A coincidence or a creation?

[selah]

A COINCIDENCE OR A CREATION?

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.  Proverbs 9:10.

Here is wisdom.  Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is six hundred threescore and six.  Rev 13:18.

There were many languages available in the day of John of Patmos, but God does NOT state the language to be used to solve this mystery.

I believe He does not identify the language, because it was not in existence in that day, but rather, it will be a common language of the last days during the time of the numbered beast.

I believe it to be the world recognized language of our day … English.

The Bible was written in Aramaic, Hebrew and Greek … they did not have a separate numbering system, as each letter had a numeric value … this is called “gematria”.

“Roman” Numerals … 1 V X L C D are a form of gematria.  They just “happen” to sum at … 666
Could this be an indication pointing to “Roman” Catholicism … I think so.

This has been a study for me going on 30 years.  The following are some examples of “simple English Gematria” wherein A=1 … Z=26

 
Isaiah 20:1 speaks of a specific Assyrian king, but skeptical historians said he did not exist.  They said this because the discovery of an obelisk stone with the names of the Assyrian kings that had ruled that empire made no mention of him.
 
The University of Chicago made a bold statement that they had found a glaring contradiction in the Bible.  The “experts” said he did not exist, the Bible said he did!
 
God would have laughed at these “great men” for archaeology finally discovered this king's palace.  How did they know it was his?  Because the measurement of the palace wall was the gematria of that king’s name.
 
The information I present involves “gematria”, wherein an alphabet letter is assigned a numerical value … as was the case with Hebrew and Greek.
 
THE FIRST RECORDED USE OF GEMATRIA was found on that king's palace wall.
 
The name of that king was … Sargon.  
 
SARGON = 74
 

MOSES “MESSIAH SIGN” . . . 74

God The Great Mathematician and His two “EVERLASTING WITNESSES”

It has been said that there is only one PURE science . . . . . . . . mathematics.

A book in my library is titled … “Mathematics Queen & Servant of Science”.

I hope to provide concrete, visual evidence that our Great God has encrypted His mathematics into the Torah as a sign TO THE JEW that Jesus is the Messiah.

The sign that God placed is the personal “signet” of  Y’SHUA . . . JESUS.

This particular sign is placed in, what Jesus called, the first and great commandment to Jew and Gentile … Deut 6:4.  Hear, O Israel: the Lord our God is one Lord.

This is the “Shema” and is one of two verses that God commanded the Jew to be kept before their very eyes, and in literal obedience, the Orthodox Jew places the phylactery (small box) containing those two verses upon his forehead “between his eyes”.

shemA  Israel  Jehovah  elohenu  Jehovah  echaD

Note the two extra large letters  A – D

They are the last letter of the first word and the last letter of the last word.  They are “end signs”.  I believe they are God’s last sign to the Jew that Jesus is their Messiah, and a sign of the times … our time, the end time.

Except for the Masoretes and those that study “Magna Parva and Finalis”, most Christians and Jews are unaware of the fact that when Moses was writing Torah, God inspired him to place these two majuscule signs in Deut 6:4.

There are 11 confirmed occurrences of these mysterious large letters in the Torah.
The first one occurs in the first letter in Genesis.  Another one in Leviticus marks the middle letter in the Torah, and another marks the middle verse in Torah.

But, ONLY ONCE do two of these strange majuscule letters ever occur TOGETHER.
Such is the case in this first and great commandment.

To this day, God’s PURPOSE for these two large letters remains a mystery, but Rabbi Bochin states that together (‘ain/daleth) form the meaning “everlasting witness”.

See Strong’s Concordance # 5707 & 5703 regarding   DE & AD

The Bible speaks about a nation being born “in a day”.

Prior to 1948 the State of Israel was not in existence and Hebrew was considered a dead language.  These two witnesses have lain there as dead for 3 ½ prophetic days (Ps 90)  That is, 3,500 years since the day God inspired Moses to place them there.

Moses’ psalm 90 states: For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch (witness) in the night …….. so teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

The “witness” ‘Ain, has the Hebrew value of 70 assigned to it.
The other witness, Daleth has the Hebrew value of 4. Together, these “two ancient witnesses” sum at . .  74

I was informed by a statistician that ONE out of every 70 to 80  UNRELATED  words could possibly sum at 74 using a=1  b=2  … z=26.  The evidence I present is of RELATED words that sum at 74.

As further confirmation to Jew and Gentile of this mathematical sign, God ALSO designed ain and daleth to sum at 74, USING SIMPLE ENGLISH GEMATRIA.

