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Some of you know me a little already but just a quick cover of myself, I was saved 3 years ago, and in school people and teachers call me a bunch of names because of my faith and treverend is one of them, it's my name Trevor and the word reverend put together. I always type treverend with a lowercase t because I know I'm small and God is big and it also stands for the cross of Christ. So yeah people, send me a PM or something and let me know if any of you play the LEFT BEHIND video games, they're pretty sweet.
Quote (treverend @ Aug. 23 2008,07:53) Some of you know me a little already but just a quick cover of myself, I was saved 3 years ago, and in school people and teachers call me a bunch of names because of my faith and treverend is one of them, it's my name Trevor and the word reverend put together. I always type treverend with a lowercase t because I know I'm small and God is big and it also stands for the cross of Christ. So yeah people, send me a PM or something and let me know if any of you play the LEFT BEHIND video games, they're pretty sweet.
Hello treverend. I'm Stuart. I have not been saved. You may gather from my other posts that I do not have a god-believing worldview. I am curious about why people fall for being told that they need 'saving'. Doesn't that ignore the fascinating complexities of human existence? Don't you feel like someone has thrown a chainmail blanket over aspects of your basic humanity? Your comment about the lowercase t particularly leads me to ask this.Stuart
Well dude, I was confused about your question, lol. But yeah I was born agaim when I was like 13, and now I have experienced Jesus in such real ways. My faith maybe shaken sometimes, but I never lose hope because I know He is there, all the time, and God is good all the time, all the time God is good.
And your signature says that we shut the door to your questions. I will answer your questions the best I can. I'm going to Bible school to be a youth Pastor so please test me, ask questions about evolution vs creation or anything.
Quote (treverend @ Aug. 23 2008,08:17) Well dude, I was confused about your question, lol. But yeah I was born agaim when I was like 13, and now I have experienced Jesus in such real ways. My faith maybe shaken sometimes, but I never lose hope because I know He is there, all the time, and God is good all the time, all the time God is good.
OK. May I rephrase the question. What went wrong the first time you were born? I'm presuming you got access to oxygen, food, warmth, care, shelter, hopefully love and social access to other people. Where down that list of basic human essentials did you need to know that a man was killed by the ancient Roman authorities so you could be 'saved' today? How is it that 2/3 of the world population live without that 'saving', most of the perfectly happily?Stuart
Quote (treverend @ Aug. 23 2008,08:19) And your signature says that we shut the door to your questions. I will answer your questions the best I can. I'm going to Bible school to be a youth Pastor so please test me, ask questions about evolution vs creation or anything.
I would encourage you to read the 'Do you believe in evolution' thread in the 'Creation & Science' section. I would welcome keenly (as I am sure others here would) any points that have not yet been raised that elevate creationism any higher than wishful mythology!Stuart
Jesus saved me from sin, no earthly thing like your speaking of. And your right, most the world are not Christians, and most Christians who profess to be Christian are not. The Bible even says that, Jesus said the road to destruction is wide and many people will pass through it but the road to eternal life is narrow and few will find it. And did you know God perfectly predicted the death of Christ 1000 years before it happened? Those wern't just Roman soldiers and that wasn't just a man, He was God in the flesh and those Roman soldiers completed anctient prophiesies. There are many prophesies of Jesus' death way WAY before it happened but just take a look at Psalm 22 and tell me that it isn't talking about Jesus, it clearly is, he was no ordinary man… and that was no ordinary death. It was the pivet point of Human history which God had planned since the beginning and also prophesied about. Even our calender is centered around the death of Christ, this wasn't no little thing, it was the hugest thing to happen in ALL Human history!
Creation, wishful mythology?! lol Seriosly dude, science points toward God and the creation, evolution is based off of so called “scientific proofs” that were proven wrong 100 years ago. A evolutionist once said that all evidence points towards a Creator but he said he chooses not to believe just because he doesn't want to, I'l lfind that quote but evoltion is a lie, and God exist whether you believe it or not, your theory doesn't change God's reality.
Regarding biblical prophecy, you need to appreciate the amount of effort that the gospel writers put into making Jesus's profile fulfil those prophecies. If you need better evidence than just the bible, as I do, then there is no particularly strong reason to believe that Jesus existed at all. Other records of the time, like the possible mention of Jesus by the Jewish writer Josephus, were so altered by early christians that they can't be relied on. You have to take Jesus on faith. It is reasonable to say he might never have been born.
Can you please tell me which bit of Psalm 22 you think refers to Jesus? To me it is less clear than the ravings of a psychic! There will be a solar eclipse on 23 July 2047 that will be visible from Wellington, starting at 10:19am. It will cover 21.4% of the sun. How does Isaiah stack up against prophecies like that?
