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Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,16:59) To WorhsippingJesus. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,10:55) Hi t8, John 10:38 shows that the Father and the Son mutually indwell each other.
It doesn't explicitly say this for the Spirit, so go ahead and celebrate, but it's a reasonable inference that Christians have made for 2000 years.
Tim
OK I am celebrating and I invite you to celebrate too.It also says that we can be one with each other and with the Father and the Son.
John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.So do we have a new Trinity, the Father, Son, Church; because we are one?
No it simply means that there is one God who is in his son and his son in him and in spirit we can be one too with each other and one with God and his son. Surely God can be in his people and is in his people. Does God live in you? Are you in God? If yes, are you God?
The point here is that God, the son, and the Church are different identities even though we can all be one in spirit.
Being one was never meant to be taken as being the same being. But Trinitarians desperate for scriptures to back up their stance have taken this teaching and twisted it to suit.
2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
t8Did God create all things through the church?
Is the church from everlasting?
Does the “sons of God” give the Spirit?
Do the “sons of God” dwell in each other?
Are the “sons of God” to worship each other?
Is the “sons of God” the church the sprit of God, the Spirit of Christ.
Can the “sons of God” be everywhere?
Shall we sit in the throne and be worshipped, the throne that is reserved for the Father and the Lamb.
Jesus is all of the above. You dont see a difference? Are you blind? Do yo make yourelf to be equal to Jesus the Lord from heaven?
So no we are not ontologically one with God. We share in the divine nature but we are not the exact replication of his essence.
The Lord is the Spirit. One Spirit, three persons, One God.
Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,14:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,12:37) Quote (t8 @ April 10 2007,17:22) Fully God, Fully Man. Hmmmmm
That makes him 100% of either, i.e., a 200% being.
But God is not a man and we know that the Father is greater than the son.
So if Jesus is God and Man and the Father is God only, then Christ is in one sense greater than his Father. Of course scripture doesn't teach this and therefore such conclusions are in the realm of mens heads.
t8Easy to make a statement like that without showing me where my interpretation of the scriptures I present are wrong.
But of course that is you way.
100% God & 100% man is the realm of speculation, not scripture. So I used logic against your speculation, not against scripture.
t8Then why do you call him God?
Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:47) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,16:59) To WorhsippingJesus. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,10:55) Hi t8, John 10:38 shows that the Father and the Son mutually indwell each other.
It doesn't explicitly say this for the Spirit, so go ahead and celebrate, but it's a reasonable inference that Christians have made for 2000 years.
Tim
OK I am celebrating and I invite you to celebrate too.It also says that we can be one with each other and with the Father and the Son.
John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.So do we have a new Trinity, the Father, Son, Church; because we are one?
No it simply means that there is one God who is in his son and his son in him and in spirit we can be one too with each other and one with God and his son. Surely God can be in his people and is in his people. Does God live in you? Are you in God? If yes, are you God?
The point here is that God, the son, and the Church are different identities even though we can all be one in spirit.
Being one was never meant to be taken as being the same being. But Trinitarians desperate for scriptures to back up their stance have taken this teaching and twisted it to suit.
2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
t8Did God create all things through the church?
Is the church from everlasting?
Does the “sons of God” give the Spirit?
Do the “sons of God” dwell in each other?
Are the “sons of God” to worship each other?
Is the “sons of God” the church the sprit of God, the Spirit of Christ.
Can the “sons of God” be everywhere?
Shall we sit in the throne and be worshipped, the throne that is reserved for the Father and the Lamb.
Jesus is all of the above. You dont see a difference? Are you blind? Do yo make yourelf to be equal to Jesus the Lord from heaven?
So no we are not ontologically one with God. We share in the divine nature but we are not the exact replication of his essence.
The Lord is the Spirit. One Spirit, three persons, One God.