AIN = 24  DALETH = 50 . . . (24 + 50 = 74)

I stress the term “simple” because some Christians in their zeal have devised some pretty complex systems to “make” some suspect sum at 666. 
Please note that it is God that designed the number 666 not Satan.

Simple English gematria is simply … a=1  b=2 … z=26

Is it coincidence that the following words using simple English gematria sum at 74 ?

SIMPLE = 74
ENGLISH = 74
GEMATRIA = 74

In that God gave us a special sign, an “everlasting witness” to place before our eyes (3,500 years so far) I would ask a question of the JEWISH READER.

Was Jesus the Jewish Messiah that was rejected?

JESUS = 74
JEWISH = 74
MESSIAH = 74

Jesus in Hebrew is Y’shua, and in Greek it is Joshua.

Y’SHUA = 74
JOSHUA = 74

I noted that God through Moses placed the personal “signet” of Jesus in Deut 6:4.

SIGNET = 74

Did Jesus die on the cross … did He preach the gospel … did He speak in parables?

CROSS = 74
GOSPEL = 74
PARABLES = 74

Revelation speaks of a mystery … “the key” of David.

THE KEY = 74

73 of the 150 psalms in the Book of Psalms are attributed to David.
The book of Revelation speaks about a “new song”.  If David wrote a new song, it would be his song number … 74

David’s “new song” added to the existing 150 psalms would result in there being 151. 

JESUS CHRIST = 151

SONGS = 74
MELODY = 74

The word “song/songs” (form 7893 Strongs Concordance) occurs in the OT … 74 times.
A controversial musical mystery in the Bible is the word “selah”.  It occurs … 74 times.
“Ezekiel’s Temple” by H. Sully.  Sully claims that the temple area covers  …  74 acres.

Songs and harps are a sign of prophecy in the Old Testament.  The “new song” is a sign of prophecy in the OT and NT … see David’s Ps 144 and his “new song”.  It states:

Blessed be the Lord my strength, which “teacheth” my hands to war, and my fingers to fight. “Hands fingers (and palms) are biblical units of measure used for “counting”.
The Hebrew word used here, Lamed, means to teach or teach wisdom.
Revelation … here is wisdom … count the number of the beast.

The Hebrew gematria of this wisdom word Lamed is … 74

As I noted in an earlier post, I am an historicist and I believe the papacy is the numbered beast.  I believe the identifying mark
of its followers is the sign of the cross … and always given with the right hand, never the left.

In Psalm 144, David pleads with God to send thy hand from above; rid me, and deliver me out of great waters, from the hand of strange children; Whose mouth speaketh vanity, and their right hand is a right hand of falsehood.

Repeated three verses later:  Rid me, and deliver me from the hand of strange children, whose mouth speaketh vanity, and their right hand is a right hand of falsehood.

Is it a coincidence that David’s Psalm 144 is the same number as the “measurement” of the wall of 144 cubits in God’s mystical city?

CUBITS = 74

And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the messenger.  Rev 22:17

In one of the oldest manuscripts of the book of Revelation (the Chester Beatty Papyri) this particular number is denoted in its gematria form … not written out in words.

The victors over the image mark and “number of the beast” sing the Song of Moses and the Song of the Lamb.  Rev 15:3

Moses Songs in Torah are constructed in a very unusual (visual) form, but that is a story for another time.

Jesus is the first … the Initial … He is the last … The Omega..

INITIAL = 74
THE OMEGA = 74

Jesus is our Ruler … The King.

RULER = 74
THE KING = 74

Jesus is the light of the Menorah … the oil.

MENORAH = 74

When He gave himself for our sins, He said it is finished.

FINISHED = 74

Daniel’s sign or “writing on the wall” was mene, mene … meaning … number number.

MENE MENE = 74
A NUMBER = 74

Daniel and the children of Issachar had the gift of the magi.  Dan 1:17,21.  I Chron 12:32.
It is said that the magi were skilled in the use of gematria, and I believe this is why Daniel was able to decipher the “hand of God” and His “writing on the wall”.

HAND OF GOD = 74

Our God is the Great I am . . . . . . . GREAT I AM = 74

He is God and a man . . . . . . . . . . .GOD AND A MAN = 74

Orthodox Jews will not write “God” … they do it as . . . G-D
“G” is our 7th letter and “D” is our fourth . . . . . . . . . . 7-4

The 144 thousand of Rev 14 sing a very unusual song that only they
understand, however, the first mention of the 144 thousands occurs in . . . Rev 7:4

This group with the new song IMMEDIATELY follow the verse that numbers the beast.
As noted earlier, God did not state the language to be used for this numbering purpose.

