per Gal 4:4. A Lamb(sacrificial animal) a mortal being can not exist before its birth. Therefore I don't believe in any preexistence of Jesus. Love to you Adam Adam, I mean that Rev 13:8 should NOT say: 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.KJV I believe that it SHOULD say: 13:8 and all those who live on the earth will worship the beast, 26  everyone whose name has not been written since the foundation of the world 27  in the book of life belonging to the Lamb who was killed. 28 NET I am NOT saying that Christ's death wasn't planned from the foundation of the world.  I believe that it was. The verb “slain” was written in the perfect aspect in the above verse in Greek.  That means that the action was brought to completion but has effects carrying into the present.  We know that the killing of Christ wasn't brought to completion before the foundation of the world.  It was brought to completion on the cross when He was about 33 years old.  Therefore, that is another reason that the KJV is inaccurate in this case.  IMO Blessings, LU

Hi Sis Kathi,
Thanks for your response. In God's master plan all things appear as if they already happened and past. I understand these verses in the same way as “the lamb that was slain from the foundations of the world” or “Father glorify me with the glory I had with thee from the foundations of the world”
Once again I stress on no preexistence physically but in the master plan of God.
Thanks and love to you
Adam

[Lightenup]

Quote (gollamudi @ July 23 2008,03:51)

Quote (Lightenup @ July 23 2008,04:59) Quote (gollamudi @ July 22 2008,01:58) Hi Sis Kathi, You mean to say that the Lamb was not slain before the foundations of the world in the Master plan of God Almighty? God sees the end from the beginning. Is it so difficult to God to have a book  in the name of Lamb who will take birth in due time through a woman as per Gal 4:4. A Lamb(sacrificial animal) a mortal being can not exist before its birth. Therefore I don't believe in any preexistence of Jesus. Love to you Adam Adam, I mean that Rev 13:8 should NOT say: 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.KJV I believe that it SHOULD say: 13:8 and all those who live on the earth will worship the beast, 26  everyone whose name has not been written since the foundation of the world 27  in the book of life belonging to the Lamb who was killed. 28 NET I am NOT saying that Christ's death wasn't planned from the foundation of the world.  I believe that it was. The verb “slain” was written in the perfect aspect in the above verse in Greek.  That means that the action was brought to completion but has effects carrying into the present.  We know that the killing of Christ wasn't brought to completion before the foundation of the world.  It was brought to completion on the cross when He was about 33 years old.  Therefore, that is another reason that the KJV is inaccurate in this case.  IMO Blessings, LU Hi Sis Kathi, Thanks for your response. In God's master plan all things appear as if they already happened and past. I understand these verses in the same way as “the lamb that was slain from the foundations of the world” or “Father glorify me with the glory I had with thee from the foundations of the world” Once again I stress on no preexistence physically but in the master plan of God. Thanks and love to you Adam

Adam,
This verse Rev 13:8 does not show pre-existence, I agree. It doesn't NOT show it either.

Quote

In God's master plan all things appear as if they already happened and past. I understand these verses in the same way as “the lamb that was slain from the foundations of the world”

I do not agree with “all things appear as if they already happened and past.” I would agree that God's purposes are known to Him to happen before they actually happen. I don't think they are written as if they happened in past tense when they didn't even actually happen in our reality.

I know that you think there was no pre-existence physically but I think that many have given enough time and verses and reasons to show you that it is at the very least a very likely probability. I think that you should be more open to that and realize that you are unaware of the nuances of the original languages. For instance, I have shown in my last few posts how Rev 13:8 should read and you dismiss it without dealing with the reasons given. I think that you are not looking at this in an unbiased fashion. I'm not mad at you Golla, but you haven't countered my reasons for the translation. Again, I know that Rev 13:8 doesn't show pre-existense but it shouldn't read as you continue to state: “the lamb that was slain from the foundations of the world”. That tells me something about you and I think that you are not teachable.

I'm not suggesting that just because you disagree with me that you are unteachable with what I have tried to teach you. I am saying that you do not deal with the seriousness of the greek nuances, most recently in this verse in Revelation 13.

Again, please do not read this as if I am mad at you or something because I am not. I think you are great!

God bless,
Kathi

[gollamudi]

Hi Sis Kathi,
I am very much thankful to you for your timely response. I don't feel bad about your words because I am open to learn any truth if it is proved beyond doubt. I have seen here nobody has proved Jesus' physical preexistence so far. I am not worried about your interpretations on Rev 13:8 that doesn't mean I don't know the different translations. But I always see how God the Master planner see end from the beginning. The book of lamb itself is His plan even before the foundations of the world as you also agree and is named in the name of Lamb much before the Lamb Jesus was born physically on this earth.

Hi Sis, I only see Jesus' preexistence in the plan of God as per 1 Pet 1:18-20

18 “Knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, as gold or silver, from your vain conversation of the tradition of your fathers: 19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb unspotted and undefiled. 20 Foreknown indeed before the foundation of the world, but manifested in the last times for you”

and also Gal 4:4-5

4 “But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent his Son, made of a woman, made under the law: 5 That he might redeem them who were under the law: that we might receive the adoption of sons”

Jesus was not a person prior to his birth on this earth but was the word of God which was with that one and only God as per Jn 1:1.

