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Wakeup,
Sorry for this long post.
Continued….Quote 3. What is the difference between born of God and begotten of God? There is no difference in the words “born of God” and “begotten of God”.
It is the same word used in each of the biblical occurrences, and it is the Greek word “Gennáō”There is another word “Monogenes” often translated also as begotten, which has only nine occurrences in the New testament, with only four occurrences pertaining to Jesus. It is not the same word. It can also mean 'Unique' and some translations, such as the “International Standard Version” have chosen to translate it as 'unique'.
“The Word became flesh and lived among us. We gazed on his glory, the kind of glory that belongs to the Father’s unique Son, who is full of grace and truth.” John 1:14
“No one has ever seen God. The unique God, who is close to the Father’s side, has revealed him.” John 1:18
“For this is how God loved the world: He gave his unique Son so that everyone who believes in him might not be lost but have eternal life. ” John 3:16
“Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God’s unique Son.” John 3:18
“By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered Isaac—he who had received the promises was about to offer his unique son in sacrifice, about whom it had been said, “It is through Isaac that descendants will be named for you.” Hebrews 11:17
“This is how God’s love was revealed among us: God sent his unique Son into the world so that we might live through him.”1John 4:9
And that is the ONLY occurrences of that word “monogenes” pertaining to the topic, compared to the exclusive word “Gennáō” which I will touch upon soon.
The above can be verified with the following links:
http://biblos.com/john/3-16.htm
http://biblesuite.com/greek/3439.htm
http://biblesuite.com/greek/strongs_3439.htm——————–
As for the correct word for beget..
1080 gennáō – properly, beget (procreate a descendant), produce offspring; (passive) be born, “begotten.”
This is found (only) in the following verses:
(Those marked with an asterisk are pertaining to natural birth – I will only quote those that are pertaining to something different)
*Matt 1:1-16
Matt 1:20
'But as he considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit; she will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins.'
*Matt 2:1
*Matt 2:4
*Matt 19:12
*Matt 26:24
*Mark 14:21
*Luke 1:13Luke 1:35
'And the angel said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.'
*Luke 1:57
*Luke 23:29John 1:12-13
'But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God; who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.'John 3:3-8
'Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” Nicode'mus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?” Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, `You must be born anew.' The wind blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know whence it comes or whither it goes; so it is with every one who is born of the Spirit.”*John 8:41
*John 9:2-34
*John 16:21
*John 18:37——————
*Acts 7:8-29
Acts 13:33
'And we bring you the good news that what God promised to the fathers, this he has fulfilled to us their children by raising Jesus; as also it is written in the second psalm, `Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee.'*Acts22:3
*Acts 22:28
*Romans 9:11
*Gal 4:23-29
*2Tim 2:23
1Cor 4:15
Philemon 1:10—————–
Hebrews 1:5
'For to what angel did God ever say,”Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee”? Or again, “I will be to him a father, and he shall be to me a son”?Hebrews 5:5
'So also Christ did not exalt himself to be made a high priest, but was appointed by him who said to him, “Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee”Hebrews 11:12
'Therefore from one man, and him as good as dead, were born descendants as many as the stars of heaven and as the innumerable grains of sand by the seashore.'*Hebrews 11:23
*2Peter 2:121John 2:29
'If you know that he is righteous, you may be sure that every one who does right is born of him.'1John 3:9
'No one born of God commits sin; for God's nature abides in him, and he cannot sin because he is born of God.'1John 4:7
'Beloved, let us love one another; for love is of God, and he who loves is born of God and knows God.'1John 5:1-18
'Every one who believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God, and every one who loves the parent loves the child.'The above can be verified with these links:
http://biblesuite.com/greek/strongs_1080.htm
http://biblesuite.com/greek/1080.htm%5B/color%5D—————-
So what can we learn in that?
