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my question is, are today christians true to God and Christ asemble in a particular churche ?
if yes .were?
if no . why?When believers (consisting of all those born again), gather or assemble together we call it “church”. The word “church” as it is used in the NT is translated from a Greek word ekklasia meaning “those who assemble.” As God seems to define it, all believers within a definable region make a “church”, “Write on a scroll what you see and send it to the seven churches: to Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamum, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia and Laodicea.” in these cases it was cities.
The purpose of “assembling” according to scripture is to gather with fellow believers for worship, to equip, to encourage, to correct, to share, and to have a common meal.
let us consider how to stimulate one another to love and good deeds, not forsaking our own assembling together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another; and all the more, as you see the day drawing near.
(Heb. 10:24-25 NASB)Did that mean that all believers met in one place? Not likely, some of these were very large cities. 23 If, therefore, the whole assembly may come together, to the same place. This scripture seems to indicate that it wasn't that common or maybe even possible for the whole assembly to come together in one place. This I believe supports the idea that they met in scattered groups, (at least some of them in homes “so does the church that meets at their house”)and as shown in Paul's writings, not all these groups believed exactly the same thing.
Today many have lost sight of the fact that “church” is not a building but an assembly of believers (two or more) and within my community there are several “assemblies” scattered about with “born again” attendees; worshipping, being encouraged and challenged (yet all the while “Studying to show themselves approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.”). in other words not believing what's being taught without searching out the scriptures to see if it is so.
I believe that as God begins to pour out His Spirit (17And it shall be in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of My Spirit upon all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams; ) that it will first be a wake up call to any of those within the various assemblies (churches) who will listen, followed I believe by a mass exodus of true believers (“come out of her my people”) from all “churches” having not embraced what God has said to the churches.
So my opinion is that we should gather together with fellow believers (that can be accomplished to some extent right here on Heven.net) and if there is not a “church” where you can achieve the assembling of ourselves then we need to find other believers of like faith. However while many are quoting “come out of her” as their reason for not attending any church, I'm not sure that that call has gone out yet and our “churches” are white unto harvest and we should be lights to those in dark places and “religion” is the darkest.
My opinion, Wm
Copied from a different treadSo no, I do not believe that any denomination is the true Church.
My opinion – Wm
hi seekingtruth
i totally believe the same thing ,it is very sad to see ,all the different versions of explanation to the scriptures,wen it is so simple,it is to the righteous because is mind and heart is set to the spirit of the Lord,
I do thank you for letting me share some of my views on the scriptures.May God bless you in the aspiration of your heart,because the time is very near.
Christian churches are so called, because they preach Jesus Christ.
However, already in the time of the apostles there were those who tried to get a following for them self. What most people don't understand is, that the preaching of the gospel's main purpose was, to have those that were predestined to be called would get to hear the message, and respond to it. Even Paul said, Phil. 1:18, the important factor is, that Christ be preached.
In spite of all the persecution by the Romans, one group in particular had become stronger in numbers and in influence, so that by 324 AD Constantine made it the religion of the empire, the Roman Catholic church. This church was the dominating religion over all Europe, mainly by force, because if you did not believe what it taught, you were killed. Bible reading was forbidden too, punishable by death.
There were those that did not agree with the church, but would not risk their lives for it, until 1517 when Martin Luther nailed his 95 disagreements to the castle Wittenberg's door; it was the beginning of the “Great Reformation”.
Many other “church Leaders” used the moment to split from the “mother church”, and started their own denomination taking with them the basic teaching of the “Mother” church.
They may call them self “Christian” churches, but what they teach is not biblical for at least two reason, one; they do it for the following and the money. Two; they don't have the understanding of the “word” do to the lack of the Holy Spirit, in spite of their claim, that they do.Georg
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 15 2009,08:53) my question is, are today christians true to God and Christ asemble in a particular churche ?
if yes .were?
if no . why?
Yes the true Church exists. It is called the body of Christ and it is made up of living stones (people with God's Spirit).Do not look for a carnal church or a carnal anything. The kingdom of God is not of this world and the Church is not like any worldly organisation.
When you meet another person with the Spirit you can fellowship with them (if you have the Spirit of God dwelling in you).
If there is no one in your area, then make disciples.
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 14 2009,16:53) my question is, are today christians true to God and Christ asemble in a particular churche ?
if yes .were?
if no . why?