This group had their father’s name written in their forehead.  Rev 14.
The earthly parent of Jesus was Joseph the carpenter.  (coincidently,my parents were Mary-David and Joseph, he was a carpenter also)

PARENT = 74

The Hebrew meaning of the word Joseph means “he shall add” or “increase”.

HE SHALL ADD= 74
INCREASE  =  74

During a period of discouragement and rejection by Christians to my study of God’s prophetic numbers (144  153  666)  He gave me a personal sign of assurance.

I AM SAVED = 74

Jesus will appear in the heavens, His chariot in the clouds.

HEAVENS = 74
CHARIOT = 74
CLOUDS = 74

Today, we hear much talk among futurists about an expected Third Temple.
I believe this to be spiritually understood, not literal.  40 years ago they talked about its imminent construction, and today they are still talking about it.  I do not think God will ever allow that to happen, as He had their temple and their priesthood and Jerusalem itself, totally destroyed and left desolate in 70AD

TEMPLE III = 74

Are these signs designed by the God who knows the end from the beginning, or are they merely “coincidence”?

There is much more, but I will close with something from the OT.

Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab and Abihu and seventy of the elders
of Israel . . . (74) . . . and they saw The God of Israel.  Exodus 24:9-10.

THE GOD OF ISRAEL = 144

TO GOD BE THE GLORY

May this study be a blessing to you.
cc cormier

[Elizabeth]

selah

I think you and Ed J. should get together.

Georg

[mikeangel]

Interesting….. I believe 666 is very simple. I believe in the trinity. God in three persons.  A trinity is three. If each being is in each other and all three are differant, then each ones number would be 333. There are 3 of them. 333+333+333=999, god's whole number. Turn that around(the opposite of God) –666.   Interesting enough, also live-evil:love-evol. As I stated in other post I believe the anti-christ is this worlds king-Elvis..Evils. Godbless.:)

[Elizabeth]

mike

you said that on the other post.

Georg

[mikeangel]

Georg-You mean adding 333's together or Elvis? I said “as I stated in other post” Mike

[Tim Kraft]

All of the law, the prophets, the Psalms testified of the coming of Jesus. (Luke 24:44) . Jesus said, .. “search the scriptures for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they that testify of me…”(John5:39). The law led us up to the coming of Christ, (Gal.3:24). All of the Law and the Prophets prophesied until John the baptist. (Matt.11:13). The Law and the prophets were until John (the baptist) since then the Kingdom of God is preached. (Luke 16:16).
The arrival of John the Baptist and Jesus the Christ were the fulfillment of all prophecy. The genealogies all led up to Jesus. All prophecy led us to Christ and the establishment of the New Testament Kingdom of God. The end of one religious order and the establishment of the new.
THE END OF THE OLD COVENANT: The prophets of the old covenant prophesied of the end of that world order when the Christ would come to establish a new covenant. The old way to seek God passed away and behold all things became the way of the New Covenant with the anointing of God’s eternal word/Jesus. The eternal word/Jesus/spirit of God was come to establish the Kingdom of God that would be without end or eternal.Yeshua Ben Joseph also known as Jesus of Nazareth was the chosen one of God to administer the Spirit of Christ to all who would receive and accept/believe. So did Jesus arise among the people with the mission from God to establish the Kingdom in the new temple built without hands. The new church, the new body of Christ all within the human being. (Luke 17:21) “The Kingdom of God cometh NOT WITH OBSERVATION: Neither shall they say, Lo here or, lo there! For the Kingdom of God is within you..” There are great multitudes of religious doctrines, pages and pages with thousands of scriptures written very ambiguously with vague interpretations describing horrific destruction, chaos, pain and suffering that will be had at the end of the world. Most of these doctrines come from the Revelation of St John the Divine. This writing is a vision by a very old John, alone on an island called Patmos. The writing called Revelation has caused the religious world to work overtime to make the new testament gospel of (glad tidings) into a warning of death and destruction that is about to be poured out on mankind. “Beware of the end of the world.” Revelation is a metaphorically and spiritually discerned book that religious persons are attempting to interpret and make understandable at a literal level. All Bible prophecy was about the coming of Jesus to establish the Kingdom of God. (Matt.11:13—Luke18:31—John5:39) Also included is the writing of Revelation which at ch3:v4 says it also is a prophecy. It also ends with the Kingdom of God being established in the earth or when Jesus appeared. The Revelation is an overview leading up to Christ. It is an unveiling or uncovering of the events leading up to and including the ministry of Jesus, the Christ, unto the establishment of the Kingdom of God. An uncovering or an overview of the mission of Jesus Christ. It is a prophecy which like all prophecies ended with the finished work of Jesus. Luke 16:16, All prophecy was until John the baptist. The prophets prophesied about the coming of Jesus and his work to accomplish. Jesus was the end of the old covenant way of serving God. They had lost their way to God through doctrines, rituals, rules, etc., and were in darkness and sin. Jesus established the new covenant arrival of the Kingdom of God. This is what he preached and that is what fulfilled his mission. Daniels interpretation of the Kings dream with feet of bronze, iron and clay was in the days of those Kings, the Roman Empire, God will set up a Kingdom that will NEVER BE DESTROYED!! There is no end time or end of the Kingdom of God on earth. So, when you read the New Testament, about the Kingdom of God which was the truth Jesus came to preach and establish, you must be born again by the renewing of your mine or re-create your mind to a new way of thinking that God dwells in you. Old covenant ritualistic works for God were passed away and the new way truth is the gift of the Spirit of God which has come to us in the words of Truth from Jesus the anointed Christ. Jesus said his words are spirit and are life.(John6:63). Jesus spoke Gods spirit words in parables, pictures, dreams. Only the spirit of God can reveal to you the Truth in this form. Seeing is no longer just the eyes, it is understanding. Hearing is no longer just with ears but understanding. In all knowledge get understanding. Understanding is with the heart! Bless all, TK

