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- September 3, 2009 at 3:42 am#143936davidParticipant
This will get us started:
Moses was NOT a false god.”–david (p 15)
“What does “I have made thee a god to Pharaoh” mean?”–david (p 15)“It means that to Pharaoh he was “a god” because Pharaoh believed in many gods.”–WJ (p 16)
“Was Moses a false god?”–david (p 16)
“Neither, because Moses was not a god at all!–WJ (p 16)
[That’s odd, because the Bible says ‘Jehovah made him God to Pharoah.’ Saying Moses was “not a god at all” is kind of like saying ‘Jehovah didn’t make him god to Pharoah.’ ]
“Maybe you can give us a scripture where Moses followers like Joshua and Aaron ever referred to Moses as a God, or maybe there is another scripture that says Moses was “a god” somewhere in the OT!”–WJ (p 16)
[Also, true, Moses followers like Joshua and Aaron never referred to Moses as God. Interestingly, Moses did serve as “God” or “a god” to Aaron as well. (Ex 4:16) So, yes to your Aaron question and also yes to your last question. But anyway, it doesn’t matter, that we can’t find references of many people calling Moses God. How many people called Jesus God? Like 3 or 4 out of the thousands of characters in the Bible? Yet, that doesn’t matter to you.]
“Moses was not a God at all, unless you believe like Pharaoh a Polytheist that there are many gods!”–WJ (p 16)
“because Moses was not a God at all!
Where is the scriptures or scripture David that Moses is called God in the OT.
Where is the reference that shows Joshua or Aaron or anyone calling him God!
No, Moses was “a god” to Pharaoh because he was a Polytheist, and nothing more!–WJ (p 16)“He was a god (mighty one) to Pharoah, or at least, that's what scripture says.”–david (p 16)
“Are you suggesting that Pharoah was a polytheist who worshipped Moses? Is that how you think Moses was a god to Pharoah?”–david (p 17)
“No, I am sugesting that Pharaoh acknowledged that Moses was some sort of “a god” who he may or may not have worshipped.”–WJ (p 17)
“EXODUS 7:1
“Consequently Jehovah said to Moses: “See, I have made you God to Phar?aoh, and Aaron your own brother will become your prophet.”
“I [Jehovah] have made you [Moses] god to Pharoah.”
It was Jehovah who made Moses a god to Pharoah.
Are you suggesting that Jehovah wanted Pharoah to worship Moses?
Or, is my explanatin better: That the word “god” means “mighty one” and that Jehovah gave Moses power over Pharoah?”–david (p 17)“No, I am saying it doesn't make any difference, because in believing in other gods he was a Polytheist, and YHWH said that he (Moses) would be a god “to Pharaoh”, not that he was “a god”!
How clear is it David. Where is the example of Moses being called “a god” by his followers like Joshua or Aaron?”–WJ (p 17)“Who said there had to be other examples? Where are the examples of Abraham [insert a hundred other names] calling Jesus a God? How about that? So please stop asking that silly question.–david (p 17)
Did Pharoah worship Moses?
Is that why he was called a god to Pharoah?”–david (p 18)“The answer to your question is in my statement!
“May or may not have worshipped”
The scriptures do not tell us do they. They simply tell us that YHWH said he would make Moses “A god to Pharaoh”, not to the Hebrews or anyone else because there are no other gods, yet to Pharaoh there was.”–WJ (p 18)“I know you said “may” have.
BUT, IF PHAROAH did not “worship” Moses, then guess what? That whole thing about “worship” having to be connected to the idea of the word “god” is thrown out the window, as it should be.
The truth is, the word “god” does not have to involve worship. It often does, because 99.9% of the time, the word “god” is used with reference to the Almighty God who is rightfully to be worshiped.
But, we see here, that in this case, and others, (where Jehovah makes Moses a god to Pharoah) that the word “god” does not have to mean “someone who is worshiped.” (You yourself suggest this, in saying it may or may not involve worship.)
In fact, it doesn't mean that at all. It usually does refer to Jehovah who is to be worshiped, but the word “god” simply means “mighty one.” That idea fits ALL the scriptures where “god” is used.
MY QUESTION TO YOU, AGAIN, which you are trying your very hardest to avoid, (and understandably) is, what does your statement above, in effect mean?
It CAN'T mean that Moses was worshiped by Pharoah BECAUSE it was God who MADE Moses a god to Pharoah.
So, this is why I keep asking you. You say it “maybe” means that. And then when I point out it can't logically mean that (unless you think Jehovah wanted Moses to be worshiped by a pagan ruler), you go back to your “maybe.”
Well, my question to you then is: How would that be possible? You think that maybe Jehovah wanted Moses to be worshipped? (That is what you think “god” means, isn't it?) So is that what you think, that Jehovah wanted Moses to be worshiped by Pharoah?
–We know Moses wasn't a false god, right? (For it was Jehovah that “made” him a God to Pharoah.)
–And here, you suggest “maybe” Jehovah made him a god to Pharoah meaning, “worshiped” by Pharoah.
I think we're beginning to build enough evidence that Moses is part of the trinity.
Or, perhaps, the other explanation: “god” means “mighty one.”–david (p 19)david
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