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you know what i have a problem with? Jesus came preaching the kingdom of God. He sent his deciples out to preach the good news. Now His deciples didn't know at this point Jesus was going to die, and be ressurected and be our Saviour. So they weren't out preaching having to believe in Jesus, His death and ressuration. Yet all sudden the message changed from being about the Kingdom of God to being all about believing in Jesus, His death, His ressurection. Not being able to have a relationship with G_d without going through Jesus. It sounds alot to me like Jesus got put in the position of our modern day Catholic priests. You can't forgiveness of sin unless you go confess to the priest. Yet before Jesus the OT shows over and over again all you have to do is ask G_d for forgiveness, repent, and your sins are forgiven. You didn't even have to give a animal scrafice. In fact once the Temple was destroyed they couldn't do blood scracfices. So now no Jewish person throughout history has gotten forgiveness for thier sins? King David sinned and got forgiveness for his sin. Where did the idea that we can't get forgiveness of sin, or have a relationship with G_d without Jesus come from? I see Jesus taking first place over G_d. Nothing is done except through Jesus, Pray His name, get saved in His name, do mircales in His name etc etc. Yet He said He didn't do anything except through the Father. G_d healed, did mircales, forgave sins, delivered his people, etc before Jesus. I don't see in the OT (i haven't read every word of it yet) where it says we lost our relationship with G_d because Adam and Eve sinned. I see pushishment for the sin. And since Jesus did His thing I don't see sin being less, if anything the world is more sinful.
“Constantius also had much of the NT altered. And it is proven he didn't accept Christ until he was on his death bed, so he was never a quote Christian.
Hi JA and welcome,
It is more about the Spirit of God than any vessel including Jesus.
The testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of prophecy.
Grace and peace was through Jesus.
He is the gate to the kingdom.The priests went into the Holy of holies once a year on behalf of the sins of the people.
Now Jesus has done this through the veil of his flesh for all men.
Now he is the only door to the kingdom and the disciples preached that same kingdom.While he was with them he used his authority and empowered them to work with him.
Those disciples were infused with the same Spirit of Christ to continue his work after his return to God.
Once you have been washed then only your feet need daily cleansing of the sin that clings to us.
Quote (julieannz @ Sep. 23 2008,20:59) you know what i have a problem with? Jesus came preaching the kingdom of God. He sent his deciples out to preach the good news. Now His deciples didn't know at this point Jesus was going to die, and be ressurected and be our Saviour. So they weren't out preaching having to believe in Jesus, His death and ressuration. Yet all sudden the message changed from being about the Kingdom of God to being all about believing in Jesus, His death, His ressurection. Not being able to have a relationship with G_d without going through Jesus. It sounds alot to me like Jesus got put in the position of our modern day Catholic priests. You can't forgiveness of sin unless you go confess to the priest. Yet before Jesus the OT shows over and over again all you have to do is ask G_d for forgiveness, repent, and your sins are forgiven. You didn't even have to give a animal scrafice. In fact once the Temple was destroyed they couldn't do blood scracfices. So now no Jewish person throughout history has gotten forgiveness for thier sins? King David sinned and got forgiveness for his sin. Where did the idea that we can't get forgiveness of sin, or have a relationship with G_d without Jesus come from? I see Jesus taking first place over G_d. Nothing is done except through Jesus, Pray His name, get saved in His name, do mircales in His name etc etc. Yet He said He didn't do anything except through the Father. G_d healed, did mircales, forgave sins, delivered his people, etc before Jesus. I don't see in the OT (i haven't read every word of it yet) where it says we lost our relationship with G_d because Adam and Eve sinned. I see pushishment for the sin. And since Jesus did His thing I don't see sin being less, if anything the world is more sinful.
Welcome! We came out of the Catholic Church in 1984-85. I am happy and glad that God has called us, my Husband and I, we are now under Jesus Blood, that means that my sins are forgiven when I ask. He is our Mediator to go directly to the throne of Almighty God, Jesus cannot forgive us our Sins, we have to ask the Father to do that. That is why it says that Sin is not imputed to us. IMO I think that we still have to ask for forgiveness of that sin.
We are to come out of this world, do not be part of it. Yes, I know what you are saying everything is Jesus. Some overdo it, and forget the Almighty, and that is sad. I have put up a bunch of Songs to praise the Almighty with. Check them out in the Messinger tread under Songs of praise.
Peace and Love Irenethank you i have been searching the internet for songs that praise G_d and not just Jesus. I will check them out thank you.
jaI understand all the stuff about Jesus forgiving our sins and such. What I am questioning is if in the OT people were able to go to G_d directly and ask for forgiveness of sins. They didn't even need to use animal scracfices to get forgiven. They were not allowd to do animal scracfices except in the Temple once the Temple was destroyed no other blood scrafices were given. So obviously the poeple were getting forgiveness of sins simply by asking for it and repenting. So I asking, where and why was it necessary to have Jesus die for our sins when we were already able to get forgiveness of sins. Also in the NT it teaches that we still sin and need to ask for forgiveness of sin. Getting “saved” doesn't make it so you never have to ask for forgiveness of sin. And If having to have Jesus die for us so we could have a relationship with G_d and get forgiveness of sin, than why does the OT tell us to ask for forgivenss of our sin, repent and G_d forgives us? What I am asking is why was it necessary for Jesus to die for us? It seems to me, Christianity just subsituted Jesus in the place of priests, now the only way to G_d is through Jesus. We could go directly to G_d before Jesus died.
