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Let the dead bury the dead – I think He was speaking of those who are spiritually dead. Jesus spoke spiritual things, people thought earthly things, they never understood Him, I could be alive but dead I could live amongst others who are the same, do you see that ?
Do you believe God can raise people from the dead ?
“Your dead shall live; together with my dead body they shall arise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in dust; for your dew is like the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead. – Isa 26:19
“I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death. O Death, I will be your plagues! O Grave, I will be your destruction! – Hosea 13:14
“Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 04 2010,06:41) Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 04 2010,09:59) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 04 2010,02:46) Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 03 2010,20:31) Ah I see, your a Muslim, Do you have any queries regarding Christianity ?
Yes,Why did Paul see Jesus differently than the “resurrected” Jesus that the disciples had seen?
Bodhitharta glad you asked, forgive me if I have anything wrong, I'm only learning I'm not an expert.Before coming to earth Jesus was with God, the earth was made through Him, He came to the earth born of the virgin Mary He humbled Himself as a Man and became one of us, He was crucified died and was risen from the dead, Begotten of the Father and given a position higher than any other, seated at the right hand of God.
How He appears can vary, He appeared to the two Mary's and the 11 disciples as a flesh body before the ascension to Heaven, but one which could appear even though the doors were shut, To Paul He appeared as a bright light and a voice which spoke. Peter heard a voice and saw a vision, Stephen saw the Lord in Heaven and John saw and heard in a vision,
So the Lord appeared in may ways,
Bodhitharta, if no-one has ever seen God, then Who was walking and talking with man in the Old Testament, Who could it be but the Word of God, who became Jesus…
When it says that the doors were shut it doesn't mean Jesus walked through the door it simply means the doors were shut in fear of the Jews, Jesus was already in the room:Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
John 20:18-20John 20:18-19 (Young's Literal Translation)
18Mary the Magdalene cometh, telling to the disciples that she hath seen the Lord, and [that] these things he said to her.
19It being, therefore, evening, on that day, the first of the sabbaths, and the doors having been shut where the disciples were assembled, through fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and saith to them, `Peace to you;'
Why is it assumed that he appeared miraculously as opposed to him simply coming and standing?
Also if Paul never met Jesus and simply saw a light and heard a voice how could he know it was Jesus and why would Jesus have not informed his disciples about appearing to Paul?
Also, only if you consider Jesus an angel could you say in the past he was the angel of the Lord, is that what you are saying?
Actually the Bible states that the diciples didnt even regonize Jesus FYI.
several times they didnt know who he was until they were revealed. He did die because he showed his marks.They closed the door and were secretive yes becuase of the Jews, but how is it that he got passed everyone and than surprised them?
he must have appeared.
and if they were so secretive, how is it that Jesus just ENTERED without the door being locked?Actually the scriptures state that I beileve Paul spent time with Jesus. and Jesus spoke*(he had a dream or something like that)* to annais to confirm his healing and blindnesss.
Why did Jesus have to inform his diciples? they wouldnt believe anyways, its Peter for goodness sakes.
I do believe at one point he was the angel of the Lord.
Did He really Die ?
The extent of Jesus' injuries are a clear indication that He must have died, he had no sleep the night before, he went through two trials. He was beaten several times and whipped 39 times by a whip of leather throngs with either lead balls or nails and glass, most did not survive the whipping. When first whipped the heavy thongs cut through the skin as the blows continue, they cut deeper into the muscles which produce arterial bleeding from vessels in the underlying muscles. The skin of the back is ripped wide open hanging in pieces. The entire area is an unrecognizable mass of torn bleeding tissue. The centurions would finally stop the beating when the prisoner is just short of death. They then put a robe around him and it adhered to the open wounds.
A crown of thorns were pressed into his head (these were big sharp thorns pressed into the scalp, a very sensitive area to bleeding). Then they struck his face and hit him with the stick on the head. After tiring of their sport of mocking him they quickly removed the robe after it dried on the wounds causing excruciating pain and the wounds would again begin to bleed. By now he was in shock and very weak.
He was then brought before Pilate and the people who insisted on his crucifixion. He was given a cross beam to carry over his shoulders on his open wounds weighing what some say was over 100 lbs. He was so weak he collapsed on the way to his own crucifixion his loss of blood and strength is now life threatening. Jesus was no weakling. Many times he exhibited stamina beyond normal ability. He got up consistently in the Mornings to pray and he lasted far beyond the disciples. When they were sleeping at night, he was praying. Yet he still was human and was weak and tired like anyone else, but he did not let this interfere with fulfilling Gods will. He live to do God’s will.
The Romans see this and picked someone else to help him carry his cross. He walked up the Mount to Golgotha a 650 yard journey being totally exhausted. There would be a tremendous loss of blood from being on the cross for more than six hours. The victim crucified would constantly press themselves up on a plate under the feet in order to keep breathing. Doing this for 6 hours could kill even the healthy. He mustered up every bit of strength left to stay conscious. If he had swooned from exhaustion on the cross he would have suffocated.