Or is it one spirit shared by two persons. The only immortal everlasting Father and his divine Son begotten before all worlds in his exact image and representation; manifesting the invisible, visible?The Father sharing his omnipresent spirit and power with his son who he has given all authority and power to. His namesake inheriting not just the titles of the Father but actually his supernatural power, breath and life giving spirit; whom the Son then distributes to those who are abiding in him. The Gardner watering the vine which the vine then nurishes the branches.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:55) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Good Question W,
Since you teach there is one spirit God
and that Holy Spirit is also somehow
a person in God as well.Quote (Morning Star @ April 12 2007,06:12) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:47) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,16:59) To WorhsippingJesus. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,10:55) Hi t8, John 10:38 shows that the Father and the Son mutually indwell each other.
It doesn't explicitly say this for the Spirit, so go ahead and celebrate, but it's a reasonable inference that Christians have made for 2000 years.
Tim
OK I am celebrating and I invite you to celebrate too.It also says that we can be one with each other and with the Father and the Son.
John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.So do we have a new Trinity, the Father, Son, Church; because we are one?
No it simply means that there is one God who is in his son and his son in him and in spirit we can be one too with each other and one with God and his son. Surely God can be in his people and is in his people. Does God live in you? Are you in God? If yes, are you God?
The point here is that God, the son, and the Church are different identities even though we can all be one in spirit.
Being one was never meant to be taken as being the same being. But Trinitarians desperate for scriptures to back up their stance have taken this teaching and twisted it to suit.
2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
t8Did God create all things through the church?
Is the church from everlasting?
Does the “sons of God” give the Spirit?
Do the “sons of God” dwell in each other?
Are the “sons of God” to worship each other?
Is the “sons of God” the church the sprit of God, the Spirit of Christ.
Can the “sons of God” be everywhere?
Shall we sit in the throne and be worshipped, the throne that is reserved for the Father and the Lamb.
Jesus is all of the above. You dont see a difference? Are you blind? Do yo make yourelf to be equal to Jesus the Lord from heaven?
So no we are not ontologically one with God. We share in the divine nature but we are not the exact replication of his essence.
The Lord is the Spirit. One Spirit, three persons, One God.
Or is it one spirit shared by two persons. The only immortal everlasting Father and his divine Son begotten before all worlds in his exact image and representation; manifesting the invisible, visible?The Father sharing his omnipresent spirit and power with his son who he has given all authority and power to. His namesake inheriting not just the titles of the Father but actually his supernatural power, breath and life giving spirit; whom the Son then distributes to those who are abiding in him. The Gardner watering the vine which the vine then nurishes the branches.
MSThis is not the Holy Spirit thread but since the Holy Spirit is fully God then I will ask you to show me where Jesus who is the Spirit is begotton before he was born a Son.
And if you can, please explain the following verses that says the Father and Yeshua and the Comforter is One Spirit three persons and one God. Can you reconcile the following scriptures?
There is One Spirit!
Question for the Arian followers, (those who do not have a Trinitarian view).
How do you reconcile the folowing scriptures from an Arian view?
Rom 8:
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.1 Cor 3:16
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?2 Cor 6:16
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.1 Cor 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to *drink into one Spirit*.Eph 2:18
For through him we both have access *by one Spirit* unto the Father.Eph 4:4
There is one body, and *ONE Spirit*, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;2 Cor 3:17
Now the Lord(Kurios) is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord(Kurios) is, there is liberty.2 Cor 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus (Yeshua)Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?Jn 14:16
And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;Jn 16:7
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.As you can see these scriptures state there is the Spirit of God, Spirit of Christ, the Spirit, Spirit of Him, His Spirit, Comforter all gloriously united together as One Spirit, which Paul calls the Spirit of God.
When someone accepts Jesus into their heart does the Spirit of Christ or God or the Comforter come to live in them?
How many Spirits do they recieve? According to the above scriptures, Yeshua and the Father and the Holy Spirit all three persons live in us but by “ONE” Spirit.
Please show me where this is not true.
Blessings!
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 12 2007,12:47) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,16:59) To WorhsippingJesus. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,10:55) Hi t8, John 10:38 shows that the Father and the Son mutually indwell each other.
It doesn't explicitly say this for the Spirit, so go ahead and celebrate, but it's a reasonable inference that Christians have made for 2000 years.
