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Hi Journey,
I think we that we should keep this thread on topic – 'The kingdom of the antichrist is Islam' – okay?But to answer your post the best I can,
Firstly,
Quote
Isaiah 58:12 And THEY that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the FOUNDATIONS OF MANY GENERATIONS; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.In context:
And your ancient ruins shall be rebuilt;
you shall raise up the foundations of many generations;
you shall be called the repairer of the breach,
the restorer of streets to dwell in.
“If you turn back your foot from the sabbath,
from doing your pleasure on my holy day,
and call the sabbath a delight
and the holy day of the LORD honorable;
if you honor it, not going your own ways,
or seeking your own pleasure, or talking idly;
then you shall take delight in the LORD,
and I will make you ride upon the heights of the earth;
I will feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father,
for the mouth of the LORD has spoken.”This was if they obeyed God but read what Jesus said in the parable of the vineyard (Matthew 21).
Quote Isaiah 61:4 And THEY shall build the old wastes, THEY shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, THE DESOLATIONS OF MANY GENERATIONS. In context – Isaiah 61:4-6
They shall build up the ancient ruins,
they shall raise up the former devastations;
they shall repair the ruined cities,
the devastations of many generations.
Aliens shall stand and feed your flocks,
foreigners shall be your plowmen and vinedressers;
but you shall be called the priests of the LORD,
men shall speak of you as the ministers of our God;Rev 1:6 'To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.'
Do you see that or what am I understanding wrong?
Hi 2Besse
Quote Hi Journey,
I think we that we should keep this thread on topic – 'The kingdom of the antichrist is Islam' – okay?
And I think Edj has been given enough proof that the kingdom of the antichrist is not Islam. We are on page 83 already, and the truth doesn't just stop there, it keeps going and going this is where it has lead to for you.Quote
Isaiah 58:12 And THEY that shall be of thee shall build the old waste places: thou shalt raise up the FOUNDATIONS OF MANY GENERATIONS; and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach, The restorer of paths to dwell in.God is speaking through Isaiah to Israel. In the beginning of the book of Isaiah, we can see this.
As you know, Israel was under the law, yet their hearts were not right and their sacrifices, feasts, & celebrations were an abomination to the Lord (Isaiah 1:11-15)
God is so angry at them, yet he says this to them;Isaiah 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isaiah 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land.
Isaiah 1:20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.The Israelites were under the law. If they obeyed, they would eat the good of the land, but if they refused to obey, they would be punished.
Well there were those who obeyed the law with all their hearts. These ones will be rewarded. These ones will eat the good of the land. So their sacrifices and offerings will be accepted. We cannot forget about them, these ones, and God has not forgotten them either,
however, there is a new covenant, as the old one was just a school master to THEM, working it's way towards the New Covenant.John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: NO MAN cometh unto the Father, BUT BY ME.
So now those Israelites even back then, and already long dead, await for their reward, but have to now go through Christ. This is the new commandment.
BUT….1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD..IN CHRIST..SHALL RISE FIRST
Only those with the holy spirit can take part in the first resurrection. Without it, we cannot enter. Those Israelites who were under the law, did die not knowing Christ, their Messiah, and although some died in obedience to the law, they did not die filled with the spirit of Christ, the holy spirit, (seal of promise), which is what it takes to be in the first resurrection.
So therefore, they can't be raised to spirit, at the 2nd Coming, but God has designed a way that they can now come through Christ, to know him, learn his ways, and have the opportunity to be filled with the holy spirit,
…so they will be raised in the flesh, and brought into the kingdom.Ezekiel 37:5 Thus saith the Lord God unto these bones; behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live.
Ezekiel 37:6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the Lord.
Ezekiel 37:10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood upon their feet, an exceeding great army.
Ezekiel 37:12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and BRING YOU INTO THE LAND OF ISRAEL
Ezekiel 37:13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
Ezekiel 37:14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I SHALL PLACE YOU IN YOUR OWN LAND: then shall ye know that I the Lord have spoken it and performed it, saith the Lord.So now, this verse should make more sense
Quote “If you turn back your foot from the sabbath,
from doing your pleasure on my holy day,
and call the sabbath a delight
and the holy day of the LORD honorable;
if you honor it, not going your own ways,
or seeking your own pleasure, or talking idly;
then you shall take delight in the LORD,
and I will make you ride upon the heights of the earth;
I will feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father,
for the mouth of the LORD has spoken.”[/color]If you follow the Law, keep the sabbath, and call it a delight (from the heart) then they will ride on the heights of the EARTH (not heaven) but in the kingdom, upon God's holy mountain, the highest kingdom. They will be fed with the heritage of Jacob, their father, and will dwell in that place given to them AGAIN. ISRAEL.