There is no ambiguity in believing this I don't believe in any other gods besides this One and only God.
Forget about Jesus' preexistence, I see Jesus even now as in his glorious form he is not God but glorified son of man and son of God. He is the man mediator between that One God and men as per 1 Tim 2:5. Beyond these understanding we make God a mystery and polytheism.
Blessings
Adam

[Proclaimer]

Quote (gollamudi @ July 24 2008,21:46)

Hi Sis Kathi, I am very much thankful to you for your timely response. I don't feel bad about your words because I am open to learn any truth if it is proved beyond doubt. I have seen here nobody has proved Jesus' physical preexistence so far. I am not worried about your interpretations on Rev 13:8 that doesn't mean I don't know the different translations. But I always see how God the Master planner see end from the beginning. The book of lamb itself is His plan even before the foundations of the world as you also agree and is named in the name of Lamb much before the Lamb Jesus was born physically on this earth. Hi Sis, I only see Jesus' preexistence in the plan of God as per 1 Pet 1:18-20 18 “Knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, as gold or silver, from your vain conversation of the tradition of your fathers: 19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb unspotted and undefiled. 20 Foreknown indeed before the foundation of the world, but manifested in the last times for you” and also Gal 4:4-5 4 “But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent his Son, made of a woman, made under the law: 5 That he might redeem them who were under the law: that we might receive the adoption of sons” Jesus was not a person prior to his birth on this earth but was the word of God which was with that one and only God as per Jn 1:1. There is no ambiguity in believing this I don't believe in any other gods besides this One and only God. Forget about Jesus' preexistence, I see Jesus even now as in his glorious form he is not God but glorified son of man and son of God. He is the man mediator between that One God and men as per 1 Tim 2:5. Beyond these understanding we make God a mystery and polytheism. Blessings Adam

Jesus is the Logos become flesh and the Logos was with God.

Revelation 19:13
He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.

Mark 16:19
After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God.

Luke 22:69
But from now on, the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the mighty God.”

Acts 7:55
But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked up to heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God.

OK, so ask yourself is Jesus with God? Yes.
Is Jesus called the Word of God? Yes.
So, is the 'Word of God' with God? Yes.

So if the 'Word of God' is with God now and it is Jesus, why couldn't the Word that was with God before all things also be him?

Especially since the following also supports this view:

Jude 1:25
to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.

Colossians 1:15-17
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.

John 8:58
“I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

I think it is a hard road to try and disprove all this and much more. But I guess it is possible to justify anything if a person wants to believe it. This goes for me too, but the reality is that I have no reason to want to believe that Jesus was the literal firstborn of all creation. I only believe it because it is written that he has first palce in all things and that all things that are created were created through him. That is the only reason I beleive it. Because it is written. It is not something I conjured up or wanted to believe it so much that I created my own reality.

Thanks for listening.

[gollamudi]

Hi brother T8,
Thank you very much for those realisements. But you are forgetting that the 'word was God' before that word became flesh in jesus the man. If you claim that the 'word' which was with God in the beginning also as Jesus then you make God poly not One. There is much difference in what I quoted above and what you just quoted. Please be careful. God is the word that lives in Jesus not that Jesus himself is the word. Jesus is called now as the 'word of God'. Again he himself is not the 'word' but the 'word of God'. This is the reason why Jesus used to mention that the words he was speaking were not of him but of the Father who is living(abiding) in him. God is always and forever remain one and only.
Please understand this.
Thanks
Adam

[Lightenup]

Dear Golla,
Do you have one God who is referred to as the “Father” and then a seperate being who is your one Lord who is referred to as “Jesus Christ”?

I Cor 8:6
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

Interested in your response…
Kathi

[Not3in1]

Quote (t8 @ July 24 2008,22:09)

Jesus is the Logos become flesh and the Logos was with God.

It is my opinion that this idea of “Jesus” being the Logos is where everyone starts off on the wrong foot. Nowhere are we told that the Logos or the Word in the passages of John are the preexistent son OR the man, Jesus.

Jesus is the son of God AND Mary. He was formed in the womb of Mary – taking on her DNA and becoming a human being much like you and me. We cannot deny this though many do by claiming he (meaning, Jesus) was preexistent. JESUS had his BEGINNING when he was born per the gospels.

Now, I'm open to believing that “Jesus” in some OTHER STATE was preexistent. Meaning, a pre-Jesus, such as perhpas we were all preexistent before we were born. But “Jesus” was not in heaven existing as a son prior to his conception. There is no scripture to back that up AT ALL. One must conjure that up and assume much. This Logos that was present with God *became* flesh. That “flesh” was a COMBINATION of God and Mary. Therefore it could not be an exact, pure, Logos any longer. It (the flesh that the Logos became) is now something *other than* what it was in heaven.

Mary plays a huge role in understanding who Jesus was on earth, but in my opinion she also gives us some clues as to what “Jesus” was before he was born as well. I know most disount Jesus' conception – not believing that it is a true conception at all – but a different kind of conception. But wouldn't that make Jesus a “different kind” of human? Hmm? How many are willing to admit that bit along with the other? Not many I would presume?

Above t8 says, “Jesus is the Logos become flesh…” but scripture says, “The Logos became flesh….”. To me, these are two different ideas. T8 must assume that the Word in John 1:14 is indeed “Jesus” in the full sense of who Jesus is. I disagree wholeheartedly. If this is true, Mary was never needed.

Jesus could have said to the Father, “Beem me down, Dad!” and that would have been that, imo. He could have taken any body “prepared for him” at that rate.

Mandy

[Lightenup]

Hi Mandy,
I hope things are going better for you.

Ya know, I suppose that the Son of God could have come through Mary's sister (if she had one and if she were a virgin) if she married Joseph's brother (if he had one). He had to be born a virgin and be born in the line of David. I think that was what was important not that it were Mary and Joseph.

Just thoughts-Kathi

[Not3in1]

Quote (Lightenup @ July 25 2008,07:59)

Hi Mandy, I hope things are going better for you. Ya know, I suppose that the Son of God could have come through Mary's sister (if she had one and if she were a virgin) if she married Joseph's brother (if he had one).  He had to be born a virgin and be born in the line of David.  I think that was what was important not that it were Mary and Joseph. Just thoughts-Kathi

Hi Kathi,

Things are about the same here, but I am trying to stay off the computer and be more supportive of Dan. It seems to be working. On his own he has checked into a rehab. We shall see. I'm too afraid to hope for anything different at this point. You can almost see-through my prayer cloth!