It is certainly true that the Western world revolves around the mythology of Jesus. Don't forget that we got it wrong, the best estimates of the birth of Jesus (if it happened at all) are a few years before 0BCE! Just goes to show how strongly we pass memes around!
The most important event in human history was the mass extinction that occured 65 million years ago. Without the removal of the dinosaurs we might still be the shrew-sized creatures that out ancestors were at that stage.
Stuart
Isaiah didn't write Psalm 22 King David did but yeah, lol. the prophecies in the Bible are way more complex and detailed that what you said just read all of Psalm 22 it isn't that long and you will know what I mean. And I know about Josephus but do you have proof his writing were altered? Even if they were it would be crazy to say Jesus never existed, few historians will argue the existence of Jesus. And Josephus is not the only out of the Bible source of Jesus. And also… why do you think so strongly that the people who wrote the old testiment lied about Jesus, and even more important, why would they have died for a lie? All of them were killed except for the Apostle John, the Apostle Paul was whiped by Romans more than 1 time and he was happy every time. Why? Because he was being hurt and persecuted for a lie? They all endured the persecution to bring glory to God. And are you going to say the apostles didn't exist neither even though there were disciples trained by them such as Polycarp and Irenaeus?
And did you ever hear of VenomFangX on YouTube? I think you should watch some of his videos. http://www.youtube.com/venomfangx
Hey it looks like Stu has competition regarding the avatar.
Maybe I should get one too.
What about this one?
Hey Trev,
Regarding your PM to me – you don't need me here you have Stu to keep you busy for quite some time. Good luck!
Love,
MandyI appreciate that Isaiah was not a psalmist. I did read Ps 22 and I am still asking you to tell me which part you think unquestionably is predictive of Jesus. I don't think it is crazy to argue that Jesus never existed. None of the gospel writers actually met Jesus. There is no eyewitness account of him in existence anywhere. The principles that the gospel writers claim he expoused are not really new. The kernel of goodness contained in Matthew 7:12 is not exclusive to christianity. I am happy to accept the existence of Jesus for the sake of discussion, despite the paucity of evidence. I don't accept that you know what he said or did though. I think you should be very suspicious that Paul does not mention his supposed miracles.
As for people hoping to be punished or martyred to the glory of god, your previous avatar of the delightful rantings of the koran pretty much gives the explanation for that! (I like the new one, by the way – you have chosen an even closer cousin that I have!). Blowing oneself up for greater glory is very much something of the present. Why do they do it?
Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Aug. 23 2008,10:31) Hey it looks like Stu has competition regarding the avatar. Maybe I should get one too.
What about this one?
That is perfect for you! The ape that doesn't know it yet and wants to be child-like!Stuart
Thanks. And don't forget the cute part.
Or maybe this one fits a bit better, coz the surprise on the face looks reminiscent of someone telling me about the singularity that came out of nothing and after billions of years spat out bananas, trees, and galaxies and stuff.
Actually this one might be good for you.
A monkey in a Santa outfit. Sort of fits the singularity santa theory thingy.
Quote (t8 @ Aug. 23 2008,10:43)
Lie no 1: He concluded from observing finches that bananas and finches are related.Lie no 2: Arms are difference sizes, people use that as evidence that humans evolved from earthworms
Lie no 3: It is possible that god created humans with the ability to produce offspring with different arm sizes (not if you believe the Adam and Eve or Noachian myths!)
Lie no 4: Finches are evidence for creation (there is no Theory of Divine Creation so that evidence is yet to have an scientific interpretation other than one based on natural selection)
Lie no 5: Darwin said finches’ beaks prove that everything is interrelated
Lie no 6: People believed Darwin because they don’t like the alternative
Lie no 7: Darwin’s work is only based on finches
Lie no 8: Evolution is a philosophy
Lie no 9: If you ‘believe in evolution’ you do not believe that life was designed with purpose (I don’t, but millions do!)
Lie no 10: If you believe in evolution you cannot tell right from wrong
Lie no 11: ‘Evolutionists’ (whatever) cannot distinguish the value of life
Lie no 12: Young people do drugs because we are teaching them that they came from monkeys (they don’t, we didn’t)
Lie no13: Humans are not animals
Lie no 14: The fossil record of dinosaurs can be explained by Noah’s flood
Lie no 15: Textbooks are out of date because ‘they don’t like the alternative’
Lie no 16: ‘Evolutionists’ are trying to censor creationists (they are trying to ignore them these days)
Lie no 17: It is impossible for the parts of a cell to assemble without intelligent design
That’s more than one lie a minute. So much for not bearing false witness.
Stuart
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