Heb 1:8

[Is 1:18]

Quote (seminarian @ July 15 2006,03:12)

Very Biblical, SHORT respone to Is 1:18, “cut n' paste” articles to attempt to say our Lord Jesus is equal to or is God the Father.

I overlooked this….

Seminarian my challenge to you is to find one instance where I have affirmed on the Heaven.Net MBs that Jesus is the “God the Father”. I have written 676 posts here previous to this one, so you have quite a lot of material at your disposal. Good luck with your searching. You will also likely learn more about my position on the equality issue, so you can actually make informed comments in that regard too.

If you fail to come up with the attendant proof that I hold that Jesus is “God the Father”, and you will Seminarian, I would like an apology from you for misrepresenting me.

[Proclaimer]

My understanding is that the word 'OR” means that it is one or the other and not necessarily one or both of them. Maybe I missed something here?

Anyway the question at hand for Trinitarians:

1.) Does our Lord Jesus have a God? Yes/No
2.) Does God the Father have a god? Yes/No

A simple yes or no for each question is sufficient.

Thx

[NickHassan]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 16 2006,05:28)

Quote (seminarian @ July 15 2006,03:12) Very Biblical, SHORT respone to Is 1:18, “cut n' paste” articles to attempt to say our Lord Jesus is equal to or is God the Father. I overlooked this…. Seminarian my challenge to you is to find one instance where I have affirmed on the Heaven.Net MBs that Jesus is the “God the Father”. I have written 676 posts here previous to this one, so you have quite a lot of material at your disposal. Good luck with your searching. You will also likely learn more about my position on the equality issue, so you can actually make informed comments in that regard too. If you fail to come up with the attendant proof that I hold that Jesus is “God the Father”, and you will Seminarian, I would like an apology from you for misrepresenting me.

Hi Is 1.18,
You seem to imply that you have learned nothing in the past few years and I am sure that could not be true. This is not trench warfare but a journey of discovery together surely?
During your time here has the Spirit taught you anything new, or will the 676 posts only show that what you came with is all you still know?
Surely, like the rest of us, you are here to learn from the Spirit in the Word, in which case your knowledge changes as you grow?
Are we not meant to walk in the Spirit and to learn from the Teacher if we are teachable?

[Is 1:18]

Quote (t8 @ July 16 2006,13:29)

My understanding is that the word 'OR” means that it is one or the other and not necessarily one or both of them. Maybe I missed something here? Anyway the question at hand for Trinitarians: 1.)  Does our Lord Jesus have a God?  Yes/No 2.)  Does God the Father have a god?  Yes/No A simple yes or no for each question is sufficient. Thx

he he….stay tuned….

[Is 1:18]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 16 2006,23:03)

Hi Is 1.18, You seem to imply that you have learned nothing in the past few years and I am sure that could not be true. This is not trench warfare but a journey of discovery together surely? During your time here has the Spirit taught you anything new, or will the 676 posts only show that what you came with is all you still know? Surely, like the rest of us, you are here to learn from the Spirit in the Word, in which case your knowledge changes as you grow? Are we not meant to walk in the Spirit and to learn from the Teacher if we are teachable?

To the contrary I think have learnt quite a lot over the last year or two. But I am discerning. If something is clearly unsciptural I will reject it – naturally.

 

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
Trinity is not scriptural.

[Proclaimer]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 18 2006,02:23)

If something is clearly unsciptural I will reject it – naturally.

That still leaves you open to rejecting scripture like the ones I have listed below, including hundreds more that identify God as the Father and his son and messiah as Jesus.

1 Corinthians 8:5-6
5 For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”),
6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

John 17:3
Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

1 Corinthians 11:3
Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.

Ephesians 4:4-6
4 there is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called
5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Revelation 1:1
The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place.
He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,

Also, learning and truth are 2 different things.

2 Timothy 3:7
7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith.

You can learn all you like, but if the heart is not right, then knowledge of the truth that leads to righteousness will evade you.

Titus 1:1
Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God and the knowledge of the truth which is according to godliness,

[seminarian]

Is 1:18,

No need to “work” on anything.  Just answer the two questions I posed from the scriptures.
If you are in fact admitting your posts are your own original writings, I believe you are only further
embarrassing yourself.

Just my honest opinion.

