Born of water.

[2besee]

Perhaps the reason you are so confused in basic matters, is because you have not been water baptized? (just a possibility).

[Ed J]

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2013,07:06)

We all have experienced one birth,and that is when we were born of mothers belly. Now there is one more.Only one more. What is this going to be? 1 or 2 or 3. 1. At water Babtism? 2. At spiritual babtism? 3. In the resurrection? wakeup.

2.

[Ed J]

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,09:07)

Ed, I leave you to your group, good luck.

What group? You mean
the Prophets and Apostles?

[2besee]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 17 2013,11:15)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 17 2013,01:56) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 16 2013,03:05) Quote (942767 @ Jan. 16 2013,01:59) Hi Marty, Water baptism does not save us.   Love in Christ, Marty Hi Marty, Then we agree (that it is unnecessary), so why do YOU persist in trying to tell me that it is then? God bless Ed J Hi Ed: I am not trying to tell you anything, but the Apostle Peter speaking to Cornelius and those with him who had received the Holy Ghost by simply believing the gospel with a repentant heart, asked “can any man forbid water who have not been baptized as well as we”(the answer is no), and he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. And so, based on the scripture water baptism is necessary.  Is it the Word of God or not? By what authority do you state that water baptism is not necessary?  The Apostle Peter said it was necessary even though they had already received the Holy Ghost. Love in Christ, Marty Hi Marty, “I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;” (1Cor.1:14) PAY ATTENTION MARTY: I don't forbid water baptism, an open show of our belief in Christ is necessary. The Jews did this by water baptism, we do this by confessing with our mouth. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed, WRONG.

The only alternative to Water Baptism according to the early church history was dyeing a martyrs death. People heard the truth and then they were water baptized, and then were baptized in the Holy Spirit with the Laying on of hands. THIS was being born again.

I am guessing that if somebody never had the chance to be born again before death, but had received the truth, then believers were baptized on their behalf (I'm guessing).

[2besee]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 17 2013,11:18)

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,09:07) Ed, I leave you to your group, good luck. What group? You mean the Prophets and Apostles?

No, your group here in this conversation.

[Ed J]

Hi 2Besee,

It is not necessary that I even post in this thread.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org[/quote]

[942767]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 17 2013,09:15)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 17 2013,01:56) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 16 2013,03:05) Quote (942767 @ Jan. 16 2013,01:59) Hi Marty, Water baptism does not save us.   Love in Christ, Marty Hi Marty, Then we agree (that it is unnecessary), so why do YOU persist in trying to tell me that it is then? God bless Ed J Hi Ed: I am not trying to tell you anything, but the Apostle Peter speaking to Cornelius and those with him who had received the Holy Ghost by simply believing the gospel with a repentant heart, asked “can any man forbid water who have not been baptized as well as we”(the answer is no), and he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. And so, based on the scripture water baptism is necessary.  Is it the Word of God or not? By what authority do you state that water baptism is not necessary?  The Apostle Peter said it was necessary even though they had already received the Holy Ghost. Love in Christ, Marty Hi Marty, “I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;” (1Cor.1:14) PAY ATTENTION MARTY: I don't forbid water baptism, an open show of our belief in Christ is necessary. The Jews did this by water baptism, we do this by confessing with our mouth. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Ed:

By confessing with your mouth the Lord Jesus, you are stating by that confession that you will obey his commandments.

And so, are you saying that it is not necessary for believers to be baptized in water?

If so, give me the scripture that states this.

The Apostle Paul certainly did not say this by the scripture that you posted. If so, why did he baptize anyone at all? You posted that he baptized Crispus and Gaius. What he said is that God did not send him to baptize but to preach the gospel.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Ed J]

Hi Marty,

“If thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.” (Matt 19:17)
“Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right
 to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.  (Rev 22:14)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[terraricca]

2bee

Quote

Ed, WRONG. The only alternative to Water Baptism according to the early church history was dyeing a martyrs death. People heard the truth and then they were water baptized, and then were baptized in the Holy Spirit with the Laying on of hands. THIS was being born again. I am guessing that if somebody never had the chance to be born again before death, but had received the truth, then believers were baptized on their behalf (I'm guessing).

in your description it looks like that you have placed MEN in power to give the holy spirit
and also to give the gift of LIFE to men ,

any scriptures for this

[2besee]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2013,12:58)