Hi JA,
Our sense of righteousness is not that of God.
All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.[Rom3]
All are under His wrath.[Jn3]He made special provision for His chosen people enabling ongoing forgiveness.[Heb9]
But those who were outside that Law were to perish.[Rom2]The law could make nobody perfect.
Now Jesus has perfectlty fulfilled the Law salvation is now offered through him.
He is the captain of our salvation, for Jew and gentile.He is the source of the enabling grace of the Spirit of God.
Thanks Nick I think you are trying to answer my question but I feel you are talking in circles and not telling me anything. I guess I really am not even asking for an anwer, I at this moment in time, believe in G_d. The G_D of Abraham, Issac, and Moses. I don't believe in 3 separate Gods making up one God. Gen 2:4, Psa 11:7, I don't believe we needed or need a saviour, the OT says G_D is our Saviour Isa 43:3, Provider Gen 22:14,Shepard Psa 23, Creator, Protector , Judge Gen 18:25, Healer Isa 61:1, Sanctifier Lev 20:8, Shield Psa 3:3, StrengthPsa 22:19, RockIsa 30:29, and KING Psa5:2 and oh!!OUR SAVIOUR Isa 43:3 G_D is everything I need. I believe in the OT laws and that I have a relationship with G_d, forgiveness of my sin by simply asking for forgiveness and REPENTING. I love and worship the Great I Am Gen2:4. Why do I need somone to do the things G_D is already doing for me?
God is our saviour.
So how does God save men? Did he come to earth himself?
Or did he send his son, the mediator between God and man?
In the OT, God sends his messengers to represent himself.
God is invisible and doesn't have a body like us. He is Spirit.
The Bible says G_D is our Saviour, so my point is why did we need a saviour to come in the form of G_d/man to be a saviour? Where in the OT does it say we can not have a relationship with G_D without someone dying? The Jewish poeple had a relationship with G_d throughout history, and recievced forgiveness of sin by simply asking for it and repenting.
Nick, again once the temple was destroyed the Jews no longer were able to make animal scrafices, they had to make them only in the Temple. also all the scriptures you are quoting to me are from the NT. On top of that, the deciples, even Jesus were preaching the Kingdom of God. The message they preached was not Jesus dying for our sins. That didn't get preached till after Jesus death. So how and why did the message get changed from preaching the Kingdom of God to having to get saved through Jesus dying on the cross? The message totaly changed. When and why did it change? It went from spreading the good news of the Kingdom of God to over night being your condemmed to Hell and can't have a relationship with G_d unless you accept Jesus. When did they start preaching having to accept Jesus death instead of the Kingdom of God? I know the Kingdom of God is not preached now, because I have been a quote “Christian” for over 40 yrs and involved in many different demonations.
Hebrews 9:22-26
22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
Quote (julieannz @ Sep. 24 2008,22:42) Nick, again once the temple was destroyed the Jews no longer were able to make animal scrafices, they had to make them only in the Temple. also all the scriptures you are quoting to me are from the NT. On top of that, the deciples, even Jesus were preaching the Kingdom of God. The message they preached was not Jesus dying for our sins. That didn't get preached till after Jesus death. So how and why did the message get changed from preaching the Kingdom of God to having to get saved through Jesus dying on the cross? The message totaly changed. When and why did it change? It went from spreading the good news of the Kingdom of God to over night being your condemmed to Hell and can't have a relationship with G_d unless you accept Jesus. When did they start preaching having to accept Jesus death instead of the Kingdom of God? I know the Kingdom of God is not preached now, because I have been a quote “Christian” for over 40 yrs and involved in many different demonations.
Thats the problem, you sat you belonged to many denomination.
But Rev. tells you to come out of Her my people. Have you?
I have.
If you go to my Songs you will see, that I worship our Father in Heaven. Because the Father cannot look on sin, and I do, I have a Mediator in Christ. For that I honor Him, He deserves all honor ansd glory, but worship belongs to our Father, who is
above all. Ephesians 4:6
Peace and Love IreneHi JA,
The evil principalities and powers in heavenly missed the point.
They would not have allowed Jesus to be killed if they had understood the deeper wisdom.I think God actually brought in the sacrificial system to set up for the later sacrifice of Jesus to save men.
Many credit Emperor Constantine for the spread of Christianity. While the Roman Empire once heavily persecuted the Church, Constantine legalised the Christian faith and even endorsed it to the point o it becoming the official religion of the empire. Should we thank Constantine or did something more sinister take place?
It seems that a growing number of people are coming to the conclusion that what Constantine actually did was hijack the Christian faith and changed it into a faith that merged his pagan roots. Doctrines like the Trinity and holy days like Sunday and December the 25th certainly point to this and form the basis of the Roman Catholic Church to this day. The following video explores the idea that Constantine was a pagan king who wanted to control Christians which by this stage existed in all four corners of the empire.
Welcome julieannz
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