Bless you,

Semmy

[seminarian]

Quote (t8 @ July 16 2006,13:29)

My understanding is that the word 'OR” means that it is one or the other and not necessarily one or both of them. Maybe I missed something here? Anyway the question at hand for Trinitarians: 1.)  Does our Lord Jesus have a God?  Yes/No 2.)  Does God the Father have a god?  Yes/No A simple yes or no for each question is sufficient. Thx

Hey T8,

No, YOU didn't miss anything.  Yes that was my point as you and everyone else saw above here.  Is 1:18's post rambled so much, I wasn't sure what she was trying to say about Christ. Also as everyone one can see, she did not answer the questions but is still “working” on them. Uh huh.

Anyway, trinitarians always refuse to answer my two questions using scripture.  They will most always go to some extra-Biblical doctrines or definitions.

Only one, the pastor of education who has a Masters in Divinity answered and that was ONLY after I pressed him to.  Then he said Christ DID NOT have a God which of course is the exact opposite of what scripture says.  Once I showed him this in the Bible, (several palces in fact), the debate was over and he said he didn't want to discuss it anymore.  

The bottom line is that you can not be God and have a god.  However the definition of God as placer or disposer from Psalm 82:6 which our Lord Jesus quoted would be accurate. God the Father appointed the Lord Jesus over everything. Nobody appoints God the Father over anything, period.  That is not a “co-equal” relationship as the trinity doctrine teaches. Very simple actually.

I gave the head pastor my notice of my License to Preach and that I have assumed pastoral duties at the facilities I serve. In other words, don't expect me in church Sunday mornings as I will be busy with my own. I'll still serve at the altar the first Sunday of the month and support their visiting the nursing homes. I did pastoral calls yesterday and it was fantastic. God is good, all the time.

Oh well, back to seminary classes!

Semmy

[Proclaimer]

Thanks Semmy.

Soldier on.

BTW: I think Is 1:18 is male.

[NickHassan]

psst t8,
So is Ramblinrose.

[Proclaimer]

OK.

Kind of interesting to note that it is hard to pick a persons gender when you can't see them.

[Is 1:18]

Quote (seminarian @ July 17 2006,16:06)

No, YOU didn't miss anything.  Yes that was my point as you and everyone else saw above here.  Is 1:18's post rambled so much, I wasn't sure what she was trying to say about Christ. Also as everyone one can see, she did not answer the questions but is still “working” on them.  Uh huh.

Yes, Seminarian I was still working on it, as time permitted. You might think your questions send all trinitarians reeling and running for cover, but it's not true.

Anyway here is my reply (I’ll try not to ramble on too much):

Quote

After all you wrote are you saying Yahweh is calling Yeshua Himself?  Does that make any sense?

No, it doesn’t. Could you please frame your question so it’s intended meaning is made clearer?

Quote

Here's something that does.

He he…we'll see.

Quote

Here are two questions that will show who our Lord Jesus is in relationship to his Father.  Hint: Kenrch gave you a clue by quoting 1 Co 15:28.

Seminarian, I'm happy to answer questions for those that reciprocate when questions come their way. I have seen that you were very reluctant to supply direct answers to WhatIsTrue’s questions in your exchanges with him, so I hope you will not be so evasive when it comes time for you to answer some question of mine….time will tell.

I'll address 1 Co 15:28 at the end of the post.

Quote

Please Answer these two simple questions from the Holy Scriptures:

Okay, sure.

Quote

1.)  Does our Lord Jesus have a God?  Yes/No

My answer – Yes.

Quote

2.)  Does God the Father have a god?  Yes/No

My answer – No.

Does this somehow invalidate the trinity doctrine? – No. Let me see if I can explain it to you.

Jesus has a God because He is also a man, born of woman and born under the law (Gal. 4:4). As a man, if He does not have His Father as His God, and all that that entails, He would have been a transgressor of that law. Is His Father a man? No. That is why He doesn’t have a God, Seminarian. It's really quite simple.

So is this a valid refutation of the doctrine? No. Trinitarians, as far I can tell, affirm the humanity of Christ. The fact that His Father is His God is of course a natural consequence of His incarnation and mission. If he had not taken His Father and His God He would not have been the sinless Lamb of God, and we would all be in trouble. But we know that He fulfilled the law perfectly. Praise God!

So in summary, your assertion that Jesus having a God IS not legitimate testimony against validity of the trinity doctrine itself, it just an affirmation of Christ’s humanity – something that trinitarian do not dispute. If you want to set about disproving the doctrine it might be more productive to try disproving His deity.

Quote

Here are some direct citations from God's Word, not some subjective interpretations.

sub·jec·tive  
adj.
1.
a.Proceeding from or taking place in a person's mind rather than the external world: a subjective decision.
b.Particular to a given person; personal: subjective experience. From: Dictionary.com.

