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Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 14 2010,14:08) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,20:48) I hate to tell you this Kejonn but without God and an afterlife existing there is no logical reason to be “moral” So theists say. But the very logical reason that we have “morals” (which are subjective) is the survival of our species. The Golden Rule ensures that we live another day. Without it, we'd be wild beasts, killing one another for the sport of it. No god is holding us back, our very survival is.
And afterlife means nothing. It is imaginary. It holds no weight. What is here and now is the true test.
Quote Because morality cannot exist without an Authoritive standard of what it is to be Moral. Malarkey. The “authoritative standard” is our fellow humans in our societies. No sky daddy that works on ancient precepts and behavior.
Quote If there is no absolute judge and no absolute judgement then all morality is arbitrary and meaningless. For you. You've already shown that you are selfish without the fear of a god. Some of us have enough care and compassion for our fellow man — for the other inhabitants of our planet — to not disrespect life so easily.
Quote If there were no God why in the world would I not be selfish and self-centered in the extreme? Because of your fear of the god you have created in your own mind. That god does not have to exist, just your imaginings of who he could be if he was real.
Quote Why would you respect life? what would be the point of that? It sounds nice but someone who loves life a little more than you might want to take all of what you have so that they can have more and they wouldn't even worry about if it was right or wrong because if God doesn't exist they can't be wrong or right they could just be living or dead. Without God what “true values in life” are there?
Life itself. If I'm lucky, I will live to be 90+ like my grandmother, or 80+ like my dad who is still alive and working 5 days a week! My dad has been an atheist all of his life, and he has been a good man. Not the best father, not the best husband, but overall, he has not gone out of his way to harm anyone. IOW, he did the best he could as a human. He has made it all of this time without the fear of some sky daddy, what is his excuse?
Quote STU already has admitted that as an atheist he believes that Morality is a human construct and if that is true life is Amoral
If Stu said that, then all it means is that we as humans are the only ones who even care to make a distinction. The rest of the animal world does what it takes to survive, even if that means helping their fellows. They do not sit and ponder about it (as far as we know), they just do it. They do not need to imagine some higher power to keep them in line.
Kejonn,What are you talking about wild beast survive just fine and they take what they want and kill whoever gets in their way.
But more importantly without God why would anyone care about the life of others beyond themselves including their children?
It is a fact that drug addicts, alcoholics and others with certain issues can at times have an erosion of morality that takes place where they don't care about anything other than getting a fix or whatever their obsession.
If there is no God aren't they just being natural?
It seems your dad wasn't truly commited to being an atheist it amazes me that an atheist would limit themselves to a false construct of morality but at the same time utilizing their atheism whenever needed to justify an error of judgement.
Think about it he can steal sometimes but most of the time he will not, he can cheat on your mom but most of the time not. It's like having a confused moral code
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:30) Quote STU already has admitted that as an atheist he believes that Morality is a human construct and if that is true life is Amoral
How does this logic work? Morality is a human construct, so therefore morals exist. How then can you claim that in this view life is amoral?Stuart
Because it is an individual construct and therefore arbitraryQuote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:58) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:30) Quote STU already has admitted that as an atheist he believes that Morality is a human construct and if that is true life is Amoral
How does this logic work? Morality is a human construct, so therefore morals exist. How then can you claim that in this view life is amoral?Stuart
Because it is an individual construct and therefore arbitrary
Are YOU claiming it is an individual contruct, or are you claiming that I said it was an individual construct?I said nothing of the sort.
In any case, how does arbitrary mean amoral?
Stuart
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,21:55) What are you talking about wild beast survive just fine and they take what they want and kill whoever gets in their way. Name some and we will discuss. Most of the animal kingdom do what they can to survive, not what they want because they have the power. That takes humanity.
Quote But more importantly without God why would anyone care about the life of others beyond themselves including their children? Seriously? Because life is precious. It is all we have! That you do not recognize that is the reason you must believe in some sky tyrant.
The more your reveal of your true character, the more I'm glad I do not know you in person. I think that without your god belief that you would be a very bad person.
