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To be honest Phoenix, I don't think i'm alone in seeing that paradoxical contradiction in the Watchtower assertion that Jesus is MTA incarnate. If Yeshua really was the maker of ALL things (as John 1:3 and Col 1:16 affirm), He then is precluded from being a created “thing”. Therefore He cannot be Michael.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 24 2007,20:44) Hi P,
Christ is the firstborn monogenes Son.
He was before all things with God in the beginning.
Angels are created beings-created by God[the Father]-through the Son.Heb 1-2 contrasts him with the angels which includes Michael.
Hi NickWhere did you get the word Monogenes from because LOL I did a dictionary search and the first reference was “libido enhancer”
Anyway, I am beginning to see what you mean now.
Hugs
Quote (Is 1:18 @ Mar. 24 2007,21:06) To be honest Phoenix, I don't think i'm alone in seeing that paradoxical contradiction in the Watchtower assertion that Jesus is MTA incarnate. If Yeshua really was the maker of ALL things (as John 1:3 and Col 1:16 affirm), He then is precluded from being a created “thing”. Therefore He cannot be Michael.
Hi IsThankyou. Yes I am starting to see that now.
Hugs
PhoenixQuote (Phoenix @ Mar. 24 2007,21:07) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 24 2007,20:44) Hi P,
Christ is the firstborn monogenes Son.
He was before all things with God in the beginning.
Angels are created beings-created by God[the Father]-through the Son.Heb 1-2 contrasts him with the angels which includes Michael.
Hi NickWhere did you get the word Monogenes from because LOL I did a dictionary search and the first reference was “libido enhancer”
Anyway, I am beginning to see what you mean now.
Hugs
pThe word “Monogenes” is the Greek word for Begotten!
Monogenes simply means “Unique”.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 24 2007,22:49) Quote (Phoenix @ Mar. 24 2007,21:07) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 24 2007,20:44) Hi P,
Christ is the firstborn monogenes Son.
He was before all things with God in the beginning.
Angels are created beings-created by God[the Father]-through the Son.Heb 1-2 contrasts him with the angels which includes Michael.
Hi NickWhere did you get the word Monogenes from because LOL I did a dictionary search and the first reference was “libido enhancer”
Anyway, I am beginning to see what you mean now.
Hugs
pThe word “Monogenes” is the Greek word for Begotten!
Monogenes simply means “Unique”.
LOL Whew!! thank youHugs
The term “sent” seems to add to your affirmation of pre-existence; am I correct? In other words, I've heard it said before that you have to actually exist before some one can actually “send” you. I beg to differ with you. If God is in heaven, and we are on the earth, then in order for him to “give” a Son to us (on earth), he would have to “send” himself in the form of a seed to the earth (to join with Mary's egg and make a Son). Thus, he “sent” his Son (his seed) into the earth. Because before this “sending” of his seed (Son), the Son existed with God (and in God, as God).
Just as your seed remains in you, Nick. So Jesus remained in God. Just as your (potential) seed is you. So Jesus (the potential seed) remained as God. John 1:1.
But that potential seed is NOT a person yet……. Your sperm is nothing without an egg (sorry guys).
Just a little bit of a rambling before bedtime
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2007,08:08) The term “sent” seems to add to your affirmation of pre-existence; am I correct? In other words, I've heard it said before that you have to actually exist before some one can actually “send” you. I beg to differ with you. If God is in heaven, and we are on the earth, then in order for him to “give” a Son to us (on earth), he would have to “send” himself in the form of a seed to the earth (to join with Mary's egg and make a Son). Thus, he “sent” his Son (his seed) into the earth. Because before this “sending” of his seed (Son), the Son existed with God (and in God, as God). Just as your seed remains in you, Nick. So Jesus remained in God. Just as your (potential) seed is you. So Jesus (the potential seed) remained as God. John 1:1.
But that potential seed is NOT a person yet……. Your sperm is nothing without an egg (sorry guys).
Just a little bit of a rambling before bedtime
Hi Not 3
Rom 8
3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the fleshNick,
Are you tempted to think that because Romans 8 says, “….in the likeness of sinful flesh…..” that he wasn't really a TRUE man? But just “took on” flesh?David – thank you for the PM and for the extensive information regarding Michael/Jesus. I will print it off, and give it some thought over the next few weeks. I'm glad to know that I have a resource here (in you), to better understand the JW's. As I said before, these two ladies that come to my door have become dear friends. They have invited me to come tonight to the Memorial of Christ's death.
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2007,18:56) Nick,
Are you tempted to think that because Romans 8 says, “….in the likeness of sinful flesh…..” that he wasn't really a TRUE man? But just “took on” flesh?
Hi not3,
Jesus partook of flesh
and
was a true man-body, soul, spirit.Quote David – thank you for the PM and for the extensive information regarding Michael/Jesus. I will print it off, and give it some thought over the next few weeks. I'm glad to know that I have a resource here (in you), to better understand the JW's. As I said before, these two ladies that come to my door have become dear friends. They have invited me to come tonight to the Memorial of Christ's death. I'm sorry it is somewhat in an unorganized state right now, with overlapping information. I haven't visited that file for a while. Regarding the invite you got, you should come, if for nothing else, that you have become “dear friends” with these ones. But of course, it is the one and only thing that Jesus instituted for his followers to observe.
Regarding that invitation which is being given out to everyone,
Not3in1, for you:Oh sheesh I forgot about the memorial. It was Last Nite for me. But now that i think about it I wouldnt have been able to go due to the TV programs that were on
Quote Oh sheesh I forgot about the memorial. It was Last Nite for me. But now that i think about it I wouldnt have been able to go due to the TV programs that were on Is that supposed to be funny?
huh?
NO! I was serious!
I really was intending to go to the memorial because the JW's dropped off a pamphlet last weekend.
hmmm
Hi Not3in1
Yes he has to be a first begotten Son to been the sent Son; God can’t send what he has not Got yet?Interesting also
Behold I knock at the door if any should open I shall come in
Yet if some one is at your table dinning with you; How then is possible to be still waiting for them to appear.
As he Christ is sent, they had the challenge to consider who God sent, Instead of just a man called Christ; a deeper revelation was need to fulfill the truth in us
We on top of this have the challenge of him appeared already as a man and now a coming again; Double trouble!IN considering this it remains that we are at risk of possible knowing not whom God has sent
and he still has to appear for us in truth and Paul beseeching us back to the coming of Christ that he may come for us in understanding as the sent son of man first to the son of God in prolonged Days; that we may enter the rest of the seventh day creationBeing first not God but having Gods Words by given measure
Jhn 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure [unto him].
And he beseeches us to believe on God Who Has sent him
Jhn 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
Christ is sugesting another Identity/new Name/resurrection of life as if its not me look back before me ?Target first begotten Son…tO BE THE FIRST BORN Son..Ps 89
charity
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