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We KNOW that dinos existed. They are not mentioned in the Bible at all (KJV). Why? Were they on the earth prior to Adam and Eve? Since the Bible starts with A&E, that is not possible. Were they WITH A&E? Also not possible since there is no mention of dinos either in the Garden or after the expulsion on the outside. Where did they come from? We know where they went.
Hi, and welcome.
I could try and answer this one myself but I would be borrowing heavily from the Answers in Genesis ministry. They specialize in this type of question and for what it's worth, I highly respect their scholarship and lack of compromise of the Word of God.
Their URL: http://www.answersingenesis.org
cheersThe Genesis record appears to show that animals were created before man. So do we really know how long these animals were around before God created man. Also the dinosaurs could have existed until the flood and were drowned in the flood leaving fossils as we see today.
Apparently fossils are the exception rather than the norm. They exist when an animal or plant is killed and preserved suddenly. Otherwise decay sets in and the organism just breaks down. A flood is a perfect catastrophe for creating fossils.
Mammoths have been discovered in the Artic ice. I heard that some were found with buttercups in their stomachs. If this is true, then it suggests that they were eating plants from a warm north pole and then in a very quick period of time, they were frozen before physical decay set in. The flood could explain this.
You may also be interested in the following verse where the LORD is chastising Job:
Job 40:15-24
15 “Look at the behemoth,
which I made along with you
and which feeds on grass like an ox.
16 What strength he has in his loins,
what power in the muscles of his belly!
17 His tail sways like a cedar;
the sinews of his thighs are close-knit.
18 His bones are tubes of bronze,
his limbs like rods of iron.
19 He ranks first among the works of God,
yet his Maker can approach him with his sword.
20 The hills bring him their produce,
and all the wild animals play nearby.
21 Under the lotus plants he lies,
hidden among the reeds in the marsh.
22 The lotuses conceal him in their shadow;
the poplars by the stream surround him.
23 When the river rages, he is not alarmed;
he is secure, though the Jordan should surge against his mouth.
24 Can anyone capture him by the eyes,
or trap him and pierce his nose?Some say this animal is a hippopotamus, but the description of this creatures tail doesn't seem to support this.
Back in 1970, newspapers reported the discovery of cave paintings in Zimbabwe. The paintings were made by bushmen who ruled that area from about 1500 B.C., until a couple of hundred years ago. Along with accurate representations of the elephant and the giraffe, is a painting of an Apatosaurus (brontosaurus). These art works have greatly puzzled scientists since bushmen are known to have painted from real life!
Also a supposed discovery of what appeared to be human footprints, along with dinosaur tracks (in the Paluxy River bed near Glen Rose, Texas), was reported in the May 1939 issue of Natural History.
There is also a possibility that the earth was populated before God created man. I do not have an opinion here, but I offer this line of thought anyway. The scriptures used to back this up include:
Genesis 9:1
“And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.”Genesis 1:28
“And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.”So Noah was told to replenish the earth after it was destroyed by the flood and man was also told to replenish the earth when God created man. If this were true, then Genesis 2 may offer a clue.
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
So there could have been an age or many ages before our one and they ended with darkness, with God creating a new world after that. People who hold this view tend to say that God wouldn't create a world in darkness to begin with. Rather it is a period that marks the end of an age and God then creates a new one. Let there be light etc.
Again I do not have a solid belief here, but I also do not see a conflict with the bible and the existance of dinosaurs.
Hi , Scientists tell us there have been dinosaurs from the fossil record. I am not saying they did not exist but no one has ever seen a dinosaur so the evidence is not direct that they walked the earth. Scientists have become the icons of this world yet they do not create life. All they do is find and try to interpret the evidence of the work of God. But do they praise God when his glory and power is revealed by their work?
Genesis tells us, as t8 has said, that animals were created before man. How long before is not clear as one day to the Lord can be as 1000 years at least. In fact fish and birds were created before animals -the previous “day” in Genesis terms-and light, water, the seas, the atmosphere and vegetation before that.
Scientists propose scenarios that explain why animal designs appear to have changed in the fossil record and favour adjustment to environmental circumstances. However it all remains conjecture as no one was there to see it. God may have been experimenting and developing and perfecting His creation over time.
