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Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:47) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:44) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:41) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:37) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:32) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:26) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:19) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:16) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:10) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,21:07) Quote (david @ Aug. 02 2010,18:47) Quote (david @ Aug. 01 2010,06:09) Quote Hi David, Sorry I had to crash,,,,back now. YHVH could be the name used for God (El) but not for God (Elohim).
–DBF
But YHVH is the name used for Elohim thousands of times in Scripture.
I went through the Bible. Here's what I found:
“Jehovah is God.” (Ps 100:3)
Expressions we find in the Bible:
Jehovah God–50 times
the [true] God Jehovah–4 times
Jehovah their God–39 times
Jehovah the [true] God–8 times.
Jehovah is in truth God–1 time
Jehovah is God–1 time
Jehovah is my God–1 time
Jehovah is our God–1 time
Jehovah your God–455 times
Jehovah our God–105 times
Jehovah my God–40 times
Jehovah his God–29 times
Jehovah is a God–7 times
Jehovah the God of–204 times
Jehovah a God–1 timeLiterally a thousand times YHWH is called “God.”
Quote Also, yesterday I spent the day looking at the words LORD, LORD God, etc. Most of the verses talk as if that YHVH was a Title like “Master” instead of a name. If it is a “name” then put a name there and see how it reads…without the context. I think you should consider a Bible that hasn't taken God's name out thousands of times. The word “lord” means “master,” and since your Bible has substituted the title “LORD” and also “GOD” thousands of times where YHWH originally was, it's understandable that you would get that impression. Read it without the substitutions and you will get a much different impression.
Also, “Jehovah” is used with reference to him more than “LORD”, “God” “Father” “Almighty” etc combined!
Quote It also seemed odd that if the Jews/hebrews so revered the name why did Moses and Abraham address him directly so much? Unless they realized their place and was lovingly calling him “Master”. Also, for a name that was so sacred it is used over 6500 times, wow!
Abraham and Moses were faithful servants of God who did the right thing.
The Jews who took out and removed Gods name because they said it was too sacred to pronounce were doing the wrong thing.
Again, this is what the Bible shows and how the Bible portrays Jehovah, as “God.” It does this specifically a thousand times, and not so specifically thousands of other times.Comments?
Hello David,David's shirt.
Is “shirt” the name for David.?
One step at a time.
Hi David,Gen 1:2 RuachElohim (notice that the words are together)
Word translations:
Ruach = Spirit
Elohim = GodTogether = God's Spirit
Step 2
The Professor
Hello David,Gen 2:4 YHVHElohim (notice two words together)
Word translations:
YHVH = YHVH
Elohim = Godtogether = God's YHVH
Step 3
The Professor
Hello JA and David,Elohim = God (noun, masculine AND feminine, singular)
RuachElohim = God's Spirit (feminine)
YHVHElohim = God's YHVH (masculine)Step 4
The Professor
Hello David & JA,Genesis 1:27 God (Elohim, noun, “masculine AND feminine”, singular) created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; “male and female” He created “them”.
Genesis 1:28 God blessed “them”; and God said TO “them”
(notice it wasn't just to Adam, but to “them”. When did Adam become THEM? After his operation….and Eve was already in existence, JA)Step 5
The Professor
Hello David,YHVH = male essence of Elohim
So, all of your quotes concerning YHVH are right on, as long as YOU understand the GOD references are to “El” and not “Elohim” unless you put YHVHElohim together.
Then that would be OOPS Elohim's YHVH.
What does your Bible put for those two words together?
LORD (title) God.
Step 6
The Professor
Hello David,Now for the final infomation concerning the feminine essence of Elohim
Elohim = God (noun, masculine AND feminine, singular)
YHVH = YHVH (noun, masculine)
YHVHElohim = Elohim's YHVH (male)RuachElohim = God's Spirit (noun,feminine)
Step 7
The Professor
Hello David,This should help in all of your references concerning YHVH and who He is.