2bee Quote Ed, WRONG. The only alternative to Water Baptism according to the early church history was dyeing a martyrs death. People heard the truth and then they were water baptized, and then were baptized in the Holy Spirit with the Laying on of hands. THIS was being born again. I am guessing that if somebody never had the chance to be born again before death, but had received the truth, then believers were baptized on their behalf (I'm guessing). in your description it looks like that you have placed MEN in power to give the holy spirit and also to give the gift of LIFE to men , any scriptures for this

Hi T,
The laying on of hands – I am not sure where I got that from. Perhaps it happened when I was baptized, I cannot really remember if they did that (it was a long time ago) all that i remember is that we wore white gowns and me and my teenage friends were all water baptized. And I can truly say that my past sins and hurts were gone and I felt as if a new person. I had a lot of learning to do though (about 20 years of mistakes) before I ever experienced the Holy Spirit.

Do not not know where I got the laying of hands from though, perhaps I read it somewhere or in scripture?

[2besee]

Actually, I think I did experience the Holy Spirit as a teenager. I was completely healed from my darkness. But I become lost for a long time, before I was 'brought back'.

[terraricca]

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,08:04)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2013,12:58) 2bee Quote Ed, WRONG. The only alternative to Water Baptism according to the early church history was dyeing a martyrs death. People heard the truth and then they were water baptized, and then were baptized in the Holy Spirit with the Laying on of hands. THIS was being born again. I am guessing that if somebody never had the chance to be born again before death, but had received the truth, then believers were baptized on their behalf (I'm guessing). in your description it looks like that you have placed MEN in power to give the holy spirit and also to give the gift of LIFE to men , any scriptures for this Hi T, The laying on of hands – I am not sure where I got that from. Perhaps it happened when I was baptized, I cannot really remember if they did that (it was a long time ago) all that i remember is that we wore white gowns and me and my teenage friends were all water baptized. And I can truly say that my past sins and hurts were gone and I felt as if a new person. I had a lot of learning to do though (about 20 years of mistakes) before I ever experienced the Holy Spirit. Do not not know where I got the laying of hands from though, perhaps I read it somewhere or in scripture?

2bee

what I try to say is that rituals are made for men to be used in performance to a result,

rituals in Christ are gone ,why because we must worship God in SPIRIT AND TRUTH this combination leaves no room for anything else,

I some times wander if people understand what it means ;

in SPIRIT and TRUTH the dept of it as no limits ,

[2besee]

T,

Worshiping the Father in spirit and in truth — is not just with the mouth and the body as a robot or because everybody else is doing it. True worship is coming from the HEART — as simple as that — it is in truth because you are being truthful. It is a broken heart, a contrite spirit, a heart of love, a heart of trust and dependance. And in that God is pleased.

You also have to obey God and do all that He commands us to do.

[terraricca]

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,08:45)

T, Worshiping the Father in spirit and in truth — is not just with the mouth and the body as a robot or because everybody else is doing it. True worship is coming from the HEART — as simple as that — it is in truth because you are being truthful. It is a broken heart, a contrite spirit, a heart of love, a heart of trust and dependance. And in that God is pleased. You also have to obey God and do all that He commands us to do.

2bee

right you are ,

Pr 2:2 turning your ear to wisdom
and applying your heart to understanding,
Pr 2:6 For the LORD gives wisdom,
and from his mouth come knowledge and understanding.
Pr 2:10 For wisdom will enter your heart,
and knowledge will be pleasant to your soul.
Pr 2:12 Wisdom will save you from the ways of wicked men,
from men whose words are perverse,
Pr 3:13 Blessed is the man who finds wisdom,
the man who gains understanding

Pr 4:5 Get wisdom, get understanding;
do not forget my words or swerve from them.
Pr 4:6 Do not forsake wisdom, and she will protect you;
love her, and she will watch over you.

Pr 4:7 Wisdom(truth of God) is supreme; therefore get wisdom.
Though it cost all you have, get understanding.

Pr 9:10 “The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom,
and knowledge of the Holy One is understanding.

Pr 14:33 Wisdom reposes in the heart of the discerning
and even among fools she lets herself be known.

Pr 19:8 He who gets wisdom loves his own soul;
he who cherishes understanding prospers.
Pr 19:11 A man’s wisdom gives him patience;
it is to his glory to overlook an offense.