—————–
Quote 4.What is the difference between born again, and the renewing of the mind? 'I therefore urge you, brothers, in view of God’s mercies, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices that are holy and pleasing to God, for this is the reasonable way for you to worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but continuously be transformed by the renewing of your minds so that you may be able to determine what God's will is—what is proper, pleasing, and perfect.'
It means what it says. Submit to God, do God's will, do not be conformed to the ways of the world, but be transformed by the renewing your mind, to God.
Quote 6.How many times can one be born, according the scriptures? To be honest. Literally, once.
Of water, and spirit, a second time.Quote (journey42 @ Feb. 08 2013,11:24) Quote (2besee @ Feb. 08 2013,06:13) Wakeup, Aren't you going to join me in the other thread?
2BesseWhat question did you ask wakeup in the hot seat?
All I can see is quotes.
Hi Journey.It is not a hotseat topic just a discussion, but I wanted to discuss without interruption, because this was becoming too hard to follow.
This is okay though, I guess.
Sorry, one of those links is not working above, for 1080 gennáō
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 08 2013,09:54) Wakeup,
Sorry for this long post.
Continued….Quote 3. What is the difference between born of God and begotten of God? There is no difference in the words “born of God” and “begotten of God”.
It is the same word used in each of the biblical occurrences, and it is the Greek word “Gennáō”There is another word “Monogenes” often translated also as begotten, which has only nine occurrences in the New testament, with only four occurrences pertaining to Jesus. It is not the same word. It can also mean 'Unique' and some translations, such as the “International Standard Version” have chosen to translate it as 'unique'.
“The Word became flesh and lived among us. We gazed on his glory, the kind of glory that belongs to the Father’s unique Son, who is full of grace and truth.” John 1:14
“No one has ever seen God. The unique God, who is close to the Father’s side, has revealed him.” John 1:18
“For this is how God loved the world: He gave his unique Son so that everyone who believes in him might not be lost but have eternal life. ” John 3:16
“Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God’s unique Son.” John 3:18
“By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered Isaac—he who had received the promises was about to offer his unique son in sacrifice, about whom it had been said, “It is through Isaac that descendants will be named for you.” Hebrews 11:17
“This is how God’s love was revealed among us: God sent his unique Son into the world so that we might live through him.”1John 4:9
And that is the ONLY occurrences of that word “monogenes” pertaining to the topic, compared to the exclusive word “Gennáō” which I will touch upon soon.
The above can be verified with the following links:
http://biblos.com/john/3-16.htm
http://biblesuite.com/greek/3439.htm
http://biblesuite.com/greek/strongs_3439.htm——————–
As for the correct word for beget..
1080 gennáō – properly, beget (procreate a descendant), produce offspring; (passive) be born, “begotten.”
This is found (only) in the following verses:
(Those marked with an asterisk are pertaining to natural birth – I will only quote those that are pertaining to something different)
*Matt 1:1-16
Matt 1:20
'But as he considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit; she will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins.'
*Matt 2:1
*Matt 2:4
*Matt 19:12
*Matt 26:24
*Mark 14:21
*Luke 1:13Luke 1:35
'And the angel said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.'