Quote It is a fact that drug addicts, alcoholics and others with certain issues can at times have an erosion of morality that takes place where they don't care about anything other than getting a fix or whatever their obsession.[/quoe] Wow, now we're talking extremes. Drugs and alcohol influence the mind and can twist our sensibilities. Why go to such an an extreme? Is that all you have at this point? The god believers s those under the influence of mind-altering chemicals?
If there is no God aren't they just being natural?
It seems your dad wasn't truly commited to being an atheist it amazes me that an atheist would limit themselves to a false construct of morality but at the same time utilizing their atheism whenever needed to justify an error of judgement.
My dad never cared about atheism or theism. He simply did not care about believing in a god. He did not feel it was worth his time, as he saw no evidence that a god existed. He was unlike me as i was under the influence of theism or so many years. Now I must struggle to remove the vestiges of mythology from my mindset.
Quote Think about it he can steal sometimes but most of the time he will not, he can cheat on your mom but most of the time not. It's like having a confused moral code
Hahahahaha, theists do all of those things to. You are a fool if you think otherwise. They lie, cheat, and steal. They are humans.You seem to have lost a grip on reality.
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,15:06) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:58) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:30) Quote STU already has admitted that as an atheist he believes that Morality is a human construct and if that is true life is Amoral
How does this logic work? Morality is a human construct, so therefore morals exist. How then can you claim that in this view life is amoral?Stuart
Because it is an individual construct and therefore arbitrary
Are YOU claiming it is an individual contruct, or are you claiming that I said it was an individual construct?I said nothing of the sort.
In any case, how does arbitrary mean amoral?
Stuart
If their is no Authority then it would have to be an individual construct, right?Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 14 2010,16:32) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,21:55) What are you talking about wild beast survive just fine and they take what they want and kill whoever gets in their way. Name some and we will discuss. Most of the animal kingdom do what they can to survive, not what they want because they have the power. That takes humanity.
Quote But more importantly without God why would anyone care about the life of others beyond themselves including their children? Seriously? Because life is precious. It is all we have! That you do not recognize that is the reason you must believe in some sky tyrant.
The more your reveal of your true character, the more I'm glad I do not know you in person. I think that without your god belief that you would be a very bad person.
Quote It is a fact that drug addicts, alcoholics and others with certain issues can at times have an erosion of morality that takes place where they don't care about anything other than getting a fix or whatever their obsession.[/quoe] Wow, now we're talking extremes. Drugs and alcohol influence the mind and can twist our sensibilities. Why go to such an an extreme? Is that all you have at this point? The god believers s those under the influence of mind-altering chemicals?
If there is no God aren't they just being natural?
It seems your dad wasn't truly commited to being an atheist it amazes me that an atheist would limit themselves to a false construct of morality but at the same time utilizing their atheism whenever needed to justify an error of judgement.
My dad never cared about atheism or theism. He simply did not care about believing in a god. He did not feel it was worth his time, as he saw no evidence that a god existed. He was unlike me as i was under the influence of theism or so many years. Now I must struggle to remove the vestiges of mythology from my mindset.
Quote Think about it he can steal sometimes but most of the time he will not, he can cheat on your mom but most of the time not. It's like having a confused moral code
Hahahahaha, theists do all of those things to. You are a fool if you think otherwise. They lie, cheat, and steal. They are humans.You seem to have lost a grip on reality.
You misunderstand my point.The reason I am compassionate and Merciful to others is not just because I believe in God but Because God is Real and hence we see Mercy and Compassion being expressed as Ideals that don't always work for the benefit of our survival.
If God did not exist to be the most successful in safety and security would simply be strong rule the weak, period.
If You have a wife and I want her what would be the purpose or reason in resisting, If I see that you have items I want that could improve my lot tell me why wouldn't I take them?
Why would I feel guilt for any reason that increased my lot?
When we believe in God we feel guilt when we do wrong because we believe there is right and wrong. but an atheist in the trues sense must be amoral.
Can you tell me why it would be “wrong” to have sex with your family members? Or animals?
Why would it be “wrong” to completely dominate your Father or Mother and why would it be “wrong” to lie or to bear false witness?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,23:53) You misunderstand my point. The reason I am compassionate and Merciful to others is not just because I believe in God but Because God is Real and hence we see Mercy and Compassion being expressed as Ideals that don't always work for the benefit of our survival.
