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Morningstar,
Give me some bullet points for this doctrine of the catholic church so I can show where it fails according to the Jewish bible.
Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:43) Morningstar, Give me some bullet points for this doctrine of the catholic church so I can show where it fails according to the Jewish bible.
this was before the catholic church. The catholics changed it to our current model. And, I am not really inclined to do so. You can search for it yourself on google.Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 25 2007,13:52) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:43) Morningstar, Give me some bullet points for this doctrine of the catholic church so I can show where it fails according to the Jewish bible.
this was before the catholic church. The catholics changed it to our current model. And, I am not really inclined to do so. You can search for it yourself on google.
Well, that was a convenient way to show you had no defense against what I listed, but OK. I'm not going to bother because it is all false doctrine in any case.Why Jesus could not die for your sins
Deu 24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.
Jer 31:30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.
Eze 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
——–
As you can see, no one can die for your sins. You are responsible for your relationship with G-d.What about human sacrifices?
——–
Deu 12:29 When the LORD thy God shall cut off the nations from before thee, whither thou goest to possess them, and thou succeedest them, and dwellest in their land;
Deu 12:30 Take heed to thyself that thou be not snared by following them, after that they be destroyed from before thee; and that thou enquire not after their gods, saying, How did these nations serve their gods? even so will I do likewise.
Deu 12:31 Thou shalt not do so unto the LORD thy God: for every abomination to the LORD, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods.Deu 18:10 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,
Psa 106:37 Yea, they sacrificed their sons and their daughters unto devils,
Psa 106:38 And shed innocent blood, even the blood of their sons and of their daughters, whom they sacrificed unto the idols of Canaan: and the land was polluted with blood.Jer 19:4 Because they have forsaken me, and have estranged this place, and have burned incense in it unto other gods, whom neither they nor their fathers have known, nor the kings of Judah, and have filled this place with the blood of innocents;
Jer 19:5 They have built also the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings unto Baal, which I commanded not, nor spake it, neither came it into my mind:Eze 16:20 Moreover thou hast taken thy sons and thy daughters, whom thou hast borne unto me, and these hast thou sacrificed unto them to be devoured. Is this of thy whoredoms a small matter,
Are we truly to believe that G-d, who never changes, told the children of Israel to avoid the pagan practices of human sacrifice and then turned around and sacrificed his own son? Is this why people say Christians are hypocrites, because they believe their god is a hypocrite?
Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:57) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 25 2007,13:52) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:43) Morningstar, Give me some bullet points for this doctrine of the catholic church so I can show where it fails according to the Jewish bible.
this was before the catholic church. The catholics changed it to our current model. And, I am not really inclined to do so. You can search for it yourself on google.
Well, that was a convenient way to show you had no defense against what I listed, but OK. I'm not going to bother because it is all false doctrine in any case.
no i didnt bother because I could tell that you aren't here to actually try to see our side at all. You are here for a less altruistic motive. I just don't want to waste my time explaining things to someone who only wants to add more to his repitoire of mockery.you dont have to agree but at least show respect if you really want to learn a christian's perspective.
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 25 2007,15:13) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:57) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 25 2007,13:52) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,13:43) Morningstar, Give me some bullet points for this doctrine of the catholic church so I can show where it fails according to the Jewish bible.
this was before the catholic church. The catholics changed it to our current model. And, I am not really inclined to do so. You can search for it yourself on google.
Well, that was a convenient way to show you had no defense against what I listed, but OK. I\\\'m not going to bother because it is all false doctrine in any case.
no i didnt bother because I could tell that you aren\\\'t here to actually try to see our side at all. You are here for a less altruistic motive. I just don\\\'t want to waste my time explaining things to someone who only wants to add more to his repitoire of mockery.you dont have to agree but at least show respect if you really want to learn a christian\\\'s perspective.
I was a christian for many years, and a strong one.How did I show disrespect? You gave a one line answer that said what I listed did not agree with some atonement theory so I felt you needed to elaborate your points. Since you did not want to, I didn\\\'t feel you really believed in it anyway.
If you were a Christian before what happend to you? I sense some anger in your posts, right from the first one you did. What are you so angry about?
Peace and Love Mrs.
Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,14:56)
The new covenant does not exist. This 'new covenant' was never made bu the God of Israel, it was a human contract between the apostate Paul and his roman cohorts.Towshab,
Your name stands for something, doesn't it? I have seen what it stands for, and this is told to you so that you will know I have heard from God.I believe you are a liar! Sent here to “bash without truth”. I don't usually make these types of accusations, in fact, some have teased me for being the politically correct one around here. But I feel that the Lord has given me a word of knowledge concerning you. And you are here soley to spread lies!