Quote And your ancient ruins shall be rebuilt;
you shall raise up the foundations of many generations;
you shall be called the repairer of the breach,
the restorer of streets to dwell in.Isaiah 1:26 And I will restore thy judges as at the first, and thy counsellors as at the beginning: afterward thou shalt be called, The city of righteousness, the faithful city.
Quote This was if they obeyed God but read what Jesus said in the parable of the vineyard (Matthew 21).
Yes, but this was them not accepting Christ, the unfaithful ones…they are antichrist, and continue not accepting him to this day. These ones wont be rewarded, but will be provoked to jealousy when they are thrust out of the kingdom, out of their land, and there outside the kingdom, will be gnashing of the teeth.I hope you can understand this so far. It's very important that we know this before hand, and then we will be even stronger witnesses to God's truth. This day will be unbelievable for them. I'm very excited for them, for this prophecy to be fulfilled. This is going to be amazing, and sadly, the christian world don't even know this is around the corner. After Christ comes of course, and not
a day before.Journey, before I read or get to your last post, I ran out of time last night and never finished the first verses you gave me.
Quote So just to make it clear, you are saying that Christ is already ruling? Yes!
Quote What about these scriptures? Mark 16:19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was RECEIVED UP INTO HEAVEN, and SAT on the RIGHT HAND OF GOD
Being at the right hand of God means he has been given power and authority and rulership IN His kingdom.
Quote Matthew 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, TILL I MAKE THINE ENEMIES THY FOOTSTOOL? That is an ongoing process which takes time (which is why it says TILL I MAKE).
The wheat has to grow up with the weeds.Quote Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, THEN shall HE SIT UPON THE THRONE OF HIS GLORY This is Jesus coming at judgment day and the throne on earth is illustrative of his position as judge and also as rewarder.
Quote Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Very I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, IN THE REGENERATION ..when the Son of man shall sit in the THRONE OF HIS GLORY, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. It does not say Jesus is NOT sitting on his throne with the saints NOW does it? We know Jesus is sitting on the throne now, or – would you disagree?
Quote Hebrews 11:16 BUT NOW they desire a BETTER COUNTRY, that is, an HEAVENLY: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath PREPARED for them A CITY.
Hebrews 13:14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.The city is the heavenly Jerusalem which comes down to earth at the end. That is why it says that they desired a heavenly country, and God has prepared for them a city which will come down and will last forever.
Quote Matthew 13:41 The Son of man shall SEND FORTH HIS ANGELS, and they shall GATHER OUT OF HIS KINGDOM ALL THINGS THAT OFFEND, and them which do iniquity. Yes, he will gather out of HIS kingdom all causes of sin and all evils .
Quote If they are ruling from heaven now, then why would Christ need to gather out of his kingdom all things that offend? Is there sin in heaven now? Earth.
Quote (journey42 @ Oct. 29 2012,00:52) Quote Hi Journey,
I think we that we should keep this thread on topic – 'The kingdom of the antichrist is Islam' – okay?
And I think Edj has been given enough proof that the kingdom of the antichrist is not Islam. We are on page 83 already, and the truth doesn't just stop there, it keeps going and going this is where it has lead to for you.
So does Ed still believe that the kingdom of the antichrist is Islam then?Just because you can't see Jesus doesn't mean to say that He isn't ruling.
Look what it says in Daniel 7:I saw in the night visions, and behold, with the clouds of heaven
there came one like a son of man,
and he came to the Ancient of Days
and was presented before him.
And to him was given dominion
and glory and kingdom,
that all peoples, nations, and languages
should serve him;
his dominion is an everlasting dominion,
which shall not pass away,
and his kingdom one
that shall not be destroyed.2Besse
This was the most powerful of all the scriptures. Straight forward, direct, and clear.
Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, THEN shall HE SIT UPON THE THRONE OF HIS GLORY
Quote (2besee @ Oct. 27 2012,21:18) Wakeup, I know and believe with all of my heart that when Jesus returns it will be the end. I also believe that there could be a false Messiah, possibly in Jerusalem. I am concerned at all of the beliefs going around today, including some of my family who believe the same thing as you do. All I can do is give my point of view, get a little bit frustrated, and then move on from that particular discussion, as I do with my family. Fair enough?
Hi 2besse,Could you please explain what you mean by the end?
For example, will it be the end of death, the end of flesh, the end of non Christians (in the sense of people who know Christ has returned but choose not to follow Him still) etcThank you.