Dude, in the last few responses to me, you have admitted that, as an unbeliever, you were a nasty person. So it takes a belief in some god for you to get back in line with civilized society. That's scary, because others in your religion take god belief to another extreme that leads to the death of others.
Quote If God did not exist to be the most successful in safety and security would simply be strong rule the weak, period. The strong still rule the weak, your god is not intervening.
Quote If You have a wife and I want her what would be the purpose or reason in resisting, If I see that you have items I want that could improve my lot tell me why wouldn't I take them? Why would I feel guilt for any reason that increased my lot?
When we believe in God we feel guilt when we do wrong because we believe there is right and wrong. but an atheist in the trues sense must be amoral.
Again, bullhockey. You assert, yet you provide zero evidence. Please feel free to provide evidence or even the other theists will see your empty responses.
Quote Can you tell me why it would be “wrong” to have sex with your family members? Or animals? Having sex with family members could possibly lead to pregnancy. Such pregnancy could lead to birth defects because of interbreeding. Seriously, you need to study some science.
As far as having sex with animals, the animal cannot give consent. Sex should be between adult parties who give consent that is not under duress. Again, the Golden Rule fits rather well here.
Quote Why would it be “wrong” to completely dominate your Father or Mother and why would it be “wrong” to lie or to bear false witness?
You are warped. I can see what your life would be without the fear of your imaginary god. It is not pretty, and I am glad you are on the other side of the screen from me.That you cannot see humanity's role in resisting such things is indicative of your depravity.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,16:43) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,15:06) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:58) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:30) Quote STU already has admitted that as an atheist he believes that Morality is a human construct and if that is true life is Amoral
How does this logic work? Morality is a human construct, so therefore morals exist. How then can you claim that in this view life is amoral?Stuart
Because it is an individual construct and therefore arbitrary
Are YOU claiming it is an individual contruct, or are you claiming that I said it was an individual construct?I said nothing of the sort.
In any case, how does arbitrary mean amoral?
Stuart
If their is no Authority then it would have to be an individual construct, right?
Let me introduce you to the concept of democracy….Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:25) Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,11:10) Stu, so do you support the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yes it is sad that in Malaysia things like this are happening. It is sad that countries like Iraq were invaded, It is also sad that Haiti was hit with a deadly earthquake yesterday.
Afghanistan: yes. Although it did not have official sanction of the UN Security Council it was a widely supported international action that I think was justified ethically. The Taliban was certainly harbouring terrorists and making the region, and the world, unsafe. They did invade with the cooperation of the UN-recognised government of Afghanistan, the Northern Alliance.Iraq: no. Regime change by an idiot of a president whose father failed at regime change during the last invasion, and his UK poodle Tony Blair, against international law and backed by lies about imminent military threats and involvement with terrorism on the part of Saddam Hussein was an offense to decent moral people everywhere.
Saddam was a monster and the Kurds were suffering appallingly, but he was effectively a secular leader with control over Iraq, and was not protecting terrorists, with whom he had no sympathy. There were no weapons either. Now we have a breeding ground for terrorists where none existed before, and Afghanistan is in stalemate itself possibly because Iraq has consumed so much of the available resources.
Bush and Blair are war criminals in my opinion.
Of the four countries you mentioned, the only one not suffering from the effects of islamic violent jihad is Haiti. Because they had an earthquake! Iraq wasn't suffering from jihadist violence until Bush and Blair went in. Afghanistan still has Taliban-inspired insurgencies but they are better-off since Bush went in. Malaysia is following the pattern of what islamists have done elsewhere. Give a muslim extremist an inch and he incites others to violently steal the whole mile.
What do you think?
Stuart
Completly agree with you on most except Afghanistan which I dont know much about ,think I will go find out more.I think Haiti is a mainly Christian country- Catholic according to CNN, scary how in just a few minutes everything can crumble down like that. Could happen anywhere at any time.
Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,20:40) I think Haiti is a mainly Christian country- Catholic according to CNN, scary how in just a few minutes everything can crumble down like that. Could happen anywhere at any time.