*Luke 1:57
*Luke 23:29John 1:12-13
'But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God; who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.'John 3:3-8
'Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” Nicode'mus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?” Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, `You must be born anew.' The wind blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know whence it comes or whither it goes; so it is with every one who is born of the Spirit.”*John 8:41
*John 9:2-34
*John 16:21
*John 18:37——————
*Acts 7:8-29
Acts 13:33
'And we bring you the good news that what God promised to the fathers, this he has fulfilled to us their children by raising Jesus; as also it is written in the second psalm, `Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee.'*Acts22:3
*Acts 22:28
*Romans 9:11
*Gal 4:23-29
*2Tim 2:23
1Cor 4:15
Philemon 1:10—————–
Hebrews 1:5
'For to what angel did God ever say,”Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee”? Or again, “I will be to him a father, and he shall be to me a son”?Hebrews 5:5
'So also Christ did not exalt himself to be made a high priest, but was appointed by him who said to him, “Thou art my Son, today I have begotten thee”Hebrews 11:12
'Therefore from one man, and him as good as dead, were born descendants as many as the stars of heaven and as the innumerable grains of sand by the seashore.'*Hebrews 11:23
*2Peter 2:121John 2:29
'If you know that he is righteous, you may be sure that every one who does right is born of him.'1John 3:9
'No one born of God commits sin; for God's nature abides in him, and he cannot sin because he is born of God.'1John 4:7
'Beloved, let us love one another; for love is of God, and he who loves is born of God and knows God.'1John 5:1-18
'Every one who believes that Jesus is the Christ is a child of God, and every one who loves the parent loves the child.'The above can be verified with these links:
http://biblesuite.com/greek/strongs_1080.htm
]http://biblesuite.com/greek/1080.htm[/color]—————-
So what can we learn in that?
—————–
Quote 4.What is the difference between born again, and the renewing of the mind? 'I therefore urge you, brothers, in view of God’s mercies, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices that are holy and pleasing to God, for this is the reasonable way for you to worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but continuously be transformed by the renewing of your minds so that you may be able to determine what God's will is—what is proper, pleasing, and perfect.'
It means what it says. Submit to God, do God's will, do not be conformed to the ways of the world, but be transformed by the renewing your mind, to God.
Quote 6.How many times can one be born, according the scriptures? To be honest. Literally, once.
Of water,
and spirit, a second time.
2Besee.Thank you for all those scriptures.
Basically it is this what you should concentrate on.
1.If you are born of God; you **CAN NOT SIN**.
do you really blieve that you CAN NOT SIN? Be honest.2. If you are BEGOTTEN of God; you keep your self
from sinning.
We still can sin occasionally. **WE CAN SIN**.
3. If we can not sin,we will be as Jesus,we **WONT NEED*
FORGIVENESS OF SIN. For we are clean.4. If you are born of the spirit;YOU ARE SPIRIT LIKE THE
WIND. Well no one I have seen; is like the wind.5. You will be as the wind when you have come out of your grave,just as Jesus. He came out of his grave,and is as the wind, he can go through closed doors.
If you really, genuinely believe that you CAN NOT SIN YOU ARE FOOLING YOURSELF,THE TRUTH IS NOT IN YOU.
1John. 1:10.If we say that we have not sinned,we make him a liar,and his word is not in us.*****************************************
IF WE LOVE ONE ANOTHER,WE ARE BORN OF GOD.
MEANING; LOVE COMES FROM GOD AND HE HAS PASSED IT UNTO US. WE HAVE THE SPIRIT OF LOVE IN US FROM GOD,WE ARE BORN OF GOD.BUT NOT PHYSICALLY. BUT SPIRITUALLY A LOVING PERSON.
THE FLESH IS STILL THE SAME UNTILL THE CHANGE COMES. AND THAT IS AT THE COMING.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,10:43) 2Besee. Thank you for all those scriptures.
Basically it is this what you should concentrate on.If you are born of God; you **CAN NOT SIN**.
do you really blieve that you CAN NOT SIN? Be honest.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“He that is begotten of God keepeth himself,
and that wicked one toucheth him not.” (1John 5:18)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,10:43) 2Besee If we can not sin,we will be as Jesus,we **WONT NEED*
FORGIVENESS OF SIN. For we are clean.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.” (Luke 5:31-32)“Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man,
unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:” (Eph 4:13)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgHi 2Besee.
You agreed that we can only be born 2x.
1. Our natural birth.
2. Our spiritual birth.Now we can start from here.
This only means that there is no other physical births in between.There is though a renewing of the mind,a coversion of thinking. And that is the mind of Christ.
We have left behind us the old thinking of the world.
That is past,gone.From now on we follow Christ and his commandments.
