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According to Genesis 5:23, Enoch lived for 365 years. But the fragment from the book of Noah near the end of the Book of Enoch says that Methusalah consulted Enoch after Noah was born to Lamech. If you do the math, Enoch would have been 454 years old when Noah was born. Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error?
Quote (tressyj @ Oct. 22 2007,09:54) According to Genesis 5:23, Enoch lived for 365 years. But the fragment from the book of Noah near the end of the Book of Enoch says that Methusalah consulted Enoch after Noah was born to Lamech. If you do the math, Enoch would have been 454 years old when Noah was born. Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error?
Hi:Personally, I do not believe that the book of Enoch is the inspired Word of God. That is my explanation.
God Bless
Quote (tressyj @ Oct. 22 2007,09:54) According to Genesis 5:23, Enoch lived for 365 years. But the fragment from the book of Noah near the end of the Book of Enoch says that Methusalah consulted Enoch after Noah was born to Lamech. If you do the math, Enoch would have been 454 years old when Noah was born. Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error?
I don't believe there is a god that could have inspired the book of Enoch.As for people living several hundreds of years, the next thing you will be telling us is that fallen angels begat giants!
Stuart
Quote Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error? The book of Enoch is not inspired, perhaps? Controversy surrounds it. I believe it contains many errors.
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 27 2007,23:17) No these giants were begotten from apes.
How tall are you Stu?, ( standing upright of course).
Hi t8Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Describes the same 100m tall giants as:
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 28 2007,09:32) Quote (t8 @ Oct. 27 2007,23:17) No these giants were begotten from apes.
How tall are you Stu?, ( standing upright of course).
Hi t8Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Describes the same 100m tall giants as:
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists?
Stuart
stuHow do you know their bones were not eaten by dogs or apes or maybe since the deluge was world wide they could be at the bottom of the ocean burried under tons of sand.
God is a God of Faith. You will never be able to disprove his non existence by science. Unless yoiu can look into every atom in every corner or place in the Universe.
Quote Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists? Well, I guess they just haven't been found yet, along with the millions of transitions.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 28 2007,09:40) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 28 2007,09:32) Quote (t8 @ Oct. 27 2007,23:17) No these giants were begotten from apes.
How tall are you Stu?, ( standing upright of course).
Hi t8Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Describes the same 100m tall giants as:
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists?
Stuart
stuHow do you know their bones were not eaten by dogs or apes or maybe since the deluge was world wide they could be at the bottom of the ocean burried under tons of sand.
God is a God of Faith. You will never be able to disprove his non existence by science. Unless yoiu can look into every atom in every corner or place in the Universe.
I don't think you read my post. For the giants to be present in Numbers they must have survived the flood. Were they so tall that they were able to keep their heads above the surface for the duration of the flood? Did they survive on fish?I'll grant you that having no evidence is no disproof, but you're the one making the claim without evidence here!
Stuart
Quote (david @ Oct. 28 2007,09:48) Quote Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists? Well, I guess they just haven't been found yet, along with the millions of transitions.
That's just what Darwin said! The only difference is that he turned out to be right.Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 28 2007,18:34) I don't think you read my post. For the giants to be present in Numbers they must have survived the flood. Were they so tall that they were able to keep their heads above the surface for the duration of the flood? Did they survive on fish? I'll grant you that having no evidence is no disproof, but you're the one making the claim without evidence here!
Stuart
The only real evidence to go off of is the stories that the ancients are telling…Ok 100m tall giants, sounds like an exageration… maybe 10-15 ft tall…
If you're going to take the story at it's word, these giants were breeding with 'human' (at least higher % human) then some of this height would be bred out, but on occasion even these days there are giants of men and women that are born… 8-10ft tall. One thing that's not clear is the exact timelines, I mean this crossbreeding between the 'gods' the 'sons of the gods' and the 'humans' could have gone on for thousands of years by then they could have been indistinguishable from any other human other than an unusual height.
I'm sure it will be brushed off as a hoax, but http://www.rationalistinternational.net/article/20041001_en.html
seems relevant evidence… I'd only add weight to this picture because of the claims that the site is closed to the general public.Quote (t8 @ Oct. 27 2007,23:17) No these giants were begotten from apes.