YHVH, male essence of Elohim. Positions:
God, “El” or God + Adjective
God's YHVH
Father
Ki
ngStep 8
The Professor
Hello JA and David,Holy Spirit feminine essence of Elohim.
Positions:
Spirit of YHVH
Fear of YHVH
Wisdom
Counsel
Knowledge
Understanding
PowerStep 9
The Professor
Hello David and JA,YHVH has a “physical” body.
Holy Spirit has a “spiritual” body.Step 10
The Professor
Hello JA and David,SUMMARY:
Elohim = God (noun, masculine and feminine, singular)
YHVH = masculine essence of Elohim
El = God (noun, masculine, singular)
(Holy) Spirit = feminine essence of ElohimYHVH = God (El); God + Adjective
YHVHElohim = God's YHVH
YHVH has a physical body.
YHVH's positions: God, Father, King, God's (Elohim's) YHVH
YHVH = LORDHoly Spirit is spirit.
Positions: Spirit of YHVH, Fear of YHVH, Power, Counsel, Knowledge, Understanding, Wisdom.When disagreeing please put which step you are referring to and it will be easier to address.
Thanks,
The Professor
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,05:50) Hi Ed, Elohim is spelled with ee only with you and your numbers.
i = hebrew yud (consonant, and not a vowel.
E = 5 L=12 O=15 H=8 I=9 M=13 = 62
There I've done it and used your numbers….
Hi DBF,ĔL-ō-Hêêm(63) = YHVH(63)
Hebrew #430 <– Click on Link (Prob.18:13 / 1Thess.5:21)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Aug. 02 2010,22:14) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,05:50) Hi Ed, Elohim is spelled with ee only with you and your numbers.
i = hebrew yud (consonant, and not a vowel.
E = 5 L=12 O=15 H=8 I=9 M=13 = 62
There I've done it and used your numbers….
Hi DBF,ĔL-ō-Hêêm(63) = YHVH(63)
Hebrew #430 <– Click on Link (Prob.18:13 / 1Thess.5:21)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed,lol
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,22:20) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 02 2010,22:14) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,05:50) Hi Ed, Elohim is spelled with ee only with you and your numbers.
i = hebrew yud (consonant, and not a vowel.
E = 5 L=12 O=15 H=8 I=9 M=13 = 62
There I've done it and used your numbers….
Hi DBF,ĔL-ō-Hêêm(63) = YHVH(63)
Hebrew #430 <– Click on Link (Prob.18:13 / 1Thess.5:21)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed,lol
430. 'elohiym (el-o-heem') = 79el-o-heem' is the pronunciation guide
'elohiym is the translitertion and should've been used
how many points is an apostrophe?While on the subject, YHVH with vowel points is Y”e” h”o” v”a”hh. (blb.org)
But you knew that.
Quote Hi JA, and David, I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts:
Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular)
If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
I'll respond to other issues but I want to keep this short and to the point.
Let the people know what you don't like about the word and how it is constructed. With no philosophical input from an educator.
The Professor
Hi DBF.
I have never argued that I don't like the word “Elohim” or the way it's put together, if that is what you're saying.
But now that you've brought it up, how do we know that this is true?
Quote I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts: Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Some research shows me that it is probably true that Elohim comes from the base of Eloah, but many others have argued that it came from El and that Eloah was just a rare alternative, which occurs mostly in the older book of Job. I don't know either way. Could you provide some research on this?
Quote Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular) If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
Everything Ive read says that Elohim can be plural (indicating many gods) or singular (indicating the mighty and true God.)
That's how Hebrew works. It's different than most languages in that respect. (If tree is shown in plural it could just as easily be a large tree.)Quote Hello David and JA, YHVH has a “physical” body.
Holy Spirit has a “spiritual” body.When you say “physical” do you mean “physical” as in that which is material?
I just wonder what you think of Jehovah repeatedly being called “Father”?
Also, he is repeatedly (a few times at least) called the “husbandly owner” or “husbandly master [Lord]” of Israel.
