Greetings from VestnikRA!

[Stu]

Quote (david @ Oct. 28 2008,19:06)

Quote Hi theodorej The bible says that the earth has corners and at the alleged 'time of Jesus' You know, people today still speak of the four corners of the earth.  For example, Athletes came from the four corners of the earth to compete in the Olympics.  Today, it means every part of the world.  I wonder what it meant back then.  Perhaps the same. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/142625.html http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/four+corners+of+the+earth Stu, do you have anything real in your bag of delusions?  Everything, everything you suggest, it's all the same, all like this–something that you can take more than one way.  Even science articles contain that phrase.  Most people “get” what is meant.  Most people.

If I can take it a different way from you, what of the ability of your god to communicate 'his word' clearly?

The resurrection is allegorical. It is too absurd to be literal. Why don't people 'get' that?

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (david @ Oct. 28 2008,19:07)

Quote Re the dimentions of the ark, you can't make a seaworthy boat that long. They didn't need a boat, they didn't need a thing they could control or direct.  They only needed something that could float.

Who said anything about control? A boat half that long would snap in half even with iron bracing.

We have been through all this before, and you have jumped several steps backwards in the progress we made last time. Do you have memory problems, David?

Stuart

[charity]

I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no offense, but I have noticed the memory of Christians seemingly is Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations

sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions

said in all true

charity

[theodorej]

Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12)

I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity

Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached…

[TimothyVI]

Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 29 2008,23:49)

Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12) I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached…

Hi Theodore,

If God intends to damn people for not understanding His word,
why would He not have it written clearly instead of in such a way as to confuse?
Is it just a big game of hide and seek with the stakes being your soul?

Tim

[theodorej]

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 30 2008,00:18)

Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 29 2008,23:49) Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12) I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached… Hi Theodore, If God intends to damn people for not understanding His word, why would He not have it written clearly instead of in such a way as to confuse? Is it just a big game of hide and seek with the stakes being your soul? Tim

Greetings Tim…..I would think that it is Gods wish and desire that none should perish….God takes no pleasure in cursing the wicked…It is the huberous of man that causes the damnation….

[charity]

Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 30 2008,00:43)

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 30 2008,00:18) Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 29 2008,23:49) Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12) I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached… Hi Theodore, If God intends to damn people for not understanding His word, why would He not have it written clearly instead of in such a way as to confuse? Is it just a big game of hide and seek with the stakes being your soul? Tim Greetings Tim…..I would think that it is Gods wish and desire that none should perish….God takes no pleasure in cursing the wicked…It is the huberous of man that causes the damnation….

Everything is vanity

God dose not take pleasure in cursing people, I like that
yet All are cursed to return to dust, that is perish, and nothing changes, even down to a righteous believer, whom dose not rise up on his feet?
unless someone can reveal how Jesus kept his body after death and did not perish under the curse that be broke, and also Elias, and Enoch, escaping the body “perishing”
religion is of no use, and has failed after making a promises. even turning tricks.

for the curse was lifted in Jesus that all should follow after him, and the fruit of evidence is all remain to perish under Adams curse, in which can be tested for the Lie that people believe from the beginning.

[Tiffany]

It is the spirit being that counts, that we become after the physical. Do you believe that?
Peace and Love Irene

[charity]

Quote (Tiffany @ Nov. 01 2008,09:11)

It is the spirit being that counts, that we become after the physical. Do you believe that? Peace and Love Irene

HI,
That would be nice, yet Many are begotten mockers by a written gospel, and not having any spiritual Idea of the true Nature of Jesus, due to gospel cross roads.

1Cr 4:15   For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet [have ye] not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus
(I have begotten you) through the gospel.

What was the gospel before this was written as the gospel?
for it is this writing that rises up as an army, all begotten of Paul, to the glory of his arm, having used the knowledge of Jesus?

[TimothyVI]

Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 30 2008,00:43)

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 30 2008,00:18) Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 29 2008,23:49) Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12) I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached… Hi Theodore, If God intends to damn people for not understanding His word, why would He not have it written clearly instead of in such a way as to confuse? Is it just a big game of hide and seek with the stakes being your soul? Tim Greetings Tim…..I would think that it is Gods wish and desire that none should perish….God takes no pleasure in cursing the wicked…It is the huberous of man that causes the damnation….