Pr 21:30 There is no wisdom, no insight, no plan

that can succeed against the LORD.

Pr 23:23 Buy the truth and do not sell it;
get wisdom, discipline and understanding.

Pr 24:14 Know also that wisdom is sweet to your soul;
if you find it, there is a future hope for you,
and your hope will not be cut off.

Ecc 1:18 For with much wisdom comes much sorrow;
the more knowledge, the more grief.

those are my two favored books wen I was in my twenties ,

[Wakeup]

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,08:49)

Hi Wakeup. Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2013,00:04) 2Besee. Those Churches back then are already being corrupted,if you read the letters to the churches.you will see that they are all being warned by Jesus. But, it was common knowledge handed down from the Disciples and from Jesus himself that water baptism was to be born again. Quote batism is not born again. Because it is contradictory to the scriptures. No, it is not contradictory to the scriptures. Quote Why is it contradictory? 1. Born Of mothers womb.(born of the flesh). 2. Born again at babtism. 3.Born again in spirit in the resurrection.(We are no more flesh but spirit,as the angels). This makes it born 3x. Born again means born only 2x.(born once and born again). Quote from early church, I think this answers it well.: “How mighty is the grace of water, in the sight of God and His Christ, for the confirmation of baptism! Never is Christ without water: if, that is, He is Himself baptized in water; inaugurates in water the first rudimentary displays of his power, when invited to the wedding; invites the thirsty, when He makes a discourse, to Himself being living water; approves, when teaching concerning love, among works of charity, the cup of water offered to a poor child; recruits His strength at a well; walks over the water; willingly crosses the sea; ministers water to his disciples. Onward even to the passion does the witness of baptism last: while He is being surrendered to the cross, water intervenes; witness Pilate’s hands: when He is wounded, forth from His side bursts water; witness the soldier’s lance!… True and stable faith is baptized with water, unto salvation;    pretended and weak faith is baptized with fire, unto judgment.” Quote How many millions have been babtised by the Roman church? Are they all born again? God is the judge. God knows the hearts of men. Are you the only three saved on this planet? What about the number that is seen before the throne of God – too numerous to count – from every tongue, nation, race and people? Yet, you say that the whole world, since the beginning of the church, has been in error, and only you three know the truth (It seems this is what you are saying, correct me if I am wrong) and so everybody has to be retaught by you? So nobody is saved yet. As I said, correct me if I am wrong, but it does seem to be what you are implying? If that is true then why was the Holy Spirit sent, to lead all into truth? Quote If one is babtised by a corrupt preacher;is he born again? Baptism is between the person being baptized and God.

2Besee.

WRONG AGAIN,ALL JUST EMPTY WORDS.

John 4:13 JESUS ANSWERED AND SAID UNTO HER, WHOSOEVER DRINKETH OF **THIS WATER** shall thirst AGAIN: (WHY? ITS JUST WATER).

John 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that *I shall give him* shall *never thirst*; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water *springing up* *into everlasting life*.

wakeup.

[2besee]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 18 2013,01:41)

those are my two favored books wen I was in my twenties ,

[2besee]

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 18 2013,03:30)

