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Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 10 2010,06:26) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2010,19:00) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 09 2010,16:33) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2010,16:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 09 2010,15:58) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 08 2010,16:18) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 08 2010,13:39) What evidence do you have that I exist?
There is something calling itself bodhitharta that is forming words in a language common to mine. That is what I know to exist. There is also the trivial evidence of things such as the fact that I am familiar with it being only humans who can generate responses in the way “bodhitharta” is doing. I can conceive of other explanations for why I see comprehensible typing on the screen in response to mine, but the greatest probability must be that it is a person doing the typing.I conclude therefore, that while there is a tiny chance I am being deceived, the overwhelming case leads to the provisional conclusion that I am interacting with a human being.
I detect further evidence that the person is indeed a convert to islam, as there are aspects of his style of debate that can be seen in the tactics employed by other islamists, such as ignoring good points made in opposition, and passing off pure assertion as rational argument.
Stuart
Sorry, there is no evidence that I exist, who am I?
How about you read my post and reconsider whether you paid any attention to the two pieces of evidence I gave you. Then get back to me when you have overcome your own laziness.Stuart
You have no evidence, I could be T8
I gave you the evidence that suggested to me that you were muslim!Although, you shifting the goalposts by changing the question from one about existence to one about identity is quite a christian thing to do, also.
Stuart
How can you rely on that evidence?How can you possibly prove I exist or my identity?
What if T8 is playing the role of several different identities to keep the site interesting? In-fact what if T8 is also one of the made up identities?
What if BD and Kejonn are the same people and ED and Karmarie are the same people?
Now you have shifted the goal posts again, from 'evidence' (and, as I was explaining to you, the provisional conclusions you draw from that evidence) to 'proof'.Can you stick to one concept for longer than half a post?
I assume you know something about philosophy and Descartes: you cannot even prove your own existence, you have to take that as an unprovable assumption.
So no I cannot prove you exist.
Is this just a general conversation now, or are we still discussing your Imaginary Friend?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2010,12:32) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 10 2010,06:26) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2010,19:00) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 09 2010,16:33) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2010,16:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 09 2010,15:58) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 08 2010,16:18) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 08 2010,13:39) What evidence do you have that I exist?
There is something calling itself bodhitharta that is forming words in a language common to mine. That is what I know to exist. There is also the trivial evidence of things such as the fact that I am familiar with it being only humans who can generate responses in the way “bodhitharta” is doing. I can conceive of other explanations for why I see comprehensible typing on the screen in response to mine, but the greatest probability must be that it is a person doing the typing.I conclude therefore, that while there is a tiny chance I am being deceived, the overwhelming case leads to the provisional conclusion that I am interacting with a human being.
I detect further evidence that the person is indeed a convert to islam, as there are aspects of his style of debate that can be seen in the tactics employed by other islamists, such as ignoring good points made in opposition, and passing off pure assertion as rational argument.
Stuart
Sorry, there is no evidence that I exist, who am I?
How about you read my post and reconsider whether you paid any attention to the two pieces of evidence I gave you. Then get back to me when you have overcome your own laziness.Stuart
You have no evidence, I could be T8
I gave you the evidence that suggested to me that you were muslim!Although, you shifting the goalposts by changing the question from one about existence to one about identity is quite a christian thing to do, also.
Stuart
How can you rely on that evidence?How can you possibly prove I exist or my identity?
What if T8 is playing the role of several different identities to keep the site interesting? In-fact what if T8 is also one of the made up identities?
What if BD and Kejonn are the same people and ED and Karmarie are the same people?
Now you have shifted the goal posts again, from 'evidence' (and, as I was explaining to you, the provisional conclusions you draw from that evidence) to 'proof'.Can you stick to one concept for longer than half a post?
I assume you know something about philosophy and Descartes: you cannot even prove your own existence, you have to take that as an unprovable assumption.
So no I cannot prove you exist.
Is this just a general conversation now, or are we still discussing your Imaginary Friend?
Stuart
Quote So no I cannot prove you exist. Yet, I do exist.
So believing whether or not I exist is based upon your experience and knowledge of me and it is the same with God.
God has shown me that He has existed in ways that far surpass your conclusion that I exist.
Quote Yet, I do exist. So believing whether or not I exist is based upon your experience and knowledge of me and it is the same with God.
God has shown me that He has existed in ways that far surpass your conclusion that I exist.
And yet you are utterly unable to demonstrate the reality of any of that to me. I certainly accept that this god exists in your imagination, and that there are versions of it in the imaginations of many other people. This is why the only honest society is a secular one, though. People should have to be able to demonstrate the reality of what they propose we accept. Otherwise any old crackpot can come along with his “revelation” and expect to be taken seriously.Apart from the reason that we might fear for our safety because followers of your religion have intimidated (and visited violence on) people in the name of that religion, why should we take your unsupported claims any more seriously than anyone else's?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,10:03) Quote Yet, I do exist. So believing whether or not I exist is based upon your experience and knowledge of me and it is the same with God.
God has shown me that He has existed in ways that far surpass your conclusion that I exist.