The main aim of these human theories is to write God out of the script as God is annoyingly unable to be defined in their terms. So when Darwin came up with his evolution theories he was welcomed and his theories soon taught as fact.
I have heard some say that dinosaurs must have been present with Adam as death only entered the earth through his sin.
But sin was present on earth well before the arrival of man. Satan was created “in the beginning ” with the other sons of God who cheered when the foundations of the earth were laid according to Job 38.4-7. He was “a sinner from the beginning” and had a special relationship to earth so sin was already here when Adam was created.
Also the law of sin and death only applies to man as shown in Romans so ,of course, God could do as He wished with His creation.
I would love to hear more from you on this Is1.18Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 24 2004,01:11) I have heard some say that dinosaurs must have been present with Adam as death only entered the earth through his sin.
But sin was present on earth well before the arrival of man. Satan was created “in the beginning ” with the other sons of God who cheered when the foundations of the earth were laid according to Job 38.4-7. He was “a sinner from the beginning” and had a special relationship to earth so sin was already here when Adam was created.
Also the law of sin and death only applies to man as shown in Romans so ,of course, God could do as He wished with His creation.
I would love to hear more from you on this Is1.18
Hi NH,
Why would God need to experiment? He can't learn.Quote Genesis 1
31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good.
Why would God declare his creation “very good” if carnage, bloodshed and death reigned?Quote Romans 5
12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned– 13for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law. 14Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses
This shows that sin and death entered the world with Adam's fall. Nothing on earth could have died before this act. Therefore the only logical conclusion is that dinosaurs must have co-existed with men. I don't have a problem with that.
God BlessHi Is 1.18,
Hope your w/e is going well. The verse in Roman use of sin entering the “world” [Kosmos]is a different word to that used for “earth”[ge]. One [ge]is a purely physical definition and the other seems more broad in meaning that may not apply to the animal world? In context it says “death thus coming to all MEN.”
You, also, have made no comment on the previous sin of Satan.What is your view here?
God does not need to experiment but may have enjoyed creating different animals. He should not be defined in legalistic terms of behavior surely. Why should He be boring?Likewise we can never understand the meaning of “good” in God's sight.
Personally I think carnage and bloodshed probably were not features. The reason I say that is in the view of restored Eden in Is 65.25 “the wolf and the lamb graze alike and the lion shall eat hay like the ox”.
But God could always take away the life given to His creation surely. Where is it written that all created life was designed to be eternal? Again there is the risk of looking through human legalistic glasses at the ways of God.
T8 that interpretation of “replenish” for “fill” seems to be one of those KJV ones that may have altered in understanding through time, It certainly stands alone in KJV in suggesting previous life among many interpretations of the word in my concordance.
Behemoth and Leviathan are mysteries and I wonder if they were ever physical.Hi NH,
Why would it not apply to the animal world? Can you provide some scriptural support for this?
Why is it that people always recognise a literal time frame for almost any other scripture where dates are given, e.g.
– The resurrection 3 days after Christs death
– The 40 day temptation in the desert
– The 1000 year millenial reign of Christ
and yet insist on playing the 2 Peter 3:8 card when it comes to Genesis 1.
Can you show me another scripture where the word yom is used with a number that refers to ages, not literal solar days? I don't think you wiill find one.
Consider Exodus 20:Quote 8 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your animals, nor the alien within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.
Moses recognised the fact that it took God 6 literal days.
It seems to me that you can either take what God has to say about His creation at face value or try to make the sciptures somehow conform to what the scientists tell you. I choose to do the former.Good points. Is . I will search further. Will you address the questions too?
Some more questions though from Genesis.Was there time “in the beginning?”
Was there time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day? Light and darkness were created on the first day but only then, on the fourth day, were the sun and moon there “to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness”
Did God then create time before he created the luminaries to mark them?
We love time as it is a scientific measure but can we apply science to God? That is a form of legalism that says God must obey all the measures we have identified in our study of his creation?
What about the Day of the Lord? Is that one day or a time period of indefinable length?Quote Hope your w/e is going well.
Hi NH,
My w/e went well thanks (too fast though), yours?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 24 2004,23:53) Good points. Is . I will search further. Will you address the questions too?
sureQuote You, also, have made no comment on the previous sin of Satan.What is your view here?
