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Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 21 2008,09:10) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 20 2008,15:52) Hi SOL,
Not really.
We can refer back to ALL that is written.
You have to remove parts like Paul's teachings and add sympathetic writings.
But there are gnostic writings that are written. The Koran is written. the Book of Mormon is written. L. Ron Hubbard's works on Scientology are written.So what you are saying is that you believe in the Protestant canon of books that are written, right?
HI KJ,
Are you having doubts about the bible?
Which books trouble you?To claim that the gnostics had strange beliefs ignore the strange beliefs of the “orthodox”:
Orthodox Christianity is the belief that God has multiple personality disorder and that he loved the world so much that he sent one of his split personalities to earth as his son, thus becoming his own father, so that he can then kill himself in order to appease his own wrath through the shedding of blood and become a cosmic Jewish zombie because by doing so he can forgive you and make you live forever if you telepathically apologize and tell him that you accept him as your master, be dunked in water 3 times while the names of God’s split personalities are uttered and symbolically eat his flesh and drink his blood so that he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a woman made out of a rib bone ate from a magical tree after being tricked by an infinitely sadistic being who was disguised as a talking snake with legs. If you do not have enough faith to believe that this plan of salvation is literally true then God will throw you into a pool of lava filled with demons where you will still live forever anyway but with the stipulation of being on fire.
Hi SOL,
I can see why you devised your own kinder gnostic religion
but your understanding of the truth is very warped.Quote (david @ Jan. 20 2008,18:03) Quote Most will be happy to see [Tow] go, I'm sorry to say. He that is not on my side is against me, and he that does not gather with me scatters.–mat 12:30
Tow was clearly “against” Jesus.
How sad should we be to see someone who is against the son of God?
Or do you no longer have faith in this fundamental truth, because of him?
Either Tow is correct, or Jesus is. They cannot both be.
If Tow is correct, Jesus was a false messiah and liar.
If Jesus is correct, Tow is a stumbling block who is destroying your life and the lives of others.Goodbye mandy. While I'm glad I met you, I now wish you had never found this place.
david
Mandy, you had earlier told me that his posts were laced with lies and that you were afraid he would deceive “many” on this forum.When I was saying that I wished you hadn't found this place, I was essentially agreeing with your earlier words. You were right.
Quote It seems that those who hold strict belief systems do not want me to falter from them. –mandy
More accurately mandy, you began by believing that he was filled with lies and would deceive many, and now yet, you say you are sad to see him go. To “falter” means to be “unsure or weak.”
What I do not want you to falter from is your faith in Jesus as the Messiah. Yes, do some research. But NO, do not succomb to his “lies” as you yourself called them. You yourself stating that many would be deceived by them. I just don't want you to be among the many you spoke of.
More than anything, I think some on here are trying to protect you, whether you like it or not. And I'm sorry for that, but the motivation is love and a certain experience and knowledge in these matters that leads us to believe it's better not to taste the poison.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 20 2008,20:26) Soak in the scriptures and accept for now what is not yet understandable.
You know Nick, this has significant meaning to me this evening.I watched the movie Moses tonight. And there was a part that really spoke to me; Miriam had had it with the desert and she began to question God's motives, she said, “I'm sure God knows where we are headed – where the Promised Land is – why doesn't he just take us there? Why must we continue to aimlessly wonder?” And then of course we know the story, she received a terrible consequence for her questioning and was cast out of the camp for 7 days! Goodness.
I'm a lot like Miriam. She was asking the same question that I am asking today…….why must we continue to wonder about who and what God is – surely he could just tell us so that we could eliminate all doubt and have the absolute truth.
But what did Moses tell Miriam? He said, “If we are supposed to know then God would tell us.” And he also said, “Do you think we are ready to know?” This really is something for me to ponder tonight….
But meanwhile I will take your advice and accept for now what is not yet understandable. Because I love him. And because I want to follow him – even if I am wondering in the desert. I guess I must be there for a reason.
Thanks, brother, for your patience and loving wisdom to me. And for your prayers.
Love,
MandyQuote (david @ Jan. 20 2008,17:35) isaiah 1:18, every time I say something about Isaiah 53 referring to the Messiah, you respond: “No, that's incorrect,” ok?
Not a problem Dave, you know it comes naturally for me with you…Quote (david @ Jan. 20 2008,17:40) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Jan. 20 2008,07:59) I see the HN believers have been dubbed the “fundies” over there… 
In my experience these new forums either take off or die a slow (and sometimes quick) death. There is a honeymoon period where everyone loves eachother, and think “our point of difference is that we are all truth seekers here and isn't it great that in this site everyone gets along”. The irony is this harmony is the eventual source of people losing interest in the site. It's contention that fuels enthusiam in visiting the forum usually, especially for men who are competitive by nature. Woman can survive on the nicites and platitudes for longer but men quickly bore of them and crave argument. I predict it won't be long until that site is just like this one, perhaps more acrimoneous. Either that or it will will die.
Interesting observations, Is 1:18
Don;t get too smug David, the watchtower would argue about scriptural things as well…if they were allowed to….Quote (david @ Jan. 21 2008,16:10) Quote It seems that those who hold strict belief systems do not want me to falter from them. –mandy
More accurately mandy, you began by believing that he was filled with lies and would deceive many, and now yet, you say you are sad to see him go. To “falter” means to be “unsure or weak.”
What I do not want you to falter from is your faith in Jesus as the Messiah. Yes, do some research. But NO, do not succomb to his “lies” as you yourself called them. You yourself stating that many would be deceived by them. I just don't want you to be among the many you spoke of.