Is 54:5; Jer 314; 31:32The same scripture we've considered before when looking at God's name for example:
ISAIAH 54:5
““For your Grand Maker is your husbandly owner, Jehovah of armies being his name; and the Holy One of Israel is your Repurchaser. The God of the whole earth he will be called.”DBF, what do you make of God inspiring his writers to write that he is our “Father” and that he was symbolically a “husband” to Israel.
He did not choose to be called “mother” or “wife” did he? Does this count for anything?
Also,
Quote Someone tried to say that the “US” in those verses is the Father and Jesus….but again the verse says male AND female; which one is the female? –davidbfun
So, DBF, do you think that God and Jesus in heaven have all the parts that we do. You seem to think that us being created in God's image, means physical image, as opposed to us being created with godly attributes. If you look at this physically, then let me ask you:
Does God use have literal ears that he uses to hear like we do?
Does God have literal eyes like we do that let's him see light?
Does God have literal fingers that help him to move things around?
Does he have reproductive organs? Does he have a stomach? Does he have lungs that help him breath?When we are told that he wears a crown or sits on a throne, it is to convey a thought, that of authority. When we are told of his “arm” or his “finger” it is refernce to his holy spirit, which he uses to accomplish his will. (He does not literally need an arm to pick things up.)
For the sake of understanding, we are given ideas that help us understand his glory, etc. In one account, his holy spirit is called his finger. This is for the sake of understanding.
He does not need the sound waves to travel to his ear and have his eardrum bones vibrate in order for him to hear you. That is ridiculous.
You act as though God were a man.
Us being created in his image means we were given godly attributes, the ability to love, to show wisdom, to be patient, to reason, etc. The animals were not created in his image. Look at the verse in context.
Also:
Image: to draw a likeness; to describe; to reflect; to picture in the mind.
Can it not be said that we “reflect” God in ways that animals don't?
Image does not have to mean “exact physical form.”Quote YHVH could be the name used for God (El) but not for God (Elohim). I just checked my very first example in the list of 1000.
Psalm 100:3: “Yahweh hu Elohim.” “Jehovah himself [is] God.”
How do you explain this?
I just checked a second verse: Jer 10:10: “Jehovah is in truth God.”
It's actually: “Yahweh Elohim emet,” or “Jehovah God is the true.” Turning that into normal English grammar: “Jehovah is the true God.”david
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,14:29) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,22:20) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 02 2010,22:14) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,05:50) Hi Ed, Elohim is spelled with ee only with you and your numbers.
i = hebrew yud (consonant, and not a vowel.
E = 5 L=12 O=15 H=8 I=9 M=13 = 62
There I've done it and used your numbers….
Hi DBF,ĔL-ō-Hêêm(63) = YHVH(63)
Hebrew #430 <– Click on Link (Prob.18:13 / 1Thess.5:21)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed,lol
430. 'elohiym (el-o-heem') = 79el-o-heem' is the pronunciation guide
'elohiym is the translitertion and should've been used
how many points is an apostrophe?While on the subject, YHVH with vowel points is Y”e” h”o” v”a”hh. (blb.org)
But you knew that.
Hi David,Do you look for faults in others as well? (Matt.7:1-5)
Ed, could we please call him DBF, or DavidBF, or Professor?
(I spent a good 3 seconds being confused and frustrated at you for posting that to me.)
David.
David,
'Husband' means 'to look after and care for, to provide for'.
Man was to 'Husband' the animals. Of course, this has nothing to do with 'sexual relationship'. It is a 'management' relationship.
A man 'husbands' his wife, provides and cares for her.
God 'husbands' the nations, provides and cares for them.
In terms of being called 'Father', this means that the He is their 'creator', the one that brought them forth.
All the angels of Heaven are 'Sons of God' because God brought them forth and His Spirit is in them.
Adam was created 'Son of God' through the Holy Spirit and therefore God was his Father. But he lost that privilege when he sinned, and became no more 'son of God'. This also disenfranchised mankind from God, so mankind is currently not 'Sons of God' but 'Sons of Man'.
