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- May 6, 2004 at 12:51 am#180887NickHassanParticipant
This topic is about discussing Islam.
May 6, 2004 at 12:51 am#41472Surgeon83Participant” For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect”. Mat. 24:24.
I have often wondered what events could possibly arise that would ever lead to such deceit as that of which Jesus spoke here concerning the last days. I have heard countless interpretations and theories abounding about such likelihoods as to the identity of the antichrist (not to say that mine is correct either, only an hypothesis as well). Now I cannot say that this thought of mine is the Gospel truth either only an idea. With the recent release of The Da vinci code by author Dan Brown, the world has been thrown into a very dangerous situation. The book as a whole essentially says that Jesus and Mary Magdalene not only had sexual relations,but birthed a bloodline of individuals leading through the Merovingian dynasty of French kings and even to the present. What is included in this blasphemous book is the notion of a “secret society” dubbed the Priori of Sion whose founding in 1099 was established in order to protect the secret down the generations to this day. I can say that the book is interesting, but so are occultic and gnostic books. While the idea sounds exciting, secret conspiracies, historical scandals, and earth-shattering love affairs, it sets up dangerous grounds for the end-times.
The main problem I have with the book isn’t its obvious blasphemous contents, but the portrayal of such material as FACT. I have been meeting lots of people (Christians included) who have fallen under the spell of this book. I have talked with them and they discuss this book like they’ve just uncovered a new Gospel or a secret section of the Bible. It has been noted in Matthew and Revelation that the elect will be deceived and seduced by another doctrine concerning Jesus; both his identity and divinity. The Da Vinci code has sold ,I believe, somewhere close to 6 million copies and continues to do so. I think that this book could set the stage for the antichrist.
How I believe this is very simple. In the Da Vinci code it is stated that this so-called Priori of Sion exists to this day and is awaiting the ideal moment to declare this secret of Jesus to the world. What COULD happen, I believe, is for either this sect (which does exist, founded in 1956 not 1099), or others claiming identity to such a group, to openly declare to the world not only this secret of Jesus and Mary Magdalene, but also that his descendents exist today. All that needs to happen is for them to declare a direct descendant of Jesus whose kingly identity has the power to perform miracles of great power. The Bible says that the antichrist will have the ability to perform signs and wonders.
A person possesed with the power of satan could easily fit this description and capture the admiration of the entire globe. Muslims could welcome such a notion for it strips Jesus’ divinity but not his identity as a great prophet of power. In fact, the Muslims are also awaiting a final prophet, the Ma’hadi. Many Muslims are often found praying to Mary the mother of Jesus when apparitions appear (such as Egypt and many other locations). If a religion could tie in an Apostate form of Christianity and Islam then who could stop it? Now as for a “way out there” theory this is certainly one of them. An even crazier idea is that the next pope will be involved in this deceit as well. Not just by his certification of the divine identity of the so-called descendant of Jesus, but also through the “Secret of Fatima”. It has been said that the last secret of Fatima (Also the name of Mohammad’s daughter, hint-hint) was the knowledge of the attempted assassination of Pope John Paul 2, but much is left to speculation because it has never been openly revealed. Now, what if this secret coincided with that of the da vinci code’s? A frightening porposal indeed.
Now I say this only as a suggestion because the only one who knows the actual timing and order of events is God. What I can say is that even though these proposals seem far-fetched, many people pick up Dan Brown’s book and believe every word of it. In fact, I highly doubt that anyone who devours this book and thoroughly enjoys it will have any trouble believing someone who attempts to bring the fantasy world of that novel and the real events of the end times together. And with signs and wonders as proof I can only imagine if such a scenario could arise.
May 6, 2004 at 5:46 am#41473ProclaimerParticipantI think your post is thoughtful and worth consideration as prophecied events come to pass. It certainly seems feasible that the antichrist will claim to be the Christ and as you say, he may even lay claim to being a decendant, just as Jesus was a decendant of David.
May 7, 2004 at 2:35 am#41474ringo111ParticipantThere are many antichrists, Anyone who does not believe Jesus is the christ is an antichrist. (bible quote)
I think you'd be refering to one of the beasts, Its good to get terminology correct ^_^
Its good your thinking about these things. Hurrah, for people that think for themselves ^_^ instead of being led into a pit ^_^
May 7, 2004 at 12:17 pm#41475ProclaimerParticipantTo ringo111,
Some believe that the Beast is the AntiChrist and there are also many antichrists because of the following verse.
1 John 2:18
Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.December 30, 2004 at 7:42 am#41476Surgeon83ParticipantJust a quick thought (haven't been here for quite a while), it is so disgusting to see that almost all of the television programs about Jesus this past Christmas (2004) included sections dedicated to the da vinci code. This whole thing is disgusting. I am led to the Book of Revelation concerning the Harlot and the golden cup. It has been known now for some time that one of the central themes of dan brown's book is that mary magdalene was the referenced Holy Grail of Christ. In Rev. chapter 17 John speaks of the “Great Harlot”, dressed in scarlet and purple holding a golden cup full of her fornication and abomination. Could this allude to the Mary Magdalene- Holy Grail connection that the new world system will try to implement? It is interesting to see that many people are buying into this blasphemous system; how much more after the film comes out? This is exactly how Satan works his dillusions. He will take a grain of truth or half-truth and wrap it up in lies. In this situation the very life of Christ is being perverted and blasphemed at the expense of many people's slavation. We need to keep careful watch over this situation and lead others in the right direction.