Tim
OK I am celebrating and I invite you to celebrate too.It also says that we can be one with each other and with the Father and the Son.
John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.So do we have a new Trinity, the Father, Son, Church; because we are one?
No it simply means that there is one God who is in his son and his son in him and in spirit we can be one too with each other and one with God and his son. Surely God can be in his people and is in his people. Does God live in you? Are you in God? If yes, are you God?
The point here is that God, the son, and the Church are different identities even though we can all be one in spirit.
Being one was never meant to be taken as being the same being. But Trinitarians desperate for scriptures to back up their stance have taken this teaching and twisted it to suit.
2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
t8Did God create all things through the church?
Is the church from everlasting?
Does the “sons of God” give the Spirit?
Do the “sons of God” dwell in each other?
Are the “sons of God” to worship each other?
Is the “sons of God” the church the sprit of God, the Spirit of Christ.
Can the “sons of God” be everywhere?
Shall we sit in the throne and be worshipped, the throne that is reserved for the Father and the Lamb.
Jesus is all of the above. You dont see a difference? Are you blind? Do yo make yourelf to be equal to Jesus the Lord from heaven?
So no we are not ontologically one with God. We share in the divine nature but we are not the exact replication of his essence.
The Lord is the Spirit. One Spirit, three persons, One God.
WorshippingJesus you completely misunderstood what I was saying.I will explain it in a different way.
If men and angels are called 'theos' and 'elohim' it is not to be taken that we are the Almighty. Yet you take the same words and make it say that Jesus is the Almighty.
I am saying that you need to be consistent in your rendering of the words 'theos' and 'elohim'. You cannot just pick and choose the word theos and elohim as meaning different things to different people. If you believe they are applied to the Almighty only, then you need to include men and angels in your Almighty.
Do you understand now what I am saying. As you can see, I am in no way saying that we are better than Christ. I have never said that. Rather I am saying that you take the word theos when it is used in reference to Christ as proof that he is God, but you do not do the same thing for angels and men.
I am just showing you how weak your argument is and how your bias works.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 13 2007,02:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:55) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Good Question W,
Since you teach there is one spirit God
and that Holy Spirit is also somehow
a person in God as well.
Yes if there is one Spirit and that Spirit is another person different in identity to the Father, then the Father cannot be Spirit according what he teaches. Because even he would acknowledge that there are not 2 Spirits that are God.If Jesus were “fully God,” or God incarnate, he could have never made any other choice but to be obedient. For God cannot go against himself.
Jesus didn't have a choice.
Quote (t8 @ April 12 2007,12:11) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 12 2007,12:47) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,16:59) To WorhsippingJesus. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,10:55) Hi t8, John 10:38 shows that the Father and the Son mutually indwell each other.
It doesn't explicitly say this for the Spirit, so go ahead and celebrate, but it's a reasonable inference that Christians have made for 2000 years.
Tim
OK I am celebrating and I invite you to celebrate too.It also says that we can be one with each other and with the Father and the Son.
John 17:21
that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.So do we have a new Trinity, the Father, Son, Church; because we are one?
No it simply means that there is one God who is in his son and his son in him and in spirit we can be one too with each other and one with God and his son. Surely God can be in his people and is in his people. Does God live in you? Are you in God? If yes, are you God?
The point here is that God, the son, and the Church are different identities even though we can all be one in spirit.
Being one was never meant to be taken as being the same being. But Trinitarians desperate for scriptures to back up their stance have taken this teaching and twisted it to suit.
2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
t8Did God create all things through the church?
Is the church from everlasting?
Does the “sons of God” give the Spirit?
Do the “sons of God” dwell in each other?
Are the “sons of God” to worship each other?
Is the “sons of God” the church the sprit of God, the Spirit of Christ.
Can the “sons of God” be everywhere?
Shall we sit in the throne and be worshipped, the throne that is reserved for the Father and the Lamb.
Jesus is all of the above. You dont see a difference? Are you blind? Do yo make yourelf to be equal to Jesus the Lord from heaven?