Jesus was born 'Son of God' through the Holy Spirit and remained 'Son of God' to his death on the cross. He was raised again from the dead and was 'begotten' Son of God once again having triumphed over both sin and death, thus paving the way for mankind to become 'Sons of God' if individuals 'lay off their fleshly life and take on a spiritual life in God through Christ'.
Jesus always called God, 'Father'. And this is to emphasise Jesus' lesser position as Son of God and is reverentially respectful in that it places God as Father, husbander of him, his provider and carer, in Power, authority and Spirit.
Quote (david @ Aug. 02 2010,17:53) Ed, could we please call him DBF, or DavidBF, or Professor? (I spent a good 3 seconds being confused and frustrated at you for posting that to me.)
David.
Hi david,Is it to hard for you to look up at the quote?
Would you rather I call 'you' 'david' to make a distinction?Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:27) Quote Hi JA, and David, I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts:
Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular)
If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
I'll respond to other issues but I want to keep this short and to the point.
Let the people know what you don't like about the word and how it is constructed. With no philosophical input from an educator.
The Professor
Hi DBF.
I have never argued that I don't like the word “Elohim” or the way it's put together, if that is what you're saying.
But now that you've brought it up, how do we know that this is true?
Quote I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts: Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Some research shows me that it is probably true that Elohim comes from the base of Eloah, but many others have argued that it came from El and that Eloah was just a rare alternative, which occurs mostly in the older book of Job. I don't know either way. Could you provide some research on this?
Quote Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular) If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
Everything Ive read says that Elohim can be plural (indicating many gods) or singular (indicating the mighty and true God.)
That's how Hebrew works. It's different than most languages in that respect. (If tree is shown in plural it could just as easily be a large tree.)
Hello David,Eloh and Eloah are different…and a different topic.
The Hebrew language says what each word is, not the Bible.
El is the generic root; God (noun, masc)
Eloh is God (noun, fem)ot = fem, plural ending
im = masc, plural endingIt is ironic that they don't use Elim for gods or Elohot which would be the correct usage but they use a “wrong” “rare” combination Elohim.
Another thread discussed the “Majestic Plural” aspect of the word. Me, I am just saying the basics of the two parts.
In another post I gave you the Scriptures showing the two essences existing separately.
If you have a predisposition to believe one way because of “Church Teachings” feel free to say so. Biases always influence how we choose to look at Scripture. Before when I adhered to the Trinity Doctrine I placed everything I read in that vein.
Something new or different will always be discarded at first, which is understandable.
And since you like to think out a concept and then twist them around in your mind, mull them over again and rearrange your thoughts again (which is good) and see how they fit into your theology that is super…then you are sure in your mind of what the facts are.
Truth is another Thread and Category.
If you allow yourself to see the possibility of Elohim being God Most High as an umbrella and under Him being “YHVH and Spirit” then you will be able to think on your own concerning the Bible and not need any church to do your thinking for you. Nor will you argue their philosophy but have your own; based only on the Bible.
The Professor
Quote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:27) Quote Hi JA, and David, I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts:
Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular)
If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
I'll respond to other issues but I want to keep this short and to the point.
Let the people know what you don't like about the word and how it is constructed. With no philosophical input from an educator.
The Professor
Hi DBF.
I have never argued that I don't like the word “Elohim” or the way it's put together, if that is what you're saying.
But now that you've brought it up, how do we know that this is true?
Quote I put out that Elohim is composed of two parts: Eloh = base (noun, feminine)
im = ending (noun, masc, plural)Some research shows me that it is probably true that Elohim comes from the base of Eloah, but many others have argued that it came from El and that Eloah was just a rare alternative, which occurs mostly in the older book of Job. I don't know either way. Could you provide some research on this?
Quote Together = Elohim (noun, masc & fem, singular) If God were ONLY singular they could and do use El (noun, masc, singular).
Everything Ive read says that Elohim can be plural (indicating many gods) or singular (indicating the mighty and true God.)