Quote (2besee @ Oct. 29 2012,18:59) Journey, Jesus is sitting on the throne NOW.
He is waiting.
Siiting next to his father waiting for what?Untill the father had put all his enemies his foot stool.
Pslms 110:1.
This will only happpen at the coming.wakeup.
Devo, it will be the end as Jesus said, as Peter said, etc.
Matt 13:41 'The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity'
Matt 24:28 'Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together' (Read Rev 19:7)Matt 3:12 'His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor and gather his wheat into the granary, but the chaff he will burn with unquenchable fire'
2nd Peter 3:5-7 'They deliberately ignore this fact, that by the word of God heavens existed long ago, and an earth formed out of water and by means of water, through which the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist have been stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men'
Do you really think that when Jesus returns, life will be as normal? Is this what you all believe?
Quote (journey42 @ Oct. 29 2012,00:52) Quote This was if they obeyed God but read what Jesus said in the parable of the vineyard (Matthew 21).
Yes, but this was them not accepting Christ, the unfaithful ones…they are antichrist, and continue not accepting him to this day. These ones wont be rewarded, but will be provoked to jealousy when they are thrust out of the kingdom, out of their land, and there outside the kingdom, will be gnashing of the teeth.I hope you can understand this so far. It's very important that we know this before hand, and then we will be even stronger witnesses to God's truth. This day will be unbelievable for them. I'm very excited for them, for this prophecy to be fulfilled. This is going to be amazing, and sadly, the christian world don't even know this is around the corner. After Christ comes of course, and not a day before.
Journey, I may agree with you to a point. I feel there are Jews who are obedient to the Torah – the true Torah Jews, and only God knows…But still, either way, the end will be the end.
Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 29 2012,21:08) Quote (2besee @ Oct. 29 2012,18:59) Journey, Jesus is sitting on the throne NOW.
He is waiting.
Siiting next to his father waiting for what?Untill the father had put all his enemies his foot stool.
Pslms 110:1.
This will only happpen at the coming.wakeup.
Yes….
That is what i said.2Beese.
Before the coming ,certain things has to happen first.
1.There must be a falling away first; an apostasy.churches teaching error.2thess.2. Things are not getting better,but worse.
2. The son of perdition will be revealed,(son of satan).2thess.2. He will call himself god,and sit in the temple of God. saying that he is god.
3. He will take over control of the 10 kings.(the N.W.O.).
He will introduce the number for every person to have one;
or one can not buy or sell.4. The sealing of the 144000,just before the first trumpet will sound.
5. The 1st trumpet: fire around the earth,1/3 of green burning.
6. The 2nd. trumpet: a mountain burning cast into the sea,1/3 of life in the sea died and 1/3 of ships destroyed.
7. The 3th trumpet: A star fell from heaven(angel) to turn the 1/3 part of rivers into wormwood.(Poisonous).
8. The 4th trumpet: The sun and moon smitten 1/3 of it in darkness.
9. The 5th trumpet: A star fall from heaven with the key of the bottomless pit openned,and locusts came out to sting all man that have not THE SEAL OF GOD. fOR 5 MONTHS,but can not die,for 5 months.
9. The 6th trumpet: the 4 angels bound in the great river euphrates let loose, to gather all the armies to slay 1/3 of man; the number of the armies 200 million.
This will be the last war of mankind,no flesh will be saved if war continues. But for the elect sake this war will be shortened by the appearing of the Lord.
10. The 7th trumpet: The coming of the Lord.(rev19.).
satan put in prison for 1000yrs,but not his angels.11. Babylon the great destroyed(this world system of things and all the cities of the nations will be in heaps).(rev16:19.).
12. Christ will set up his kingdom in israel,with his resurrected saints,and rule over the jews that have been brought back from the grave in the flesh by choice.(Ez.37.)
They will be taught by the saints for a 1000yrs,and in turn ,they also will teach all the gentiles living outside the kingdom,and amongst them will also be christians that did not make the first resurrection.
13. This kingdom will be paradise restored. Isiah 11:6–12.
65:17–25. Zech14:16–21.14. After the 1000yrs, satan will be let loose for a season, and he will again go and gather all the stubborn non believers,to one place,(this is the battle of gog and magog), and fire from heaven will destroy them all.
15. Now comes the second resurrection,consisting of all the dead of all generations; they will be judged by the books.Sheep on the right and goats on the left.
All goats cast in the fire where satan is.
this is the second death.16. Now all bad are gone,only the good left; But the earth is still full of pollution; all the heaps of the cities and all the temples and pyramids; and all the cities under the sea and underground needs to be cleaned up by melting the earth.
