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Quote (RokkaMan @ July 03 2010,09:36) Quote (942767 @ July 03 2010,09:32) Hi RM: I believe that I can go along with you on this last post, except for the following:
You say:
Quote He was begotten, in spirit…and was later manifested in flesh. Begotten in the spirit? What does that mean?
Love in Christ,
Marty
God is a spirit, if he begets…his offspring so too will be spirit.We know that spirit to be The Word of God.
That spirit was later humbled and manifested as flesh, to whom we know as Jesus Christ.
Hi RM:Two questions. What scripture do you have to support that Jesus was begotten in the spirit, and was later manifested in the flesh?
And secondly,
Was Jesus the man begotten of God?
Love in Christ,
MartyJesus was begotten of the Father at the time of conception. The Father wasn't a father until His firstborn was born. He was born of Mary as we well know. Jesus received the Holy Spirit when He was baptised and His Father spoke from Heaven commending Him.
Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,12:36) Jesus was begotten of the Father at the time of conception. The Father wasn't a father until His firstborn was born. He was born of Mary as we well know. Jesus received the Holy Spirit when He was baptised and His Father spoke from Heaven commending Him.
Unlike us, Jesus existed before his incarnation on earth, as The Word of God.He was begotten of The Father before he was a man.
If not, then he wouldn't of been The Son of God until after his ressurection (proving himself so).
But since we know he was the son of God even at the time of his birth…he was so, before his incarnation.
Quote (RokkaMan @ July 03 2010,16:21) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,12:36) Jesus was begotten of the Father at the time of conception. The Father wasn't a father until His firstborn was born. He was born of Mary as we well know. Jesus received the Holy Spirit when He was baptised and His Father spoke from Heaven commending Him.
Unlike us, Jesus existed before his incarnation on earth, as The Word of God.He was begotten of The Father before he was a man.
If not, then he wouldn't of been The Son of God until after his ressurection (proving himself so).
But since we know he was the son of God even at the time of his birth…he was so, before his incarnation.
Yeah that doesn't really make any sense.. well some of it does.How can one be a son before being born? The Word was not the Son, nor a created being, hence the “was with God and was God”.
The Word became the Son of God and was called Jesus. When Jesus was raised from the dead He was restored to His former glory as the Word of God as per His prayer in Jn 17
Quote (RokkaMan @ July 03 2010,14:21) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,12:36) Jesus was begotten of the Father at the time of conception. The Father wasn't a father until His firstborn was born. He was born of Mary as we well know. Jesus received the Holy Spirit when He was baptised and His Father spoke from Heaven commending Him.
Unlike us, Jesus existed before his incarnation on earth, as The Word of God.He was begotten of The Father before he was a man.
If not, then he wouldn't of been The Son of God until after his ressurection (proving himself so).
But since we know he was the son of God even at the time of his birth…he was so, before his incarnation.
Hi RM”No, you are speculating on these statements.
Jesus was not begotten until he was conceived of the Holy Ghost in the womb of the virgin Mary.
He was a Son of God under the Law of Moses raised by parents who were under the Law of Moses. At the Jordan when Jesus was baptized:
Quote Matthew 3:16And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased
After his sanctification came his glorification:
Quote Romans 1 1Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
2(Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
3Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;
4And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
Love in Christ,
MartyHi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was.
I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
Quote (RokkaMan @ July 03 2010,14:21) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,12:36) Jesus was begotten of the Father at the time of conception. The Father wasn't a father until His firstborn was born. He was born of Mary as we well know. Jesus received the Holy Spirit when He was baptised and His Father spoke from Heaven commending Him.
Unlike us, Jesus existed before his incarnation on earth, as The Word of God.He was begotten of The Father before he was a man.
If not, then he wouldn't of been The Son of God until after his ressurection (proving himself so).
But since we know he was the son of God even at the time of his birth…he was so, before his incarnation.
Hi RokkaMan,How do you know we weren't there as well? (John 15:27)
Who are these sons of God mentioned in Job? (Job 38:7)You said before that the “Stars of God” were Angels. (Rev.12:4)
Job 38:7 mentions both “Morning Stars” and “Sons of God“, who are these “Sons of God” if not us?
We are called “Sons of God” elsewhere in Scripture so why can't it mean us there?John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power
to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Rom.8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
1John 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should
be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
1John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be:
but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.EDj,
Step off, please.
The Sons of God are the angels.
The Stars are the 'Principle Sons' of God, the 'Princes', of which I believe that 'Jesus' is the foremost Son, having shown himself to be more righteous and 'Godfearing' than all the others, hence he was 'raised to a higher position than his brethren'.
Quote (JustAskin @ July 04 2010,00:23) EDj, Step off, please.
The Sons of God are the angels.
The Stars are the 'Principle Sons' of God, the 'Princes', of which I believe that 'Jesus' is the foremost Son, having shown himself to be more righteous and 'Godfearing' than all the others, hence he was 'raised to a higher position than his brethren'.
I disagree. Angels were never sons of God, however there is evidence that we, or at least Jeremiah pre-existed, Before you were in your mother's womb I knew you.Quote (JustAskin @ July 03 2010,22:23) EDj, Step off, please.
The Sons of God are the angels.
The Stars are the 'Principle Sons' of God, the 'Princes', of which I believe that 'Jesus' is the foremost Son, having shown himself to be more righteous and 'Godfearing' than all the others, hence he was 'raised to a higher position than his brethren'.