That's how Hebrew works. It's different than most languages in that respect. (If tree is shown in plural it could just as easily be a large tree.)
Hello David,In another post you addressed how you learned French and didn't like the arbitrariness of gender being attached to nouns. This post only addresses what the Hebrew word Elohim consists of.
You are right about “elohim” referring to gods. Notice the only time it is “singular” is when it is referring to The Supreme Being, God, and that is what this Thread is all about.
That is why I put my comment in how I thought that Elohim is the NAME of this Supreme Being to distinguish Himself from all other “gods”….as if there were a comparison
I like how this one word encompasses both masc and fem “gods” and addresses them altogether regardless of gender as it includes BOTH genders and doesn't single out one over the other.
The Professor
Quote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:34) Quote Hello David and JA, YHVH has a “physical” body.
Holy Spirit has a “spiritual” body.When you say “physical” do you mean “physical” as in that which is material?
Hello David,Yes I do mean a physical, material body. YHVH is seen in Genesis 3 walking, talking, killing an animal and then covering Adam and Eve, receiving tithes and sacrifices (Priestly duties) from Cain and Abel, etc. He also is a King and sits on a physical throne. He also is Father to the son of God and taught His son everything to say and do before He sent him as a gift of Salvation to the world.
This is why it is important to realize the TWO essences of Elohim.
Elohim and Holy Spirit are spirit so when the Bible says that no one has seen God, this aspect is true. And then when YHVHElohim is physically present as you pointed out so well, in the many Scriptures, that is true, too. One truth, does not negate the other truth.
What may seem to be a contradiction really isn't especially when you can see the different functions of YHVH and Spirit within the one God (Elohim).
The Professor
Quote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:47) I just wonder what you think of Jehovah repeatedly being called “Father”? Also, he is repeatedly (a few times at least) called the “husbandly owner” or “husbandly master [Lord]” of Israel.
Is 54:5; Jer 314; 31:32The same scripture we've considered before when looking at God's name for example:
ISAIAH 54:5
““For your Grand Maker is your husbandly owner, Jehovah of armies being his name; and the Holy One of Israel is your Repurchaser. The God of the whole earth he will be called.”DBF, what do you make of God inspiring his writers to write that he is our “Father” and that he was symbolically a “husband” to Israel.
He did not choose to be called “mother” or “wife” did he? Does this count for anything?
Also,
Quote Someone tried to say that the “US” in those verses is the Father and Jesus….but again the verse says male AND female; which one is the female? –davidbfun
So, DBF, do you think that God and Jesus in heaven have all the parts that we do. You seem to think that us being created in God's image, means physical image, as opposed to us being created with godly attributes. If you look at this physically, then let me ask you:
Does God use have literal ears that he uses to hear like we do?
Does God have literal eyes like we do that let's him see light?
Does God have literal fingers that help him to move things around?
Does he have reproductive organs? Does he have a stomach? Does he have lungs that help him breath?When we are told that he wears a crown or sits on a throne, it is to convey a thought, that of authority. When we are told of his “arm” or his “finger” it is refernce to his holy spirit, which he uses to accomplish his will. (He does not literally need an arm to pick things up.)
For the sake of understanding, we are given ideas that help us understand his glory, etc. In one account, his holy spirit is called his finger. This is for the sake of understanding.
He does not need the sound waves to travel to his ear and have his eardrum bones vibrate in order for him to hear you. That is ridiculous.
You act as though God were a man.
Us being created in his image means we were given godly attributes, the ability to love, to show wisdom, to be patient, to reason, etc. The animals were not created in his image. Look at the verse in context.
Also:
Image: to draw a likeness; to describe; to reflect; to picture in the mind.
Can it not be said that we “reflect” God in ways that animals don't?
Image does not have to mean “exact physical form.”Quote YHVH could be the name used for God (El) but not for God (Elohim). I just checked my very first example in the list of 1000.
Psalm 100:3: “Yahweh hu Elohim.” “Jehovah himself [is] God.”