Hi Theodore,
I assume you meant hubris when you wrote huberous.
If so then I do not understand how pride alone can cause the damnation of men, or the confusion with the written word.

Tim

[TimothyVI]

Quote (charity @ Oct. 31 2008,09:04)

Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 30 2008,00:43) Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 30 2008,00:18) Quote (theodorej @ Oct. 29 2008,23:49) Quote (charity @ Oct. 29 2008,21:12) I Know this sounds bad, and I mean it as no  offense,  but I have noticed the memory of Christians  seemingly is  Unable to indure retaining the prior context, I feel this this is due to lies as foundations sorry sorry, I encounter the same vagueness with all religions said in all true charity Greetings Charity……A profound observation indeed and I agree with you somewhat…..The lies are created by misinterpretation and lack of understanding….scripture ,by design,is intended to confound and confuse the learned and the wise….It becomes clear as you digress into childhood with your faith attached… Hi Theodore, If God intends to damn people for not understanding His word, why would He not have it written clearly instead of in such a way as to confuse? Is it just a big game of hide and seek with the stakes being your soul? Tim Greetings Tim…..I would think that it is Gods wish and desire that none should perish….God takes no pleasure in cursing the wicked…It is the huberous of man that causes the damnation…. Everything is vanity God dose not take pleasure in cursing people, I like that yet All are cursed to return to dust, that is perish, and nothing changes, even down to a righteous believer,  whom dose not rise up on his feet? unless someone can reveal how Jesus kept his body after death and did not perish under the curse that be broke, and also Elias, and Enoch, escaping the  body “perishing” religion is of no use, and has failed after making a promises. even turning tricks. for the curse was lifted in Jesus that all should follow after him, and the fruit of evidence is all remain to perish under Adams curse, in which can be tested for the Lie that people believe from the beginning.

Thank you Charity,
I agree.

Tim

[Proclaimer]

Quote (Stu @ Oct. 28 2008,18:42)

Hi theodorej The bible says that the earth has corners and at the alleged 'time of Jesus' it was possible to see all the kingdoms of the world from a high mountain.  That is not literally possible given the known geometry of the earth, for example the kingdom of Tonga existed then but clearly would not have been visible from anywhere in the Middle East.  The bible does give the literal human view of the time but in order to make it an infallible view in modern terms it has to be stretched allegorically, to the point where really nothing in the bible can be taken to be literally true with any internal consistency. Re the dimentions of the ark, you can't make a seaworthy boat that long.  The properties of wood as a boat building material do not allow it.  It really is that simple.  Of course there are also many other facts that disprove the Noachian flood myth as a true account. Stuart

Stu, if you put a circle over the earth, do 4 parts stick out? The earth isn't a perfect circle in case you thought it was.

Anyway, the Hebrew word for corner generally means extremity.

It is translated “borders” in Numbers 15:38. In Ezekiel 7:2 it is translated “four corners” and again in Isaiah 11:12 “four corners.” Job 37:3 and 38:13 as “ends.”

The Greek equivalent in Revelation 7:1 is gonia. The Greek meaning is perhaps more closely related to our modern divisions known as quadrants. Gonia literally means angles, or divisions. It is customary to divide a map into quadrants as shown by the four directions.

In addition, if you think visions are to do with natural sight then I can understand your post, but they are not. Supernatural is greater than natural. There are things in the spirit realm that you and I do not understand.

Anyway, why discuss such here. A more suitable discussion will ensure more readers who are interested in such topics.

[charity]

Stuart and T8, ??

Noah's  flood?
How did God get so much water TO BE HELD in the heavens having that water is….
held, STORED by clouds, clouds as furious as sea?
surely the earth could change shape with unsettled,  uneven distributing and weights of water  moving in such extreme to for fill? (Image flattened earth shape)
unbelievable amounts that are capable of covering the earth, to heights that would require oxygen support, where Noah's arch  supposedly is found.

What speed would the rain have to fall  to be for filled in the amount of Days?
Would the Largest boat in the world be able to withstand not fulling up and sinking with only five staff on board?

charity

[TimothyVI]

Greetings from vestnik turned into a whole lot of responses that should be in the “too hard basket”

Tim

[charity]

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