There is no scriptural evidence that satan interacted with the creation before Genesis 3:1 also God pronounced the creation “very good”, therefore it is logical to assume that the uncursed creation was immortal – with mortality entering with the fall. Romans 5:8-11 paints a pretty clear picture of this to me – sin and death entered the world with Adam's sin.Quote God does not need to experiment but may have enjoyed creating different animals. He should not be defined in legalistic terms of behavior surely. Why should He be boring?Likewise we can never understand the meaning of “good” in God's sight.
NH, its pretty clear from scripture that death comes from sin. There was no sin before Adam's, he set that precident. If you want to believe that God “experimented” a little during the creation (sounds a little like Darwinian evolution to me) and that animals were made mortal then thats fine with me, but please recognise the fact that scripture doesn't support this conjecture.Quote Personally I think carnage and bloodshed probably were not features. The reason I say that is in the view of restored Eden in Is 65.25 “the wolf and the lamb graze alike and the lion shall eat hay like the ox”.
fair point, I agree, but your theory still insists that, although a sin hadn't been committed, death still reigned.Quote But God could always take away the life given to His creation surely. Where is it written that all created life was designed to be eternal? Again there is the risk of looking through human legalistic glasses at the ways of God.
I don't think this is legalism, I thinks its respecting scriptures and not trying to allegorise them to conform to the world's view of the earths origin.Quote Behemoth and Leviathan are mysteries and I wonder if they were ever physical.
why wouldn't they be. Wouldn't God be lying to Job if they weren't physical. After all he describes physical acts (feeds on grass like an ox) and features (16 What strength he has in his loins, what power in the muscles of his belly!) of the BehemothQuote Was there time “in the beginning?”
can anyone really answer this question, with authority, but God alone?Quote Was there time before the sun and moon were created on the fourth day? Light and darkness were created on the first day but only then, on the fourth day, were the sun and moon there “to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness”
Did God then create time before he created the luminaries to mark them?
Genesis 1
3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning-the first day.Day and night are measures of time, these were instituted on day one. Anyway its irrelevent to the argument because the luminaries were created before both animals and men. Therefore their co-existance is still supported by scripture.
Quote We love time as it is a scientific measure but can we apply science to God? That is a form of legalism that says God must obey all the measures we have identified in our study of his creation?
NH would you say i was being legalistic because I interpreted the following verse literally:1 Corinthians 15
1Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. 2By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
3For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance[1] : that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5and that he appeared to Peter,[2] and then to the Twelve.Whats the difference?
Quote What about the Day of the Lord? Is that one day or a time period of indefinable length?
There is no numerical value attached to any of the “Day of the Lord” verses.
RegardsHi Is,
Good morning. Baching this weekend so was a busy lad.
We are all searching for truth here and I am not an expert. We know Satan sinned prior to the creation of the animals and man. Why did God curse serpents, who are physical and of earth, if Satan had not interacted with nature?
Enoch says that Behemoth and Leviathan will be the fare at the wedding feast of the Lamb if my reading is correct. Where are they now if they are physical? I am not saying they are not but am unsure?
Likewise you have to show from scripture if your belief is that all life was meant to be eternal. I am not sure it says either way so we cannot assume.
The thing about legalism is only with regard to human measurements and not truth itself. That cannot be measured.Hi Is.1.18,
You talk of the 2 Peter 3.8 card of 1000yrs equalling 1 day [also in a psalm]and relate it to the 1000yr reign of Jesus and Genesis 1. But the whole thing makes sense if 1000 yrs equals 1 day as with the 4000 years between adam and Jesus adding up the 'begats' in the OT and 2000yrs odd since Jesus and the 1000yr reign at the return of Jesus making up 1 week. The rest day is the sabbath rest promised in Hebrews Ch 4.
So should we also apply it to creation days? Could be more than 1000 as we cannot confine God. Could be but it also could just be non equal time periods described as days to show God's love of the sabbath principle. Who Knows???2 Peter 3:8
But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.So it is like a thousand years. It doesn't have to be that exactly, although the genealogies seem to be close to each day being 1 thousand years in as far as human history from Adam to Abraham, Abraham to Christ and Christ to our time. 2000 years x 3 = 6000 years.