How tall are you Stu?, ( standing upright of course).
I like that t8
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 28 2007,09:32) Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. Describes the same 100m tall giants as:
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Who (a) survived the flood and (b) left no bones for archeologists?
Stuart
I'm not going to stir up controversy for too much longer, all I really am trying to say is that thousands of years ago, when these ancient texts were written (I'm talking the bible, sanskrit writings, celtic legends, greek mythology, etc) I don't think that the people that started writing weren't on in on a global fiction story that they could pass on the generations, they weren't writing about how to be good people to reach enlightenment, they were trying to make sense of the things going on in their time, describing them as best as their limited intellects would allow, and somehow world wide, we see some of the same traits :A) Stories of Giants
b) a reverence for snakes
c) A lost civilisation (Re : Eden / Atlantis)
d) A messiah that was born of a virgin, was a teacher, was crucified, and was resurected 3 days later
e) A war of the gods
etc.Now, that said, let's look at the first Genesis quote :
Genesis 6:4 There were giants on the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
A) Who were the giants? Where did they go? Could these Giants be the same as the Nephilim (I've also heard them called Anunaki amon other names)?
B) 'When the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men' : This statement says alot; god had many sons (Elohim seems to be an accepted name for the sons of God), that these were corporeal gods with corporeal sons, and they either found the daughters of men to be attractive, or they arrived with very few women of their own race.
C)The sons of the sons of god were to become men of renown; Now, this is going to be a controversial statement, but, if the story of the bible and other ancient texts is as I see it an attempt at understanding actual events, therefore a statement that the people blessed with the bloodline of the gods would be the men of renown, the leaders, the politicians, the ones that created and controlled the systems of politics and capitalsim of the modern world.
Now in Numbers :
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Anak = short form for Anunaki = Nephilim = Gods
Sons of Anak therefore = sons of GodMeaning we're still talking about the same group of people here.
The second part of this statement, 'and we were in… as grasshoppers… in their sight'. If you ask me, this sounds a lot more like a description of someone fliying over your head than it does of someone towering above you.
Back to the original question of did Enoch actually live to be 450+ years old??
I would say that it is plausible that, in time before the catastrophe, our natural lives could have been very much longer, or perhaps Enoch, who it seems was in the favor of the 'gods' / watchers / Nephilim had access to their advanced medical technology that I would propose they might have. Or it's also possible that before the catastrophe people had naturally longer lives.Regardless of the answer someone gives, at best it will be a plausible answer…
Hi bmanmcfly
Quote The only real evidence to go off of is the stories that the ancients are telling… What about actual skeletons?
Quote Ok 100m tall giants, sounds like an exageration… maybe 10-15 ft tall… If you're going to take the story at it's word, these giants were breeding with 'human' (at least higher % human) then some of this height would be bred out, but on occasion even these days there are giants of men and women that are born… 8-10ft tall. One thing that's not clear is the exact timelines, I mean this crossbreeding between the 'gods' the 'sons of the gods' and the 'humans' could have gone on for thousands of years by then they could have been indistinguishable from any other human other than an unusual height.
Or it is all just made-up stories for the credulous.
Quote I'm sure it will be brushed off as a hoax, but http://www.rationalistinternational.net/article/20041001_en.html
seems relevant evidence… I'd only add weight to this picture because of the claims that the site is closed to the general public.I assume you actually read the page, which explained why the photos were hoaxes.
Stuart
Hi again bmanmcfly
Quote Back to the original question of did Enoch actually live to be 450+ years old??
I would say that it is plausible that, in time before the catastrophe, our natural lives could have been very much longer, or perhaps Enoch, who it seems was in the favor of the 'gods' / watchers / Nephilim had access to their advanced medical technology that I would propose they might have. Or it's also possible that before the catastrophe people had naturally longer lives.Regardless of the answer someone gives, at best it will be a plausible answer…
It is only plausible to the gullible. It is myth. The archaological evidence of such a thing would be extensive, but the truth is humans have never before lived as long as they do today. The other problem with your hypothesis is that there is no trace that there was a global flood, an event that also would have left huge amounts of archeological evidence. The evidence that the dinosaurs were eradicated by a meteorite is the iridium layer around the earth, and this is not conclusive. The evidence of a world-wide flood is non-existent.