So no we are not ontologically one with God. We share in the divine nature but we are not the exact replication of his essence.
The Lord is the Spirit. One Spirit, three persons, One God.
WorshippingJesus you completely misunderstood what I was saying.I will explain it in a different way.
If men and angels are called 'theos' and 'elohim' it is not to be taken that we are the Almighty. Yet you take the same words and make it say that Jesus is the Almighty.
I am saying that you need to be consistent in your rendering of the words 'theos' and 'elohim'. You cannot just pick and choose the word theos and elohim as meaning different things to different people. If you believe they are applied to the Almighty only, then you need to include men and angels in your Almighty.
Do you understand now what I am saying. As you can see, I am in no way saying that we are better than Christ. I have never said that. Rather I am saying that you take the word theos when it is used in reference to Christ as proof that he is God, but you do not do the same thing for angels and men.
I am just showing you how weak your argument is and how your bias works.
t8You say…
Quote I am saying that you need to be consistent in your rendering of the words 'theos' and 'elohim'. You cannot just pick and choose the word theos and elohim as meaning different things to different people. If you believe they are applied to the Almighty only, then you need to include men and angels in your Almighty. What do you mean you cant pick and choose?
If we didnt pick and choose who and what the words 'Theos' and 'Elohim' are applied to based on the context then how can you even claim the words apply to the 'True God' with certainty?
What kind of logic is that?
So then we dont know who Paul was speaking of when he said “the God, (Theos), of this world hath blinded the minds…”.
So he could have been speaking of a man or a ruler or an angel of God, right? Wrong!
I believe that the writters were very careful in how they used the words!
For Example…
1336 times the word “Theos” is found in the New Testament scriptures.
All were translated “God” referring to the Father and Yeshua, except 13 times for “False gods” including satan and the man of sin and man, and eight times Godly.
I checked them all. Not once out of all 1336 times is there a mention of any Angel of God with the word “Theos”.
Neither is there any example of the word “Theos” ascribed to a living man or king or lord of the most high *in that day* other than Yeshua.
Jn 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.This is one of the scriptures that you have a problem with. Because you say that you shouldnt pick and choose and yet that is exactly what you do. You say he is “A” god or he is divine.
John knew exactly what the word “Theos” meant to him, because in every other place the word is used for Yeshua, he used this word when he could have used another?
Do you think he would create this kind of confusion by using “Theos” in John 1:1 as well as John 20:28?
Why didnt he use “chrematizo, Acts 10:22, Heb 11:7”
or
“theios, 2 Pet 1:3,4, which by the way is used by Peter for divine nature and power, which you try to force this word to mean that we are equal to Yeshua or the Father in being. Yeshua *is* divine, “Theos”, not “Theios” which is what we share”, This word is found only these 3 times in scripture. Which describes his nature and not his being.
or
“theotes, Col 2:9”
or
“theiotes” Rom 1:20″
Why didnt John use one of these words instead of “Theos” in John 1:1?
Why didn't Paul or Peter or Timothy or Titus use one of the other words?
You talk about being consistant with the word “Theos”.
It seems to me that being consistant with “Theos” is exactly what over 500 Greek and Hebrew scholars did when they translated John 1:1.
So do you believe the Scriptures and the Apostles or not?
Quote (t8 @ April 12 2007,12:13) Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 13 2007,02:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:55) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Good Question W,
Since you teach there is one spirit God
and that Holy Spirit is also somehow
a person in God as well.
Yes if there is one Spirit and that Spirit is another person different in identity to the Father, then the Father cannot be Spirit according what he teaches. Because even he would acknowledge that there are not 2 Spirits that are God.
t8Did I say there were two Spirits?
One Spirit, three persons, ONE GOD.
Read the post and show me where I am wrong.
Line by line t8.
You have no answer for these scriptures do you?
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 12 2007,16:40) If Jesus were “fully God,” or God incarnate, he could have never made any other choice but to be obedient. For God cannot go against himself. Jesus didn't have a choice.
not3in1Read your Bible with open eyes. Jesus was sent and Jesus said “Lo I come to do thy will”. If you look at this verse it is proof of his preexistance, because it speaks of a body being prepared for him to come into.