When it says that God created the world in 6 days, I do not see any measuring stick apart from 6 distinct periods. Would God have subjected his day to the earth spinning on it's axis or the earth revolving around the sun 1000 times. I am not so sure that this is what his day was. It is possible, but it is also possible that God chose his own time period too. Of course even if it were 6 literal earth spins on its axis, then 2 Peter 3:8 also says that “a thousand years are like a day”. So God could do an immeasurable amount of things in the space of an earth day. Even time is of no limit to his eternal power.
Lets face it. An eternal working in the confounds of time is still eternal.
Some times we can read too much into something. But I am willing of course to discuss such things in case God has revealed the answer to us.
i may be a little off subject at the moment, but is there not an even earlier mention of dinosaurs before that of Job? perhaps within the very first few chapters of Genesis even? remember the fall of man? logically, therefore, it is possible that such a species, of dinosaurs, could have been referred to as the 'serpent'. how else would you be able to describe a dinosaur without legs? exactly what moses meant when using the word serpent we cannot be sure of, can we?
Welcome WWB,
What is a dinosaur?
I guess most people would imagine some huge creature but they could be small too.
Everyone one knows what a serpent looks like and they appear throughout scripture usually symbolising Satan and described as crafty deceivers.
But no one has seen a living dinosaur. So surely we should go by what is known rather than speculation? Serpents were biting and killing the Israelites because of their sin of rebellion.
Moses fashioned a bronze replica of a serpent in Num 21.9 so that those bitten by deadly fiery serpents would look on it and live.
John 3.14 compares the death of Jesus on the cross as a similar event. Those who look on the Saviour's death and believe also can live. No longer can the attacks of Satan the old serpent kill them as they have eternal life.well, as the fact remains, we cannot return back in time many thousands of years, so we will never know (in this life at least) exactly what was being referred to as the serpent and the fall of man. however, can we not conclude that since God created all animals and living creatures in the beginning, along with the earth, and, 'apparantly', before the creation of man, it is of course, that dinosaurs were alive during the time that we existed, no?
Hi,
All we know is that animals were created before man. Did God allow them all to continue such that they were all here when Man arrived? We do not know the timespan difference so who can know?the time span difference? if you are relating to the different 'days' in which God created the earth, it is difficult to believe that He could have created the plants, land animals, animals of the water, and animals of the air in more then a couple days. if it had been thousands of years, as has been proposed, this would upset the natural state of homeostasis necessary to support such animals. suppose, for example, that God had decided to create plants, and for 1000 years, He waited before creating the animals of the air and waters. without animals, how could plants survive? plants require CO2 to generate their food, through the process' which most plants require, in an anaerobic state. it is possible, through the aerobic 'fermentation' for plants to generate their energy, however, it produces an extraordinarily fractional amount of energy compared to the lactic acid cycle. Therefore, plant species could not survive on this 'fermentation' as a source of energy. secondly, supposing that God classified the kingdoms monera, and protista as animals, the decomposition of these plants would be impossible, and a build up of undecomposed materials, as well as the non-circulation of these necessary nutrients into the earth's soil, would leave the living plants without any souce of energy from which to continue their life functions, would kill off the plant species quite rapidly. as another contradiction, certain seed bearing plants, that rely upon the spread of their seeds through other animals, would be unable to reproduce. though it is possible that God had some other way to make this possible, with what we have to work with, making the assumption that plant species today are as they were when God created them originally, this would be impossible.
Good points,
I guess volcanoes add some CO2 to the environment? Many countries like New Zealand had very few land creatures, being mainly plants, and there was no problem.
But God is not tied to 1 day or 1000 years or 1,000,000 yrs for His creation days is He?that is an example, yet you are forgetting the tinier forms of life. bacteria, and other single celled organims are very capable at producing the quantaties of CO2 necessary. God is not tied to any sort of time (in the sense that we are percieving it as such) but is infinite in all his way. but i must say im not entirely sure what you are trying to say. God is all moments into one, and one moment into all. because of the way we are designed, it is impossible for us to understand and comprehend all that he is. yet we can study what he has created, and understand Him in this way.
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