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“There is nothing new under the sun.” That’s what the wise King Solomon said. There has always been preachers tickling the ears of the somewhat faithful. Satan is wicked. Satan takes YHVH’s word and twists it ever so little as to desensitize people, just a little at a time. And now you see the results in the church today because of years of men’s traditions, being taught as truths. Ecc. 1:9 and Malachi 3:6
I once heard a Christian pastor speak these wise words, “God’s Word is written in black and white.” “There is no grey area.” Several months later I asked that pastor to show me in Scripture where it was written, certain doctrine that he and many pastors teach. He couldn’t show me.
Hi ChipWhite,
I hope you found me here. I thought this would be a good place to discuss misc. topics. I also have a few things I need to get out there, and since this is our thread, no-one can kick us out.About Adam and Eve and their relationship with Elohim…
I was considering how the world was before sin came into it and also the story of hpw Adam and Eve spoke with Elohim in the garden, how Adam was formed from earth, and Elohim breathed life into him which is not how Y'shua or any of us were formed. We were born of the womb of our Mothers.Before sin, there was no need for a Savior. There was no enmity, to separate man from Elohim.
Elohim is plural in Hebrew and I understand Elohim to mean YHWH and Spirit combined. YHWH with Spirit. I believe YHWH is our Father in heaven. I believe Y'shua is Son of YHWH and was flesh and blood, with “one set of genes”, since His Father was Elohim.
With that all said, I was thinking out loud when I said Adam and Eve had a physical relationship with Elohim. I feel that way because they had not sinned yet. I think it is sin that keeps Him from us. Sin is why there is enmity in the world. That enmity is a separation of the Spirit and the flesh.
Adam and Eve had a physical one on one relationship with Elohim. They could walk and talk with Him.
Once they sinned, they were no longer pure enough for the Father to walk with them, as He can have no part of sin, for He is love. Now came the need for the veil that covered sin, the same veil that was rent when Y'shua died for our sins. So Elohim clothed them in animal skins. For that to take place, there was blood shed. That blood was spilled to represt the future Savior, the Messiah. Adam and Eve had to believe in this Messiah and except the fact, they were now under His mercy through His grace. Hind sight is 20/20. They knew the things Elohim taught them needed to be shared with their children, so that they too would be in His grace.
This is evident when you consider that Cain's offering was not acceptable by Elohim. Cain was so jealous, He murdered his brother. Able did fing grace but now he was gone. Eve was overjoyed when she was blessed with another son to carry on, since Cain was evil in the sight of Elohim, he could not teach the truths that we needed to be saved.
Finally, consider this: Probably every one of the 10 commandments as we know them were broken when Eve and Adam ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. I believe this tree represents, “Elohim's doctrine in a twisted form.”
Twisted because the fruit looked good to eat and she saw no harm in it. She was tempted by the spirit of satan which showed itself in the form of a snake. The snake ate from the tree and didn't die, so why not eat from it, it would only make her smarter right?
Satan continues this day twisting Elohim's commands, making satans way look good through deception. For instance: Sexual relationships Elohim says should be between one man and one woman who have a covenant with one another.
For years I was deceived to think that it was ok to have sexual relations without that covenant, as long as I was faitfull to my man. Since I quit that practice, I now understand that the covenant of marraige represents, the pure bride of the Messiah, and that adultry not only refers to men and women, but also whoring after other gods. This knowledge would have not come to me if I had continued in my sin.
Well enough for now. Looking forward to listening to you words again.