WJ, thank you. I will give this passage in Hebrews some thought as I head to bed. I do not believe this is proof positive of pre-existence, however.
Adam is hardly comparable to an eternally pre-existent being. Rather, he was a created being made in the image of the One who created him, God. Adam was not “fully man and fully God.” Jesus could have no intrinsic advantage over Adam, or his qualification as Redeemer would be legally nullified. He was the Last Adam, not the first God-man.
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 12 2007,17:27) WJ, thank you. I will give this passage in Hebrews some thought as I head to bed. I do not believe this is proof positive of pre-existence, however. Adam is hardly comparable to an eternally pre-existent being. Rather, he was a created being made in the image of the One who created him, God. Adam was not “fully man and fully God.” Jesus could have no intrinsic advantage over Adam, or his qualification as Redeemer would be legally nullified. He was the Last Adam, not the first God-man.
not3in1Jesus is the second Adam the Lord form heaven!
1 Cor 15:47
The first man [is] of the earth, earthy: the second man [is] the Lord from heaven. Good night!
Jesus is the second Adam …….
The Jesus you believe in is not comparable to Adam. This is one of the problems that I see with this “fully God and fully man” theory.
OK, really off to bed now. These forums can become addicting!
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 12 2007,17:35) Jesus is the second Adam ……. The Jesus you believe in is not comparable to Adam. This is one of the problems that I see with this “fully God and fully man” theory.
OK, really off to bed now. These forums can become addicting!
not3in1Exactly! The first Adam brought sin into the human race.
Do you think another Adam like him wouldnt do the same?
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 12 2007,16:46) Quote (t8 @ April 12 2007,12:13) Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 13 2007,02:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:55) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Good Question W,
Since you teach there is one spirit God
and that Holy Spirit is also somehow
a person in God as well.
Yes if there is one Spirit and that Spirit is another person different in identity to the Father, then the Father cannot be Spirit according what he teaches. Because even he would acknowledge that there are not 2 Spirits that are God.
t8Did I say there were two Spirits?
One Spirit, three persons, ONE GOD.
Read the post and show me where I am wrong.
Line by line t8.
You have no answer for these scriptures do you?
That's close WJ Two persons one Spirit that is why Jesus and the Father are one..IN…Spirit.Jesus was as you and I, Flesh, The Son of man He called Himself. But not born with sin just as the first Adam. Because He was tempted but did not sin He was granted the full measure of God's Spirit.
Obviously if you lie to the Spirit you lie to God. The Holy Spirit is God. But is the Holy Spirit a third SEPARATE person?
Is the Holy Spirit (as Jesus) with His own personality?
The Father and Son and we who are born again have the same Spirit. God will be all in all 1Cor. 15:28.
Quote (kenrch @ April 13 2007,01:03) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 12 2007,16:46) Quote (t8 @ April 12 2007,12:13) Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 13 2007,02:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 11 2007,17:55) Quote (t8 @ April 11 2007,15:01) To Tim2. Quote (Tim2 @ April 12 2007,04:32) Hi Nick, All the persons of the trinity mutually indwell each other.
Tim
Prove it. Show me a scripture that says this.
t8How many Spirits are there?
God is Spirit! Is there another Spirit that we recieve?
How many Spirits t8. Prove to me that there is more than one Spirit in us or that there is more than one Spirit of God.
Shall we go to the Holy Spirit thread? Should we go to the debates catagory and start a debate on the Spirit of God?
Good Question W,
Since you teach there is one spirit God
and that Holy Spirit is also somehow
a person in God as well.
Yes if there is one Spirit and that Spirit is another person different in identity to the Father, then the Father cannot be Spirit according what he teaches. Because even he would acknowledge that there are not 2 Spirits that are God.
t8Did I say there were two Spirits?
One Spirit, three persons, ONE GOD.
Read the post and show me where I am wrong.
Line by line t8.
You have no answer for these scriptures do you?