Jesus finally declares, “Father into thy hands I commend my spirit.” And having said this He breathed His last “He gave up His spirit”( he dismissed it). Jesus' death cry was heard by the eyewitnesses who stood near. The Romans who were professional executors pronounced Jesus dead. The scripture states when they broke the legs of the two thieves (who were not whipped or beaten) the Guards came to Jesus and were convinced that Jesus had already died.
The Roman piercing of Jesus' side with a spear from which poured out blood and water is proof of His death. This is proven medially that he had a ruptured heart .[unquote]
All that sounds emotional and with much romance but tell me could Jesus rise from the dead and still have all his wounds when we know that Jesus healed others completely? Also the spear incident is strangely only mentioned in John
Luke 23:11-17 (King James Version)
11And Herod with his men of war set him at nought, and mocked him, and arrayed him in a gorgeous robe, and sent him again to Pilate.
12And the same day Pilate and Herod were made friends together: for before they were at enmity between themselves.
13And Pilate, when he had called together the chief priests and the rulers and the people,
14Said unto them, Ye have brought this man unto me, as one that perverteth the people: and, behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him:
15No, nor yet Herod: for I sent you to him; and, lo, nothing worthy of death is done unto him.
16I will therefore chastise him, and release him.
What makes you believe that Pilate would not have found a way to actually free Jesus?
Luke 23:22 (King James Version)
22And he said unto them the third time, Why, what evil hath he done? I have found no cause of death in him: I will therefore chastise him, and let him go.
Notice Jesus prays to be saved by God 3 times and here you see pilate saying 3 times that he will be set free
Bodhitharta,
From what I understand,
The wounds were shown to prove Who He was, otherwise they would have doubted and not believed that it was Him who was crucified, it was Him who was on the stake, it was Him who indeed rose from the dead. If He had no wounds to show, they would not have believed, well, not Thomas.
John was the beloved Disciple, John Had much love for His Lord. John Peter and James spent much with Him, and John witnessed the transfiguration, What He wrote should be taken as truthful and precise.
Pilate did not set Him free because if He had then scripture would not have been fulfilled, all that God and the son said would happened would not have happened,
Jesus humbled Himself and came as a Man so He had the same weakness as Man, He knew what was to occur, He did not want to die, He had friends; Disciples; followers; family; loved one's, He knew He would be leaving them alone, if you knew what was to come, and you were to be crucified, would you be looking forward to it ? He came to do the will of Him who sent him not His own thus He prayed “Not my will but your's” so it was God's will to save us through Him, or to save all those who believed through Him,
Isaiah 53:12 — Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out his soul to death, and was numbered with the transgressors; yet he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
Isaiah 53:5 — But he was pierced for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. The punishment that brought our peace was on him; and by his wounds we are healed. All of us like sheep have gone astray, Each of us has turned to his own way; But the LORD has caused the iniquity of us all To fall on Him.
John 1:29 — The next day, he saw Jesus coming to him, and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!
1 Corinthians 15:3 — For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
Hebrews 9:28 — So Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, without sin, to those who are eagerly waiting for him for salvation.
Peter 2:24 — Who his own self bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live to righteousness; by whose stripes you were healed. For you were going astray like sheep; but now have returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.
Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 06 2010,09:36) Bodhitharta, From what I understand,
The wounds were shown to prove Who He was, otherwise they would have doubted and not believed that it was Him who was crucified, it was Him who was on the stake, it was Him who indeed rose from the dead. If He had no wounds to show, they would not have believed, well, not Thomas.
John was the beloved Disciple, John Had much love for His Lord. John Peter and James spent much with Him, and John witnessed the transfiguration, What He wrote should be taken as truthful and precise.
Pilate did not set Him free because if He had then scripture would not have been fulfilled, all that God and the son said would happened would not have happened,
Jesus humbled Himself and came as a Man so He had the same weakness as Man, He knew what was to occur, He did not want to die, He had friends; Disciples; followers; family; loved one's, He knew He would be leaving them alone, if you knew what was to come, and you were to be crucified, would you be looking forward to it ? He came to do the will of Him who sent him not His own thus He prayed “Not my will but your's” so it was God's will to save us through Him, or to save all those who believed through Him,
Isaiah 53:12 — Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out his soul to death, and was numbered with the transgressors; yet he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
Isaiah 53:5 — But he was pierced for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. The punishment that brought our peace was on him; and by his wounds we are healed. All of us like sheep have gone astray, Each of us has turned to his own way; But the LORD has caused the iniquity of us all To fall on Him.
John 1:29 — The next day, he saw Jesus coming to him, and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!
1 Corinthians 15:3 — For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
Hebrews 9:28 — So Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, without sin, to those who are eagerly waiting for him for salvation.
Peter 2:24 — Who his own self bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live to righteousness; by whose stripes you were healed. For you were going astray like sheep; but now have returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.
Matthew 27:59-68 (King James Version)59And when Joseph had taken the body, he wrapped it in a clean linen cloth,
60And laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn out in the rock: and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed.