Regarding Mary, yes I agree with you that it could have been any virgin who fit the bill. That wasn't really the point I was trying to make, however.

We're off to the beach….take care!
Mandy

[NickHassan]

Hi not3,
So he was not the Son of God
but the son of God and Mary?

[Not3in1]

Was Jesus born of a women?

[NickHassan]

Hi not3,
Jesus was indeed the son of Man
But he was also known by a more significant name-Son of God.

[Lightenup]

Hi all,
He was also referred to as:
“our great God and Savior”
and
“our God and Savior”

See for yourself:

Tit 2:13 –
looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus,

2Pe 1:1
Simon Peter, a bond-servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ

Blessings!
LU

[gollamudi]

Quote (Lightenup @ July 25 2008,07:21)

Dear Golla, Do you have one God who is referred to as the “Father” and then a seperate being who is your one Lord who is referred to as “Jesus Christ”? I Cor 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. Interested in your response… Kathi

Hi Sis Kathi,
I clearly see there is only one God every where in the Bible unless the Scribes or human translators changed the text to prove their Trinity or Arianism.

Yes Father is One and only God in this whole universe and Jesus is the Lord, the Messiah and the King appointed by that one God. Jesus is human and will remain human even in his glorified status. We are going to share similar glory that of Jesus in resurrection as per 1 Jn 3:1-2

1 “See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God. Yet so we are. The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him.
2 Beloved, we are God's children now; what we shall be has not yet been revealed. We do know that when it is revealed we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.
3 Everyone who has this hope based on him makes himself pure, as he is pure”

Remember one thing God never shares His glory with anybody even Jesus.

Please understand these things.
Thanks and blessings
Adam

[epistemaniac]

A few other perspectives…..

“No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, the One ever being (existing) in the bosom of the Father, He hath declared Him” (John 1:18, literal rendering from the Greek).

Since Jesus is the Word (John 1:1ff) and the only begotten Son, (John 1:14) and since John tells us (1:18) that the only begotten Son (Jesus) was always existing in the bosom of the Father, then there never was a time when Jesus, the Son did not exist. Jesus took on flesh (that is what “incarnate” means) at a certain time in history, true, but that doesn't mean he did not exist beforehand.

re Jn 1:15; John summarized what John the Baptist had to say about Jesus Christ (John 1:15-18). First, He is eternal (John 1:15). John the Baptist was actually born six months before Jesus (Luke 1:36); so in this statement he is referring to our Lord's preexistence, not His birth date. Jesus existed before John the Baptist was ever conceived.
—Bible Exposition Commentary – New Testament

“He was before me. This can refer to nothing but his preexistence, and can be explained only on the supposition that he existed before John, or, as the evangelist had before shown, from the beginning. He came after John in his public ministry and in his human nature, but in his divine nature he had existed long before John had a being-from eternity. —Barnes' Notes on the New Testament

“John the Baptist gave a continuing testimony to Jesus. The present tense of the Greek verbs testifies and cries out stresses this. Jesus was younger and began His ministry later than John. But John said that because of His preexistence (and thus His true nature) He… has surpassed me.—Bible Knowledge Commentary

“Moreover, this is found wherever the Bible speaks in detail about Christ's person. The author of the Book of Hebrews looks back to the beginning when he says, “In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe” (Heb. 1:1-2). The Book of Revelation reveals Jesus to be the “Alpha and Omega … the First and the Last” (Rev. 1:8, 17). Paul writes that before Jesus became man he was “in very nature God” and had “equality with God” (Phil. 2:6). These statements all point to the preexistence of Jesus as one important aspect of his divinity.
—Boice Expositional Commentary

“Unique in his origins! How exalted this makes the Lord Jesus! Donald Grey Barnhouse has written in The Cross through the Open Tomb: “The history of every other human being begins at birth: but the Lord Jesus Christ exists eternally as the Second Person of the Godhead. Before He was born at Bethlehem, He lived; He was one with the Father in essence and being. Before He came to earth as a baby, He walked among men and revealed Himself to them. The Old Testament, which was completed four centuries before His birth, contains many stories of His appearing among men before He came as babe, child, and man.” Abraham saw Christ in his day; for Jesus declared, “Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad” (John 8:56). He later added, “before Abraham was born, I am” (v. 58). Isaiah saw Jesus when he had his vision of the Lord high and lifted up (vsa. 6:1-3), for John refers to this vision, saying, “Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus' glory and spoke about him” (John 12:41). There were others.
It is no wonder, therefore, that in almost every instance in which the writers of the New Testament refer in depth to Christ's person they refer almost instinctively to his preexistence. The author of Hebrews begins by writing: “In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe” (Heb. 1:1-2). Paul in the Book of Philippians writes: “Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death—even death on a cross!” (Phil. 2:5-8).
Some people consider Jesus Christ only a man, and indeed he is a man. Some point to him only as an example, and he is that also. But if that is all you can see in Jesus Christ, then your view of him is entirely misleading. For the first and most important thing to be said about him is that he is without any historical beginnings and that this is the equivalent of calling him God. Everything he did and said takes its meaning from this great truth and flows from it.
—Boice Expositional Commentary

“….. in the eighth chapter of John there is the record of a conversation between Jesus and the Jewish rulers over the relationship of Jews to Abraham. They thought they were saved because of their physical descent from Abraham. Jesus denied it. They became angry and attacked him personally. “Are you greater than our father Abraham?” they asked. Jesus answered, “Before Abraham was born, I am” (John 8:58). This so offended those who heard him that they began to pick up stones to throw at him and kill him. They did this because they recognized the claim to divinity that Christ's words implied. At the least these words were a claim to preexistence; that is, Jesus claimed to have existed in the beginning with God before Abraham was created. In addition, however, they were also a claim to be God himself. For Christ's “I am” was the very name for God—Jehovah—which means, “I am who I am” (Exod. 3:14). It was because of this claim that those who heard Jesus took up stones to kill him.—Boice Expositional Commentary

Also, in John 6:62 we have a clear affirmation of Jesus' preexistence: John 6:61-62 (ESV)
61 But Jesus, knowing in himself that his disciples were grumbling about this, said to them, “Do you take offense at this?
62 Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?”