This interview might be of interest to you found here:http://www.sidroth.org/site….br=rad_
The author discusses his book “Leaving the Church to Find God” on that interview and his book has a description here:
Editorial Reviews
Product Description
Motivated by a deep hunger for more of God, millions of Christians are leaving the traditional church to look for more freedom and fulfillment than the routine of five songs, announcements, a plea for money and a forty five minute sermon allow. They are looking for open ended, deep worship that flows with the Holy Spirit, relatable Bible study and discussion in which they may participate, and strong bonds of fellowship outside the four walls of organized church. Instead of leaving the church to fall away from God, they are leaving the church to find God. Leaving the Church to Find God offers scriptural, safe, and balanced answers tempered by real life experiences, on how to move from a traditional church structure into meetings that allow the Lord to set the agenda and where needs are met. John Fenn – I was a Christian who felt disconnected from church though I'd been actively involved nearly all my life. I was looking for answers to my desire and hunger for God to move freely, and came to realize I wasn't alone. From all walks of life and across the church spectrum people are searching for something deeper, but they don't quite know what. This is the story of how I found God moving outside the church structure that I had known, loved, and been a part of my whole Christian life. John and his wife Barbara were born in Kokomo, Indiana and began dating as teenagers when they met the Lord, and began ministering to their teenage friends. They've been in the ministry now for over thirty years, serving in various capacities including Campus Pastor, Associate Pastor, Senior Pastor, and advisor to churches and Bible schools all over the world. John also worked with Peter Wagner teaching at the Wagner Leadership Institute, serving as Canadian National Director and Education Advisor. He remains an adjunct instructor of Wagner Leadership Institute of Colorado Springs. In early 2002 John and his wife Barb, founded The Church Without Walls International of Tulsa, a house church network, emphasizing Relationship Based Christianity. He travels and teaches in all different streams of Christianity, helping churches and individuals find significance and fulfillment through Godly relationships and the discipleship process.Review found here:
http://www.amazon.com/Leaving….&sr=1-1
Google “the church without walls” and see how many sites appear.
Q: Is there today a true churche to go to ?
A: All believers are the Church. You don't go to Church you are the Church. When 2 or 3 are gathered, then you have a congregation and fellowship.Quote (t8 @ Aug. 31 2010,19:56) Q: Is there today a true churche to go to ?
A: All believers are the Church. You don't go to Church you are the Church. When 2 or 3 are gathered, then you have a congregation and fellowship.
hi T8i have to disagree with you in part only;;,Jesus says that it is not all the ones who call on my name that will be saved but the once doing the will of my father….
you right Jesus said those words were 2 or 3 gather in my name i will go and my father as well…
the word here are in both verses MY NAME,and the intention to do the will of God.
otherwise you are not a part of the church or body of Christ..
if this is not true please show me were i am wrong???
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 31 2010,15:19) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 31 2010,19:56) Q: Is there today a true churche to go to ?
A: All believers are the Church. You don't go to Church you are the Church. When 2 or 3 are gathered, then you have a congregation and fellowship.
hi T8i have to disagree with you in part only;;,Jesus says that it is not all the ones who call on my name that will be saved but the once doing the will of my father….
you right Jesus said those words were 2 or 3 gather in my name i will go and my father as well…
the word here are in both verses MY NAME,and the intention to do the will of God.
otherwise you are not a part of the church or body of Christ..
if this is not true please show me were i am wrong???
Pierre
Depends on your understanding of “believer“.
It is more common than the word “Christian” and the opposite is also mentioned quite a bit, i.e., “unbelievers”.What do you call someone who is part of the Body of Christ, (the Church)?
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 01 2010,02:07) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 31 2010,15:19) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 31 2010,19:56) Q: Is there today a true churche to go to ?
A: All believers are the Church. You don't go to Church you are the Church. When 2 or 3 are gathered, then you have a congregation and fellowship.
hi T8i have to disagree with you in part only;;,Jesus says that it is not all the ones who call on my name that will be saved but the once doing the will of my father….
you right Jesus said those words were 2 or 3 gather in my name i will go and my father as well…
the word here are in both verses MY NAME,and the intention to do the will of God.
otherwise you are not a part of the church or body of Christ..
if this is not true please show me were i am wrong???
Pierre
Depends on your understanding of “believer“.
