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Where are such revelations? In a book. I can pick up tons of books that speak of miracles and gods. My revelation of God is found all around me. He gave me intelligence and reason, I don't plan to shut them down and waste such a gift.
Yes, and children believe in Santa and the Easter Bunny too. Most have imaginary friends. So its less about faith and more about impressionable minds.
Tell you what Nick. Grab any child off the street and read Joshua to him/her. I can supply you a list of other passages to read to them as well. Try Lev 20 and Exo 21.
Let me know how it turns out.
I would tell you that this means to not pratice the use of the powers of the enemy.
The enemy can self-impose himself as a angel of light, quote scripture…even convience people that he is in fact the christ.
If someone came up to you and said “Hey I'm the anti-christ” Would you believe them? Probably not…if that same person said told you “Hey, I am the Christ” would you believe them? Most likely not…
The point that I'm trying to make here is this. If I am to have any success at all of convencing you that I am in fact “Samuel” I would have to “Impose” myself as Samuel…even if I weren't in fact “Samuel” All this mumbo jumbo going on in the world about this person or that person is the anti-christ…or that is of the anti-christ…is a bunch of hogwash. No one is going to know that the Anti-Christ is in fact the Anti-Christ…he is most likely going to have everyone convinced that he is Jesus Christ…came back to the earth. And everone will accept his mark…thinking it is the mark of GOD.
Satan, that old Devil…is in fact and extremely good liar…Understand? …of course you don't…thats excatly how he will decieve you.
People don't pay attention to anything…they won't read the bible…they discredit it…and pass it off as being a fake story. And thus, refuse GODS word altogether.
When these things start happening people still won't know that it is of GOD. Does the book of Exodus mean anything to anyone? …of course it don't becasue you don't believe the Bible or in GOD.
But THUS SAITH THE LORD!
That all will one day confess that the Lord Jesus Christ is truly the KING OF KING AND LORD OF LORDS.
Every knee will bow…and every tongue will confess.
I can assure you of it.Its quite a shame really that the world refuses the GOD that loves them, and wants to fellowship with them and give them everything they could ever want or need.
But thats the way of this world. The word of GOD is a sharp “Two-Edged” sword…that cuts both ways. Meaning that the truth hurts ever heard that before? Yes…the truth hurts and man does not want it.You say GOD “Murderd” people…how is this if he gave them life…can he not take it away…and then also give it back again? No to you of course you don't understand…because you shun GOD from your knowledge.
But everyone in the end will know that GOD is very much alive and that his Lamb …his Son, our Lord Jesus Christ will rule his Kingdom on this earth.
Thus saith the LORD!
It is written!Quote (kejonn @ April 02 2008,21:25) Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,00:40) One definition of “magic”: human control of supernatural agencies or the forces of nature. Jesus had access to the supernatural through the Father. The Father worked through Jesus, but I'm not so sure we could stretch that to say Jesus had “control” of these God-given powers.
Sorry Kejonn, but I think it's a bit far-fetched to say that Jesus used a “type” of magic. It's certainly not a good idea to compare Harry Potter to Jesus Christ. One man is ficticious while the other man brought you to the living God (or are you willing to say that a ficticious character brought you to God, since Jesus can not be proven?) Bro, you are on a slippery-slope I'm afraid.
Here's a question for you Mandy: had Jesus really worked the powers he was supposed to have, don't you think he would have caught the attention of at least one notable person who would have recorded at least a rumor of him during the time? After all, the bible says he came before both Pilate and Herod, both prominent men.But if he did the other things: preached, taught, and got mad at people in the temple, would he catch the attention of such historians? No.
That being said, it is odd that the the people who wrote of his life were mostly anonymous. The only person who are certain wrote about him was Paul, and he doesn't mention the miracles Jesus did. All Paul was about was the death and resurrection of Jesus.
Finally, ponder this: why was Paul, a man who never walked with Jesus, the first to write about him? Could it be that the gospels, which were written after Paul, could have been a response to the religion that Paul had started?
Bro,You have gone from faith and searching to demanding proof. I wonder when this change happened? Can you pin-point it? I bet not. When faith is damaged it doesn't take long to be destroyed if you are listening to (or reading) the wrong voices.
Have you ever considered that Jesus was too powerful of a revelation that it was kept under hat? In other words, a conspiracy of sorts. That in the beginning folks knew the truth and as it progressed, the “enemy” of the truth got rid of any writings or such evidence that would promote absolute faith in Jesus so that all would be left is faith? And we all know (or at least you and I know) how fragile faith can be?
You're looking for proof of Jesus' existence and miracles by history, but what if he was wiped out of history? And all that remains is this book that has been made a mess of?
This messy/flawed book and the words of it's Messiah brought you to God, remember? How so? Was it strickly faith in it's flawed words? I think not. I believe that it was God's spirit that drew you and brought you to the truth *even through flawed history and dried ink.*
If this is true, and you've admitted that it is, you must not deem the bible only a book of history that is so flawed that it may not be trusted or believed…..instead I would look at it in such a way that this book is used of God to draw men. How the truth is propogated after it has been planted is up to each believer.
