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I see there's more than one translation of the Book of Enoch. I understand that the earliest was by Laurance in the mid 1800s. Heaven.net uses a translation by R H Charles Oxford. Why did Heaven.net use that particular translation? Is the translation more accurate? Thanks.
Hi Doug
Welcome to Heaven.Net. I hope the owner of the site will answer your question soon.
I would like to add another question in regards to the Book of Enoch. I am not sure if someone has already asked it or not but if Jude quotes from the Book of Enoch then why do we not have it in the bible.
Jude 1:14
14Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy onesHugs
PhoenixHi Phoenix,
I believe that is a quote from Jude, not the book of Enoch.
So Jude mentions Enoch. That means that he was worth mentioning.
But do we know that the book of Enoch was even written by Enoch?Tim
Hi Tim
Jude is stating what Enoch prophesied. So, evidently, Jude must have read that somewhere or heard it from someone. No where else in the bible states any of Enochs prophesies. Except in the Book of Enoch. So, in my opinion, they (or maybe just Jude) must have had some writings of Enochs at hand to quote from
Hugs
PhoenixHi T8
If you happen to pop in this thread I just wanted to let you know that… “I dont read well do I?” lol. I never thought that you might have covered my question on the website, hence Doug mentioned that he saw your link to the Book of Enoch.
Anyway, since I have read your page on the Book of Enoch now, are you saying that scholars today are still saying that the Book of Enoch is still forgery?
Hugs
PhoenixPhoenix
Based on my understanding and with factoring in my memory I hesitate to even respond, but from what I've read the book of Enoch was in use during the time of Jesus whether it was the same as the one we have today I don't know. When it came time to compile the scriptures there was something that the “power that be” did not like about it so it was left out and from what I remember they attempted to destroy all copies but a couple of hundred years ago other copies were found in Ethiopia where it is included in their grouping of scripture.Personally I use it to gain insight or expand on scripture but not to set doctrine.
Once again my understanding, based on my memory (not so good anymore)
As far as one translation better, T8 would have to respond to that and I'm sure he will.
My opinion – Wm
Hi seeking
I havent read all of the Book of Enoch but only the first part of it (not sure how much though) and I started to not like it too. It was starting to seem a little too scary to me so I stopped. Although I cant quite remember what I did read of it I am starting to think I might go read it again. But, Im thinking that maybe the book of enoch might show some hint of what the 'Son of God' actually was before he came to flesh. I dont know. Also, I remember thinking that the Book of Enoch shows us things in the Angelic Realm or the Heavens possibly which isnt really covered in the bible as much or as in depth as Enoch's did (except for Revelations). Again, I dont know. I am really assuming here.
My opinion though
Hugs
PhoenixPhoenix – I think you asked why the Book of Enoch is not in the Bible. I can tell you why. In the Book, enoch does a lot of talking about fallen angels. During the time that the book was popular (maybe from 200 BC to about 400 AD) Enoch said in his writings that fallen angels took the form of man and lived among them. So, the thinking was that fallen angels take a physical form. About 400 AD thinking switched and the thought was that angels were purly spiritual. Thus the Book fell out of favor and was not included in the bible. At least that's what I understand.
Hi Doug
Although I had the same thought you did, I dont think the scholars would have used the fact that it states the fallen angels took on the form of man as a reason to destroy or leave the book of enoch out. Why would they? Did they ignore Genesis Chapter 6 about the Nephilim?
Maybe I should just go read the whole book LOL.
Hugs
PhoenixEdit: On second thoughts, maybe the scholars would. Therefore making the Bible corrupted.
Phoenix – Good point! I could speculate on other reasons it was banned. Remember in Genesis 5-22 he “walked with God.” Perhaps it it was banned because Enoch talks a great deal about what heaven actually looked like. He talked a great deal about the landscape, about different landmarks and what their significance was, where the sinners and rightous would go. He even said that he spoke directly to God. Perhaps some of his writings fell in disfavor of the church and that was why it was banned. Who knows? I'm just guessing again.
My personal reason on why I believe it was left out was because the powers of darkness didn't want people to know what it told. It doesn't want men to understand that we truly live in “the matrix” (yes the movie). That we are truly under the dominion of principalities who move us like pawns.
Jesus sets us free from them, they can't stop that message, but they have done their best to make man forget why we need set free.
The early church fathers all believed it was scripture, hundreds of years later men changed their minds. The church then fell into darkness.
Hi Ms
Quote The early church fathers all believed it was scripture, hundreds of years later men changed their minds. The church then fell into darkness. You have a good point there.
I have just recieved an email from another person I asked and they said it was considered “Not divinely inspired” but the person said this decision was made between the Malachi – Jesus Period. Unfortunately I disagreed because if that were the case then Jude would not have quoted from it. Am I right?
Hugs
PhoenixQuote (doug02346 @ Mar. 29 2007,08:25) I see there's more than one translation of the Book of Enoch. I understand that the earliest was by Laurance in the mid 1800s. Heaven.net uses a translation by R H Charles Oxford. Why did Heaven.net use that particular translation? Is the translation more accurate? Thanks.
R H Charles Oxford edition was published in 1912 and given copyright laws, it is in the public domain. The older version would of course be in the public domain too, but the R H Charles one was the one that was more common.I make no claims as to which is a more accurate version because I truly do not no which one is.
Quote (Phoenix @ Mar. 30 2007,21:19) I have just recieved an email from another person I asked and they said it was considered “Not divinely inspired” but the person said this decision was made between the Malachi – Jesus Period. Unfortunately I disagreed because if that were the case then Jude would not have quoted from it. Am I right?
Hi Phoenix,
The Enoch reference is interesting:Jude 14-15
14It was also about these men that Enoch, in the seventh generation from Adam, prophesied, saying, “Behold, the Lord came with many thousands of His holy ones, 15to execute judgment upon all, and to convict all the ungodly of all their ungodly deeds which they have done in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”It's not certain whether Jude's reference was to the book of Enoch or perhaps an oral tradition started by Enoch and handed down through the generations – and the book later quoted Jude. There appears to be some reasonable lexical evidence that suggest the book may be pseudographic (a false-writing). I'm not sure which is true to be honest, but just wanted to bring it to your attention.
Blessings
Another view:
It is interesting to note that no scholars believe the Book of Enoch to have truly been written by the Enoch in the Bible. As you said, Enoch was seven generations from Adam, prior to the Flood (Genesis 5:1-24). Evidently, though, this particular quote was genuinely something that Enoch prophesied – or the Bible would not attribute it to him, “Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men…” (Jude 14). This saying of Enoch was evidently handed down by tradition, and eventually recorded in the Book of Enoch.
http://www.gotquestions.org/book-of-Enoch.htmlActually I believe there is a ministry that teach the Book of Enoch… called Second8thweek or something like that. Not sure. Have any of you heard of them?
Hugs
Remember reading that the priests that were gathered in Constantine's reign had thought that Enoch's visions were too “wild” that the book of Revelation was more in keeping with final judgement…. more easily understood….
Also remember reading that the priests really didn't think there was a place for it… That it 'certainly' couldn't be put in the OT, where it belonged and it couldn't go into the NT with Revelation, hence the exclusion.
Through years, I've met many that say if a book wasn't included in the bible then we have no business even reading them, let alone mentioning the names.
Of course I think that's a bunch of bunk…. If the Lord hadn't meant for us to know, these books and their translations wouldn't have survived.
Just my opinion.
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