It is more common than the word “Christian” and the opposite is also mentioned quite a bit, i.e., “unbelievers”.What do you call someone who is part of the Body of Christ, (the Church)?
hi T8well believer is someone how believes what it says and work accordingly,
the action confirms his or her believe.now many do have believes in other religion and do the same what separate the true worshipers from the others.
but what about the beleivers in Christianity?
is there a difference ,to me and scriptures there is,history shows how important it is to know who you worship as God ,you action in your worship make you stand out who you really worship God or the world.
God separate Israel from the rest of the world and told them how he wants to be worship and so in action the true believers followed what God asked of them.
is there a change with Christ ? no all that practice is now reinforced not only we have to act out our faith but on the inside of us we have to be in harmony with it.
so what does it now means wen we do not agree with scriptures ,are we disagree with God? yes
but this is not in all things ,we have to look for the truth of God because this action shows some of our intentions,but it has to be for the glory of God not for our glory.or our intention are not right.
we have to search for the understanding of the spirit of Gods will,this is part of the obtaining the grace of God.
if we believe only what good does it do to anyone?
God as nothing.
your fellow men as nothing.
and you end up having nothing as well.the faith or real believe make you move,so if you do not move to apply Gods will your faith is dead.
so to answer you question;there is only one sort of believers that God and Christ will accept and that is a true believer that respond according to the will of God,not to men will and believes.
Pierre
all
are the true believers to paid attention to what they do say and practice,scriptures say to do the will of God,
this is God ;1Ki 19:18 Yet I reserve seven thousand in Israel—all whose knees have not bowed down to Baal and all whose mouths have not kissed him
1Pe 3:10 For,
“Whoever would love life
and see good days
must keep his tongue from evil
and his lips from deceitful speech1Pe 2:1 Therefore, rid yourselves of all malice and all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and slander of every kind.
1Pe 2:22 “He committed no sin,
and no deceit was found in his mouth.”
talking about Christ in 1Pe 2;;;;let do what Christ did.Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 02 2009,14:11) hi georg
you quote PHl 1;18. do you know why Paul said this ?
Yes I do know, because Christ commanded it, Mat. 28:19,20.
But now you should ask, for what reason? has any one paid attention to the gospel?
Paul gives us the reason.Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Rom 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
So that those who were to be called, from all nations, and a long way off, would hear the message/gospel and could respond to it.
Georg
The thread title is one that I have queried in myself for so long that I no longer attended any churches.
I was actually thrown out of a Church for simply asking about the trinity…no questions, just didn't want anyone to ask about it….is that a 'spiritual church'?
Yet, it may have just been the pastor who feared their ability to respond to questions..just wanted complete sheeplike congregation.
Then, i went to a convention for the same type f church and it was incredible. The Holy Spirit was perfusely apparent. God was there, Jesus embraced us.
The revelation was there,..it's not the individual church but the overall message that the parent church expouses.
Did Jesus not give seven example churches to us in the Book of Revelation. Did he not show that, perhaps only one, will show proper credit to his testiment, the others will lead astray in different ways but yet still belong to him, and to God?But yet, we should choose that church that fits our feelings as led by the Holy Spirit. We cannot all attend the same church. Different cultures, attitudes, beliefs, standings, leadership, acceptances, will divide the True Church of God in the world so pick and choose as you will according to your own leaning but be aware of descent of righteousness within and get out if it seems in nosedive…the Catholic Churches, for example, Protestism, worship of the Holy Spirit (Mainstream Pentecostal and perhaps Baptist) worship of Jesus (Christadelphians), ..curiously, Trinity based is not included directly and there is a good reason for that: Satan has been allowed to 'mislead the entire earth' and this is one way he is doing so.
However, the basic tenet is to be alive to truth and the great call has gone out and is loud and clear..the trumpet has sounded: “The great whore – Get out of her, lest you share in her iniquities”. The great whore was born out of the Abomination that was the Roman Empire, the same Roman empire that stood in the Holy of Holies in the Temple of God in Jerusalem, in God's Holy place, on the 'mount of God' and declared itself as God, defiling the inner sanctuary with it's blood and gore stain weapons of war, the inner sanctuary, where only the [Human] unblemished High Priest of God may enter on certain days of the week.'The Abomination standing where it should not'
JustAskin
This is what Paul said about preaching the gospel.
Phl 1:15 Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife; and some also of good will:
Phl 1:16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds:
Phl 1:17 But the other of love, knowing that I am set for the defence of the gospel.
Phl 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.