How do you explain this?
I just checked a second verse: Jer 10:10: “Jehovah is in truth God.”
It's actually: “Yahweh Elohim emet,” or “Jehovah God is the true.” Turning that into normal English grammar: “Jehovah is the true God.”david
Hello David,Many good thoughts!
And super how you recognize the metaphors. Too many want to argue lunacies when they can't recognize metaphors. God is a door, bird, etc
God is my Father. He adopted me. Jesus is my brother.
Israel is His people. He adopted them.
Christians are Jesus' people. Jesus is the bridegroom we are the bride….can't get any closer that a husband and wife, especially when they are joined and one “body”.
How are we united? Thru the Power and agency of the Holy Spirit.
The Professor
Quote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:47) I just wonder what you think of Jehovah repeatedly being called “Father”? Also, he is repeatedly (a few times at least) called the “husbandly owner” or “husbandly master [Lord]” of Israel.
Is 54:5; Jer 314; 31:32The same scripture we've considered before when looking at God's name for example:
ISAIAH 54:5
““For your Grand Maker is your husbandly owner, Jehovah of armies being his name; and the Holy One of Israel is your Repurchaser. The God of the whole earth he will be called.”DBF, what do you make of God inspiring his writers to write that he is our “Father” and that he was symbolically a “husband” to Israel.
He did not choose to be called “mother” or “wife” did he? Does this count for anything?
Also,
Quote Someone tried to say that the “US” in those verses is the Father and Jesus….but again the verse says male AND female; which one is the female? –davidbfun
So, DBF, do you think that God and Jesus in heaven have all the parts that we do. You seem to think that us being created in God's image, means physical image, as opposed to us being created with godly attributes. If you look at this physically, then let me ask you:
Does God use have literal ears that he uses to hear like we do?
Does God have literal eyes like we do that let's him see light?
Does God have literal fingers that help him to move things around?
Does he have reproductive organs? Does he have a stomach? Does he have lungs that help him breath?When we are told that he wears a crown or sits on a throne, it is to convey a thought, that of authority. When we are told of his “arm” or his “finger” it is refernce to his holy spirit, which he uses to accomplish his will. (He does not literally need an arm to pick things up.)
For the sake of understanding, we are given ideas that help us understand his glory, etc. In one account, his holy spirit is called his finger. This is for the sake of understanding.
He does not need the sound waves to travel to his ear and have his eardrum bones vibrate in order for him to hear you. That is ridiculous.
You act as though God were a man.
Us being created in his image means we were given godly attributes, the ability to love, to show wisdom, to be patient, to reason, etc. The animals were not created in his image. Look at the verse in context.
Also:
Image: to draw a likeness; to describe; to reflect; to picture in the mind.
Can it not be said that we “reflect” God in ways that animals don't?
Image does not have to mean “exact physical form.”Quote YHVH could be the name used for God (El) but not for God (Elohim). I just checked my very first example in the list of 1000.
Psalm 100:3: “Yahweh hu Elohim.” “Jehovah himself [is] God.”
How do you explain this?
I just checked a second verse: Jer 10:10: “Jehovah is in truth God.”
It's actually: “Yahweh Elohim emet,” or “Jehovah God is the true.” Turning that into normal English grammar: “Jehovah is the true God.”david
Hello David,I realized when I read Gen 1:26 – 27 that it was talking about two aspects of God – image & likeness.
v.27 repeated “image” twice and then said that “male and female” were God's image. I don't want to debate the word “image” and what that means…..I only know the product of “image” = male and female And I know that because GOD SAID SO in verse 26.
Likeness to me are other aspects of God: lovingkindness, wisdom, nuturing, etc.
Image appears to be essences of God that He wants us to know about and be aware of. We are male and female….LIKE God.
v.28 God blessed THEM… (which means Adam and Eve; so, it was a period of time after creating Eve when this action takes place) which shows that Verses 26-28 are a “summary” of events and not in a chronological order as people tend to read them as.