Beware brother's and sister's! This person is not of the Lord and in fact, he has never belonged to the Lord. He is here on a mission……
Home > Lexicons > Hebrew Lexicon > Towshab
Sponsor a Child with Compassion
The Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon
Strong's Number: 8453b#wt
Original WordWord Origin
b#wt from (03427)Transliterated WordPhonetic Spelling
Towshab to-shawb'Parts of SpeechTWOT
Noun Masculine 922d
Definition
1. sojourner, stranger
HI Towshab. YOu jump around a lot.
You wrote:Quote What happened to the guards? Mat 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
Mat 28:2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
Mat 28:3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:
Mat 28:4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.
Mat 28:5 And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.
Mat 28:6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.
Mat 28:7 And go quickly, and tell his disciples that he is risen from the dead; and, behold, he goeth before you into Galilee; there shall ye see him: lo, I have told you.
Mat 28:8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.
Mat 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.Matthew has guards at the tomb of Jesus and Mary finding an angel who tells her Jesus has risen. But what does John say?
Joh 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Joh 20:2 Then she runneth, and cometh to Simon Peter, and to the other disciple, whom Jesus loved, and saith unto them, They have taken away the Lord out of the sepulchre, and we know not where they have laid him.
Joh 20:3 Peter therefore went forth, and that other disciple, and came to the sepulchre.
Joh 20:4 So they ran both together: and the other disciple did outrun Peter, and came first to the sepulchre.
Joh 20:5 And he stooping down, and looking in, saw the linen clothes lying; yet went he not in.
Joh 20:6 Then cometh Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and seeth the linen clothes lie,
Joh 20:7 And the napkin, that was about his head, not lying with the linen clothes, but wrapped together in a place by itself.
Joh 20:8 Then went in also that other disciple, which came first to the sepulchre, and he saw, and believed.
Joh 20:9 For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.
Joh 20:10 Then the disciples went away again unto their own home.
Joh 20:11 But Mary stood without at the sepulchre weeping: and as she wept, she stooped down, and looked into the sepulchre,
Joh 20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.Now if guards were at the tomb in Matthew, where did they go in John? And if she saw an angel when she first came to the tomb and spoke with Jesus on the way back, why does John have her coming back without meeting Jesus until she returned a second time, and telling the disciples that Jesus had been taken? Did not the angel tell her in Matthew he had risen?
Let me help. You have to understand that when two people write of the same happening, they don't capture exactly the same things. Let's take a closer look. At first glance, these accounts may seem to be the exact same account. But really, they are overlapping accounts. And you had them backwards. Let's start with John's account.
Joh 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
Joh 20:2 Then she runneth, and cometh to Simon Peter, and to the other disciple, whom Jesus loved, and saith unto them, They have taken away the Lord out of the sepulchre, and we know not where they have laid him.
Joh 20:3 Peter therefore went forth, and that other disciple, and came to the sepulchre.
Joh 20:4 So they ran both together: and the other disciple did outrun Peter, and came first to the sepulchre.
Joh 20:5 And he stooping down, and looking in, saw the linen clothes lying; yet went he not in.
Joh 20:6 Then cometh Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and seeth the linen clothes lie,
Joh 20:7 And the napkin, that was about his head, not lying with the linen clothes, but wrapped together in a place by itself.
Joh 20:8 Then went in also that other disciple, which came first to the sepulchre, and he saw, and believed.
Joh 20:9 For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.
Joh 20:10 Then the disciples went away again unto their own home.Joh 20:11 But Mary stood without at the sepulchre weeping: and as she wept, she stooped down, and looked into the sepulchre,
Joh 20:12 And seeth two angels in white sitting, the one at the head, and the other at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.Mat 28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
Mat 28:2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
Mat 28:3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:
Mat 28:4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.
Mat 28:5 And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.
Mat 28:6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.
Mat 28:7 And go quickly, and tell his disciples that he is risen from the dead; and, behold, he goeth before you into Galilee; there shall ye see him: lo, I have told you.
Mat 28:8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.
Mat 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.Early Sunday morning Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James, along with Salome, Joanna, and other women, bring spices to the tomb to treat Jesus’ body. En route they say to one another: “Who will roll the stone away from the door of the memorial tomb for us?” But on arriving, they find that an earthquake has occurred and God's angel has rolled the stone away. The guards are gone, and the tomb is empty.