He he…is there such a thing as a non-subjective interpretation? Given that interpretation requires personal judgement of inferred meaning. Anyone, who doesn’t outsource his theology, subjectively interprets scripture. Doesn’t mean that everyone’s subjective interpretation is objectively true though, but that’s a different matter.

Quote

“So that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the GOD AND FATHER of our Lord Christ Jesus.” [Romans 15:6] “Yet for us there is but ONE GOD, the Father…and there is but ONE LORD, Jesus Christ…” [1Cor 8:6] Now try as you may, there is no way you can make these scriptures say anything than what they do.

I agree. And I could equally throw a few dozen trinitarian prooftexts at you and argue the same point. In fact you could ‘prove’ just about every conceivable position, no matter how erroneous, from a few selective scriptures. That is why the whole counsel of God’s word should be taken into account when judging the authenticity of a doctrine.

Quote

There is only one God, the Father and there is only one Lord, Chirst Jesus

I disagree that Paul’s intended conveyance in writing 1 Cor 8:6 was that The Father is exclusively “God” and Yahshua is exclusively “Lord”, and that these appellations denote unique and disparate ontological categories. If that is you assertion. If you hold to this then you will will first have to prove to me that 'kurios' is used by Paul to denote lesser deity or non-deity.  

I suppose Paul could have referred to both as 'theos', but this certainly could have been misunderstood as teaching polytheism. He calls the Father God, which He is. He calls the Son Lord, which He also is. But there is no grammatical reason to take the application of ‘kurios’ to Jesus to mean a lesser deity, or non-deity. The NT writers frequently used ‘kurios’ in reference to the Father and also used ‘theos’ in reference to Jesus. Luke, for instance, showed a remarkable ambiguity in the use of 'kurios' relative to Jesus and the Father. In fact here are 26 verses from the first TWO chapters of Luke’s Gospel where ‘kurios’ is used and the context makes it plain that it is the Most High God that is being identified:

1.Luke 1:6
They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.

2.Luke 1:9
according to the custom of the priestly office, he was chosen by lot to
enter the temple of the Lord and burn incense.

3.Luke 1:11
And an angel of the Lord appeared to him, standing to the right of the altar of incense.

4.Luke 1:15
“For he will be great in the sight of the Lord; and he will drink no wine or liquor, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit while yet in his mother's womb.

5.Luke 1:16
“And he will turn many of the sons of Israel back to the Lord their God.

6.Luke 1:17
“It is he who will go as a forerunner before Him in the spirit and power of Elijah, TO TURN THE HEARTS OF THE FATHERS BACK TO THE CHILDREN, and the disobedient to the attitude of the righteous, so as to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”

7.Luke 1:25
“This is the way the Lord has dealt with me in the days when He looked with favor upon me, to take away my disgrace among men.”

8.Luke 1:28
And coming in, he said to her, “Greetings, favored one! The Lord is with you.”

9.Luke 1:32
“He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David;

10.Luke 1:38
And Mary said, “Behold, the bondslave of the Lord; may it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.

11.Luke 1:43
“And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me?

12.Luke 1:45
“And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what had been spoken to her by the Lord.”

13.Luke 1:46
And Mary said:” My soul exalts the Lord,

14.Luke 1:58
Her neighbors and her relatives heard that the Lord had displayed His great mercy toward her; and they were rejoicing with her.

15.Luke 1:66
All who heard them kept them in mind, saying, “What then will this child turn out to be?” For the hand of the Lord was certainly with him.

16.Luke 1:68
“Blessed be the Lord God of Israel, For He has visited us and accomplished redemption for His people,

17.Luke 1:76
“And you, child, will be called the prophet of the Most High;For you will go on BEFORE THE LORDTO PREPARE HIS WAYS;

18.Luke 2:9
And an angel of the Lord suddenly stood before them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them; and they were terribly frightened.

19.Luke 2:11
for today in the city of David there has been born for you a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.

20.Luke 2:15
When the angels had gone away from them into heaven, the shepherds began saying to one another, “Let us go straight to Bethlehem then, and see this thing that has happened which the Lord has made known to us.”

21.Luke 2:22
And when the days for their purification according to the law of Moses were completed, they brought Him up to Jerusalem to present Him to the Lord  

22.Luke 2:23
(as it is written in the Law of the Lord, ” EVERY firstborn MALE THAT OPENS THE WOMB SHALL BE CALLED HOLY TO THE b]LORD[/b]“),

23.Luke 2:24
and to offer a sacrifice according to what was said in the Law of the Lord, “A PAIR OF TURTLEDOVES OR TWO YOUNG PIGEONS.”

24.Luke 2:26
And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not see death before he had seen the Lord's Christ.