The professor
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 03 2010,11:32) Quote (david @ Aug. 03 2010,01:47) I just wonder what you think of Jehovah repeatedly being called “Father”? Also, he is repeatedly (a few times at least) called the “husbandly owner” or “husbandly master [Lord]” of Israel.
Is 54:5; Jer 314; 31:32The same scripture we've considered before when looking at God's name for example:
ISAIAH 54:5
““For your Grand Maker is your husbandly owner, Jehovah of armies being his name; and the Holy One of Israel is your Repurchaser. The God of the whole earth he will be called.”DBF, what do you make of God inspiring his writers to write that he is our “Father” and that he was symbolically a “husband” to Israel.
He did not choose to be called “mother” or “wife” did he? Does this count for anything?
Also,
Quote Someone tried to say that the “US” in those verses is the Father and Jesus….but again the verse says male AND female; which one is the female? –davidbfun
So, DBF, do you think that God and Jesus in heaven have all the parts that we do. You seem to think that us being created in God's image, means physical image, as opposed to us being created with godly attributes. If you look at this physically, then let me ask you:
Does God use have literal ears that he uses to hear like we do?
Does God have literal eyes like we do that let's him see light?
Does God have literal fingers that help him to move things around?
Does he have reproductive organs? Does he have a stomach? Does he have lungs that help him breath?When we are told that he wears a crown or sits on a throne, it is to convey a thought, that of authority. When we are told of his “arm” or his “finger” it is refernce to his holy spirit, which he uses to accomplish his will. (He does not literally need an arm to pick things up.)
For the sake of understanding, we are given ideas that help us understand his glory, etc. In one account, his holy spirit is called his finger. This is for the sake of understanding.
He does not need the sound waves to travel to his ear and have his eardrum bones vibrate in order for him to hear you. That is ridiculous.
You act as though God were a man.
Us being created in his image means we were given godly attributes, the ability to love, to show wisdom, to be patient, to reason, etc. The animals were not created in his image. Look at the verse in context.
Also:
Image: to draw a likeness; to describe; to reflect; to picture in the mind.
Can it not be said that we “reflect” God in ways that animals don't?
Image does not have to mean “exact physical form.”Quote YHVH could be the name used for God (El) but not for God (Elohim). I just checked my very first example in the list of 1000.
Psalm 100:3: “Yahweh hu Elohim.” “Jehovah himself [is] God.”
How do you explain this?
I just checked a second verse: Jer 10:10: “Jehovah is in truth God.”
It's actually: “Yahweh Elohim emet,” or “Jehovah God is the true.” Turning that into normal English grammar: “Jehovah is the true God.”david
Hello David,I realized when I read Gen 1:26 – 27 that it was talking about two aspects of God – image & likeness.
v.27 repeated “image” twice and then said that “male and female” were God's image. I don't want to debate the word “image” and what that means…..I only know the product of “image” = male and female And I know that because GOD SAID SO in verse 26.
Likeness to me are other aspects of God: lovingkindness, wisdom, nuturing, etc.
Image appears to be essences of God that He wants us to know about and be aware of. We are male and female….LIKE God.
v.28 God blessed THEM… (which means Adam and Eve; so, it was a period of time after creating Eve when this action takes place) which shows that Verses 26-28 are a “summary” of events and not in a chronological order as people tend to read them as.
The professor
Hello David,Psalms 100:3 is saying what I've been saying, YHVH is part of Elohim, the male essence.
Jer 10:10 YHVH Elohim is together in Hebrew but is separated in translation which can lead to some confusion. See for yourself: And YHVH Elohim is true Elohim…
If you translate like Gen 2:4 it would read like:
And Elohim's YHVH is truly Elohim……All agreeing with what you wrote.
Again seeing Elohim as God Most High; YHVH as God (El) male essence of Elohim everything makes sense and is self-explanatory and nothing is contradictory. Elohim and El are “God” (one), however, Elohim has the female essence additionally.
Food for thought: Why does Israel make a big deal about God being one?
If you use God (El) there is not a need to explain “one”.