Stuart
Hi Stu,
Evolution is a myth.
There is no good scientific evidence for it.
If you value good science you should protect it from such inferential nonsense.Hi Stu,
Has someone proved Darwin was right?
Surely you would not offer us implications and rationalisations as proofs?
That is not any form of science.
But that is what is happening and others build on this sandy foundation and cast feeble stones at our God.Quote (tressyj @ Oct. 22 2007,09:54) According to Genesis 5:23, Enoch lived for 365 years. But the fragment from the book of Noah near the end of the Book of Enoch says that Methusalah consulted Enoch after Noah was born to Lamech. If you do the math, Enoch would have been 454 years old when Noah was born. Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error?
Hi,
Do we know how old they were when sons were born to these men?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 13 2007,09:27) Quote (tressyj @ Oct. 22 2007,09:54) According to Genesis 5:23, Enoch lived for 365 years. But the fragment from the book of Noah near the end of the Book of Enoch says that Methusalah consulted Enoch after Noah was born to Lamech. If you do the math, Enoch would have been 454 years old when Noah was born. Does anyone have an explanation or is this part in error?
Hi,
Do we know how old they were when sons were born to these men?
Did Enoch die?Gen. 5:24 “ And Enoch walked with God; and he was not; for God took him “.
What does “ he was not “ mean? That he just disappeared? And “ God took him “, does that mean Enoch went straight to heaven and didn’t have to die? Paul seems to agree with that thought, because he writes in;
Heb. 11:5 “ By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him; for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God “.
Enoch is only one, of a long list of faithful men and woman that Paul talks about in Hebrews chapter 11; but then he says something that seems to contradict what he just said in verse 5;
Heb. 11:13 “ These all died in faith, not having received the promise…”
Is Paul contradicting himself? Did he make a mistake? Neither!! Paul knew exactly what he was saying; he is the one that tells us in;
1 Cor. 15:50 “ Now this I say brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, neither doth corruption inherit incorruption”.
He also says this;
Heb. 9:27 “ And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment”.
And this;
1 Cor. 15:22 “ For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive”.
He also knew what Jesus had said;
John 3:13 “ And no man has ascended up to heaven…”
Does anyone doubt the word of Christ? When we read the account of Enoch we tend to forget what Paul says in;
Rom. 3:23 “ For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God”.
We are all sinners, and we all need a savior; when God took or translated Enoch, Jesus was a long way off. Paul tells us only after Christ’s death could we receive forgiveness for our sins;
Col. 2:13 “ And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses”.
Paul is saying; all these holy men and woman have died, but they are not forgotten;
Heb. 11:40 “ God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect”.
Could it be that God made an exception to the rule? NO ! There are no exceptions, there is only God’s rule, because;
Acts 10:34 “ God is no respecter of person”.
Heb. 13:8 “Jesus Christ the same jesterday, and today, and for ever.”
What then does “translated“ mean? One definition is: “To change from one place, position, etc, to another”. To me this means; from a position in life, to no position in death; from a place on the earth, to a place in the earth, grave. “Should not see death“ How many times do we say, “oh I see“, but we don’t mean seeing with our eyes. It could also mean; “should not experience death”. When we’re young we don’t think much about dying, we’re to busy thinking about living; when we get into our senior years, that all changes. We feel ourselves getting weaker and slower, we get more easily tired, we may even get sick and dependent, starting to feel lonely; your friends, if they are still alive, are just as old as you are and you may wonder; why am I still alive? To many sick people death can be quite an experience; and how often then do we hear people say; “Please God, just take me“. We may never know the reason why God took Enoch, but we do know why God took another man when his job was done, Moses. God told Moses to come up unto the mountain;
Deut. 34:1 “And Moses went up from the plains of Moab, unto the mountain of Nebo, to the top of Pisgah, that is over against Jericho. And the LORD showed him all the land of Gil’ead, unto Dan.”
v. 5 “So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in the land of Moab, according to
the word of the LORD.”
v. 6 “And he buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Beth-peor: but
no man knoweth of his sepulchre unto this day.”
Whenever we come across a scripture that seems to contradict another, we have to always take a closer look to see what it is really saying.Peace and Love
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