Does God not like Catholics, or is he just testing their faith?Tim
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,16:40) I wanted to disprove God so I went on a quest to do so
Hi BD,Was this the point when you took satan to be your god?
Ed J
Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,20:40) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:25) Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,11:10) Stu, so do you support the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yes it is sad that in Malaysia things like this are happening. It is sad that countries like Iraq were invaded, It is also sad that Haiti was hit with a deadly earthquake yesterday.
Afghanistan: yes. Although it did not have official sanction of the UN Security Council it was a widely supported international action that I think was justified ethically. The Taliban was certainly harbouring terrorists and making the region, and the world, unsafe. They did invade with the cooperation of the UN-recognised government of Afghanistan, the Northern Alliance.Iraq: no. Regime change by an idiot of a president whose father failed at regime change during the last invasion, and his UK poodle Tony Blair, against international law and backed by lies about imminent military threats and involvement with terrorism on the part of Saddam Hussein was an offense to decent moral people everywhere.
Saddam was a monster and the Kurds were suffering appallingly, but he was effectively a secular leader with control over Iraq, and was not protecting terrorists, with whom he had no sympathy. There were no weapons either. Now we have a breeding ground for terrorists where none existed before, and Afghanistan is in stalemate itself possibly because Iraq has consumed so much of the available resources.
Bush and Blair are war criminals in my opinion.
Of the four countries you mentioned, the only one not suffering from the effects of islamic violent jihad is Haiti. Because they had an earthquake! Iraq wasn't suffering from jihadist violence until Bush and Blair went in. Afghanistan still has Taliban-inspired insurgencies but they are better-off since Bush went in. Malaysia is following the pattern of what islamists have done elsewhere. Give a muslim extremist an inch and he incites others to violently steal the whole mile.
What do you think?
Stuart
Completly agree with you on most except Afghanistan which I dont know much about ,think I will go find out more.I think Haiti is a mainly Christian country- Catholic according to CNN, scary how in just a few minutes everything can crumble down like that. Could happen anywhere at any time.
Well that is a very interesting point, because while various kinds of natural disaster do affect most areas of the world indiscriminately, devastating earthquakes do not happen just anywhere.I wonder about the thinking of those who claim earthquakes as punishments, for example. They obviously think the most immoral people live around the edges of tectonic plates!
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,07:28) I wonder about the thinking of those who claim earthquakes as punishments, for example. They obviously think the most immoral people live around the edges of tectonic plates! Stuart
Well, California is a good example. Hollywood and San Francisco and all that.Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 14 2010,17:05) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 13 2010,23:53) You misunderstand my point. The reason I am compassionate and Merciful to others is not just because I believe in God but Because God is Real and hence we see Mercy and Compassion being expressed as Ideals that don't always work for the benefit of our survival.
Dude, in the last few responses to me, you have admitted that, as an unbeliever, you were a nasty person. So it takes a belief in some god for you to get back in line with civilized society. That's scary, because others in your religion take god belief to another extreme that leads to the death of others.
Quote If God did not exist to be the most successful in safety and security would simply be strong rule the weak, period. The strong still rule the weak, your god is not intervening.
Quote If You have a wife and I want her what would be the purpose or reason in resisting, If I see that you have items I want that could improve my lot tell me why wouldn't I take them? Why would I feel guilt for any reason that increased my lot?
When we believe in God we feel guilt when we do wrong because we believe there is right and wrong. but an atheist in the trues sense must be amoral.
Again, bullhockey. You assert, yet you provide zero evidence. Please feel free to provide evidence or even the other theists will see your empty responses.
Quote Can you tell me why it would be “wrong” to have sex with your family members? Or animals? Having sex with family members could possibly lead to pregnancy. Such pregnancy could lead to birth defects because of interbreeding. Seriously, you need to study some science.
As far as having sex with animals, the animal cannot give consent. Sex should be between adult parties who give consent that is not under duress. Again, the Golden Rule fits rather well here.
Quote Why would it be “wrong” to completely dominate your Father or Mother and why would it be “wrong” to lie or to bear false witness?
