- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Stu.
I have an idea.
Let's swap sides and debate the existence not of real space, but cyber space.
In this debate, I will be the Atheist and you will be the Creationist, or the one who believes that it was designed by intelligence.
(BTW) anyone can participate. But if you believe that the universe was created, then you must take the role of the Atheist, and vice versa, if you are an Atheist, you are now the Creationist.
The point of this exercise will become apparent in time.
I will go first.
The Internet (cyberspace) exploded from a single pixel.
It wasn't created because mathematical logic which this space exists on, means that Internets can spontaneously appear from nothing. It is because of mathematical logic that we do not need a creator or intelligence of any kind behind the existence of cyberspace.
Sure there exists logical code and what may appear as design to the uneducated, but that is just the output of this mathematical logic from this binary universe.
We stand by the FACT that cyberspace was not created. In fact while searching cyberspace with the Google Telescope, some computer scientists noted that they found a web site that had not existed the day before. In other words it just appeared out of nothing.
I know that Creationists will reply with something about the designer not being visible from inside cyberspace, but that he can been understood to exist by his very creation and work. However, I just say that is religious platitude and a bunch of hogwash.
I haven't seen a creator on my travels inside cyberspace, so until he/she/them actually appear to me in cyberspace, I will continue to state the obvious. There is no intelligence or creator/s behind cyberspace.
I rest my case and now hand over the debate to Creationist Stu.
He he.
My guess is that Stu will not participate.
First off, he will not be able to stand being the Creationist, even though that position is correct. It will be against every fiber of his being.BTW, anyone can participate.
t8
I have no idea what your point is. In another thread I explained how digital systems are indeed designed by designers.
What exactly are you asking for here?
Stuart
Quote (JustAskin @ Oct. 16 2010,11:17) t8,
The point is perfectly apparent to me….Delete after reading…
What point is perfectly apparent to you?Is it the logical fallacy that because some things are designed then all things must be designed?
An ice sculpture is designed and a snowflake isn't. Do you understand that difference?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,11:27) t8 I have no idea what your point is. In another thread I explained how digital systems are indeed designed by designers.
What exactly are you asking for here?
Stuart
No they don't Stu. They don't require designers.Religious platitude.
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,11:27) I have no idea what your point is. In another thread I explained how digital systems are indeed designed by designers.
What designers? Zues, Bob, Jane?Quote (t8 @ Oct. 16 2010,11:31) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,11:27) t8 I have no idea what your point is. In another thread I explained how digital systems are indeed designed by designers.
What exactly are you asking for here?
Stuart
No they don't Stu. They don't require designers.Religious platitude.
Not a platitude actually because whether it is right or wrong the statement actually has meaning.Will we be interested in getting our facts right in this thread?
Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 16 2010,11:35) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,11:27) I have no idea what your point is. In another thread I explained how digital systems are indeed designed by designers.
What designers? Zues, Bob, Jane?
Not sure about Zeus (as it is spelled). These three are called Michael, Jeremy and Ben.
Maybe in one of those other threads where you have been arguing against the evidence for the existence of a designer of the universe (and the guinea worm) you could post a picture of that designer.
Stuart
T8,
Ever seen Tron? it is an attempt by the creationist to imply that cyberspace has a design and a designer, how ridiculous can you get. We all know everything came from nothing, just random bits of code converging over billions of years.Oh yeah. Tron just happened.
Digital Worlds can spontaneously come into existence.
It's simply explained in that after billions of years, binary sequences will eventually reorder to allow the current state of cyberspace with order that allows for life.
It's all in the numbers.Quote (t8 @ Oct. 16 2010,14:56) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,11:43)
Is this the Trinity that created cyberspace?
Apparently this trinity did. Can one bloke be a trinity?
Is your god three in one, or one god composed of three parts, or the angry god of the OT combined with the coy god of the NT amalgamated with some other god to make a trinity of only one god?
I guess Imaginary Friends can be confusing in the way they remain silent in every situation.
At least I can post a picture of the person who invented the internet, which I guess counts as cyberspace.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 16 2010,15:22) Apparently this trinity did. Can one bloke be a trinity?