Hi JustAskin,Your now doing what other here do, say 'your wrong' offering no Scriptural support.
You offer no alternative explanation for the evidences I produced,
nor offer any evidence to suggest something else is the case.
So why should I or anyone else believe what you say here?God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,17:28) Hi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was. I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
I believe this post by OXY best explains my position.Jesus Christ preexisted as The Word of God…
if The Word of God became a son to YHVH @ conception.
Then that's fine with me.
The whole point i'm trying to make, is that Jesus is a manifestation of YHVH himself.
I don't wanna argue about small interpretations like using the words, as, is or through…or begotten in spirit or whatever.
I just want to prove the point that Jesus Christ pre-existed as The Word of God.
and that
The Word of God, was and is God himself.
Because at the end of the day.
It shows how much God loves us, to manifest in flesh and die on the cross for us.
Quote (RokkaMan @ July 04 2010,04:47) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,17:28) Hi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was. I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
I believe this post by OXY best explains my position.Jesus Christ preexisted as The Word of God…
if The Word of God became a son to YHVH @ conception.
Then that's fine with me.
The whole point i'm trying to make, is that Jesus is a manifestation of YHVH himself.
I don't wanna argue about small interpretations like using the words, as, is or through…or begotten in spirit or whatever.
I just want to prove the point that Jesus Christ pre-existed as The Word of God.
and that
The Word of God, was and is God himself.
Hi RokkaMan,Are you forgetting Mary was his Mother,
so the most he can be at his birth is 50%!
100% is the highest percentage! (Ps. 83:18)God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ July 04 2010,05:23) Quote (RokkaMan @ July 04 2010,04:47) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,17:28) Hi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was. I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
I believe this post by OXY best explains my position.Jesus Christ preexisted as The Word of God…
if The Word of God became a son to YHVH @ conception.
Then that's fine with me.
The whole point i'm trying to make, is that Jesus is a manifestation of YHVH himself.
I don't wanna argue about small interpretations like using the words, as, is or through…or begotten in spirit or whatever.
I just want to prove the point that Jesus Christ pre-existed as The Word of God.
and that
The Word of God, was and is God himself.
Hi RokkaMan,Are you forgetting Mary was his Mother,
so the most he can be at his birth is 50%!
100% is the highest percentage! (Ps. 83:18)God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
You are absolutely inccorect here.His mother mary only gave him his flesh.
God gave him his spirit.He was 100% man in flesh.
100% God in spirit.According to you, scripture was lying when it said in:
Colossians 2:8
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Quote (RokkaMan @ July 04 2010,05:58) Quote (Ed J @ July 04 2010,05:23) Quote (RokkaMan @ July 04 2010,04:47) Quote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,17:28) Hi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was. I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
I believe this post by OXY best explains my position.Jesus Christ preexisted as The Word of God…
if The Word of God became a son to YHVH @ conception.
Then that's fine with me.
The whole point i'm trying to make, is that Jesus is a manifestation of YHVH himself.
I don't wanna argue about small interpretations like using the words, as, is or through…or begotten in spirit or whatever.
I just want to prove the point that Jesus Christ pre-existed as The Word of God.
and that
The Word of God, was and is God himself.
Hi RokkaMan,Are you forgetting Mary was his Mother,
so the most he can be at his birth is 50%!
100% is the highest percentage! (Ps. 83:18)God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
You are absolutely inccorect here.His mother mary only gave him his flesh.
God gave him his spirit.He was 100% man in flesh.
100% God in spirit.According to you, scripture was lying when it said in:
Colossians 2:8
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Hi RokkaMan,That's 200%, which is a Theomatic impossibility.
Perhaps you need to reread Matt.1:18,1:20 & Luke 1:35.So are you also now saying that “He” was 100% “Mary” as well?
The systems of religion and traditions of men do communicate…
distortions of truth, confusion of mind, and distractions of spirit.Can you reconcile these two Scriptures together, I can!
John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.
Jn.8:14 …Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true…John 5:37 is therefore fulfilled today in your reading of this Post! (Rev.21:2-3)
Luke 10:30-37 will help you understand who [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh was! (John 8:14)
This is an exegetical parable about יהשוע המשיח and “His neighbor” יהוה האלהים! (John 5:37)Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Oxy @ July 04 2010,07:57) Far out Ed, what's your point? RM has made a valid point and all you can do is pin #####.
Hi Oxy,What's 'your point' and what's RM's (as 'you' put it) valid point?
Quote (Oxy @ July 04 2010,08:11) I bet your mother had problems with you too lol
Hi Oxy,Why don't you ask our Heavenly Father about me,
and get back to me on what he tells you about me; OK?God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Oxy @ July 03 2010,17:28) Hi Marty, I was blown away when I read the prayer that Jesus prayed in John 17, particularly John 17:5 And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself with the glory which I had with You before the world was. I found myself asking the question, what was His glory in the beginning? The answer I found lay in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
It is interesting to note that in Revelation 19:13 it's not Jesus coming on the white horse, but the Word of God (who is Jesus)
Fascinating!
Hi Oxy:The glory that he had with the Father from the beginning is his glorification and exaltation to the head of the church and the only way that man can be reconciled to God(he is the saviour of all mankind), and the judge of the living and the dead.
God had forseen all from the beginning:
Quote John 17:1These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come;glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: 2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
5And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
6I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
7Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
8For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
9I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
10And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Quote 21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world
Love in Christ,
Marty
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