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Quote The next time you are mugged in a dark alley, ask the attacker if they will kill you if you don't give them your money. If they answer “yes”, then ask them if they have a strong faith in God. My guess is they would probably say no. What do others think this mugger's answer would be.
Yes or no.
Agreed. You are just as likely to be mugged by a Catholic as you are by an Athiest. But when it comes to “mass murders” it seems religion is always involved. People don't mug someone because of a dispostion to religion, one way or the other. They do commit genocide, etc because of religion. They do try to stamp out and kill people of one religion because of their religion. They suddenly feel justified in killing, because they believe God sanctions it. It is that kind of killing that is the most dangerous.
T8. Do you not think that some day the U.N. will say they've had enough with religion? I believe according to Revelation, the U.N. will one day try to stamp out and outlaw all religion. They will do this because they will feel it is in the best interests of peace.
A few points david.
A person that mugs, steals, rapes, or whatever, most likely doesn't care that much about the after-life and judgement. Non-belief would surely only help or give less reasons to care about such crimes. Such crimes when added up must constitute as one of the biggest forms of violence on the planet. As far as mass-murders in the name of religion, I bet that most of these are actually politically motivated and not the result of biblical or other beliefs. Sure some mis-guided efforts would exist, but I doubt that WW1 and 2 for example where about God, rather about empires seeking conquests to become bigger.
Also, Stalin, Mao, Alexander the Great were not about religion from what I can tell. Just bad old fashioned conquests done to bring glory to their own name and perhaps using religion where and if appropriate.
Who knows what the sum total of atheism really is to humanity. I don't think studies have been done regarding how no hope after death effects this life and how it is viewed. Does it aid in suicide, depression, lack of hope? I am sure it must for some people, but whatever the outcome, I cannot see it as being a positive view of existence least of all because it gives humans finite value, with no inherent love toward people, but most of all because it is a lie and no good comes from a lie.
Yes I think that one day religion will be banned as a result of bad people using Islam, Christianity, and whatever else as some kind of justification for their murderous ways. Not many can see that in order to destroy something, you can join it, then mis-represent it, leading people to think that the problem is the name in which they use rather than the person's own despicable heart. However, if this happens, it will have to be replaced by a religion, (a set of rules that says what is permissible and what is to be believed). So it will really be a religion that vies for dominance at the expense of all others.
2 Thessalonians 2:3-4
Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.Hi Stu.
I haven't listened to the video yet, but I wonder if he include the religion of non-belief?
Or is he suggesting that non-belief only, and no other belief? If so, then his idea is biased toward his belief. Either way, I bet he doesn't include his own beliefs in the same way that he probably condemns others.History shows us that there are always people wrestling for control of information. Nazis, PC, Commies, Denominations, Atheists. They are all the same really. One group tries to take over from another group and if they succeed then it happens again. Like a pendulum mankind never seems to be able to stop suddenly in the middle, but will move from one extreme to another. It is called rebellion I suppose. And rebellion often doesn't take a fair view, more likely an opposite view which has its own inherent problems.
Quote (t8 @ April 15 2010,15:14) Hi Stu. I haven't listened to the video yet, but I wonder
So maybe the cure for wondering is to listen to Hitchens first, then post after that.You know, trousers THEN shoes when dressing?
Stuart
T8 wrote:
Quote A person that mugs, steals, rapes, or whatever, most likely doesn't care that much about the after-life and judgement. Non-belief would surely only help or give less reasons to care about such crimes. Such crimes when added up must constitute as one of the biggest forms of violence on the planet. Government murders in the 20th century: 169,198,000* Source (*This does not include war dead which increases the number to 203,000,000.)
“Private” murders in the 20th century: 8,500,000 SourceWhile the people who run governments are politically motivated, the people who kill for their leaders are often motivated by their personal religious beliefs, (i.e. they are fighting “evil”). The most successful political leaders know how to use people's religious sentiments for their own political purposes.
When was the last time you heard a political leader candidly announce, “We are going to invade Country X so that we can take their resources and build our empire!”? Nearly every war is sold on both sides as fighting against some real or imagined evil that must be stomped out at all costs.
By the way, I don't think that atheists are immune to this kind of “religious” branding of wars, but theists of all stripes are particularly energized by it. Ask any red blooded evangelic in the U.S., and he will gladly inform you that the U.S. is engaged in a holy war against muslims, whereas an atheist is more likely to see it as a war against religious extremism. In reality, the latest U.S. wars are exactly as they have been described by their chief proponents: an attempt to politically reshape the middle east in favor of the U.S. and its closest ally Israel.