61And there was Mary Magdalene, and the other Mary, sitting over against the sepulchre.
62Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate,
63Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.
64Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.
65Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can.
66So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 07 2010,06:58) Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 06 2010,19:22) Hi. I don't understand ?
The women are key to this story
Really ? In what way ?Why would the women be looking for him in the first place if they expected him to be buried they had already seen a large stone being rolled in front of the sepulcher so why would they have come back?
Bod, they weren't looking for Him, they were just sitting, missing the Lord, grieving and in shock at what had just happened, Bod, you take part's of scripture to mean something else but ignore the obvious parts,
Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 09 2010,09:49) Bod, they weren't looking for Him, they were just sitting, missing the Lord, grieving and in shock at what had just happened, Bod, you take part's of scripture to mean something else but ignore the obvious parts,
Then why did they return later Jews are not allowed to touch the dead yet they came again with Spices?Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 09 2010,18:05)
Then why did they return later Jews are not allowed to touch the dead yet they came again with Spices?
Bod, this is what it says according to John,John 19
Therefore the Jews, because it was the Preparation Day, so that the bodies wouldn't remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a special one), asked of Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
Therefore the soldiers came, and broke the legs of the first, and of the other who was crucified with him; but when they came to Jesus, and saw that he was already dead, they didn't break his legs. However one of the soldiers pierced his side with a spear, and immediately blood and water came out. He who has seen has testified, and his testimony is true. He knows that he tells the truth, that you may believe.
For these things happened, that the Scripture might be fulfilled, “A bone of him will not be broken.”
Again another Scripture says, “They will look on him whom they pierced.”
After these things, Joseph of Arimathaea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly for fear of the Jews, asked of Pilate that he might take away Jesus' body. Pilate gave him permission. He came therefore and took away his body.
Nicodemus, who at first came to Jesus by night, also came bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about a hundred Roman pounds.
So they took Jesus' body, and bound it in linen cloths with the spices, as the custom of the Jews is to bury.
Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden. In the garden was a new tomb in which no man had ever yet been laid. Then because of the Jews' Preparation Day (for the tomb was near at hand) they laid Jesus there.
John 20
Now on the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene went early, while it was still dark, to the tomb, and saw the stone taken away from the tomb. Therefore she ran and came to Simon Peter, and to the other disciple whom Jesus loved, and said to them, “They have taken away the Lord out of the tomb, and we don't know where they have laid him!”
Therefore Peter and the other disciple went out, and they went toward the tomb. They both ran together. The other disciple outran Peter, and came to the tomb first. Stooping and looking in, he saw the linen cloths lying, yet he didn't enter in.
Then Simon Peter came, following him, and entered into the tomb. He saw the linen cloths lying, and the cloth that had been on his head, not lying with the linen cloths, but rolled up in a place by itself. So then the other disciple who came first to the tomb also entered in, and he saw and believed.
For as yet they didn't know the Scripture, that he must rise from the dead.
So the disciples went away again to their own homes. But Mary was standing outside at the tomb weeping. So, as she wept, she stooped and looked into the tomb, and she saw two angels in white sitting, one at the head, and one at the feet, where the body of Jesus had lain.
They told her, “Woman, why are you weeping?” She said to them, “Because they have taken away my Lord, and I don't know where they have laid him.”
Hi Shimmer,
Do you know why Pilate gave Jesus body to Joseph of Arimathaea?
Because Joseph of Arimathaea was Jesus Uncle, and it was his right to claim the body. (Mark 15:43-47)God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kejonn @ Aug. 11 2010,00:25) Where do get that Joseph of Arimathea was Jesus' uncle?
Hi Kejonn,A body cannot remain on a tree all night…
Deut.21:23: His body shall not remain all night upon the tree,
but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;)
that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.Legally the body is to be redeem by the next of kin…
Lev.25:49 Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him,
or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him…Mark 15:43-47 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God,
came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus. And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead:
and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead. And when he knew it of the
centurion, he gave the body to Joseph. And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen,
and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre. And
Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses(Jesus brother) beheld where he was laid. (Click here for more)God bless
Ed JQuote (Ed J @ Aug. 10 2010,08:54) Quote (kejonn @ Aug. 11 2010,00:25) Where do get that Joseph of Arimathea was Jesus' uncle?
Hi Kejonn,A body cannot remain on a tree all night…
Deut.21:23: His body shall not remain all night upon the tree,
but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;)
that thy land be not defiled, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.This has nothing to do with the relationship of Joseph of A. to Jesus…
Quote Legally the body is to be redeem by the next of kin… Lev.25:49 Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him,
or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him…This is the concept of “kinsman redeemer” and has to do with someone who has sold himself into slavery, not about dead bodies.
Quote Mark 15:43-47 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God,
came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus. And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead:
and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead. And when he knew it of the
centurion, he gave the body to Joseph. And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen,
and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre. And
Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses(Jesus brother) beheld where he was laid. (Click here for more)God bless
Ed J
As that site says, it is all speculation, not biblical “fact”.But thanks for clarification.
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