And yet you are utterly unable to demonstrate the reality of any of that to me. I certainly accept that this god exists in your imagination, and that there are versions of it in the imaginations of many other people. This is why the only honest society is a secular one, though. People should have to be able to demonstrate the reality of what they propose we accept. Otherwise any old crackpot can come along with his “revelation” and expect to be taken seriously.Apart from the reason that we might fear for our safety because followers of your religion have intimidated (and visited violence on) people in the name of that religion, why should we take your unsupported claims any more seriously than anyone else's?
Stuart
Do you drive a vehicle and if so how do you trust the vehicles that travel along side of you?Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 11 2010,15:16) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,10:03) Quote Yet, I do exist. So believing whether or not I exist is based upon your experience and knowledge of me and it is the same with God.
God has shown me that He has existed in ways that far surpass your conclusion that I exist.
And yet you are utterly unable to demonstrate the reality of any of that to me. I certainly accept that this god exists in your imagination, and that there are versions of it in the imaginations of many other people. This is why the only honest society is a secular one, though. People should have to be able to demonstrate the reality of what they propose we accept. Otherwise any old crackpot can come along with his “revelation” and expect to be taken seriously.Apart from the reason that we might fear for our safety because followers of your religion have intimidated (and visited violence on) people in the name of that religion, why should we take your unsupported claims any more seriously than anyone else's?
Stuart
Do you drive a vehicle and if so how do you trust the vehicles that travel along side of you?
In what way would I need to 'trust a vehicle'?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,16:05) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 11 2010,15:16) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,10:03) Quote Yet, I do exist. So believing whether or not I exist is based upon your experience and knowledge of me and it is the same with God.
God has shown me that He has existed in ways that far surpass your conclusion that I exist.
And yet you are utterly unable to demonstrate the reality of any of that to me. I certainly accept that this god exists in your imagination, and that there are versions of it in the imaginations of many other people. This is why the only honest society is a secular one, though. People should have to be able to demonstrate the reality of what they propose we accept. Otherwise any old crackpot can come along with his “revelation” and expect to be taken seriously.Apart from the reason that we might fear for our safety because followers of your religion have intimidated (and visited violence on) people in the name of that religion, why should we take your unsupported claims any more seriously than anyone else's?
Stuart
Do you drive a vehicle and if so how do you trust the vehicles that travel along side of you?
In what way would I need to 'trust a vehicle'?Stuart
Why do you trust other drivers?Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don'tQuote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,13:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Is cosciousness an inherent quality?Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,21:13) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,13:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Is cosciousness an inherent quality?
Wake me up when you have decided to post something that is eitherA. intelligible; or
B. interesting.Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,23:41) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,21:13) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,13:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Is cosciousness an inherent quality?
Wake me up when you have decided to post something that is eitherA. intelligible; or
B. interesting.Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.
Stuart
Has man always been conscious?Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,13:59) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,23:41) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,21:13) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,13:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Is cosciousness an inherent quality?
Wake me up when you have decided to post something that is eitherA. intelligible; or
B. interesting.Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.
Stuart
Has man always been conscious?
Do you mean as opposed to unconscious?Conscious of what?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 13 2010,16:14) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,13:59) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,23:41) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,21:13) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2010,13:30) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 12 2010,11:09) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 11 2010,18:51) Is this going somewhere BD? Stuart
I'm just showing you that you trust where you think you don't
What?Stuart
Is cosciousness an inherent quality?
Wake me up when you have decided to post something that is eitherA. intelligible; or
B. interesting.Zzzzzzzzzzzzz.
Stuart
Has man always been conscious?
Do you mean as opposed to unconscious?Conscious of what?
Stuart
Of his surroundings and his selfOf course consciousness evolved. Every aspect of every living organism is a product of evolution by natural selection.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,08:29) Of course consciousness evolved. Every aspect of every living organism is a product of evolution by natural selection. Stuart
How would consciousness evolve?Also since evolution is a slow process how would there be any initial evolution in the first living beings?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:20) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,08:29) Of course consciousness evolved. Every aspect of every living organism is a product of evolution by natural selection. Stuart
How would consciousness evolve?Also since evolution is a slow process how would there be any initial evolution in the first living beings?
Anything arises because an allele appears as a more marked phenotype of one section of a population, and bears a survival and reproductive advantage resulting in the gene having an increased frequency in the population.That's how.
What is 'initial evolution'?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,15:12) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:20) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,08:29) Of course consciousness evolved. Every aspect of every living organism is a product of evolution by natural selection. Stuart
How would consciousness evolve?Also since evolution is a slow process how would there be any initial evolution in the first living beings?
Anything arises because an allele appears as a more marked phenotype of one section of a population, and bears a survival and reproductive advantage resulting in the gene having an increased frequency in the population.That's how.
What is 'initial evolution'?
Stuart
how would the allele “know” that it bears a survival and reproductive advantage? In other words why would an alternative DNA sequence suddenly appear?And how long would it take? Obviously it couldn't happen in a single lifetime or according to the theory many lifetimes, right?
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