You are warped. I can see what your life would be without the fear of your imaginary god. It is not pretty, and I am glad you are on the other side of the screen from me.That you cannot see humanity's role in resisting such things is indicative of your depravity.
You are being inconsistent if there is no God how could someone be labled as being depraved?What are you talking about people do have sex with animals and their relatives are you saying their wrong and if you are by what standard are you judging by?
And why would consent matter once that person dies according to you that's it. why would they need consent or follow some “Golden Rule”?
Humanity has only resisted such things because of belief in God. Notice that the Bible has to actually state that you should not lay with animals so obviously people are doing such a thing that they need to be told not to.
Let me ask you, are homosexuals depraved? If you think so, why and if you think not why?
You never told me why it would be wrong that if there was no God to completely enslave your parents?
bodhitharta wrote:
Quote You are being inconsistent if there is no God how could someone be labled as being depraved? What are you talking about people do have sex with animals and their relatives are you saying their wrong and if you are by what standard are you judging by?
And why would consent matter once that person dies according to you that's it. why would they need consent or follow some “Golden Rule”?
It's called social capital. People who reject social norms find it difficult to survive after a while. “No man is an island.” We all depend on others to prosper in life. The golden rule perfectly exemplifies this concept.
By the way, social norms evolve. Two hundred years ago, few “decent” people would have batted an eye about the institution of slavery in the US. Now, if a public person uses a racial slur, he or she is pretty much ostracized and will find it very difficult to prosper. Five hundred years ago, “decent” people thought that it was “moral” to spread religion by the sword. Oh wait. That still happens!
Social capital – the great re-enforcer of our better tendencies. Learn about it.
Quote (WhatIsTrue @ Jan. 15 2010,10:26) bodhitharta wrote: Quote You are being inconsistent if there is no God how could someone be labled as being depraved? What are you talking about people do have sex with animals and their relatives are you saying their wrong and if you are by what standard are you judging by?
And why would consent matter once that person dies according to you that's it. why would they need consent or follow some “Golden Rule”?
It's called social capital. People who reject social norms find it difficult to survive after a while. “No man is an island.” We all depend on others to prosper in life. The golden rule perfectly exemplifies this concept.
By the way, social norms evolve. Two hundred years ago, few “decent” people would have batted an eye about the institution of slavery in the US. Now, if a public person uses a racial slur, he or she is pretty much ostracized and will find it very difficult to prosper. Five hundred years ago, “decent” people thought that it was “moral” to spread religion by the sword. Oh wait. That still happens!
Social capital – the great re-enforcer of our better tendencies. Learn about it.
The problem with your response is that it didn't answer my question. When slavery was perfectly acceptable in America it was because of Social Capital which is really just another word for Politics. What stopped slavery in America was Religion and the belief in God.People like the Quakers, Those who took part in the underground railroad and others who used their “social capital” to end it.
Social norms don't really evolve at all those who are religious have been consistently trying to eliminate the same things.
By the way slavery was never acceptable to everyone in the U.S.
But slavery still exist in the U.S. and other places.
The fact is those who are ungodly will give your kids dangerous drugs, rape your sisters, defraud you out of your money…etc.
The fact is if one is an atheist they don't believe that there is any such thing as an absolute authority or standard. If there is no God there is no ultimate judge and no far reaching reward or punishment beyond the life we live here and now.
Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 15 2010,01:49) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,07:28) I wonder about the thinking of those who claim earthquakes as punishments, for example. They obviously think the most immoral people live around the edges of tectonic plates! Stuart
Well, California is a good example. Hollywood and San Francisco and all that.
Did we wonder who would be first?No prizes! Yes it is that insufferable idiot Pat Robertson. How refreshing to have a US administration willing to call him on his mindless nonsense.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Jan. 15 2010,00:28) Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,20:40) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 14 2010,14:25) Quote (karmarie @ Jan. 14 2010,11:10) Stu, so do you support the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yes it is sad that in Malaysia things like this are happening. It is sad that countries like Iraq were invaded, It is also sad that Haiti was hit with a deadly earthquake yesterday.