Obviously His “ascending” was to heaven, eg, the abode of God. And if He was in heaven with God previously, for we knew His 'abode” had been earth for the past 33 or so years, then manifestly He had to have preexisted in order to ascend to heaven, where He previously was.

1 Timothy 1:15 (ESV) The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost. “

The trustworthy statement in 1:15 acts as a condensed articulation of the gospel. In only eight Greek words is found a marvelous summation of the gospel message. Each word is chosen carefully. Christ Jesus is the word order preferred by Paul in the Pastoral Epistles. He uses it twenty-five times compared to six uses of “Jesus Christ.” Bound up in those two words is all that He is. Christ is the anointed King who came to redeem, and became the earthly Jesus at the Incarnation. That He came into the world implies not only His incarnation but His preexistence. Note carefully that it does not say that He came into existence, or that He was created. He existed somewhere else before coming into the world. This phraseology is used frequently by John, who often speaks of Christ’s coming into the world (cf. John 1:9; 3:19; 6:14; 11:27; 12:46; 16:28; 18:37).
—MacArthur New Testament Commentary, The

1 Timothy 3:16 (ESV) Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. “

“First, Jesus Christ was revealed in the flesh. God became man in the person of Jesus of Nazareth. Phaneroō (revealed) does not mean “to bring into existence,” or “to create,” but “to m
ake visible.” It thus affirms Christ’s preexistence (cf. John 8:58; 17:5). At the Incarnation, Jesus “although He existed in the form of God . . . emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and [was] made in the likeness of men” (Phil. 2:6–7). Our Lord Jesus Christ made the invisible God visible to human eyes (cf. 1:17; 6:16; John 14:9; Col. 1:15; Heb. 1:3).
—MacArthur New Testament Commentary, The

Matthew 8:20 (ESV) And Jesus said to him, “Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay his head.”
the probable background for the title remains Dan 7:13–14. Thus the term actually focuses on the exaltation and preexistence of Jesus, who was present in God’s heavenly throne room and given everlasting authority over all the world.—New American Commentary

blessings,
Ken

[NickHassan]

Thanks E

[gollamudi]

Hi brother Ken,
I appreciate your detailed quote on Jesus' preexistence, whatever you have quoted is often quoted by any Trinitarian to prove Jesus being in the Godhead as the second person coexisting with the Father from eternity. Do you want to prove this idea or whatelse? If you say Jesus is not God then he should not be either an angel as per Heb 2. That's why I always quote here, you can not stand on two boats by believing Jesus' preexistence as some devine being and not believing as God. I give more credit to Trinity than to Arianism which makes understanding of Jesus more complicated and mystery. I am open to receive any truth if proved beyond doubt. Forget about Jesus' preexistence even in his glorious status he is not God himself and God is always one and only as per Jn 5:44. By jumbling of different verses we are not proving any thing rather we are complicating things. If Jesus was really conceived where is the question of preexistence? If Jesus was and is really human like you and me where is the question of preexistence?

I can only get that there is only one God and Jesus is His son after birth as Jesus and Jesus is the Messiah who was promised in the Old testament to the Israelites to fulfill all God's promises to them. I repeat God will not share His glory with any even Jesus.
How can you prove Jesus beyond these truths?
Please think over
Adam

[Lightenup]

Quote (gollamudi @ July 24 2008,22:31)

Quote (Lightenup @ July 25 2008,07:21) Dear Golla, Do you have one God who is referred to as the “Father” and then a seperate being who is your one Lord who is referred to as “Jesus Christ”? I Cor 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. Interested in your response… Kathi Hi Sis Kathi, I clearly see there is only one God every where in the Bible unless the Scribes or human translators changed the text to prove their Trinity or Arianism. Yes Father is One and only God in this whole universe and Jesus is the Lord, the Messiah and  the King appointed by that one God. Jesus is human and will remain human even in his glorified status. We are going to share similar glory that of Jesus in resurrection as per 1 Jn 3:1-2 1 “See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God. Yet so we are. The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. 2 Beloved, we are God's children now; what we shall be has not yet been revealed. We do know that when it is revealed  we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. 3 Everyone who has this hope based on him makes himself pure, as he is pure” Remember one thing God never shares His glory with anybody even Jesus. Please understand these things. Thanks and blessings Adam

Hi Golla,
Thank you for your response to my quest. Now another question for you…Do you see in this passage below of Mark 12:28-34 that it speaks of there being one Lord and that one Lord is God?

Mark 12:28-34
28 One of the scribes came and heard them arguing, and recognizing that He had answered them well, asked Him, “What commandment is the foremost of all?” 29 Jesus answered, “The foremost is, 'HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD; 30 AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH.' 31 “The second is this, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' There is no other commandment greater than these.” 32 The scribe said to Him, “Right, Teacher; You have truly * stated that HE IS ONE, AND THERE IS NO ONE ELSE BESIDES HIM; 33 AND TO LOVE HIM WITH ALL THE HEART AND WITH ALL THE UNDERSTANDING AND WITH ALL THE STRENGTH, AND TO LOVE ONE'S NEIGHBOR AS HIMSELF, is much more than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.” 34 When Jesus saw that he had answered intelligently, He said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.”

Yet, in 1 Cor 8:6 it states this:
I Cor 8:6
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

Here in 1 Cor 8:6 it states that we have “one Lord” and He is Jesus Christ. Yet in Mark 12:29 it states that God is the “one Lord”.

So, it seems that there is “one Lord” yet two that are referred to as our “one Lord”.

I believe, in a similar manner, we have “one God” yet two that are referred to as our God although not sharing the same glory.