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 17 2013,08:49) Hi Wakeup. Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2013,00:04) 2Besee. Those Churches back then are already being corrupted,if you read the letters to the churches.you will see that they are all being warned by Jesus. But, it was common knowledge handed down from the Disciples and from Jesus himself that water baptism was to be born again. Quote batism is not born again. Because it is contradictory to the scriptures. No, it is not contradictory to the scriptures. Quote Why is it contradictory? 1. Born Of mothers womb.(born of the flesh). 2. Born again at babtism. 3.Born again in spirit in the resurrection.(We are no more flesh but spirit,as the angels). This makes it born 3x. Born again means born only 2x.(born once and born again). Quote from early church, I think this answers it well.: “How mighty is the grace of water, in the sight of God and His Christ, for the confirmation of baptism! Never is Christ without water: if, that is, He is Himself baptized in water; inaugurates in water the first rudimentary displays of his power, when invited to the wedding; invites the thirsty, when He makes a discourse, to Himself being living water; approves, when teaching concerning love, among works of charity, the cup of water offered to a poor child; recruits His strength at a well; walks over the water; willingly crosses the sea; ministers water to his disciples. Onward even to the passion does the witness of baptism last: while He is being surrendered to the cross, water intervenes; witness Pilate’s hands: when He is wounded, forth from His side bursts water; witness the soldier’s lance!… True and stable faith is baptized with water, unto salvation;    pretended and weak faith is baptized with fire, unto judgment.” Quote How many millions have been babtised by the Roman church? Are they all born again? God is the judge. God knows the hearts of men. Are you the only three saved on this planet? What about the number that is seen before the throne of God – too numerous to count – from every tongue, nation, race and people? Yet, you say that the whole world, since the beginning of the church, has been in error, and only you three know the truth (It seems this is what you are saying, correct me if I am wrong) and so everybody has to be retaught by you? So nobody is saved yet. As I said, correct me if I am wrong, but it does seem to be what you are implying? If that is true then why was the Holy Spirit sent, to lead all into truth? Quote If one is babtised by a corrupt preacher;is he born again? Baptism is between the person being baptized and God. 2Besee. WRONG AGAIN,ALL JUST EMPTY WORDS. John 4:13   JESUS ANSWERED AND SAID UNTO HER, WHOSOEVER DRINKETH OF **THIS WATER** shall thirst AGAIN: (WHY? ITS JUST WATER).  John 4:14   But whosoever drinketh of the water that *I shall give him* shall *never thirst*; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water *springing up* *into everlasting life*. wakeup.

Wakeup, WAKEUP please.

“Why do you call me `Lord, Lord,' and not do what I tell you?”
Every one who comes to me and hears my words and does them, I will show you what he is like; he is like a man building a house, who dug deep, and laid the foundation upon rock; and when a flood arose, the stream broke against that house, and could not shake it, because it had been well built.
But he who hears and does not do them is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation; against which the stream broke, and immediately it fell, and the ruin of that house was great.”

“And Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
For the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are far off, every one whom the Lord our God calls to him.”
And he testified with many other words and exhorted them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.”
So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls. (Acts 2:38-41)

WHY is this such a hard thing, to 'simply obey the Lord'? WHY?

[2besee]

You can twist and turn the scriptures any way that you are able, to keep them saying what you do not want them to say, because snakes prefer dry and arid places where there is no saving water for those who want to be saved.

You have an audience, your words will always be here. Make sure that you have them right regarding others salvation.

“Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.”
“Except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he can not enter the kingdom of God.”

[Wakeup]

Quote (2besee @ Jan. 18 2013,08:25)

You can twist and turn the scriptures any way that you are able, to keep them saying what you do not want them to say, because snakes prefer dry and arid places where there is no saving water for those who want to be saved. You have an audience, your words will always be here. Make sure that you have them right regarding others salvation. “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.” “Except a man be born of water and of the spirit, he can not enter the kingdom of God.”

2 Besee.

Exactly,if you know what the word repent means.
Anyone ignoring and denying scriptures should repent.

The scriptures are there to be considered,not to be ignored, this only means the spirit is missing.

If the spirit was there he would have eccepted it with rejoycing,not with denial.

For it is the spirit that seeks the things of God,for the love of God. Not for the love of some other doctrine.
So far no one can proof me wrong, and yet,Judge me of teaching wrong.This is called falsely accusing.

wakeup.

[2besee]

Hi Wakeup,

You are teaching contrary to what Jesus taught. Jesus told us to be baptized. Jesus spoke of the saving water. Water has been here from the very beginning. Water is all through scriptures. Water makes us “clean”. Jesus was baptized in water, would you not rather follow in his very footsteps yet you say that being born again does not happen till AFTER death. This is not proven in scriptures. What has been proven in scriptures is that being born again is by spirit and by water. The water is the immersion in water and the burial of your sins, it is being risen from the dead – the spiritual death – it is being born again not of seed corruptible but of seed un-corruptible.

Jesus gives us living water, and if you knew what this meant you would agree with me.

To be baptized today does not necessarily mean that you have to go and join up for a lifetime with some denomination (unless you join a cult). I was baptized in a simple Church (i do not even know what denomination it was). They never demanded that i go, or anything. They just baptized.

Since then I regularly see the saving power of WATER. When I have a simple shower or a bath, I often see things regarding truth because I am again being washed in a way. If you doubt, why do you doubt?  

I do not know all of the fancy words and beliefs that go with baptism, I may have some things wrong, but I know that water baptism will save you. You have to reborn of water AND Spirit.

Open your eyes Wakeup.

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