LaurelLaurel thanks for the post and I wish to share a few things the next time I post. It may be a long post so I will try to break it up into sections. I am in the word and praying about some things before I post so that I can make absolutely sure that I can get what I think needs to be said in it then we can take it from there. Thank you for sharing honestly and caringly how you feel I think more on this site would get further in their disscusions if they were more worried about listening and sharing than debating. So please be patient for my next post it will be soon. (Or I will explode because of the things knocking around inside my head from the word.) Give me a day or two then after I post, invite whoever you respect in the word to maybe glance with you, and we will share it all and maybe Elohim(God) will bless us. Untill then, may you and those around you be blessed and watched over. Chip
hi Laurel… hope you are well
given your view of Jesus, did he have a sin nature, ie was he born with a sin nature like everyone else born of woman? or, if didn't sin for these reasons (his own innate nature or the fact that he was born of woman), did he ever sin prior to going to the cross, or while on the cross?
blessings
Hey,
Y'shua was born with a mind that could be tempted. He was tempted by Satan, and He was tempted to walk away from His death sentence. He was tempted more that we could ever be.His faith was great, and He placed His wellbeing His Father's hands. He knew what was to befall Him, he prayed so hard for His Father to find another way, “to take this cup from me”, that he sweated big drops of blood.
He was taught from a small child what was expected of Him. He was surrounded with people who knew who He was and told Him so. His uncle was the last of the Levites in the order of Malectzedek and was murdered. His cousin John, would have taken that Levitical job, but he was beheaded, that left Y'shua, just like Scripture said it would, the Scepter from Judah to Joseph, in the order of Malektzedek. (Promises of Jacob called Israel to his 12 sons who became the twelve tribes)
Y'shua studied the Torah, His Father's Scrolls. He believed, because it was all around Him. And don't think for a second that YHWH left His side. Think of a good earthly Father raising a son and see that Y'shua had Elohim, to show Him about life.NO Y'SHUA MESSIAH DID NOT SIN ACCORDING TO THE TORAH GIVEN BY HIS FATHER IN HEAVEN. Y'shua gave us full understanding of it. Y'shua died for it!!!!! For His Father, for us.
Hello Laurel have been checking in from time to time am on my daughters computer we got her for school right now. I know it seems like I have dissapeared but went out of town for a week then had a project dumped in my lap at work that no one wanted on the senior staff and I now I know why so It has comsumed alot of my time I am about done just tweaking all the little things that come up but I still Log in from time to time at work and at home to keep up on the conversations just have not had time to research and attach scripture to what I want to communicate. So thanks for you patience I am still out there and I pray that God gives me the time soon to Post your brother believer Chip.
Laurel I have been surfing the site and I posted something in the pre existance thread that seems appropriate to post here although it may be a bit premature I will throw it out there after all it is our thread. In romans chap 5 there is a vrs 14 that says that adam was created in the pattern/type of the one to come. The whole chapter talks about how just as one man adam brought death so the one man Christ brings life. Now if adam were created in the type/pattern of the one to come what other person in history has been brought fourth by the will of YWHW/Father/God and without sin.(because adam was without sin when he was first created.) Just as adam had no father so through the virgin birth Jesus/Yashua/Messiah had no earthly father either. So is it safe to say that Christ is the one that was to come that adam was created in the (tupos) of that is the actual greek word in the translation.
Laurel please do not shake the dust off of your shoes when you have truth that you need to impart. Testing of your faith and what you believe is good. I have never questioned things I assumed I knew, and have never even questioned the scriptures. Now I am questioning everything and the reason I have not posted yet is I am still surfing this site and some of the things I have believed in have changed (for better or worse ha ha!) so I cannot post because as I study and read and question I am being changed down to my very core. It is great to be alive and seeking and hungry about the word of God again So whether I change or not to a certain groups opionion doesn't matter I still thank everyone on this site for the passion of thier beliefs even if I do not agree with all of them. All this testing has resparked a fire in my prayer life and in my study of the torah/word.(thats out of respect for you).I sinced some frustration on your part in another thread and thought I would offer a word of encouragement believer to believer.