My point to you is there can be one, yet two. Both are referred to as “Lord” and both are referred to as our “God”.

I recognize that could be confusing, nevertheless, I have shown within my last few posts here that it is so.

I have reconciled these truths and understand that there is one Most High God who is the same as the one Lord spoken of by in Mark 29. Then, there is one and only one begotten God (not merely an only begotten son but a begotten God) who is Jesus Christ, the one Lord spoken of in 1 Cor 8:6.

The Begotten God does not share the same glory as the always existent God. No worry about that.

God bless,

LU

[epistemaniac]

Also….

Galatians 4:4 (ESV) But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

Seen in the context of Paul’s other statements concerning the preexistence of Christ (cf. 1 Cor 8:6; 10:4; Col 1:15–17; Rom 8:3; Phil 2:5–9), the confession “God sent his Son” can only mean that Jesus Christ is the eternally divine Son of God sent forth from heaven. This perspective was certainly not original or unique with Paul. Jesus himself described God as “he who sent me” (Mark 9:37).
—New American Commentary

Philippians 2:7 (ESV) but made himself nothing, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.

Certainly interpreters need not read more into the text than was intended, but overtones of Christology exist which cannot be dismissed. First, it affirms Jesus’ preexistence. Before he came to earth, he existed fully as God, in essence and appearance. —New American Commentary

2 Timothy 1:9 (ESV) who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began,

Paul also emphasized two facts about Christ in v. 9. First, he affirmed the preexistence of Christ, for the divine grace of Christ became available “before the beginning of time” (“from all eternity,” NASB).—New American Commentary

1 Peter 1:10-11 (ESV)
10 Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired carefully,
11 inquiring what person or time the Spirit of Christ in them was indicating when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glories.

We can infer Christ's preexistence from what is said here, since the subject is Old Testament prophecy. The preexistence of Christ is also implied in 1:20.[—New American Commentary

1 Peter 1:20 (ESV) He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last times for the sake of you

To say that something or someone is foreknown does not necessarily imply preexistence, for God foreknows and foreordains all that will occur in history. Nevertheless, to say that the “Christ” is foreknown probably implies his preexistence.[144]—New American Commentary

the notion of the preexistence of such a savior figure is also present in Jewish tradition, and the preexistence of Christ is similarly maintained in early Christian tradition. Since the two participles (προεγνωσμένου, φανερωθέντος) do in fact describe Christ (Χριστοῦ of v. 19*) and not God’s plan, it would be strange if Christ’s preexistence were not also implied here.
Achtemeier, Paul J. ; Epp, Eldon Jay: 1 Peter : A Commentary on First Peter. Minneapolis, Minn. : Fortress Press, 1996 (Hermeneia–a Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible), S. 131

1 John 3:5 (ESV) You know that he appeared to take away sins, and in him there is no sin.

John’s use of the demonstrative pronoun ekeinos (“he” or “that one”) points back to the historical reality of Christ’s incarnation. It also reveals the uniqueness of the Christ event. The apostle does not say, however, that Jesus “was born” but that he “appeared,” “was manifested” (KJV) or made visible (ephanerōthē; cf. 1:2; 2:19, 28; 3:2), which implies his preexistence even before the incarnation. It is important to note that John uses this word to refer to both the incarnation of Christ (1:2; 3:5, 8) and his manifestation at the parousia (2:28; 3:2). Smalley makes a crucial observation when he writes, “The self-disclosure of God in his Son, for the purpose of dealing with human sin, stretches from the preexistence of Christ to his exaltation in glory.”—New American Commentary

1 John 3:8 (ESV) Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

The tense of the verb is crucial” (1995:221). Paul means that the Christ himself, the preexistent Christ, was present with the Israelites in their wilderness journey (Bandstra 1971:14). We may then confidently see both a divine wisdom (Prov 8) and a preexistence Christology in the rock reference.
—The IVP New Testament Commentary Series

Galatians 4:4 (ESV) But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law,

“…. in light of Paul's other references to the preexistence of the Son (see 1 Cor 8:6; Phil 2:5-8; Col 1:15-17), we may also see here an affirmation of the deity of Jesus. Before the incarnation, the preexistent Son was commissioned by God to set slaves free and make them children of God.—The IVP New Testament Commentary Series

What is most important is that he (John) begins his Gospel with an exalted view of Jesus. He saw him as existing even before the creation of the world. In fact, he saw him as having a part in that creation. Therefore, when Jesus became man, it was an act of humiliation but also of illumination. The light shone, but the world preferred to remain in darkness.
Anyone examining John’s records of the life of Jesus would know at once, even before being introduced to the man named Jesus, that here was the record of no ordinary man. The account of his life and teaching which followed could not be properly understood except against the background of his preexistence.

Elwell, Walter A. ; Beitzel, Barry J.: Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible. Grand Rapids, Mich. : Baker Book House, 1988, S. 1145

As an aside, in regard to the preexistence of human souls, this is an idea rooted in Greek philosophy; “The soul is seen by Plato as both preexistent and immortal, although he apparently believed in the possibility of multiple bodily incarnations.
Benner, David G. ; Hill, Peter C.: Baker Encyclopedia of Psychology & Counseling. 2nd ed. Grand Rapids, Mich. : Baker Books, 1999 (Baker Reference Library), S. 880