25.Luke 2:29
“Now Lord, You are releasing Your bond-servant to depart in peace, According to Your word;

26.Luke 2:39
When they had performed everything according to the Law of the Lord, they returned to Galilee, to their own city of Nazareth.

If kurios is a weaker appellative and indicates non-deity in 1 Cor 8:6 then why does Luke use it predominantly in the early chapters to identify YHWH? It’s also notable that this word was used in all the NT quotations of Deut 6:4-5 (Matt 22:37, Mk 12:29-30, Lk 10:27), where it was directly substituted for the tetragamatron. Also refer: Acts 2:20, 21, 25, 34; 3:22; 4:26; 7:30, 31, 33, 37, 49; 13:47; 15:17. Rom 4:8; 9: 28, 29; 10:13, 16; 11:3, 34; 12:19; 14:11; 15:11. 1 Cor 1:3; 2:16; 3:20; 14:21. 2 Cor 6:17, 18; 10:17, 26, 28.  Heb 1:10; 7:21; 8:8, 9, 10;  8:1; 10:16, 30, 30; 12:5 ,6; 13:6. 1Pet 1:25; 3:12,12.

The truth is ‘kurios’ is commonly used to denote absolute deity in the NT. If Paul's intended conveyance in using 'kurios' to identify Yahshua in 1 Cor 8:6 was to affirm non-deity, then I am going to need some good lexical evidence of this. Can you supply some please?

Quote

Peter stood up and boldly proclaimed that God the Father MADE this Jesus both Lord and Christ. (Read Acts 2:36) If he were already God Almighty, why would he have to be MADE Lord?  Wouldn't he be that already? To go even further, take a look at the book of Revelation where our Lord is back in Heaven in his glorified state.

Hmmm….my thoughts: ‘kurios’ has a multiplicity of meanings. There are instances in NT scripture where it clearly does not indicate deity, but rather expresses the authority and lordship arising from and pertaining to ownership:

Matthew 18:27
“And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt. (cf. Ch 18: 31, 32, 34)

Luke 10:2
And He was saying to them, ” The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few; therefore beseech the lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.

And instances where is clearly does:

Luke 4:8
Jesus answered him, “It is written, ' YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD AND SERVE HIM ONLY.'”

Luke 20:37
“But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the passage about the burning bush, where he calls the Lord THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB

This of course is true of Yahshua as well. He Lord in more than one sense. He is THE Lord, an unmistakable reference to deity, and He is also “Lord of” something, a reference to His authority. Not always does it directly reference his deity. In this instance it does:

Romans 10:9-13
9that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.
11For the Scripture says, “WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED.” 12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13for “WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”

Romans 9:13 is a direct quotation of Joel 2:32, where the “Lord” is YHWH. Paul applies this to Jesus.

But not in these verses:

Romans 14:9
For to this end Christ died and lived again, that He might be Lord both of the dead and of the living. (cf. Rev 1:18)

Luke 6:5
And He was saying to them, “The Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.”

Acts 10:36
36″The word which He sent to the sons of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus Christ (He is Lord of all)

Lord in these passages is qualified, and are probably therefore are not a direct reference to his deity per se, but rather allude to the authority and prerogatives bestowed on Him by the Father as a result of His incarnation, death and resurrection:

Daniel 7:13-14
13″I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven
One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He c
ame up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14″And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations and men of every language
Might serve Him
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
 Which will not pass away;
 And His kingdom is one
 Which will not be destroyed.

Matthew 11:27
“All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.

Matthew 28:18
And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

Ephesians 1:20-22
20which He brought about in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places,
21far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.
22And He put all things in subjection under His feet, and gave Him as head over all things to the church.

Philippians 2:8-11
8And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death — even death on a cross! 9Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, 10that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father

Hebrews 2:10
9But we do see Him who was made for a little while lower than the angels, namely, Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone.

Here is another example of what I mean:

Romans 10:12
12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;

“Lord” is used twice in this verse. The first instance is a reference to the person of Christ – His title of deity. The second “Lord” alludes to His ownership by inheritance. He is Lord of all because He has inherited all – from the Father.

So the verse you gave me, Acts 2:36, which is manifestly post-resurrection in context BTW, is not a direct allusion to His deity, but to that which He inherited – the authority given to Him by the Father. That is how He was “made Lord” Seminarian. And we KNOW that Yahshua is Lord in more than one sense because He is called “Lord” in scripture countless times before He was madeLord (post-resurrection). Understand?

So again, you have failed to produce valid testimony against the doctrine of the trinity.