Chip,
These verses are key to understanding Scripture. Not pointing finger, since I don't even know who is reading this. Just plain and simply we need to “hear” this before we begin studying the Feasts. I will go over to the Sabbath thread and give some Scripture about Messiah's death and resurection. His proof is key to seeing the importance of the Feasts.John 8:47
“He who is of Elohim hears the words of Elohim, therefore you do not hear because you are not of Elohim.”Jer. 6:10
To whom shall I speak and give warning, so that they hear? See, their ear is uncircumcised, and they are unable to listen, See, the word of YHWH is a reproach to them, they do not delight in it.Proverb 28:9
He who turns his ear away from hearing the Torah, Even his prayer is an abomination.Yeshayahu (Isaiah) 51:4
Listen to Me, My people, O My nation, for the Torah goes forth from me, and My right-ruling I set as a light to peoples. (The Torah as a light in the darkness)Job 36:10
He openeth also their ear to discipline, and commanded that they return from iniquity.Mat. 15:7-9
Ye hypocrites, well did Yeshayahu prophecy of you saying, This people draw near to Me with their mouth, and respect Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me. But in vain they do worship Me, teaching as teachings the commands of men.Then we see in Jeremiah
Yirmeyahu 16:19-21
O YHWH, my strength and my stronghold and my refuge, in the day of distress the gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say, “Our fathers have inherited lies, and there is no value in them.” Would a man make mighty-ones for himself, which are not mighty ones? Therefore see, I am causing them to know My hand and My might, And they shall know that My Name is YHWH!”
Now the next verse is huge because it explains why Christians and Jews do not see eye to eye.Yirmeyahu 17:1
The sin of Yehudah is written with a pen of iron, engraved with the point of a diamond on the tablet of their heart, and on the horns of your altars.If you know YHWH’s Word, then you know Rome is the pen of iron. You also know about the
sins of Jereboam. Let’s look at 1 Kings 13:33-341 Melakim 13:33-34
After this event Yarob’am did not turn from his evil way, but again he made priests from all sorts of people for the high places. Whoever he wished, he ordained, to become one of the priests of the high places. And this matter was the sin of the house of Yarob’am, even to cut it off and destroy it from the face of the earth. (Israel revolted against Rehab’am and appointed Jerob’am over themselves, Rehab’am assembled the tribes of Judah and Benjamin)We see that this is the time the Pharisees were appointed to be the priests, or at least that they became known as the Pharisees. And since we know Paul was a Pharisee we can safely assume that these falsely appointed priests were from Rome. We know that the Levites were supposed to be the priests. This we also learn in 1 Kings. Acts 23:6, 23:27 and Deut. 18:5
To understand the point of verses 33-34 we must go back at least to 1 Melakim 12 where we learn about Yarob’am and how he went against YHWH. We see two religious leaders. One ruled over Yehudah and Benjamin in Jerusalem, he was Rehab’am. The other was Yerob’am who ruled over the rest of Israel. At this time the twelve tribes of Israel were divided and spread to all nations.
Verse 12:19 tells us that Israel revolted against Rehab’am to this very day! And we see in vs. 20 that none stayed faithful to the teachings of David except Yehudah only. We also see a couple verses later that YHVH told Rehab’am not to go to war with Israel, that He would take care of that matter Himself!
In verse 31-33 of chapter 12 we see that Yarob’am made his own form of worship. He set up golden calves and made the Feast Days (the high Sabbaths)on other dates than YHWH commanded. He also set high places in other than Jerusalem and that also was against what YHWH commanded. They worshiped on man-made holidays. (Holiday = Holy day)
Please go to the Sabbath thread.