On John “1:1 …..“Beginning” points to a time prior to creation (R. Brown 1966: 4; Beasley-Murray 1999: 10; Schnackenburg 1990: 1.232). Yet while John’s first readers would have expected the phrase “In the beginning God,” the evangelist instead speaks of “the Word” (Beasley-Murray 1999: 10). The focus of this verse is to show the Word’s preexistence (Ridderbos 1997: 25; Schnackenburg 1990: 1.232), preparing for the later reference to a new “beginning,” the incarnation of the Word (cf. 1:14) (Morris 1995: 64; Carson 1991: 114).
The designation “Word”—used in a christological sense only in the prologue (1:1, 14)—conveys the notion of divine self-expression or speech (cf. Ps. 19:1–4). The Genesis creation account establishes the effectiveness of God’s word: he speaks, and things come to pass (Gen. 1:3, 9; cf. 1:11, 15, 24, 30). Psalmists and prophets alike portray God’s word in close-to-personal terms (Ps. 33:6; 107:20; 147:15, 18; Isa. 55:10–11). Yet only John claims that this Word has appeared as an actual person, Jesus Christ (cf. 1 John 1:1; Rev. 19:13). As a comprehensive christological designation, the expression “the Word” encompasses Jesus’ entire ministry, placing all of Jesus’ works and words within the framework of both his eternal being and existence and God’s self-revelation in salvation history.
The term “Word” appears to have been used by the evangelist at least partly in order to contextualize the gospel message among his Hellenistic audience. …. Three primary backgrounds have been proposed: (1) Greek philosophy (Stoicism, Philo); (2) the personification of wisdom; and (3) the OT.
….
. In Prov. 8 (esp. vv. 22–31), wisdom is called “the first of his [God’s] works,” “appointed from eternity, from the beginning, before the world began.” Wisdom was “the craftsman at his side” when he marked out the earth’s foundations, “rejoicing always in his presence.” A whole corpus of apocryphal wisdom literature built on these notions (Sir. 1:1–10; Wisdom of Solomon). At first sight, the parallels between the characterization of wisdom in Prov. 8 and John’s logos seem impressive. Wisdom, like John’s logos, claims preexistence and participation in God’s creative activity. Like the logos, wisdom is depicted as a vehicle of God’s self-revelation, in creation as well as the law. Yet despite these surface similarities, John’s logos differs from personified wisdom in several significant respects, and the term σοφία (sophia, wisdom) is absent from this Gospel (Schlatter 1948: 43; see the three differences noted in Köstenberger 1999a: 53).
Köstenberger, Andreas J.: John. Grand Rapids, Mich. : Baker Academic, 2004 (Baker Exegetical Commentary on the New Testament), S. 25

The reference to Jesus’ ascent in (John) 6:62 (cf. 20:17), including an affirmation of his preexistence (cf. 17:5), by way of aposiopesis (the omission of the apodosis) (Ridderbos 1997: 245) suggests that crucifixion is not the end of the story and that his ascension would be every bit as striking as his forceful death (an argument from the lesser to the greater).90
Köstenberger, Andreas J.: John. Grand Rapids, Mich. : Baker Academic, 2004 (Baker Exegetical Commentary on the New Testament), S. 219

17:24–26 Jesus has one more request: he wants his followers to see the preexistent glory that the Father has given him.80
(Footnote 80 goes on to say “Westcott (1908: 2.260) writes, “The words distinctly imply the personal pre-existence of Christ. The thought of an eternal love active in the depths of divine Being presents, perhaps, as much as we can faintly apprehend of the doctrine of the essential Trinity.”

Köstenberger, Andreas J.: John. Grand Rapids, Mich. : Baker Academic, 2004 (Baker Exegetical Commentary on the New Testament)

1 Corinthians 10:9 (ESV) We must not put Christ to the test, as some of them did and were destroyed by serpents,

Paul writes, “And let us not test Christ.” A number of translators have the reading Lord instead of “Christ.” The oldest Greek manuscript (P46), the Western text, numerous witnesses, versions, and the church fathers have the word Christ. This is the primary reading that goes back to the second century, was the accepted text throughout the Mediterranean basin, and is well attested. Hence, the term Christ, which fits the context (see v. 4), is the preferred reading. And Paul teaches that the preexistent Christ accompanied the Israelites during their desert journey.
Kistemaker, Simon J. ; Hendriksen, William: New Testament Commentary : Exposition of the First Epistle to the Corinthians. Grand Rapids : Baker Book House, 1953-2001 (New Testament Commentary 18), S. 331

Paul describes Jesus’ divinity with the term Son of God, for he calls God the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ (1:3, 19; 11:31). He teaches Christ’s preexistence in glory when he writes that Jesus Christ left his heavenly riches. By coming to this earth Jesus became poor, yet through his poverty he made his people rich (8:9).
Kistemaker, Simon J. ; Hendriksen, William: New Testament Commentary : Exposition of the Second Epistle to the Corinthians. Grand Rapids : Baker Book House, 1953-2001 (New Testament Commentary 19), S. 25

[epistemaniac]

JESUS CHRIST AS SON OF GOD
References to Jesus as “Son” or “Son of God” occur frequently in Hebrews, and they reveal Him in three vital stages of Sonship, which are distinguishable theologically but are intermingled quite freely in the argument of the epistle. These stages and their interconnections may be seen in microcosm in the finely crafted introductory sentence, Hebrews 1:1–4. There Jesus Christ is portrayed as the preexistent, eternal Son who from eternity past shared fully in the divine nature and activity of God. As such He became the full and final revelation of God in His role as incarnate, earthly Son, who provided complete purification for sin. Because of His obedience to God’s saving purpose, He has been made heir of all, exalted Son of God, seated in the position of greatest honor in God’s heavenly presence. In the following discussion of these stages of sonship, other passages and Christological themes that do not explicitly use the term “Son” but present similar ideas will also be considered.