Quote (david @ Feb. 24 2010,18:43) I believe you are quite wrong on this. And until a couple hundred years ago, it was hard to find any self proclaimed athiests. Quote In the name of creating their version of a religion-free utopia, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, and Mao Zedong produced the kind of mass slaughter that no Inquisitor could possibly match. Here is 30 pictures of Hitler shaking hands with Catholic clergy, who fully supported him. Catholic (and maybe some protestant) soldiers fought his wars, not athiest soldiers.
http:
//www.remnantofgod.org/NaziRCC.htm
There are also pictures of the pope, bishops, and cardinals meeting with him, of the clergy saluting him.I think there has been far more bloodshed spilled because of people claiming to be “Christian” than by athiests.
The thing is not all Priests and Bishops were like that… Some even died because they did not do what they wanted. So it goes for many Germans too. Most had no idea what was going on. The S.S. Soldiers came to our Home and got a Jewish Family that lived next door. My Mother had to sign a paper that she would not have any more Children, because my Grandmother had Asthma. She was also on that list….Luckily the war was over before they could get her….And since I too had Asthma and now C.O.P.D. I too would be dead now, if Hitler would have succeeded…..I lost my Father and all of my Uncles but one. Georg too lost His Father. There are no winners in any war….
IreneQuote (Stu @ April 15 2010,20:05) Quote (t8 @ April 15 2010,15:14) Hi Stu. I haven't listened to the video yet, but I wonder
So maybe the cure for wondering is to listen to Hitchens first, then post after that.You know, trousers THEN shoes when dressing?
Stuart
True that, but I was making a prediction and a prediction is only a prediction when you haven't seen the outcome.Just making a point, to demonstrate aptly as to why I do not bother listening to such people sometimes, because I already know in advance what their argument and defense is and that is not good enough to spark an interest from me.
By all means, if my prediction is not true, then I will at least give him a go. He might have something compelling and new. But I doubt it. It is likely to be the same old non-belief ranting that we hear from you. “There is no God”, yeah right.
please consider that Mother Theresa of Calcutta was not only christian but a CATHOLIC christian?
??? how many of the muslim faith or the arab world are renowned for their compassion?YE SHALL KNOW THEM BY THEIR FRUITS,not all priests are homosexual predators just as not ALL muslims are terrorists.Men or women make choices as to how they behave.Given something noble and good,no matter how good,given enough time MEN will find a way to screw it up.IF the bible is divinely inspired then rationally it is subject to divine interpretation which would be and is impossible to understand without HOLY SPIRIT intervention.Little wonder why it is so difficult for most to grasp. 
how does someone find fault with a GOD they do not even believe in to begin with.In the beginning………………………………………………………………………
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Quote (t8 @ April 17 2010,12:08) Quote (Stu @ April 15 2010,20:05) Quote (t8 @ April 15 2010,15:14) Hi Stu. I haven't listened to the video yet, but I wonder
So maybe the cure for wondering is to listen to Hitchens first, then post after that.You know, trousers THEN shoes when dressing?
Stuart
True that, but I was making a prediction and a prediction is only a prediction when you haven't seen the outcome.Just making a point, to demonstrate aptly as to why I do not bother listening to such people sometimes, because I already know in advance what their argument and defense is and that is not good enough to spark an interest from me.
By all means, if my prediction is not true, then I will at least give him a go. He might have something compelling and new. But I doubt it. It is likely to be the same old non-belief ranting that we hear from you. “There is no God”, yeah right.
And how are you going to know if your prediction is not true in order to give him a go, unless you give him a go?Stuart
I don't. But I doubt it matters.
Time is precious. If you can give a compelling reason, then I will watch it.
Quote (t8 @ April 22 2010,22:03) I don't. But I doubt it matters. Time is precious. If you can give a compelling reason, then I will watch it.
The compelling reason is that you must discover the accuracy of your prophecy.Stuart
Not compelling enough coz it is not a prophecy, but a guess based on similar stuff I have seen in the past.
Needs to be more compelling than that, as I have more important things to do. Oh, the kettle just boiled. Got a go.Quote (t8 @ April 23 2010,16:55) Not compelling enough coz it is not a prophecy, but a guess based on similar stuff I have seen in the past.
Needs to be more compelling than that, as I have more important things to do. Oh, the kettle just boiled. Got a go.
OK. Bye.Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Feb. 25 2010,06:00) Oh guys sorry. Atheism must be the answer to all man's ills. Atheists never do wrong and always pay their taxes. Every single person in the word that was ever murdered was over a religious difference. 
Umm Revelation 18:23-24 speaks of the harlot as… 23 and no light of a lamp will ever shine in you again, and no voice of a bridegroom and of a bride will ever be heard in you again; because your traveling merchants were the top-ranking men of the earth, for by your spiritistic practice all the nations were misled. 24 Yes, in her was found the blood of prophets and of holy ones and of all those who have been slaughtered on the earth.”Maybe Atheism is part of a plethora of new age teachings?
Welcome betweenchristendomandjws.
Interesting name. You don't need to explain it, it is self-explanatory.
I think you can say that there is truth at each end, but what is important is not who you join, but who you know.
BTW, we can't join the Church because we are the Church. The Church is the Body of Christ.
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