Love your neighbour as your self.
Seek the scriptures,for in it is everlasting life.Seek the scriptures means eating the flesh of Christ.
Not strange flesh,for that will only cause confusion.Most have fallen into the trap of reading books ABOUT THE BIBLE,and they also are not one in spirit,but there are so many different ideas,and interpretations.
The idea is to keep us away from reading the bible.
Many books are written,by the will of satan,to keep us busy.Back to the subject of born again.
We will be born again when our change has come,at the second coming,then we will be spirits,like the wind.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,23:26) Hi 2Besee. You agreed that we can only be born 2x.
1. Our natural birth.
2. Our spiritual birth.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,We all agree with that!
It is how you define point #2
where the disagreement comes in.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 08 2013,23:09) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,10:43) 2Besee. Thank you for all those scriptures.
Basically it is this what you should concentrate on.If you are born of God; you **CAN NOT SIN**.
do you really blieve that you CAN NOT SIN? Be honest.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“He that is begotten of God keepeth himself,
and that wicked one toucheth him not.” (1John 5:18)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.Agreed; and signed,and stamped.
wakeup.
Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 08 2013,23:15) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,10:43) 2Besee If we can not sin,we will be as Jesus,we **WONT NEED*
FORGIVENESS OF SIN. For we are clean.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.” (Luke 5:31-32)“Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man,
unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:” (Eph 4:13)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EdJAgreed; signed,and stamped,and sealed.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,
See it's not hard to find agreement and just let the chaff fall away.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,00:21) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,23:26) Hi 2Besee. You agreed that we can only be born 2x.
1. Our natural birth.
2. Our spiritual birth.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,We all agree with that!
It is how you define point #2
where the disagreement comes in.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.You dont agree with point 2.
Born again to you is when you have received the holy spirit. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,00:21) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 08 2013,23:26) Hi 2Besee. You agreed that we can only be born 2x.
1. Our natural birth.
2. Our spiritual birth.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,We all agree with that!
It is how you define point #2
where the disagreement comes in.God bless
Ed J
EDJ.You dont agree with point 2.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Yes I do agree with point #2.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,00:21) Hi Wakeup, It is how you define point #2
where the disagreement comes in.God bless
Ed J
EDJ.Born again to you is when you have received the holy spirit. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,It is how you define point #2
where the disagreement comes in.Born again is when you've received God's HolySpirit,
Not our “Physical” resurrection from the dead.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.So what do you call the resurrection?
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:27) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.So what do you call the resurrection?
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“The Resurrection”
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:45) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:27) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.So what do you call the resurrection?
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“The Resurrection”
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.I knew you would say that.
But what exactly is the resurrection.
What will be happening in the resurrection.
Just spit it out.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,10:50) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:45) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:27) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.So what do you call the resurrection?
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“The Resurrection”
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.(1) I knew you would say that.
(2) But what exactly is the resurrection.
(3) What will be happening in the resurrection.
Just spit it out.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,1)
2) Cessation of death.
3) Can you be a tad more specific?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,16:24) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,10:50) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:45) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:27) Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 09 2013,02:23) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 09 2013,02:06) EDJ. The resurrection is not born again.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,Correct, that is why it is called “Resurrection”, not born again.
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.So what do you call the resurrection?
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,“The Resurrection”
God bless
Ed J
EDJ.(1) I knew you would say that.
(2) But what exactly is the resurrection.
(3) What will be happening in the resurrection.
Just spit it out.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,1)
2) Cessation of death.
3) Can you be a tad more specific?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.The birth of Zions children will be in ONE DAY.
Not so; with the receiving of the oly spirit,for not all have received the Holy spirit in the ONE DAY.The apostles and brothers have received it 2000yrs ago.
And since then all seekers received the Holy spirit in their time.NOT ALL IN ONE DAY.The new birth(born again) will happen in ONE DAY.
THE DAY of the resurrection.Can you understand?
wakeup.
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