January 1, 2005 at 11:37 pm#41477NickHassanParticipantHi S83,
I have read the book. It is quite a good novel with a deeper theme. The hidden message is that there are esoteric truths more true than the bible, which is portrayed as full of fabrications and lies to protect the power base of the catholic church.
The gospel of Philip and other books quoted and Da Vinci is as a prophet. Evil pagan and masonic occult practices are glorified as superior to faith and human wisdom higher than the Godly. What is seen is regarded as more valuable than what is unseen, what is temporal higher than the eternal.It will appeal to the ignorant and the romantic in my view.
January 6, 2005 at 4:28 pm#41478CarolineParticipantI have just read the book, and I do agree with Surgeon83 that the big problem is the way we are led to believe that a lot of the contents are factual. There is a page at the beginning laying out carefully selected facts, which could very easily lead to people accepting the vast majority of the book as factual. I spent a lot of time flipping backwards and forwards to check what was and wasn't factual, but still didn't initially notice the careful wording which simplies a broader degree of truth than it supports on closer inspection.
I do hope that most people will realise the absurdity of elevating da Vinci to the level of a prophet on the basis of his painting pictures for the religious (because they paid him well), and inserting half-hidden symbols into them for his own amusement. Unfortunately, I'm afraid most people won't spot this.
January 17, 2005 at 4:18 pm#41479AnonymousGuestGod's blessings to you,
I've been studying Bible end times prophecies for several years although not so much in the traditional academic sense. A couple of years ago rumors began floating around that sometime in the near future there would be an archeological discovery that would disprove Christianity once and for all. I personally do not believe that this is the DiVinci code, however, I recently (a few weeks ago) saw on the Discovery channel (or one of those stations) a report that proposed the idea that Jesus was actually the same person as Muhammed with Muhammed being the Islamic name for Jesus. In other words, Jesus and Muhammed were the same person, only the difference in languages caused a change in the names.
If we're to have a “one world religion” as many teach, this would be a perfect way to combine all religions into one. The idea of possibly convincing people throughout the world, in all the different cultures, that Jesus, Muhammed, Buhdda (sp?), etc. were actually all the same person, only being called by different names due to the language differences. This is something to think about and something to keep an eye open for. What better way to bring Islam, New Age, and other religious teachings into the church.
God bless you all…
Tim
January 24, 2005 at 2:39 pm#41480CarolineParticipantI don't know much about world religions, although I do have a degree in Christian Theology. I can see the appeal of a one world religion, but it seems to me that this would have to be completely manufactured.
The backgrounds, biographies, teachings, chronologies etc of the main religious figures would not allow for them to have genuinely been the same figure. Don't forget that a lot of the history of Jesus is just that – history, and not simply unsubstantiated belief. Speaking from a Christian point of view, if you denied the truth of the Bible, you would be making Jesus a liar, and there would be no purpose in following Him.January 25, 2005 at 6:54 am#41481ProclaimerParticipantQuote Speaking from a Christian point of view, if you denied the truth of the Bible, you would be making Jesus a liar, and there would be no purpose in following Him. Good point. Jesus is either the Truth or a lie. Any compromise is also a lie.
February 2, 2005 at 3:19 am#41482AnonymousGuestI got the book given to me for Christmas. I read it and could see that it was written in such a way as to convince the unwary as being based on fact.
I don't think there is much chance of deceiving any true christians however, some of the things said about the history of the bible and the Qumran texts etc immediately unveil the deception (as if the sexual relations with Mary Magdelane didn't).
In some ways it actually serves Gods purpose in making christians assure themselves of the truth of what we believe.
February 3, 2005 at 4:08 am#41483NickHassanParticipantThe book to me still held in awe and mystery the Vatican and it's activities as if it was really the city and church of God. This is a common attitude in the world as it is of the world and that is why it holds the attention of the world. It is still a powerful political temporal organisation that holds millions in thrall.
May 5, 2006 at 2:05 am#41484NickHassanParticipantMore on the antichrist
May 5, 2006 at 4:29 am#41485malcolm ferrisParticipantREVELATION 16:13
And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.Here is your Trinity – three unclean spirits, an unholy trinity of dragon, beast and false prophet.
May 5, 2006 at 4:44 am#41486Is 1:18ParticipantSatan – the master counterfeiter.
May 5, 2006 at 4:51 am#41487malcolm ferrisParticipantYeah pretty good counterfiet death instead of life
July 4, 2006 at 9:02 pm#41488NickHassanParticipantHi,
This is topicalFebruary 1, 2008 at 8:25 pm#180892NickHassanParticipantHi,
Cato has brought up the faith of Islam.
He said
” Remember the God of Islam is the same God for Christian and Jews and while they don't consider Jesus the son of God they do view him as a great prophet. All feature the God of Abraham and Moses. My point here being we should be wary at throwing stones at others beliefs especially when we do not know or understand them. This is not saying we accept those beliefs ourself or stop trying to convince others for their own sakes of what we believe to be the truth, but we should respect other travelers on the path to truth.”Do others agree we share the same God if our sacred writings differ?
We do not say we are on a path to truth but are taught by truth-Jesus Christ.
For our faith rests on belief both in God and in the Son of God.
February 1, 2008 at 8:58 pm#180893seek and you will findParticipantNick As far as throwing stones at them, who is doing that. As a Christian we are to love all. Does that mean tho that I am going to turn to their believes? No. And that is what most Muslims want you to do. So I do not associate with them, besides I don't even know one around here. Mostly trinitarian here. But I truly believe that will change and the Christians will be persecuted by them. Just what I think.
Peace and Love Mrs.
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