- This topic is empty.
- Posts
I'm not going to “Engauge” you either. I know in my heart what is right. And, with that said…there is no need to further try to explain that to you because you obviously believe differently for whatever reason. Although, I do have a hard time understanding how the spirit of GOD could give me a different understanding than the one it gave you. Nonetheless…
We simply agree to disagree.
May GOD bless your life.
Quote (martian @ Nov. 05 2007,09:53) What does it mean to keep or break the commandments?
In order to understand this concept it I necessary to understand the Hebrew words themselves.
For the purpose of this discussion, I will be using definitions found in the Ancient Hebrew Research Center at http://www.ancient-hebrew.orgCommandments
“The word command, as well as commandment, is used to translate the Hebrew word mits'vah but does not properly convey the meaning of mits'vah. The word command implies words of force or power as a General commands his troops. The word mits'vah is better understood as a directive. To see the picture painted by this word it is helpful to look at a related word, tsiyon meaning a desert or a landmark. The Ancient Hebrews were a nomadic people who traveled the deserts in search of green pastures for their flocks. A nomad uses the various rivers, mountains, rock outcroppings, etc as landmarks to give them their direction. The verb form of mits'vah is tsavah meaning to direct one on a journey. The mits'vah of the Bible are not commands, or rules and regulations, they are directives or landmarks that we look for to guide us. The word tsiyon meaning landmark is also the word translated as Zion, the mountain of God but, not just a mountain, it is the landmark.”Keep –
“Many times I have heard it said that no one can keep all of the commands but, this is not true. From an Hebraic perspective of the word shamar behind the English word keep, it is possible to keep all of the commands. The problem lies in our understanding of keep as meaning obedience, but this is not the meaning of shamar. It should first be recognized that not all of the commands of the torah are for all people. Some are only for the priests, some are only for men and some are only for women. Some are only for children and some are for leaders. But, it should also be understood that even if a command is not for you, you can still keep it. The original picture painted by the Hebrew word shamar is a sheepfold. When a shepherd was out in the wilderness with his flock, he would gather thorn bushes to erect a corral to place his flock in at night. The thorns would deter predators and thereby protect and guard the sheep from harm. The word shamiyr derived from this root means a thorn. The word shamar means to guard and protect and can be seen in the Aaronic blessing, May Yahweh bless you and keep (guard and protect) you. One keeps the commands of God by guarding and protecting them. ?”Break –
“While the word keep, as in “keep the commands of God” does not mean obedience but guarding and protecting, the meaning of “break the commands of God” does not mean disobedience. The Hebrew word parar, translated as break, is the treading of grain on the threshing floor by oxen to open up the hulls to remove the seeds. To the Ancient Hebrews, breaking the commands of God was equated with throwing it on the ground and trampling on it. In both cases, keeping and breaking are related to ones attitude toward the commands. A child who disobeys his parents and is genuinely apologetic shows honor and respect to his parents. But a child who willfully disobeys with no sign of remorse has trampled on his parents teachings and deserves punishment. “?Another word that brings these ideas into more clearity is the word translated “law” in our English Bibles.
Law –
“To interpret the Hebrew word torah as law is about the same as interpreting the word father as disciplinarian. While the father is a disciplinarian he is much more and in the same way torah is much more than law. The word torah is derived from the root yarah meaning to throw. This can be any kind of throwing such as a rock or an arrow from the bow or throwing the finger in a direction to point something out. Another word derived from this root is the word moreh which can mean and archer, one who throws the arrow, or a teacher, as one who points the way. The word torah is literally the teachings of the teacher or parent. When a parent is teaching a child a new task and he demonstrates a willingness to learn but fails to grasp the teaching completely the parent does not punish the child but rather encourages and builds on the teaching. In contrast to this a law is a set of rules that if not observed correctly will result in punishment and there is no room for teaching. The torah of God are his teachings to his children which are given in love to encourage and strengthen.”It is still assumed that at least most of the New Testament was written in Greek or Aramaic, however, these were Hebrew writers writing from a Hebrew mindset and about Hebrew concepts. We see this Hebrew concept carried on is scriptures such as, Gal 3:24-26
24Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith.
25But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
26For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.The Law/Torah was and is a teaching tool to lead us to sonship. Because we can appropriate the blood of Christ for our mistakes, we can allow God to use these directions toward Zion as teaching tools to teach us how to walk with Him. The key is the attitude of the heart toward God. Far too often Christian leaders become “sin police” rather then promoters of proper attitude toward God. They concentrate so much on stomping out sin that they stomp out the hearts of the people along with it. They become hunters of men rather then fishers of men. After all, our sins past, present and future are already under the blood. Those that keep concentrating on them deny that blood. They need to move on the cultivating the hearts of men toward a loving and nurturing father that wants his children to learn His wisdom.