[selah]

Tim,

Might you have intended to submit your post to another thread?
This one is about “a coincidence or a creation”.

Georg,

Would you use your spirit of discernment and indicate your opinion to us as to whether what was presented (about Jesus and 74) is merely coincidence or perhaps, a divine design?

Thank you.

[mikeangel]

Amazing, truely amazing. This really is incredible. I didn't believe this at first, but I started adding them up and its true. Thanks for showing this. Up to now I have thought that the biggest proof to the jews should have been the 8th and 9th chapter of Ezekiel. The lord shows him all the aboninations in Jerusalem in 8. In 9 he summons the destroyers and a man with a writing case at his waist. He tells him to go through Jerusalem and put an “x” on all those who moan and groan at all the abominations, but tells the destroyers to pass over those with the mark. In the original text, it is not a x, it is the ancient Hebrew letter taw. The taw is a cross. A list of the ancient alphabet is a the Ancient Hebrew Research Center-http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/3 home.html. Godbless

[mikeangel]

P.S. As the lord lives, My wife came home with a new hood jacket she got off the bargin shelf. When I looked at it I was very suprised. On the front -74. It tells me he has things under control. To the day that I read that and got that jacket is just beyond comprehension, just like God. Godbless

[Elizabeth]

Quote (selah @ Feb. 21 2010,11:40)

Georg, Would you use your spirit of discernment and indicate your opinion to us as to whether what was presented (about Jesus and 74) is merely coincidence or perhaps, a divine design? Thank you.

selah

  I have no clue as to what you're talking about?

Georg

[selah]

To any and all,

The question I had asked was whether the evidence presented, all relative to Jesus and 74 was (in their opinion) a coincidence or designed?

Was the question to Georg too complex?

I am not necessarily asking anyone to answer the question at this time, but rather to determine if they understood what was asked.

Did you understand the question, or were you without a clue as was Georg.

Thank you.

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeangel @ Feb. 21 2010,13:14)

Amazing, truely amazing. This really is incredible. I didn't believe this at first, but I started adding them up and  its true. Thanks for showing this. Up to now I have thought that the biggest proof to the jews should have been the 8th and 9th chapter of Ezekiel. The lord shows him all the aboninations in Jerusalem in 8. In 9 he summons the destroyers and a man with a writing case at his waist. He tells him to go through Jerusalem and put an “x” on all those who moan and groan at all the abominations, but  tells the destroyers to pass over those with the mark. In the original text, it is not a x, it is the ancient Hebrew letter taw. The taw is a cross. A list of the ancient alphabet is a the Ancient Hebrew Research Center-http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/3 home.html.  Godbless

Hi Mikeangel,

People need: “BIBLE PERCEPTION“=151, to understand “BIBLE TRUTH“=117 ! (AKJV Eph.4:22-24)
“The God Numbers”=151 (26, 63, 74, 117 & 151) help establish “Bible Truth”!

A hidden code: Prophesied: The HolySpirit coming in Jesus…
             
Here is the genealogy of the First people written in Genesis…
Adam (the first man) through Noah (the first savior).
All these Hebrew names carry meanings: These meanings Point to…
“GOD The Father”=117(The Savior=117) [117=יהוה האלהים] in Jesus Christ. (John 14:9 / John 6:46)

Adam           Man
Seth             Appointed
Enosh           Mortal
Kenan          Sorrow;
Mahalalel      The Blessed God
Jared            Shall come down
Enoch           Teaching,
Methuselah   His death shall bring
Lamech        The Despairing,
Noah            Rest or comfort.