WHEN the women find Jesus’ tomb empty, Mary Magdalene runs off to tell Peter and John. However, the other women evidently remain at the tomb. Soon, an angel appears and invites them inside.
Here the women see yet another angel, and one of the angels says to them: “Do not you be fearful, for I know you are looking for Jesus who was impaled. He is not here, for he was raised up, as he said. Come, see the place where he was lying. And go quickly and tell his disciples that he was raised up from the dead.” So with fear and great joy, these women also run off.
By this time, Mary has found Peter and John, and she reports to them: “They have taken away the Lord out of the memorial tomb, and we do not know where they have laid him.” Immediately the two apostles take off running. John is fleeter of foot—evidently being younger—and he reaches the tomb first. By this time the women have left, so no one is around. Stooping down, John peers into the tomb and sees the bandages, but he remains outside.
When Peter arrives, he does not hesitate but goes right on in. He sees the bandages lying there and also the cloth used to wrap Jesus’ head. It is rolled up in one place. John now also enters the tomb, and he beli
eves Mary’s report. But neither Peter nor John grasps that Jesus has been raised up, even though He had often told them that He would be. Puzzled, the two return home, but Mary, who has come back to the tomb, remains.In the meantime, the other women are hurrying to tell the disciples that Jesus has been resurrected, as the angels commanded them to do.
Towshab, you stated:
Quote Mat 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Mat 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.Wait, its been almost 2000 years since Jesus said this. Which one of the people he spoke to here is still alive? Failed prophecy, false prophet. I guess the next avenue would be to speak of a symbolic death, such as the final death, but that doesn't fly.
However, the context of this verse, as well as that of the parallel accounts by Mark and Luke, helps us understand the real meaning of the scripture. What did Matthew relate right after the words quoted above? He wrote:
“Six days later Jesus took Peter and James and John his brother along and brought them up into a lofty mountain by themselves. And he was transfigured before them.” (Matthew 17:1, 2)Both Mark and Luke also linked Jesus’ comment about the Kingdom with the account of the transfiguration. (Mark 9:1-8; Luke 9:27-36)
Jesus’ coming in Kingdom power was demonstrated in his transfiguration, his appearing in glory in the presence of the three apostles. Peter verifies this understanding by speaking of “the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ” with regard to his witnessing Jesus’ transfiguration.—2 Peter 1:16-18.
I think it's better to let the Bible be it's own interpreter. Context is important.
The transfiguration:
“As [Jesus] was praying the appearance of his face became different and his apparel became glitteringly white. Also, look! two men were conversing with him, who were Moses and Elijah. These appeared with glory and began talking about his departure that he was destined to fulfill at Jerusalem.” Then, “a cloud formed and began to overshadow [the apostles]. As they entered into the cloud, they became fearful. And a voice came out of the cloud, saying: ‘This is my Son, the one that has been chosen. Listen to him.’”—Luke 9:29-31, 34, 35.Jehovah’s words from heaven confirmed that identification, and the vision of Jesus transfigured was a foretaste of Christ’s coming in Kingdom power and glory, eventually to judge mankind. More than 30 years after the transfiguration, Peter wrote: “It was not by following artfully contrived false stories that we acquainted you with the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ, but it was by having become eyewitnesses of his magnificence. For he received from God the Father honor and glory, when words such as these were borne to him by the magnificent glory: ‘This is my son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.’ Yes, these words we heard borne from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain.”—2 Peter 1:16-18; 1 Peter 4:17.
Yes, the transfiguration was to Peter the fulfillment of Jesus’ promise that some of his disciples would not taste death until they had first seen the Son of man in his kingly power.
Quote Next, most Christian bibles take the liberty of capitalizing 'lord' because they feel it is speaking of Jesus. Actually, showtab, some more research will indicate that where LORD or GOD are in capital letters (such as in many versions) this indicates where God's name used to be (Jehovah or if you prefer, Yahweh)
End of his run as a supposed messiah. Which, by the way, means 'anointed'. Yet, he never was properly anointed with oil.”–Towshab.
Yes, we all know Messiah means “anointed” or “anointed one.”
Which is better–to be anointed with oil or with holy spirit?
In his hometown of Nazareth, Jesus acknowledged this anointing when he applied to himself the prophecy of Isaiah 61:1, where the phrase appears: “Jehovah has anointed me.” (Lu 4:18) Jesus Christ is the only one in the Scriptures who holds an anointing to all three offices: prophet, high priest, and king. Jesus was anointed with “the oil of exultation more than [his] partners” (the other kings of the line of David). This was by reason of his receiving the anointing directly from Jehovah himself, not with oil but with holy spirit, not to an earthly kingship but to a heavenly one combined with the office of heavenly High Priest.—Heb 1:9; Ps 45:7.