LaurelYHWH’S MARK
Exo 13:9 And it shall be1961 for a sign226 unto thee upon5921 thine hand,3027 and for a memorial2146 between996 thine eyes,5869 that4616 the LORD's3068 law8451 may be1961 in thy mouth:6310 for3588 with a strong2389 hand3027 hath the LORD3068 brought thee out3318 of Egypt.4480, 4714
Exo 13:10 Thou shalt therefore keep8104 (853) this2063 ordinance2708 in his season4150 from year4480, 3117 to year.3117 (ordinance=custom re. Strong’s H2708) (season= appointed feast re. Strong’s H4150) Speaking of the Festival of Unleavened Bread. *Notice the word “His” season.Deu 6:7 And thou shalt teach them diligently8150 unto thy children,1121 and shalt talk1696 of them when thou sittest3427 in thine house,1004 and when thou walkest1980 by the way,1870 and when thou liest down,7901 and when thou risest up.6965
Deu 6:8 And thou shalt bind7194 them for a sign226 upon5921 thine hand,3027 and they shall be1961 as frontlets2903 between996 thine eyes.5869
Deu 6:17 Ye shall diligently keep8104, 8104 (853) the commandments4687 of the LORD3068 your God,430 and his testimonies,5713 and his statutes,2706 which834 he hath commanded6680 thee.Deu 11:18 Therefore shall ye lay up7760 (853) these428 my words1697 in5921 your heart3824 and in5921 your soul,5315 and bind7194 them for a sign226 upon5921 your hand,3027 that they may be1961 as frontlets2903 between996 your eyes.5869
Deu 11:19 And ye shall teach3925 them (853) your children,1121 speaking1696 of them when thou sittest3427 in thine house,1004 and when thou walkest1980 by the way,1870 when thou liest down,7901 and when thou risest up.6965
Deu 11:20 And thou shalt write3789 them upon5921 the door posts4201 of thine house,1004 and upon thy gates:8179Rev 7:3 Saying,3004 Hurt91 not3361 the3588 earth,1093 neither3383 the3588 sea,2281 nor3383 the3588 trees,1186 till891, 3757 we have sealed4972 the3588 servants1401 of our2257 God2316 in1909 their848 foreheads.3359
Tabernacles the Feast began this past Thursday at evening. This is a celebration of the giving of the ten commandments, the landing of Noah's ark on dry land, and the birthday of Y'shua Messiah. It is also the time of year when Messiah will return as King. So we look forward to His return also.
This is the first year I put up a Sukka, or Tabernacle. The roof is decorate with 4 types of tree branches. We live in Wisconsin so we used apple (fruit bearer with a sweet odor), white Birch (no odor, no friut), pine (nice scent, no fruit) and oak (bears edible nuts, no scent). These branches are probably a shadow picture of different types of people. Scripture tells us that the original branches were temporarily cut off so that the unnatural (Gentile) branches could be grafted in. Also that the gentiles who are grafted in do not get “bragging rights”, for how much easier it would be to cut off the unnatural branches and put the natural branches back on.
The time is soon coming when the fullness of the gentiles is complete. All the world will have access to the Word of Elohim. When this occurs, the Jews and Israel will be made one again. The true and faithful witnesses of out Creator will be sealed and the heavenly scrolls will be rolled up. The ark of the covenant will come to surface and men will know that the commands still stand.
Still the majority will not worship YHWH. With much political pressure and a poor economy, people will feel the need to work 7 days a week to make ends meet. They will not trust in YHWH to be delivered. Family an friends will split up over their decision to worship YHWH or worship the political/religious system of the world. Most people on earth will not be saved, and one quarter of life as we know it on a world-wide scale will be destroye by war, famine, and disease.
It is time now to get cleaned up. Worship Him who made the heavens and the earth. Trust in YHWH not man. He is our Savior an our Deliverer.
Laurel
Quote (Laurel @ Sep. 30 2007,13:17) apple (fruit bearer with a sweet odor), white Birch (no odor, no friut), pine (nice scent, no fruit) and oak (bears edible nuts, no scent). These branches are probably a shadow picture of different types of people.
This is interesting. Out of curiosity, what type of branch is matched with which type of person?Laurel I posted but it did not take. so I will post again eventhough it is later. I so agree with the evil of this world of economies and politics being something designed of the devil to keep people from the Father amen on that sister. May you have a blessed worship time and may the Spirit and Anointing flow like rain for you and those worshipping with you. Your bro chip.
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