In anticipation of this objection which you will likely raise with me “Gee Is 1:18, if Yahshua really is YHWH why would he have to be given anything??”, this is my reply:

Philippians 2:6-9
6who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
7but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
8Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
9For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name.

Key points:

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
You say
“Jesus has a God because He is also a man, born of woman and born under the law (Gal. 4:4). As a man, if He does not have His Father as His God, and all that that entails, He would have been a transgressor of that law. Is His Father a man? No. That is why He doesn’t have a God, Seminarian. “

Then how does a coequal trinity concept stand up if
a person in God
calls another person in God,
his God?

Fulfilling legal observances does not wash here.

More patchwork required on this tattered concept drawn from the imaginations of men by men.

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
Your words
“I suppose Paul could have referred to both as 'theos', but this certainly could have been misunderstood as teaching polytheism. He calls the Father God, which He is. He calls the Son Lord, which He also is. But there is no grammatical reason to take the application of ‘kurios’ to Jesus to mean a lesser deity, or non-deity. The NT writers frequently used ‘kurios’ in reference to the Father and also used ‘theos’ in reference to Jesus. Luke, for instance, showed a remarkable ambiguity in the use of 'kurios' relative to Jesus and the Father. In fact here are 26 verses from the first TWO chapters of Luke’s Gospel where ‘kurios’ is used and the context makes it plain that it is the Most High God that is being identified:”

Now is there a Most High God within a coequal trinity concept?
If the Father is the most High God, and I agree he is, then are other so called deities not lesser?
Is Jesus another deity apart from God and also in God?
Why should God not be called “Lord” as He is Lord of all including Lord Jesus?

Sound doctrine is not built on fascinating possible ambiguities but simple truth. Darwin at least said he had a theory. Even natural scientists would require more clear evidence in their work dealing with nature than what you would offer as 'proofs' for dangerous statements about the nature of our most awesomely powerful and aware Creator Being, our God.

Is this wise?

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18
Your words
“I agree that Yahshua will always be subject to His father, but if you are asserting that the Lord always was subject to Him (i.e. before the incarnation) then I disagree and would like you to substantiate this, if you can. Can you point me to a verse that shows that the Father was also the pre-incarnate Logo’s God?”

What is the incarnation?
Was Part of God born in flesh?
Was Jesus a body from purely human parents filled with part of God, a person from God?
Or was God the Father or another “person”, the Spirit of God, the parent of the body of Jesus?
Did Jesus become subordinate to God and remain so forever?
How does this fit with equality?
The Son of God was sent into the world-what does this mean to you?

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18

The trinity concept does not need to be INvalidated by us.
It is not taught in scripture.
It must be validated from scripture.
Since it is not taught there this is impossible.

[Is 1:18]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 18 2006,11:43)

Seminarian, I'm happy to answer questions for those that reciprocate when questions come their way. I have seen that you were very reluctant to supply direct answers to WhatIsTrue’s questions in your exchanges with him, so I hope you will not be so evasive when it comes time for you to answer some question of mine….time will tell.

NH,
Read above.

[NickHassan]

Hi,
Heb 1.8-9
” But of the Son He says
'Your throne, O God, is forever and ever
and the righteous scepter is the scepter of his kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness
Therefore God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of gladness above your companions'”
Ps 45 .1f
“My heart overflows with a good theme;
I address my verses to the King;
my tongue is the pen of a ready writer;
you are fairer than the sons of men;
grace is poured out on your lips;
therefore God has blessed you forever……
Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;….
therefore God, your God, has blessed you forever'”

So the writer of Hebrews, the Spirit of God, identifies the words of love written in Ps 45 are from God.
They are written by God thropugh His Spirit to His Son.
He is indeed His own son and not just a son of a man.
God is not His Son and His Son is not that God.
God is the God of His Son.
God absolutely approves the actions and words of His Son.
God has blessed and anointed His godly Son.

[NickHassan]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 19 2006,06:30)

Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 18 2006,11:43) Seminarian, I'm happy to answer questions for those that reciprocate when questions come their way. I have seen that you were very reluctant to supply direct answers to WhatIsTrue’s questions in your exchanges with him, so I hope you will not be so evasive when it comes time for you to answer some question of mine….time will tell. NH, Read above.

Hi Is 1.18.
No worries.
Questions are not always asked to seek answers.
They are not posed to cause embarrassment.
Thet are not put to force others into a corner.

They are asked because they arise from the post.
They are asked to make everyone think more deeply.
They are just asked to make more clear what is indistinct.
They are asked to allow the possibility of agreement.

So we can walk together.

[Author]

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