Preexistent, eternal Son. As mentioned, the opening sentence of Hebrews introduces Jesus Christ as the Son of God in three senses, but its presentation of Him as the preexistent, eternal Son shows that this stage is the indispensable basis and anchor of the other two. Jesus’ mission and accomplishments as incarnate and then exalted Son were rooted in the fact that, as the eternal Son, He shared fully in the divine nature and activities of God during His preexistent state. In Hebrews, the Son’s ontology and function are inseparable.
The first verse and a half of Hebrews emphasize the change from old to new: God spoke in various ways but incompletely in earlier days, but now He has spoken fully and uniquely in His Son. The phrase “in a Son”4 is the fulcrum point of the opening paragraph (1:1–4), because it culminates the striking initial statement about God’s revelation and then becomes the focus for seven descriptions of the Son which follow in verses 2b–4. These descriptions show why the revelation through Him has completely superseded all earlier forms. Taken together they communicate forcefully the author’s compelling and central vision of Christ as exalted Son and High Priest, because they are skillfully arranged in a ring structure which begins and ends with His exaltation. Starting in verse 2b with Christ’s appointment as heir of all (a reference to His exalted status after the Resurrection and Ascension), the author backed up to show the basis for this in the Son’s preexistent activity in Creation (v. 2c, His sharing in the very essence of God (v. 3a), and His ongoing providential activity (v. 3b). The author then began to come back around the circle with a mention of the Son’s purification of sins (v. 3c)—as a quick summary of the themes of His earthly life, suffering, and high priestly accomplishment—which were developed extensively in later chapters. Finally, the descriptions come full circle with references to the Son’s session at God’s right hand and His inheritance of an exalted name (vv. v. 3d–4). In this section attention is given to the three descriptions of the Son’s protological nature and activity. The statements about His earthly and exalted status will be discussed later.
The Son’s preexistence is clearly seen in the statement of His role in the creation of the world: He was the agent or mediator through whom God created the universe in all its dimensions of time and space (1:2c). This theme is developed also by John and Paul (John 1:3, 10; Rom. 11:36; 1 Cor. 8:6; Col. 1:16). In Hebrews the specific contextual link with the preceding description (Heb. 1:2b) emphasizes how fitting it is for Christ to become heir of all things based on His work of redemption and subsequent exaltation, since He was the one involved in the creation of all things as well. But the wider theological truth evoked here is the Son’s existence prior to all created things (His “protological preexistence”) and His participation with the Father in divine works. The interpretation of this verse offered by Athanasius long ago appears to be correct: “When the sacred writers say, ‘Who exists before all the ages,’ and ‘by whom He made the ages,’ they clearly proclaim the eternal and everlasting being of the Son and designate Him as God Himself.”
Jesus’ role in Creation as the preexistent Son is mentioned in other verses in Hebrews in addition to the opening sentence. In 1:10 the words of Psalm 102 are cited as referring to the Son: “In the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands.” The quotation of the psalm is then continued (1:11–12) to bring out the eternal existence entailed by this role in Creation: “They will perish, but you continue … they will be changed, but you are the same and your years will never end.” While Jesus’ everlasting existence asserted here is explicitly focused on future eternity, there is an implicit inclusion of eternity past as well, in verse 10 and in the phrases “you continue” and “you are the same” (vv. 11–12). Later in the epistle (3:2–6) by a complex analogy the faithfulness of Jesus in God’s house is compared to that of Moses, and His honor is shown to be superior to that of Moses in the same way a Son’s honor surpasses a servant’s in the house (3:5–6). But His honor is also likened in 3:3 to the superior honor afforded to the builder of a house compared to the house itself. This point is anchored by the reminder in verse 4 that God is the builder of all things. These verses also then allude to the role the Son played in Creation and the divine status which this implies for Him.
After citing the Son’s role in Creation, the author of Hebrews moved back a step in his cycle of descriptions to portray the Son as sharing eternally in the divine nature of the Father (1:3a). This is communicated in two phrases that form the predicates of a participle expressing timeless existence (ōn, present participle of the verb eimi): “being the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of His essence.” The first of these phrases employs a word suggesting the “shining forth” of the sunlight (apaugasma from augēs, “sunshine”), denoting not the passive “reflection” of God’s glory but the active “radiance, shining forth” of one who in Himself possesses the divine perfections. To use a similar illustration, the idea is that the Son shines forth with God’s glory in the way the sun radiates its own light, not in the way the moon reflects that of the sun. Similar statements about the Son are made in John 1:14; 17:4–5; and 2 Corinthians 4:6.
The second phrase in Hebrews 1:3a changes the image but makes the same point: the Son is the “exact representation of his being.” The predicate here (charaktēr) can be used of the impression or mark made by a die in minting coins, and so the phrase is rightly translated “the exact representation of His nature” (nasb), or “he bears the very stamp of his nature” (rsv), or “he is the perfect copy of his nature” (jb). The Greek word translated “nature” (hypostasis) is also significant to note, since it denotes here the “substantial nature, essence, actual being” of God, which the Son is thus said to reproduce exactly.
What then is the point of these clauses describing the Son’s nature? Cullmann has summarized it well in saying that these attributes “express the Son’s complete participation in the deity of the Father.”13 This conclusion is disputed, however, by Rissi, who interprets the present participles (“being the radiance …” and “upholding …”) of verse 3 as describing not preexistence but the present essence of the Son, not His eternal
existence but His meaning for the community in the present.14 Of course these descriptions have a bearing on the Son’s present significance for the church, but the eternal dimension cannot be excluded, and the latter is the essential foundation for the former.15 Wilckens also misreads the structure of thought expressed by the participles in verse 3 when he attributes these qualities to Jesus only as the exalted Son: “Since God’s glory has impressed itself on Him as the One exalted by God, He is its reflection and image.”16 But this verse patently moves through the three stages of sonship emphasized in Hebrews and does not picture His exalted status only: “who being the radiance of his glory and the impress of his essence, … having made purification of sins, sat down at the right hand.”17