17 A new earth created,and a new heaven.All new and clean.
Now, only now will God come down and dwell amongst us.
God all in all.Thy kingdom come,thy will be done on earth as in heaven. This prayer prophecy is now fulfilled. Amen.This is the big picture that the christian world have failed to see.
And still will not see, because it is so different from what they have been taught.wakeup.
Quote (journey42 @ Oct. 28 2012,22:52) Hi 2Besse Quote Hi Journey,
I think we that we should keep this thread on topic – 'The kingdom of the antichrist is Islam' – okay?
And I think Edj has been given enough proof that the kingdom of the antichrist is not Islam.
Hi Journey42,You haven't given any “proof” to the contrary? …only your opinions.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (2besee @ Oct. 28 2012,18:58) Hi Ed. I'm 2besee not Wakeup:-)
Hi 2Besee,Sorry, I have been posting to “Wakeup” so much
that I had his name set to “copy and paste” as a starting point to my posts; to avoid much typing.I forgot to change his name to yours, again I apologize for my neglect.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)Quote (2besee @ Oct. 29 2012,09:47) Quote (journey42 @ Oct. 29 2012,00:52) Quote Hi Journey,
I think we that we should keep this thread on topic – 'The kingdom of the antichrist is Islam' – okay?
And I think Edj has been given enough proof that the kingdom of the antichrist is not Islam. We are on page 83 already, and the truth doesn't just stop there, it keeps going and going this is where it has lead to for you.
So does Ed still believe that the kingdom of the antichrist is Islam then?
Hi 2Besee,Sure do.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (2besee @ Oct. 27 2012,19:14) Quote (bodhitharta @ Oct. 23 2012,20:34) Quote (david @ Oct. 23 2012,17:02) Behold! the angels said: “O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be christ jesus, the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah;
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #45)Great! Now I have to spend several months figuring out the Quran.
Question BD:
1. Who is Allah believed or understood to be (in this verse)?
2. Is this verse just recounting a story from the bible? Or, is it something that you are supposed to believe?–meaning, do Muslims believe that Jesus is Gods anointed one?
3. If they do believe that Jesus is gods anointed one, do you simply understand this to mean that he is a prophet?
ALLAH is GOD(YHWH) d the Quran in english means “The Recital” so the stories are being recited by Gabriel to Muhammad they are not taken from the Bible but they are in the Bible as well because they are actual events.Jesus is the promised Messiah the Jews were waiting for he is Christ which was sent by God he is a spirit that proceeded from God Word from Him.
Jesus is not God and in Islam there is no equal to God nor any description that can fully capture His Glory it is understood in Islam that we can only know what we know about God through His known attributes.
The Quran explains that all the scriptures throughout all time are revelations and the Quran in a single book summaries all these teachings and stories with the addition of pointing out what Muhammad must relate to those who were around him in his day.
The Quran also explains that each prophet may have prohibited some things and allowed other things such as what should be eaten or the degree of punishment for certain things depending upon who he was sent to.
Many things are made clear in the Quran such as Adam repented which is why he did not die in the day he ate the fruit.
Then learnt adam from his Lord words of inspiration, and his Lord Turned towards him; for He is Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #37)When fully understood the Bible and Quran click together like beautiful puzzle pieces such as reading Jonah and realizing that God was Most Merciful when sparing the town of nineveh although it was scheduled for destruction but they too repented.
Bodhitharta, so in the bible,John 1:1 'In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God; all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made.'
What would a Muslim understand that to mean?
What would YOU understand that to mean?
The Word of God is simply that the Word of God we all know that God created all things through the Command to “Be” and when God created Jesus he created Jesus with a command to “BE” and he was conceived and thereby made flesh.So Jesus was a Spirit that proceeded from the Command of God. God Clearly says he created all things ALONE HE also said there is no other God besides HIM. These words came directly from God they are absolutely more clear than John 1:1 using a poetic language. It doesn't say that Jesus was with him in the beginning does it?
Quote (2besee @ Oct. 27 2012,21:05) Also if I remember right, Islam believes that the promised 'comforter' was Mohammad not the Holy Spirit?
Some people in Islam believe that but it does not say that in the Quran but Muhammad is never referred to as the Holy Spirit, some Muslims believe that the New testament verse that says I will send a helper can refer to Muhammad because it uses the word Ahmad which is “Truth” and it refers to the comforter using the word “Parcelet” which is most often used to describe a person. Muhammad did come glorifying Christ and doing what is described in that verse but the answer to your question is some Muslims believe that and some do not but it is nevertheless not an important topic in Islam in general
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