That's close WJ Two persons one Spirit that is why Jesus and the Father are one..IN…Spirit.Jesus was as you and I, Flesh, The Son of man He called Himself. But not born with sin just as the first Adam. Because He was tempted but did not sin He was granted the full measure of God's Spirit.
Obviously if you lie to the Spirit you lie to God. The Holy Spirit is God. But is the Holy Spirit a third SEPARATE person?
Is the Holy Spirit (as Jesus) with His own personality?
The Father and Son and we who are born again have the same Spirit. God will be all in all 1Cor. 15:28.
kenrchClose.
But if you look at my previous post on the Holy Spirit you will see that there is “another” person Jesus speaks of, the comforter.
He uses the term “Another”. Study those scriptures closely and you will see there is “Another”, in fact Jesus said that himself and the Father will send the Comforter, and we know they didnt send themselves.
Jn 7:39
(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 13 2007,02:55) He uses the term “Another”. Study those scriptures closely and you will see there is “Another”, in fact Jesus said that himself and the Father will send the Comforter, and we know they didnt send themselves.
Hi WorshippingJesusParakletos is only used five times in the entire bible.
In Jn 14:16 and Jn 14:26 Parakletos is the comforter that God will send.
In Jn 15:26 Jesus will send the Parakletos from the Father.
Isn't it interesting that that which Jesus sends from the Father is the Spirit of truth? Jesus was the truth and is sending back the spirit of the truth.In Jn 16:7 Jesus is telling them that unless He leaves, the Parakletos can not come to them. That is because while Jesus exists in his human body, He can't send his spirit back to them.
1 Jo 2:1 is the only other time that Parakletos is used in the entire bible. John says that the Parakletos is Jesus.
1Jo 2:1 ¶ My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Parakletos with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
I think that it is pretty obvious who the comforter is. It is another spirit, it is the holy Spirt of Jesus.
And yes, Jesus can send His spirit to us, just as God can send His spirit to us. So I think that you are wrong in both cases when you say ” we know they didn't send themselves.”
Tim
Quote (TimothyVI @ April 13 2007,04:08) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 13 2007,02:55) He uses the term “Another”. Study those scriptures closely and you will see there is “Another”, in fact Jesus said that himself and the Father will send the Comforter, and we know they didnt send themselves.
Hi WorshippingJesusParakletos is only used five times in the entire bible.
In Jn 14:16 and Jn 14:26 Parakletos is the comforter that God will send.
In Jn 15:26 Jesus will send the Parakletos from the Father.
Isn't it interesting that that which Jesus sends from the Father is the Spirit of truth? Jesus was the truth and is sending back the spirit of the truth.In Jn 16:7 Jesus is telling them that unless He leaves, the Parakletos can not come to them. That is because while Jesus exists in his human body, He can't send his spirit back to them.
1 Jo 2:1 is the only other time that Parakletos is used in the entire bible. John says that the Parakletos is Jesus.
1Jo 2:1 ¶ My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Parakletos with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
I think that it is pretty obvious who the comforter is. It is another spirit, it is the holy Spirt of Jesus.
And yes, Jesus can send His spirit to us, just as God can send His spirit to us. So I think that you are wrong in both cases when you say ” we know they didn't send themselves.”
Tim
TimIf you study all the scriptures concerning the Spirit of truth you will see Jesus calls him “Another”. You can believe that Jesus sent himself if you want, but personally I think that the scriptures suppoort that the Spirit is another because of all the pronouns Jesus used concerning him.
If there is not another person, then who or what was the dove that sat on him at the Jordan while the Father in heaven spoke?
Did his own personal Spirit come and sit on him.
And also Jesus says the Spirit is subservient to him.
Jn 15:26
But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:Jn 16:
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he *shall receive of mine*, and shall shew it unto you.
15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.Will Jesus glorify himself?
Will he show himself things from the Father and then show it unto us?
Sorry I dont agree. There is One Spirit, three persons, ONE God.
Also Matt 28:19 supports the third person.
And this scripture is unambiguous.
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