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I believe the Bible speaks against drinking fermented wine as well as any other alcoholic beverage.
What are your thoughts?
Hi,
Jesus made wine out of water and drank wine right until the last supper and in fact was labelled “a winebibber”
Paul told Timothy to “take a little wine”Legalistic men proscribe such things. God does not.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 24 2005,16:14) Hi,
Jesus made wine out of water and drank wine right until the last supper and in fact was labelled “a winebibber”
Paul told Timothy to “take a little wine”Legalistic men proscribe such things. God does not.
Hi Nick and k4c,Myself I cannot drink ONE! I've got to get drunk. So I stay away from the stuff.
I would advise if anyone has that same trouble to stop altogether. I've done a lot of bad things while on the sauce and am too ashamed to talk about them. So for me no alcohol!!I believe Jesus used wine as a dinner drink. He didn't get over drink anything.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 24 2005,16:14) Hi,
Jesus made wine out of water and drank wine right until the last supper and in fact was labelled “a winebibber”
Paul told Timothy to “take a little wine”Legalistic men proscribe such things. God does not.
The word (wine) in the Bible is used for fermented grape juice as well as unfermented.We know the Bible speaks harshly against drunkeness and how those who get drunk won't enter into the kingdom of God. Do you think Jesus would promote drunkeness by making 120 gallons of fermented wine at a wedding?
Do you think those people who called Jesus a winebibber was telling the truth?
Thoes same people said John the Baptist was possesed by demons.
The Bible says that John the Baptist drank no wine (grape juice) nor strong drink (fermented grape juice).
John was a Nazirite spearated from his mother's womb to serve the LORD.
Luke 1:13-16 But the angel said to him, “Do not be afraid, Zacharias, for your prayer is heard; and your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you shall call his name John. “And you will have joy and gladness, and many will rejoice at his birth. “For he will be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink. He will also be filled with the Holy Spirit, even from his mother's womb. “And he will turn many of the children of Israel to the Lord their God.
A Nazirite drinks no wine (grape juice) or strong drink (fermented grape juice).
Numbers 6:2-4 “Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: When either a man or woman consecrates an offering to take the vow of a Nazirite, to separate himself to the Lord, he shall separate himself from wine and similar drink; he shall drink neither vinegar made from wine nor vinegar made from similar drink; neither shall he drink any grape juice, nor eat fresh grapes or raisins. All the days of his separation he shall eat nothing that is produced by the grapevine, from seed to skin.
Those people called Jesus a winbibber because He drank the juice of the wine which was forbidden by those who called themselves servants of God.
Lets look at how the Bible speaks of fermented wine.
Proverbs 23:31 Do not look at wine when it is red, when it sparkles in the cup and goes down smoothly.
1 Timothy 3:2-3 For a pastor must be a good man whose life cannot be spoken against. He must have only one wife, and he must be hard working and thoughtful, orderly, and full of good deeds. He must enjoy having guests in his home, and must be a good Bible teacher. He must not be a drinker or quarrelsome, but he must be gentle and kind, and not be one who loves money.
Proverbs 20:1 WINE IS a mocker, strong drink a brawler; and whoever is led astray by it is not wise.
Do these verses speak of fermented wine as something good in the eyes of the LORD?
Paul says we should obstain from all appearence of evil.
1 Thessalonians 5:22 Stay away from every kind of evil–even from what looks like evil.
How many crimes, health problems, family and social problems has alcohol caused in God's creation?
The juice of the grape has an antiseptic quality to it so it would be good for stomach problems but alcohol causes stomach problems as well as many other health problems.
Hi k4c,
Jesus was not a Nazirite. Speculations as to what he should or might have done do not add information to what scripture says about him.It is very difficult to stop grape juice fermenting in hot climates and those who wanted to do so would have to squeeze the grapes immediately prior to drinking it. There is no such record.
It seems much more likely to me that he lived as the locals did and drank lowish alcohol wine with their meals. Why would we want to paint him as an abstemious and teetotal man. Was he not like to us in all ways except sin?
If he was called a winebibber it is likely this was a gross exaggeration rather than an outright lie. He seems to suggest he had drunk of the fruit of the vine at the last supper.Matt 26.29
” But I say to you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it with you in My Father's kingdom”Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 24 2005,23:54) Hi k4c,
Jesus was not a Nazirite. Speculations as to what he should or might have done do not add information to what scripture says about him.It is very difficult to stop grape juice fermenting in hot climates and those who wanted to do so would have to squeeze the grapes immediately prior to drinking it. There is no such record.
It seems much more likely to me that he lived as the locals did and drank lowish alcohol wine with their meals. Why would we want to paint him as an abstemious and teetotal man. Was he not like to us in all ways except sin?
If he was called a winebibber it is likely this was a gross exaggeration rather than an outright lie. He seems to suggest he had drunk of the fruit of the vine at the last supper.Matt 26.29
” But I say to you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it with you in My Father's kingdom”
I wasn't calling Jesus a Nazirite I was comparing the fact that Nazirites drink no grape juice as John did not. The fact that it says Jesus came eating and drinking does not say he came drinking fermented wine. The fact that they compared Jesus with John they could have been referring to the unfermented wine which John himself did not drink but Jesus did drink in the statement, eating and drinking.Do you think Jesus would make 120 gallons of fermented wine when the Bible forbids drunkeness?
Hi ,
If scripture says what you claim we can agree. The rest is speculation surely?
Is it sin to make wine or to drink to excess?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 25 2005,00:12) Hi ,
If scripture says what you claim we can agree. The rest is speculation surely?
Is it sin to make wine or to drink to excess?
Romans 14:13 Then let us no more pass judgment on one another, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 25 2005,00:48) Exactly k4c. Let's stick to what is revealed.
Is it plainly revealed that Jesus made 120 gallons of an alcoholic beverage for His friends and family?Can you show me where it's clearly revealed that Jesus drank fermented wine?
Do we believe those who accused Jesus of many false things and count that as revealed truth?
I tend to get migraines from alcohol. Here are some more scritures on wine:
The Bible writers Peter and Paul advised moderation by counseling the early Christians to avoid “excesses with wine” and not to “be getting drunk with wine.” This admonition was to be taken seriously, as the apostle warned: ‘Drunkards will not inherit God’s kingdom.’ In other words, habitual abusers of alcoholic beverages do not have God’s approval and lose out on everlasting life.—1 Peter 4:3; Ephesians 5:18; 1 Corinthians 6:9, 10.
God outlined both the enjoyment and the health benefits derived from wine. His prophet Jotham spoke of “new wine that makes God and men rejoice.” (Judges 9:13) King Solomon wrote of ‘cheering his flesh even with wine.’ (Ecclesiastes 2:3) And in the well-known account of the marriage feast at Cana, Jesus, in his first miracle, turned a large amount of water into “the best wine,” to the delight of the wedding guests.—John 2:6, 7, 10, The New English Bible.
If individuals lack self-control in the use of alcohol, they should abstain from it entirely. (Compare Matthew 5:29, 30.)
Nor would we want to stumble a brother, as mentioned already.Contrary to the point of view of the prohibitionist however, the Bible does not require, or even indicate, total abstinence from wine or alcoholic beverages for all persons. (Deuteronomy 14:26) The psalmist says of Jehovah:
“He is making green grass sprout for the beasts, and vegetation for the service of mankind, to cause food to go forth from the earth, and WINE THAT MAKES THE HEART OF MORTAL MAN REJOICE.”
Indeed, God has appointed wine for a good and honorable purpose, when taken in moderation.—Psalm 104:14, 15.
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