Quote My G-d does not change, that is why He can't be the Christian G-d. G-d does not call for human sacrifice –towshab.
“Take, please, your son, your only son whom you so love, Isaac, and make a trip to the land of Moriah and there offer him up as a burnt offering on that one of the mountains which I shall designate to you.”
Yes, of course, he had this stopped. But it foreshadowed what was to come.
Quote What day did Jesus die? According to the synoptic gospels, on the Passover (15th of Nissan). But according to John, he died on the eve of Passover (14th of Nissan). How do you reconcile these accounts? We know this because the synoptics have Jesus eating the Passover Seder with his disciples on the evening before his death. However, John has the last supper as a regular meal where he washes their feet. John then has Jesus dying on the eve of the Passover, or the Passover Seder.
Luk 22:15 And he said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat this passover with you before I suffer:
Joh 18:28 Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the passover.
Joh 19:14 And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!
How could the Jews eat the passover (according to John) on the evening of Jesus' crucifixion, if the synoptics show that the passover was aleady eaten the night prior to his death?
You're not perhaps confusing our time with Hebrew time are you? The sixth hour, for example…it is not six oclock, right.
++” Peter wrote: “It was not by following artfully contrived false stories that we acquainted you with the power and presence of our Lord Jesus Christ, but it was by having become EYEWITNESSES of his magnificence. For he received from God the Father honor and glory, when words such as these were borne to him by the magnificent glory: ‘This is my son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.’ Yes, these words we heard borne from heaven while we were with him in the holy mountain.”—2 Peter 1:16-18; 1 Peter 4:17.
Did Simon Peter of Galilee actually write this?
1 Peter 5:12 By Silvanus, a faithful brother unto you, as I suppose, I have written briefly, exhorting, and testifying that this is the true grace of God wherein ye stand.
It is written by Silvanus, after Peter’s death. Are there any original EYEWITNESS accounts of Jesus at all?
Stuart
Quote (IM4Truth @ Oct. 25 2007,16:02) If you were a Christian before what happend to you? I sense some anger in your posts, right from the first one you did. What are you so angry about? Peace and Love Mrs.
No anger, just disappointment in believing a lie for so many years. Anyone who really looks into the Jewish scriptures and lines up what the Messianic time will look like verses what we have and what happened in Jesus day will see that he was NOT the Messiah. A little research into the various mythologies of the era will show how Jesus supposed life lines up with many, many different mythological gods. Virgin birth, drinking blood, gods taking human form, 'Alpha and Omega', a man dying for the salvation of others, baptism, etc. All of it from various mythologies, such as Krisha, Osiris, Mithras, Horus, Aion, Attis, etc. You can find more info here: http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa1.htmCouple this with no historical records outside of the Christian bible, and you don't have a pretty picture.
Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 25 2007,16:28) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 25 2007,14:56)
The new covenant does not exist. This 'new covenant' was never made bu the God of Israel, it was a human contract between the apostate Paul and his roman cohorts.Towshab,
Your name stands for something, doesn't it? I have seen what it stands for, and this is told to you so that you will know I have heard from God.
As someone pointed out, it is basically the Hebrew word for 'sojourner'. It was a word used in the Jewish bible for someone who was with the children of Israel, but not one of them. Much like 'ger' which means 'stranger'.Quote I believe you are a liar! Sent here to “bash without truth”. I don't usually make these types of accusations, in fact, some have teased me for being the politically correct one around here. But I feel that the Lord has given me a word of knowledge concerning you. And you are here soley to spread lies!
If you feel this way, read all of what I have posted and check for yourself. Then you can judge the truth of it. Had someone told me these things years ago, I would have felt the same as you.Quote Beware brother's and sister's! This person is not of the Lord and in fact, he has never belonged to the Lord. He is here on a mission……
Typical reaction. Christians are always calling each other lost and heretics, so why would any of these words surprise me. I have seen that some of you don't really worship Jesus so you may be OK. Most of Judaism views Christianity as idol worship because you worship a man and not G-d. In any case, you follow a man who failed as Messiah, so Paul had to come up with another way: the second coming. Too bad Paul really wasn't as good a Jew as he said he was or he'd know that any Jew who knew the scriptures would see right through this.
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