Even our faith is a gift.
Press on, brother. Some things cannot be explained. This used to bother me to no end, but I've come to accept it recently and I've been blessed.
Quote (kejonn @ April 02 2008,20:54) Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,00:40) One definition of “magic”: human control of supernatural agencies or the forces of nature. Jesus had access to the supernatural through the Father. The Father worked through Jesus, but I'm not so sure we could stretch that to say Jesus had “control” of these God-given powers.
Sorry Kejonn, but I think it's a bit far-fetched to say that Jesus used a “type” of magic. It's certainly not a good idea to compare Harry Potter to Jesus Christ. One man is ficticious while the other man brought you to the living God (or are you willing to say that a ficticious character brought you to God, since Jesus can not be proven?) Bro, you are on a slippery-slope I'm afraid.
No slippery slope. I believe in the historical Jesus. Why does someone have to have miracles put on top of his life to prove anything?As the legend of Jesus grew, people likely continued to isert such in his life to keep the interest alive. Heres one for you: name the miracles that Paul mentioned.
How can you believe in the historical Jesus when you say history doesn't speak of him?Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,14:14) Quote (kejonn @ April 02 2008,21:25) Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,00:40) One definition of “magic”: human control of supernatural agencies or the forces of nature. Jesus had access to the supernatural through the Father. The Father worked through Jesus, but I'm not so sure we could stretch that to say Jesus had “control” of these God-given powers.
Sorry Kejonn, but I think it's a bit far-fetched to say that Jesus used a “type” of magic. It's certainly not a good idea to compare Harry Potter to Jesus Christ. One man is ficticious while the other man brought you to the living God (or are you willing to say that a ficticious character brought you to God, since Jesus can not be proven?) Bro, you are on a slippery-slope I'm afraid.
Here's a question for you Mandy: had Jesus really worked the powers he was supposed to have, don't you think he would have caught the attention of at least one notable person who would have recorded at least a rumor of him during the time? After all, the bible says he came before both Pilate and Herod, both prominent men.But if he did the other things: preached, taught, and got mad at people in the temple, would he catch the attention of such historians? No.
That being said, it is odd that the the people who wrote of his life were mostly anonymous. The only person who are certain wrote about him was Paul, and he doesn't mention the miracles Jesus did. All Paul was about was the death and resurrection of Jesus.
Finally, ponder this: why was Paul, a man who never walked with Jesus, the first to write about him? Could it be that the gospels, which were written after Paul, could have been a response to the religion that Paul had started?
Bro,You have gone from faith and searching to demanding proof. I wonder when this change happened? Can you pin-point it? I bet not. When faith is damaged it doesn't take long to be destroyed if you are listening to (or reading) the wrong voices.
Mandy,I can see where you might think this, but its not correctly placed. I don't demand proof to have faith in God. I just no longer view God in an Abrahamic fashion. I have a strong faith in a God who does not demand I believe this or that from an ancient book to know Him. I believe God speaks to our inner soul (not with voices in our head) but through urges, inspiration, and leadings.
Seriously, if God's only means to get people to believe in Him are miracles in a book, then He's not all that powerful. Especially when that book shows an awfully angry and vengeful God in the OT. In the NT, we know next to nothing about God, just someone who is supposed to be His “biological” son.
Quote Have you ever considered that Jesus was too powerful of a revelation that it was kept under hat?
Read that again. Tell me if it makes sense.Quote In other words, a conspiracy of sorts. That in the beginning folks knew the truth and as it progressed, the “enemy” of the truth got rid of any writings or such evidence that would promote absolute faith in Jesus so that all would be left is faith? And we all know (or at least you and I know) how fragile faith can be?
The you are saying that God messed up again and let “satan” beat Him again?As it stands, I agree with what someone said before: the most powerful being in the bible appears to be “satan”. He seems to trump God at every turn.
Quote You're looking for proof of Jesus' existence and miracles by history, but what if he was wiped out of history? And all that remains is this book that has been made a mess of?
Then God has left the building.I'm not looking for proof of Jesus' existence in any case. I believe that Jesus lived. I believe there is a basis of truth in the gospels. But like so many OT stories that have been embellished, the story has been inflated to impress people who wouldn't give a hoot about an ordinary street preacher.
Quote This messy/flawed book and the words of it's Messiah brought you to God, remember? How so? Was it strickly faith in it's flawed words? I think not. I believe that it was God's spirit that drew you and brought you to the truth *even through flawed history and dried ink.*
Actually, it was a book by Hal Lindsey using the bible that brought me to God. He turned out to be a fraud. Go figure.Quote If this is true, and you've admitted that it is, you must not deem the bible only a book of history that is so flawed that it may not be trusted or believed…..instead I would look at it in such a way that this book is used of God to draw men. How the truth is propogated after it has been planted is up to each believer.