Hi Martian:Nice to hear from you and I am sorry that you are ill. I am praying for you. I want to thank you for sharing this teaching on what is meant by “keeping the commandments”, and I agree with what you have stated.
May God Bless you and your family
Does anyone want to testify about their FAITH?
Do you have something to tell? That the LORD has laid on your heart?
I know someone out there has something to say.
Thats why I can let the JW's in my house…or talk to baptists or people that try to argue to me that GOD don't even exist.
Because I have my FAITH rooted in the right spot. I know what I believe…what I feel in my heart. Not what man hath said…but what GOD hath said. I know GOD exists…his spirit dwells within me. I know Jesus died for our sins …otherwise GOD would not hear my prayers when I pray.
Satan tries to lie to us…and send false prophets to use to try to persuade us that what we believe is false. But the Truth is not in him!
Why should you be afraid of anything if you have GOD, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost on your side? I mean if the goin' gets tough all you have to do is ask for help…it says that he will not let you go through anything he does not think you can handle.
It all boils down to one thing…one sentence…
He that is in me, is greater than he that is in the world!
We all take some heavy blows…we all make mistakes…we all get knocked down…thats what the devil wants…is to knock you down…but not only to knock you down…to keep you down. If he can get you to the point where you say “Whats the use…I've messed up now…GOD don't love me anymore” Hes won. you have to keep getting back up …keep trying…keep pressing on! Thats the only way your gonna make it…the only way your going to ever win. Your not alone…he is with you always…even unto the end of the world. GODs not gonna leave you. He wants all men to come to him.
Your not saved…
Your being saved…
You don't just go “Get Saved” and then your saved and thats the end of it.
You might say “Brother Samuel what are you talking about?”
Ok…are you in Heaven with the Father yet?
I'll answer that for you…no you are not. So therefore you are not actually saved yet.
You are saved when you are actually with the Father.
Thats when you are saved.
Until then it is a Day to Day wake…you get out of bed in the morning and the battle begins. You and the devil…next round…the world we live in…the words the devil trys to put in your ear…the flesh your soul is currently trapped in…every thing fights you every day tooth and nail. You have to keep fighting…keep your FAITH…the battle is not over yet! But it will be one day. And we are on the winning side!
Hi Brother Samuel:
You say:
Quote Your not saved… Your being saved…
You don't just go “Get Saved” and then your saved and thats the end of it.
You might say “Brother Samuel what are you talking about?”
Ok…are you in Heaven with the Father yet?
I'll answer that for you…no you are not. So therefore you are not actually saved yet.
You are saved when you are actually with the Father.
Thats when you are saved.
While it is true that only those who continue in the faith until either they go by the grave or until the Lord comes for the church are saved.
My understanding is that if I am striving to obey the commandments and repenting when I make a mistake then I am saved. In other words if I am in the Faith, and I die on any day that I am walking in that faith I am saved. The only thing that would cause me not to be saved is if I start practicing sin wilfully after I have the knowledge of the truth.
Quote Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. 28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. God Bless
Quote (Samuel @ Nov. 21 2007,13:43) You are right… But what I'm really trying to express is to keep the FAITH.
Hi Brother:There is no one that can talk me out of my salvation, and based on what I am hearing you say, I believe that no one can talk your out of your salvation either. Some people claim to be Christians but I wonder if they have received the Holy Ghost. Otherwise, why would they still be trying to find out the truth that you and I know is a certainty.
God Bless you and your family brother, I am praying for you.
Quote 1 Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. 10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he that is spiritual judgeth F6 all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. 16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. Samuel,
If I came to your door would you let ME in? I think you'd see me to the door faster that the average JW, baptist, or even atheist. The difference is I know scripture both Jewish and Christian.
Your probably right…I would let you in alright..but I would quickly see that us having a conversation would be very much in vain.
I'd thank you for you insight and ask you to leave nicely.
Then I'd pray for you.
Quote If I came to your door would you let ME in? I think you'd see me to the door faster that the average JW, baptist, or even atheist. The difference is I know scripture both Jewish and Christian –towshab
No. You don't.
While on the topic of faith, I'd like to talk about the doctrine of evolution and why people blindly put faith in this orthox theory of science.
(I've posted this in the evolution thread as well. But I now think it belongs more in the “faith” thread.)
2 TIMOTHY 4:3-4
“For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the healthful teaching, but, in accord with their own desires, they will accumulate teachers for themselves to have their ears tickled; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, whereas they will be turned aside to false stories.”Although evolution if usually presented in scientific language, it is really a religious doctrine. It teaches a philosophy of life and an attitude toward God. Its beliefs are subtly attractive to mankind's selfish, independent tendencies. Many who believe in evolution say that they also believe in God.
However, they feel free to think of God as one who has not created things, does not intervene in man's affairs, and will not judge people. It is a creed that tickles people's ears.