That is how the gospel, eventually, was preached in all the world; and is still being preached that way today.
Georg
Georg,
In this i agree – and had to learn… I found no single church agreeable to me. I contemplated what then. So I prayed to God while at one church “Is this the One”..and the next day my prayer was answered – a letter arrived from the pastor TELLING me not to come back…
yet, this was not final. God's word preached by whomever, “If they are not against you then they are with you”.
So i learnt and was obedient to the learning (Yeah, I mean – I JUST Learnt…. a few weeks ago…)JustAskin
Keep it up, you are on the right track; men can help you, but, understanding comes from God, not men, be a Berean, prove all things.
I had to chuckle when I read what the pastor said to you, my pastor just said, “lets agree that we disagree”; but I stayed away too. I'm sure I'm not missed.Georg
Quote (JustAskin @ Sep. 05 2010,05:39) The thread title is one that I have queried in myself for so long that I no longer attended any churches. I was actually thrown out of a Church for simply asking about the trinity…no questions, just didn't want anyone to ask about it….is that a 'spiritual church'?
Yet, it may have just been the pastor who feared their ability to respond to questions..just wanted complete sheeplike congregation.
Then, i went to a convention for the same type f church and it was incredible. The Holy Spirit was perfusely apparent. God was there, Jesus embraced us.
The revelation was there,..it's not the individual church but the overall message that the parent church expouses.
Did Jesus not give seven example churches to us in the Book of Revelation. Did he not show that, perhaps only one, will show proper credit to his testiment, the others will lead astray in different ways but yet still belong to him, and to God?But yet, we should choose that church that fits our feelings as led by the Holy Spirit. We cannot all attend the same church. Different cultures, attitudes, beliefs, standings, leadership, acceptances, will divide the True Church of God in the world so pick and choose as you will according to your own leaning but be aware of descent of righteousness within and get out if it seems in nosedive…the Catholic Churches, for example, Protestism, worship of the Holy Spirit (Mainstream Pentecostal and perhaps Baptist) worship of Jesus (Christadelphians), ..curiously, Trinity based is not included directly and there is a good reason for that: Satan has been allowed to 'mislead the entire earth' and this is one way he is doing so.
However, the basic tenet is to be alive to truth and the great call has gone out and is loud and clear..the trumpet has sounded: “The great whore – Get out of her, lest you share in her iniquities”. The great whore was born out of the Abomination that was the Roman Empire, the same Roman empire that stood in the Holy of Holies in the Temple of God in Jerusalem, in God's Holy place, on the 'mount of God' and declared itself as God, defiling the inner sanctuary with it's blood and gore stain weapons of war, the inner sanctuary, where only the [Human] unblemished High Priest of God may enter on certain days of the week.'The Abomination standing where it should not'
JAyes i was ready to answer you but i at to go and so now i see what Georg has written to you ,
and yes it is hard to be a true christian mostly alone but with God,this world is only temporary it will past away,
Georg has responded very well to your comment ,I like georg he is true in is heart and so is Irene ,I ken feel it in there comments ,and I do not say this by obligation but because it is true ,i just would like to add this few scriptures to you ;1Th 2:5 You know we never used flattery, nor did we put on a mask to cover up greed—God is our witness.
1Th 2:6 We were not looking for praise from men, not from you or anyone else.
As apostles of Christ we could have been a burden to you,1Th 2:14 For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews:
1Th 4:1 Finally, brothers, we instructed you how to live in order to please God, as in fact you are living. Now we ask you and urge you in the Lord Jesus to do this more and more.
1Th 4:2 For you know what instructions we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
1Th 4:3 It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality;
1Th 4:4 that each of you should learn to control his own body in a way that is holy and honorable,
1Th 4:5 not in passionate lust like the heathen, who do not know God;
1Th 4:6 and that in this matter no one should wrong his brother or take advantage of him. The Lord will punish men for all such sins, as we have already told you and warned you.
1Th 4:7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.Gal 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.
Gal 6:8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
Gal 6:9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.our road is with God the way Christ has lay it out ,on the way we practice all good things with men , for the glory of God.
Pierre
JA
you say;But yet, we should choose that church that fits our feelings as led by the Holy Spirit,
how would you choose that Church that FITS thats the way i use to choose my friends and it was not good choice.
first why would you trust your carnal feelings?? and thinking that it would be the Holy Spirit ??Pierre
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