Um yes, I know that most believe that Sir Tim is the creator, but that doesn't make it right. A claim is a claim, not a fact. I didn't witness Sir Tim actually create the Internet or even the WWW Galaxy.The fact that Sir Tim looks like Kevin Spacey is a little to conspiratorial to ignore as well as the coincidental surname being similar to CyberSpacey and the fact that he is an actor.
And what about the Al Gore God who supposedly claims to be the creator? It is fun watching Digital Creationists argue over who created Cyberspace.
Cyberspace can exist without a creator. All your creationist arguments don't work with me. I know better.
We just happen to live in the one cyberspace that has order. The other ones were possibilities, that never eventuated due to the binary orders not being aligned to favor order and life. Hence the reason why no one critiques those ones and why you think your one was created because it beats the odds when chaos or nothing is more likely.
So here we are in the one that is ordered enough to contain life. It was bound to happen given the mathematical possibilities. No creator needed Stu. Just infinite time and mathematical combinations.
You Digital Creationist theories are lame. And as for Sir Tim, well I haven't seen him. If he appeared to me, then I might consider your argument for Sir Tim. But I somehow doubt that I will ever see him, and we all know that photographs can be doctored and Wikipedia articles and web sites can be created by anyone of any persuasion.
Do you believe everything you read?
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 16 2010,19:05) Cyberspace can exist without a creator. All your creationist arguments don't work with me. I know better. We just happen to live in the one cyberspace that has order. The other ones were possibilities, that never eventuated due to the binary orders not being aligned to favor order and life. Hence the reason why no one critiques those ones and why you think your one was created because it beats the odds when chaos or nothing is more likely.
So here we are in the one that is ordered enough to contain life. It was bound to happen given the mathematical possibilities. No creator needed Stu. Just infinite time and mathematical combinations.
You Digital Creationist theories are lame. And as for Sir Tim, well I haven't seen him. If he appeared to me, then I might consider your argument for Sir Tim. But I somehow doubt that I will ever see him, and we all know that photographs can be doctored and Wikipedia articles and web sites can be created by anyone of any persuasion.
Do you believe everything you read?
Recognising and rehearsing the name “Sir Tim” is the first step in believing in Him. Perhaps you should call out to Tim to reveal himself to you. Perhaps your call will be answered if you can truly believe.Or you could email him and interrogate him that way I suppose.
I haven't posted any “theories”, I have just posted a couple of pictures. Creationists don't have theories.
Stuart
Perhaps I am a bit slow today, but the flaws in this role play are becoming clear to me now. All the evidence that exists to determine whether electronic systems have designers actually supports the theory that they are in fact designed. There is no evidence to the contrary. However, I have been charged with playing the part of a creationist, which means that if I follow the creationist method of arguing then I should be soundly beaten by anyone who understands logic and epistemology, which is what happens to creationists even if they are too ignorant to understand their defeat.
Since I have all the evidence on my side, and as an honorary creationist (do they have honour??) I will not be using the evidence then the discussion will either end dishonestly (even though BD has not yet entered the discussion) or it will be a stalemate of assertions that have no substance.
Do you have a preference? Shall we go for dishonest and get it over and done with, or have a protracted discussion that plays the same side of the same LP, much like you tend to run anyhow t8!?
Stuart
Hi Stuart,
Electrical impulses have been seen in the sky for eons.
Electrical impulses also occur naturally as static discharges; SCIENTIFIC FACT .
So it was only a matter of time before these electrical impulses coalesced into cyberspace.
This natural occurring process then took just few decades to evolve into the cyberlife you see today.
Nothing became all you can imagine, that's how cyberspace began! One big electrical bang started the whole process.Ed J
Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 16 2010,20:06) Hi Stuart, Electrical impulses have been seen in the sky for eons.
Electrical impulses also occur naturally as static discharges; SCIENTIFIC FACT .
So it was only a matter of time before these electrical impulses coalesced into cyberspace.
This natural occurring process then took just few decades to evolve into the cyberlife you see today.
Nothing became all you can imagine, that's how cyberspace began! One big electrical bang started the whole process.Ed J
You are a blind man refusing to see the truth. It is self-evident that cyberspace was designed because Tim is much bigger than your puny brain will ever understand.How's my creationist role play coming along do you think, Ed?
Stuart
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