However, when you use God (Elohim) there are two essences within God….then you have to emphasize the fact that God is ONE. Body is one. Spirit is one. God is one. (God is male and female.)YHVH (masc) is God. Spirit (fem) is Holy. Together they are the “One, True, Holy God”.
The Professor
Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 03 2010,01:52) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,14:29) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,22:20) Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 02 2010,22:14) Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 02 2010,05:50) Hi Ed, Elohim is spelled with ee only with you and your numbers.
i = hebrew yud (consonant, and not a vowel.
E = 5 L=12 O=15 H=8 I=9 M=13 = 62
There I've done it and used your numbers….
Hi DBF,ĔL-ō-Hêêm(63) = YHVH(63)
Hebrew #430 <– Click on Link (Prob.18:13 / 1Thess.5:21)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed,lol
430. 'elohiym (el-o-heem') = 79el-o-heem' is the pronunciation guide
'elohiym is the translitertion and should've been used
how many points is an apostrophe?While on the subject, YHVH with vowel points is Y”e” h”o” v”a”hh. (blb.org)
But you knew that.
Hi David,Do you look for faults in others as well? (Matt.7:1-5)
Hello Ed,You act as if this numbering system is “you”. Because I don't agree with it, or like it, does not mean that I don't like YOU.
I can see the arbitrariness in it and don't like it when one person is in charge of what meanings they want an outcome to be.
If you “could” detach yourself from this you could see what me and others have been trying to tell you.
Many people have asked the significance of the numbers and all you do is show more words or phrases and give a summation….not an answer.
YHVH = 63 what does 63 mean? What “truth” is in 63?
I apologize if you feel that I am attacking YOU.
I try to keep it light by showing how arbitrarily you come up with numbers…and then try to attach importance to the numbers.
Look at this site and people can't even agree with what words are written, nevertheless a substitution of numbers for the words.
At the beginning when I posted people made character assassinations on “me” (because they didn't like what they were hearing) and never on the “ideas”, because they couldn't refute the information. I am addressing the ideas and not you….but you care to take it personally….please don't.
Otherwise, when you post and place all this extraneous information and numbers inside the post, it immediately sets off alarms and turns me off…. and I can't see the forest from the numbers. I'd prefer to hear your IDEAS and Bible verses and not your NUMBERS.
The Professor
Quote If you have a predisposition to believe one way because of “Church Teachings” feel free to say so. Biases always influence how we choose to look at Scripture. While I don't think that God has male reproductive organs or male Genes or DNA, I do know that he chooses to be called “Father.” This is what I know and this is my bias.
If I was reading a letter from someone and they signed it, “Father” would I be predesposed to believe it was a women who wrote it, or a male?
If we are to believe the Bible, then we should believe that God inspired his servants to put in writing that God is our “Father.”
That is my bias. I feel it's a rather simple one. And I think most people would have trouble getting past the idea that someone who calls them self “Father” is not masculine.
Quote If you allow yourself to see the possibility of Elohim being God Most High as an umbrella and under Him being “YHVH and Spirit” then you will be able to think on your own concerning the Bible and not need any church to do your thinking for you. Nor will you argue their philosophy but have your own; based only on the Bible. –DBF
It's just that this is nowhere taught in scripture. Yes, you have that one scripture in Genesis where it says “spirit God” and most translators translate as “spirit of God” or “God's spirit.”
I have a question: When translating Hebrew into Greek, does Hebrew already have the word “of” and secondly, does “of” sometimes have to be inserted at the discretion of the translator? (I really don't know the answer. I thought it would be quicker to ask you.)
Because if “of” sometimes has to be added when translating it into Greek, then you have no argument. If “of” already exists in Hebrew, and it isn't in that Genesis Scripture, then we have an anomoly.
But that still wouldn't cancel out everything else that has been written.
No scripture says: “Jehovah is part of God.” There are scriptures that clearly say that “Jehovah is God” however.
People will always accept the clear scriptures over one possible anomoly.
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