More than anything, I think some on here are trying to protect you, whether you like it or not. And I'm sorry for that, but the motivation is love and a certain experience and knowledge in these matters that leads us to believe it's better not to taste the poison.
Thanks, David. Your concern comes through loud and clear.And yes, isn't it ironic that I was one of the first to announce that doubt had entered our camp, and yet I was one of the first to fall into it's pit. Curious, huh? Well, everything happens for a reason and there is a lesson in it all. I am learning those lessons.
Doubt can lead one in search of truth so not all doubt is bad. Some doubt that what they are learning in school is true and decide for themselves that the world must have a devine Creator, and they go on to find God. So in this way, doubt turned out well and fine. The doubt we fear is the one that leads us away from God…….but trust me and believe this, I have not given-way to this type of doubt. NO! I trust my God to see me through this time of wondering in the desert.
Some of us learn the hard way. But we do learn.
Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 21 2008,00:20) Quote (david @ Jan. 20 2008,00:40) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Jan. 20 2008,07:59) I see the HN believers have been dubbed the “fundies” over there… In my experience these new forums either take off or die a slow (and sometimes quick) death. There is a honeymoon period where everyone loves eachother, and think “our point of difference is that we are all truth seekers here and isn't it great that in this site everyone gets along”. The irony is this harmony is the eventual source of people losing interest in the site. It's contention that fuels enthusiam in visiting the forum usually, especially for men who are competitive by nature. Woman can survive on the nicites and platitudes for longer but men quickly bore of them and crave argument. I predict it won't be long until that site is just like this one, perhaps more acrimoneous. Either that or it will will die.
Interesting observations, Is 1:18
Perhaps it will do what you say IS, time will tell. However, the difference is we are not scared to talk about things over there. Over here all people want to do is attack others character if they don't believe a certain way. I had enough of that while I was in a church.If someone questions the bible over here, all they get is reprimands and excuses. None of us are children, we don't need this. If someone is not willing to actually get into why certain things may be the way they are, either say so or leave it alone. Don't respond with “It is written” because what is written in one place may not agree with what is written in another.
Give me a break. The ugliest exchanges I have seen in my time at Heaven.net have been in the last 6 months, and you kejonn were in the thick of it. Get off your holier than thou pedestal and quit with this 'them and us' nonsense!Quote (Is 1:18 @ Jan. 21 2008,17:48) Quote (kejonn @ Jan. 21 2008,00:20) Quote (david @ Jan. 20 2008,00:40) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Jan. 20 2008,07:59) I see the HN believers have been dubbed the “fundies” over there… In my experience these new forums either take off or die a slow (and sometimes quick) death. There is a honeymoon period where everyone loves eachother, and think “our point of difference is that we are all truth seekers here and isn't it great that in this site everyone gets along”. The irony is this harmony is the eventual source of people losing interest in the site. It's contention that fuels enthusiam in visiting the forum usually, especially for men who are competitive by nature. Woman can survive on the nicites and platitudes for longer but men quickly bore of them and crave argument. I predict it won't be long until that site is just like this one, perhaps more acrimoneous. Either that or it will will die.
Interesting observations, Is 1:18
Perhaps it will do what you say IS, time will tell. However, the difference is we are not scared to talk about things over there. Over here all people want to do is attack others character if they don't believe a certain way. I had enough of that while I was in a church.If someone questions the bible over here, all they get is reprimands and excuses. None of us are children, we don't need this. If someone is not willing to actually get into why certain things may be the way they are, either say so or leave it alone. Don't respond with “It is written” because what is written in one place may not agree with what is written in another.
Give me a break. The ugliest exchanges I have seen in my time at Heaven.net have been in the last 6 months, and you kejonn were in the thick of it. Get off your holier than thou pedestal and quit with this 'them and us' nonsense!
I've done a lot of reading in the archives here at HeavenNet, and trust me, I've seen uglier – where have you been Isaiah?Say, why is it that you haven't been here for a while and since you've been back all I've read from you is negative or you are on someone's back? Is the baby not sleeping? Usually I really feel like I've learned something from reading your posts – lately I haven't been able to tell yours from some of the other's around here…..which isn't a compliment by the way.
Thanks for the feed back, I'll take it into account. Plenty going on in my life, rather not divulge though.
Cheers
I guess I'm coming down on you because I hold you in such high esteem. Sorry. I guess I expect more from you because I have been privy to your many debates and teachings. Anyway brother, sorry. I hope all is well or at least that you will have grace to make it through what you need to go through. Prayers are with you. I've been going through a hard time, too. So, again, sorry I'm so curt with you tonight.
Love,
MandyThere are no great dramas going on in my life ATM, sorry if I gave you that impression, it's just a VERY busy life. I have been given extra responsibilities at work for instance (a commercial role, on top of the technical/scientific one). And yes, my darling son is still managing to wake up at about 4:30am most mornings lately. No need to apologise Mandy, I've got pretty thick skin (usually).
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 21 2008,20:23) Hi SOL,
So the groupings of men are irrelevant.
Christ is one who follows God's leadings.
I dont understand, Nick.Please clarify what you mean.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 21 2008,20:36) Hi Sol,
Forget all the labels,
Reborn sons of God do not need them.Only men do.
I agree we don't need labels.Christ is the truth to me.
I don't know exactly what to believe, I don't know exactly what to do, but I DO know how I should become.
Christ in you the hope of glory!
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