Teachers of evolution are often motivated not by the facts, but by “their own desires,” perhaps a desire to be accepted by other scientists or the science community in which evolution is orthodox doctrine.There is no publication in the science holy books anywhere that explains how molecular evolution of any real biochemical system did occur. It is ALL BASED ON FAITH. Faith that there is no god, and that they are therefore not accountable for their actions.
Many well respected scientists just don't WANT their to be anything out there, beyond nature. The scientists are the gods of this world, (the “mighty ones,” the ones with the so called knowledge. But if it turns out they are wrong, then what happens to their position? Everyone knows how important position and prominence are. I believe that to be accepted by their peers, they must accept the orthodox doctrine of evolution–their holy grail, their “trinity doctrine.” If you do not accept this doctrine, you are not a true scientist, how could you be? So, what choice to any of them have, but to go on, perpetuating the idea of their faith, that there is evidence out there that molecular evolution happened, waiting to be found and understood, that their is a reason why the universe suddenly popped into being, and that those pictures of the horses with one extra toe really do prove evolution.The doctrine of evolution attracts many clergyman who want to appear wise. They are similar to those described in the apostle Paul's letter to the Christians in Rome:
ROMANS 1:19-22
“What may be known about God is manifest among them. . .His invisible [qualities] are clearly seen from the world’s creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made, even his eternal power and Godship, so that they are inexcusable; because, although they knew God, they did not glorify him as God nor did they thank him, but they became empty-headed in their reasonings and their unintelligent heart became darkened. Although asserting they were wise, they became foolish”
The question, I suppose, is how can we avoid being deceived by false teachers?
First, I think it's important that we demand evidence.The Bible writer David wrote:
PSALM 139:14
“I shall laud you because in a fear-inspiring way I am wonderfully made.
Besides the amazing design of our own bodies, we can consider the mathematical precision and order of our universe. David wrote:
PSALM 19:1
“The heavens are declaring the glory of God; And of the work of his hands the expanse is telling.”People have been studying the heavens for thousands of years. Half a century ago, they finally figured out the Bible truth of Gen 1:1: The universe had a beginning.
One day, I'm confident science will again catch up with the what else that scripture says: God was the one responsible for that beginning.Does it make sense to believe and put faith in something because a majority of people believe it?
Hi KJ,
Your faith seems to be going from
yes
to yes but
to yes maybe
to
maybe, maybe not..All because reason is not fully satisfied in your view.
Is reason GOD?The GOD of this world is here to do one thing. DESTROY!
To do that he needs to attack and kill your FAITH.So…having said that anyone can get on here and shoot what ever fiery dart that might wish to at me. My shield of FAITH with stop them. I am firmly rooted in what I believe and have FAITH in.
The Lord Jesus Christ the son of the Living GOD. My strength comes from the Lord. It is not me be…he who is in me that worketh all good things. All praise and glory be to him!
Now…yeah….the reason that I may appear this way is because I'm trying not to be engaged in an “Non-Christian” like argueement. Which at that point no one would believe that I testified from the good works that GOD has done in my life. Which by the way I thought I had it bad actually. I was just reminded today of how much GOD has had his hand on my life. There is people out there on drugs, murders, theifs, money problems, homeless, etc. And I've never been addicted or strung out on drugs, or stole things from people, or killed anyone, or nothing like that….I've never been homeless, and I have a nice job.
If all I have to worry about is my little bit I have things alot easier that alot of people do.
Another reason why I might appear to go from yes to however you said whatever you said. Is because, there is alot of people that I flat out do not agree with their belief …PERIOD But in order to keep things in the meekness that GOD would have them be I usually try to side step out of the way….and just let the fiery darts fly right by. However, if need be I WILL STAND very Firmly in what I believe and hold my shield of FAITH up and I assure you it will stop that dart.
Both of these tactics produce the same effect.
One just exerts alot more force.Does this make any sense?
Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
You are most absolutely correct.
I have my FAITH of GOD and Jesus Christ. I know what they have done for me, in my life I know they exist and are very much alive. And I have received the baptism of the Holy Ghost, and felt the spirit which is more than proof enough to prove what I believe.
However…Some people are more concerned with judging others and pointing out all the things they do wrong. It really pains my soul to see people doing that to people.
In the end FAITH will do more for you then you think. Thats why Jesus was always telling people of how little their faith really was….and if they would have more they would see greater works. I believe.
Hi,
The attacks on faith are based on demanding full understanding. But faith has never needed full understanding or the door would not be open for children. Instead it is based on hope founded in scripture.
Heb 11
1Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.Hope and evidence seem like oxymorons when you see them side-by-side, huh? Opposites.
If you have evidence there is no need for hope.
Hi not3,
Faith IS the evidence.
That evidence is stronger that any human measures.
Weak human measures may or may not support faith but cannot remove hope.Men think faith is of the head but it is rather of the heart.
Acts 15:9
And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.Romans 10:8
But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;Ephesians 3:17
That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,Hebrews 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
