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Hi SS,
You say
“Again the Father calls His Son both Lord and God and the Holy Spirit inspires many many scriptures revealing the Son is one with His Father in every way possible.”Amazing the unity possible between two separate beings is it not?
Hi SS,
You say
“The Father is mainly revealed as the one God, the Son mainly as the one Lord and the Holy Spirit mainly as the one Spirit, these titles are used to show the distinct persons of the Godhead because each is revealed as God, Spirit and Lord.”So God is not a Father and the Son is not His Son and the Spirit is not His Spirit but all the words are only TITLES for a single multiple personality God?
Your argument there is with God Himself.
Peter said of Jesus in matt 16
” 16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. “
Jesus was excited to see the Spirit of God manifesting in one of his followers and praised him.
What would your answer be?
” You are God the Son, the second person of a trinity God”
Hi SS,
You say
“And indeed it was *MOSES* who wrote exodus and it was Moses that heard Yahweh’s voice and seen Yahweh the Son face to face.”No sign of the word Jesus in the OT.Speculation does not wash.
Moses wrote of the prophet and the Jews recognised this is whom they should be looking for, the messiah, not God Himself.
Acts 3
” 22For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.”
Jn 1
” 21And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.”
JN 4
“25The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.26Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
27And upon this came his disciples, and marvelled that he talked with the woman: yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why talkest thou with her?
28The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men,
29Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ? “
John 6:14
Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world.
John 6:14
Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world.
John 7:40
Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.”Jesus was no more his father than John the baptist was Jesus.
Hi SS
You say
“God declares himself as the first and the last with no God beside him, He even then says He knows not any God beside Him. Yet he calls his Son/Word both Lord AND GOD.
Does He not know his own Son? Who would dare to declare that He is calling His Word/Son a false God? What prophet was ever called a God? What Apostle was ever called God? There is only one God all other Gods are false they will be destroyed, I have already proved this using scripture.Yahshua is God because he is the Fathers very own word. He shares the exact nature of the Father.”
So because you cannot grasp the divine origins of Jesus you have decided he could never have been a son after all. Think again. Let God expand your mind according to His Word rather than restricting the understanding of the Word to the current confines of your mind.
This divine being was WITH God.
That does not make him or any other Elohim a false god.But he is not the God we worship. He told us to worship the Father, the God he also worships.
Hi SS,
You say
“THE HOLY SPIRIT AND THE SON ARE DISTINCT FROM ONE ANOTHER BUT THEY SHARE THE SAME UNDIVIDED NATURE FROM THE FATHER [ORIGIN].”So what happened at the Jordan?
Acts 10.38
“38How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.”Was Christ anointed with another member of the trinity by a third equal member?
Hi SS,
You say
“Now does the Father descend in a cloud stand before Moses then pass before him and proclaim his OWN SELF. Surely it’s quite simple to release that it is the Son/Word that proclaims the Father.”You have no right to “release” any more information into what is written than that which is already there.
Hi SS,
You can keep bringing your truckloads of inferences if it makes you happy but none of them compares with the teaching of the Word of God. No trinity god appears there.Hi,
We must be reborn from above to enter the family of God, to be sons and daughters of the Lord God and brothers of His Son, the Christ.Heb 2
10For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.11For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,”
and
“17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. “
1Peter 1
“17And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:18Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
21Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
22Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
24For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away:
25But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.”
Rom 8
” 14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.”
Hi KW,
We are adopted into the family of God by being reborn of God's Spirit.Jn1
11He came unto his own, and his own received him not.12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
1Jn4
13Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote We are adopted into the family of God by being reborn of God's Spirit.
I agree! I will also go out on a limb and suggest that Jesus is an exception to everyone needing to be reborn of the Spirit because he was born(conceived) of the Spirit and that is what makes him the Son of God and not a son of God. Nerveless Jesus still has two natures in that he has the sinful nature which is the nature of this world and the divine nature which is God’s Spirit. He chose to live by the Spirit and thus denied his own will as he teaches us to do as well.
Quote (kerwin @ April 01 2009,12:20) Nick Hassan wrote: Quote We are adopted into the family of God by being reborn of God's Spirit.
I agree! I will also go out on a limb and suggest that Jesus is an exception to everyone needing to be reborn of the Spirit because he was born(conceived) of the Spirit and that is what makes him the Son of God and not a son of God. Nerveless Jesus still has two natures in that he has the sinful nature which is the nature of this world and the divine nature which is God’s Spirit. He chose to live by the Spirit and thus denied his own will as he teaches us to do as well.
Hi Kerwin:Jesus is the “Only Begotten Son of God”. He was a Son of God under the law of Moses.
My understanding is that he was born again from the dead when he was resurrected from the dead. He died unto sin and was raised again from the dead. He was born again, and passed from death unto life.
When we are born again, we die unto sin, and are resurrected from the dead, and pass from death unto life. Water baptism symbolizes our union with Jesus in his death burial and resurrection.
Quote Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Rom 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Rom 6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.Quote Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ [be] in you, the body [is] dead because of sin; but the Spirit [is] life because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.Hi 94,
Jn5
24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.So was Jesus speaking of the future or to believers who would listen to his word even now??
John 11:26
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 01 2009,15:18) Hi 94,
Jn5
24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.So was Jesus speaking of the future or to believers who would listen to his word even now??
John 11:26
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
Hi Nick:We are saved by faith, but hearing and believing entails more than just a mental assent.
Love in Christ,
MartyNick Hassan wrote:
Quote So was Jesus speaking of the future or to believers who would listen to his word even now??
Jesus was speaking both for his hearers then and his future hearers since God judges each man according to what they know. At that time those that heard Jesus did not know of the new covenant because it would not be put into effect until it was sealed with his blood and thus they were not held accountable for entering the new covenant. From the time the Spirit came at Pentecost, and possibly slightly earlier, and beyond things changed as one could enter the new covenant. When things changed then more was expected of those that hear Jesus’ teachings. This is why Peter preached a different message than Jesus spoke prior to his death, though both spoke the word of God.
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