The only problem with this is that most come to belief because they are exposed to certain passages and shielded from others. Had I opened up the bible and read Exo 21 or Lev 20 before every reading the Gospel of John, I would not be where I am today. In fact, I would not have read GoJ after that.Quote Even our faith is a gift. Press on, brother. Some things cannot be explained. This used to bother me to no end, but I've come to accept it recently and I've been blessed.
I can get that. When I was married and my wife and I constantly fought, I figured that was my lot in life and accepted it. I was willing to go through it all to keep my family whole. She did not though.In other words, I took the 90% bad and 10% good and believed it was enough.
But I don't have to with God. He does not expect me, IMHO, to have to base my faith on Him via such a flawed creation of humanity. The bible is full of the biases of man and can in no way be inspired by a perfect loving God. It is too bigoted, sexist,
and brutal.Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,14:17) Quote (kejonn @ April 02 2008,20:54) Quote (Not3in1 @ April 02 2008,00:40) One definition of “magic”: human control of supernatural agencies or the forces of nature. Jesus had access to the supernatural through the Father. The Father worked through Jesus, but I'm not so sure we could stretch that to say Jesus had “control” of these God-given powers.
Sorry Kejonn, but I think it's a bit far-fetched to say that Jesus used a “type” of magic. It's certainly not a good idea to compare Harry Potter to Jesus Christ. One man is ficticious while the other man brought you to the living God (or are you willing to say that a ficticious character brought you to God, since Jesus can not be proven?) Bro, you are on a slippery-slope I'm afraid.
No slippery slope. I believe in the historical Jesus. Why does someone have to have miracles put on top of his life to prove anything?As the legend of Jesus grew, people likely continued to isert such in his life to keep the interest alive. Heres one for you: name the miracles that Paul mentioned.
How can you believe in the historical Jesus when you say history doesn't speak of him?
Because most legends have a basis of truth. Jesus could not help that others came after him and embellished on his life.Hi KJ,
So he was not a liar.
Men added miracles to his life story.
Why then are you here if you have no faith?
Surely you can throw off all allegiances and eat, drink and be merry?Or are you doubting yourself?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 02 2008,16:12) Hi KJ,
So he was not a liar.
Men added miracles to his life story.
Why then are you here if you have no faith?
Reasons I am here:
(1) I think rigid fundamentalism in any Abrahamic religion is detrimental to the advancement of society and science
(2) I don't watch TV beyond an hour or two a week
(3) I have my own faith that I feel is every bit as valid as you think yours is
(4) I like reading some of your responses to various posts because they are funny
(5) You said that we are beneficialQuote (Nick Hassan @ April 02 2008,17:07) Hi TJ,
They distract from progress but we learn from them too.
Sad the irrepressible vanity of men.
You then saidQuote Surely you can throw off all allegiances and eat, drink and be merry?
What would Jesus do?- Mat 11:19 “The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Behold, a gluttonous man and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!' Yet wisdom is vindicated by her deeds.”
Plus, the Preacher said it was good!Quote Ecc 8:15 So I commended pleasure, for there is nothing good for a man under the sun except to eat and to drink and to be merry, and this will stand by him in his toils throughout the days of his life which God has given him under the sun. Quote Or are you doubting yourself?
Huh?Hi KJ,
1 Corinthians 1:25
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.Hi KJ,
So if society is a collection of increasingly wierd, selfish and disturbed people
and science is a few weak measures of creation
why should one put too much energy into their possible advancement?Weird, selfish and disturbed people have been around since the first man. The only reason there are more today is that there are more people today
.I'm sorry you are so opposed to science. You've made over 23k posts so you sure like to take advantage of that science.
Why aren't you Amish?
Hi KJ,
Listen to your philosopher
Ecc12Vanity of vanities, saith the Preacher, vanity of vanities; all is vanity.
13And I gave my heart to seek and search out by wisdom concerning all things that are done under heaven: this sore travail hath God given to the sons of man to be exercised therewith.
14I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all is vanity and vexation of spirit.
..
18For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow. Ecc5
1Keep thy foot when thou goest to the house of God, and be more ready to hear, than to give the sacrifice of fools: for they consider not that they do evil.ecc7
16Be not righteous over much; neither make thyself over wise: why shouldest thou destroy thyself ?17Be not over much wicked, neither be thou foolish: why shouldest thou die before thy time?
18It is good that thou shouldest take hold of this; yea, also from this withdraw not thine hand: for he that feareth God shall come forth of them all.
Quote (Samuel @ April 03 2008,07:13) No one is going to know that the Anti-Christ is in fact the Anti-Christ…he is most likely going to have everyone convinced that he is Jesus Christ…came back to the earth. And everone will accept his mark…thinking it is the mark of GOD.
You are stuck in an impossible situation there. You cannot accept anyone who claims to be Jesus because satan is such a good con artist. Satan might be so good that he has christians convinced that the bible is truth when it is not. How do you know who to believe? I can imagine such paranoia leading to mental illness.Stuart
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