The Son’s full participation in the nature of the Father and unique relationship with Him is, of course, very significant in a statement on His revelatory role, which is the larger point of 1:1–4. Who could better reveal the Father fully than the Son who reflects His essence exactly? This connection is elaborated elsewhere in the New Testament, most notably by John (John 1:14–18; 14:8–9; Col. 1:15).
The final description of the eternal Son in the descriptive cycle of Hebrews 1:1–4 is the reference to His ongoing relation to the creation: “sustaining all things by his powerful word” (1:3b). This phrase expresses the cosmological role of the Son in sustaining and maintaining His created work (as in Col. 1:17), but includes also His providential activity of carrying the creation forward toward its God ordained end.18 This also shows the Son’s identity with the Father, since such providential activity was attributed to God in the Old Testament (Isa. 46:3–4).
These three descriptions of the protological nature and activity of the Son (Heb. 1:2–3) share a common conceptual background which requires further theological inquiry. All three clauses utilize expressions that occurred commonly in Hellenistic Judaism to describe “wisdom” or the “Word.” This usage is sourced ultimately in the Old Testament, where, for example, Proverbs 8:22–31 portrays wisdom in personified terms as existing with God before and at Creation. In intertestamental Judaism such phrasing became commonplace. In the Wisdom of Solomon, wisdom is said to be “the fashioner of all things” (7:22; 8:6), “present when God made the world” (9:9), “a pure emanation of the glory of the Almighty.… a reflection [apaugasma] of eternal light … an image of his goodness” (7:25–26), and the one who pervades and penetrates all things and orders the whole universe (7:24, 27; 8:1). Eternal existence is ascribed to wisdom in Sirach 24:9. The Word, especially in Philo, is described as the image of God, His agent in Creation, His firstborn son, the exact representation [charaktēr] of divine power, and the one through which God sustains all things.19 It is clear that Hebrews 1:2–3 describes the Son by means of language drawn from this conceptual background, but this is not new with Hebrews, since as already noted, John and Paul used similar phrasing to characterize Jesus’ relation to God and the world. What has come under debate recently is how this “Wisdom Christology” should be interpreted in Hebrews.
Robinson and Dunn have advanced the interpretation that wisdom language like that in Hebrews 1:2–3 is a “way of speaking” about Jesus which does not assert His personal preexistence and sharing of the divine nature, but simply that the preexistent Wisdom of God came to be embodied so completely in the human Jesus that these things could be said of Him as the bearer of divine wisdom. In Dunn’s words,
Christ alone so embodies God’s Wisdom, that is, God’s creative, revelatory and redemptive action, that what can be said of Wisdom can be said of Christ without remainder. … It is the act and power of God which properly speaking is what preexists; Christ is not so much the preexistent act and power of God as its eschatological embodiment.20
Though it is helpful to be aware of the background of wisdom-language, it is plainly wrong to see impersonal wisdom as the topic here. The verses clearly speak of a specific person, the Son, Jesus, of whom these things are predicated.21 To dismiss the statements of the text as merely “a way of speaking” is simply forced exegesis to fit the demands of a larger case which Dunn and Robinson try to trace through the New Testament.22 In fact, wisdom terminology as a way of reflecting on Jesus’ person and mission is important in several strata of New Testament theology,23 and it seems clear that it should be traced to Jesus’ own teaching about Himself as the full and personal expression of God’s wisdom and essence. In Matthew 11:16–30 (also see 23:34, and parallels in Luke 7:34–35; 11:49), Jesus identified Himself as God’s wisdom and as God’s Son who alone can reveal the Father, and then called people to come and learn from Him, just as wisdom (personified) called for followers in Judaism (see Prov. 8:1–21; 9:1–6; Wisdom 6:12–20; 9:17–18; Sirach 6:18–31; 24:19–22; 51:13–30, esp. 51:23, 26).24
There are two other ways in which the personal preexistence and eternality of the Son are implicitly reflected in Hebrews. One of these (to be discussed in more detail in the next section) can be seen in references to His “becoming incarnate” (2:9, 14) and “coming into the world in a body prepared for him” (10:5–9). These patently portray the Son as a preexistent, heavenly Being who entered this world and took on a human nature at a certain point in history in fulfillment of God’s plan of salvation. While this was the beginning of His earthly and human existence, it was clearly not the start of His existence; it was not His absolute beginning.
The other reflection of the Son’s preexistence and eternality is found in statements about His indestructible life and His continuing forever. In Hebrews 7:15–17, Jesus’ eternal sonship is seen as the essential foundation for His priesthood: He became a Priest not by physical descent from Aaron but “by the power of an indestructible life.”25 The author found this idea reflected in Psalm 110:4 (“You are a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek”). He connected it to Jesus’ sonship in 7:3 by the pattern found in the Melchizedek of Genesis 14, who was “without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life,” and in a reverse typology, “like the Son of God” in His unending priesthood.26 In a section of practical exhortations, Hebrews 13:8 portrays Jesus Christ in His unchanging constancy as the focus of their faith: “the same yesterday and today and forever.” This verse, like 1:10–12, points not only to His constancy into an unending future, but connects that also to His prior existence which stretched back through the lives of their leaders (13:7) and His own faithful earthly life into eternity past,27 and thus gives assurance of His eternal constancy in providing for His people at any time (cf. 4:14–16; 7:23–25).
In summary, the theme of the preexistent, eternal Son in Hebrews presents a picture of Jesus as sharing fully in God’s divine nature and activity. With this backdrop, it is easy to see why Hebrews in at least one instance explicitly labels the Son as “God.” As Cullmann states, “Jesus can be addressed as God just because of the unique sonship which implies his deity.”28 Citing Psalm 45:6–7, Hebrews 1:8 says of the Son, “Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever.” While various questions about other matters attend the full exegesis of this verse, most interpreters agree that the author of Hebrews here applied the title theos to the Son in recognition of His divine status.&#65279
;29 Thus, in the words of Cullmann, “Jesus’ deity is more powerfully asserted in Hebrews than in any other New Testament writing, with the exception of the Gospel of John.”30 The remarkable feature of the Christology of Hebrews is that at the same time, it pays close attention to the true, earthly humanity of Jesus, and it is to this topic that we now turn.
Zuck, Roy B.: A Biblical Theology of the New Testament. electronic ed. Chicago : Moody Press, 1994; Published in electronic form by Logos Research Systems, 1996, S. 370

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