Afghanistan: yes. Although it did not have official sanction of the UN Security Council it was a widely supported international action that I think was justified ethically. The Taliban was certainly harbouring terrorists and making the region, and the world, unsafe. They did invade with the cooperation of the UN-recognised government of Afghanistan, the Northern Alliance.Iraq: no. Regime change by an idiot of a president whose father failed at regime change during the last invasion, and his UK poodle Tony Blair, against international law and backed by lies about imminent military threats and involvement with terrorism on the part of Saddam Hussein was an offense to decent moral people everywhere.
Saddam was a monster and the Kurds were suffering appallingly, but he was effectively a secular leader with control over Iraq, and was not protecting terrorists, with whom he had no sympathy. There were no weapons either. Now we have a breeding ground for terrorists where none existed before, and Afghanistan is in stalemate itself possibly because Iraq has consumed so much of the available resources.
Bush and Blair are war criminals in my opinion.
Of the four countries you mentioned, the only one not suffering from the effects of islamic violent jihad is Haiti. Because they had an earthquake! Iraq wasn't suffering from jihadist violence until Bush and Blair went in. Afghanistan still has Taliban-inspired insurgencies but they are better-off since Bush went in. Malaysia is following the pattern of what islamists have done elsewhere. Give a muslim extremist an inch and he incites others to violently steal the whole mile.
What do you think?
Stuart
Completly agree with you on most except Afghanistan which I dont know much about ,think I will go find out more.I think Haiti is a mainly Christian country- Catholic according to CNN, scary how in just a few minutes everything can crumble down like that. Could happen anywhere at any time.
Well that is a very interesting point, because while various kinds of natural disaster do affect most areas of the world indiscriminately, devastating earthquakes do not happen just anywhere.I wonder about the thinking of those who claim earthquakes as punishments, for example. They obviously think the most immoral people live around the edges of tectonic plates!
Stuart
More I think to do with faultlines and plates, not an angry God, Samoa was the same.Jesus said only that it was a sign of the times, that there would be an increase in earthquakes, famines, wars.
Karmarie
Quote More I think to do with faultlines and plates, not an angry God, Samoa was the same.
Absolutely. The Pat Robertsons of the world live in an insane religious fantasy.Quote Jesus said only that it was a sign of the times, that there would be an increase in earthquakes, famines, wars.
And yet there has been no change at all in earthquake frequency, it is just that we have been better at detecting them!Maybe Jesus wasn't a seismologist.
Stuart
Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 14 2010,14:51) You are being inconsistent if there is no God how could someone be labled as being depraved? No inconsistency. You are behaving — or at least using certain words — as one who is outside of societal norms for accepted behavior. It does not take a god belief to make that judgment call.
Quote What are you talking about people do have sex with animals and their relatives are you saying their wrong and if you are by what standard are you judging by? Is it wrong? The bible did not think so. People had sex with their relatives all the time. As for sex with animals, well, just not my cup of tea, as is incest.
But do I have a right to tell others who to have sex with? No, its their choice. Again, the animal cannot give consent so it is not a willing act by both parties, so to me, that is wrong.
Again, no god needed.
Quote And why would consent matter once that person dies according to you that's it. why would they need consent or follow some “Golden Rule”? The Golden Rule basically says “do unto others as you'd have them do unto you”. Now, that can even be warped by some sick minds, but it seems to work for the majority of humanity when carried out.
Consent matters because you have the right to do whatever you want to yourself, but your rights do not extend to doing unwanted things to others. It has nothing to do with what happens after we die — its all about what happen while we are here.
Quote Humanity has only resisted such things because of belief in God. Biggest lie of the day. There have been countless people killed in the name of some god. Your religion is our modern day example.
Quote Notice that the Bible has to actually state that you should not lay with animals so obviously people are doing such a thing that they need to be told not to. And the package of dessicate in a shoe box says “Do not eat”. You can find directions on a shampoo bottle. Your point?
Quote Let me ask you, are homosexuals depraved? If you think so, why and if you think not why? No, not if their actions are between two consenting adults. Why should I care what two consenting adults do with each other? Why should you?
Quote You never told me why it would be wrong that if there was no God to completely enslave your parents?
It is wrong to enslave anyone. Again, the Golden Rule applies. Do you want to be enslaved? Then you will not try to enslave others.It really is that simple.
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