Man Appointed Mortal Sorrow; The Blessed God(YHVH is GOD) Shall come down
Teaching, His(Jesus) death shall bring The Despairing, Rest or comfort(HolySpirit).

Luke 2:34: And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold,
this child is set for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;
(Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.

                            “YHVH is God”=117
PSALM 117 “is” [The Bible's Center], the “[smallest chapter]” of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Elizabeth]

Quote (selah @ Feb. 22 2010,17:11)

To any and all, The question I had asked was whether the evidence presented, all relative to Jesus and 74 was (in their opinion) a coincidence or designed? Was the question to Georg too complex? I am not necessarily asking anyone to answer the question at this time, but rather to determine if they understood what was asked. Did you understand the question, or were you without a clue as was Georg. Thank you.

selah

Like I said, I have no clue.
If you want to talk numbers, you have to talk to Ed J.

Georg

[selah]

Georg … “If you want to talk numbers, you have to talk to EdJ”

How about talking numbers with you Georg?  Specifically the number of the beast as per Rev 13:18.

1.  What language and number system do you believe God intended for His people to solve this mystery? 

    For this was a main thrust of the question of this thread. Note the original Topic … A Coincidence or a Creation?  God's language to number the beast.   

2.  Do you know why God did NOT specify the language to be used? Do you have a logical answer?  My answer was that it was not in existence in the day of John of Patmos.

[david]

Quote

“Roman” Numerals … 1 V X L C D are a form of gematria. They just “happen” to sum at … 666

What of M?

Quote

I stress the term “simple” because some Christians in their zeal have devised some pretty complex systems to “make” some suspect sum at 666.

I think the M was left out to “make” the sum 666.

Quote

Are these signs designed by the God who knows the end from the beginning, or are they merely “coincidence”?

The answer is “neither.” Humans look for patterns and meaning where there is none. They find words in their alphabet soup. And, even if a letter is missing or a letter is added (like 'm') they ignore it or take it out or add it in to make everything fit.

[Ed J]

Quote (david @ Feb. 24 2010,18:14)

Humans look for patterns and meaning where there is none.

Hi David,

You mean like looking for salvation in the systems of religion
        and traditions of men, who make void the word of God.

Ed J

[Tim Kraft]

A challenge to anyone on this site that cares about progressing in understanding of the word of God or do you just want to argue over words, and terms and divide and separate the truth rather than unifying all truth into oneness. Shouldn’t we look from all sides at the truth rather than just take what has been handed to us from misguided churches and indoctrinated preachers for thousands of years? Do not listen to me! Hear the word of God/Jesus for a change. We say lord, lord but I don’t think we listen to the teachings of Jesus. Jesus came to save us from sin. I hear people say they sin every day or even if they don’t know it they sin. If you think you are in sin then you are, which is a rejection of what Jesus came to do. Jesus also came to preach the gospel of the Kindom of God. The good news is that the Kingdom of God came with/through Jesus, the word of God. The Kingdom is within us.
This is the great covenant change from physical(brick & mortar temple) to spiritual(understanding of the word of God).
All of the law, the prophets, the Psalms testified of the coming of Jesus. (Luke 24:44) . Jesus said, .. “search the scriptures for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they that testify of me…”(John5:39). The law led us up to the coming of Christ, (Gal.3:24). All of the Law and the Prophets prophesied until John the baptist. (Matt.11:13). The Law and the prophets were until John (the baptist) since then the Kingdom of God is preached. (Luke 16:16).
The arrival of John the Baptist and Jesus the Christ were the fulfillment of all prophecy. The genealogies were from Adam to Jesus. All prophecy led us to Christ and the establishment of the New Testament Kingdom of God.
THE END OF THE OLD COVENANT: The prophets of the old covenant prophesied of the end of that world order when the Christ would come to establish a new covenant. The old way to seek God passed away and behold all things became the way of the New Covenant with the anointing of God’s eternal word/Jesus. The eternal word/Jesus/spirit of God was come to establish the Kingdom of God that would be without end or eternal. Yeshua Ben Joseph also known as Jesus of Nazareth was the chosen one of God to administer the Spirit of Christ to all who would receive and accept/believe. So did Jesus arise among the people with the mission from God to establish the Kingdom in the new temple built without hands. The new church, the new body of Christ all within the human being. (Luke 17:21) “The Kingdom of God cometh NOT WITH OBSERVATION: Neither shall they say, Lo here or, lo there! For the Kingdom of God is within you..” There are great multitudes of religious doctrines, pages and pages with thousands of scriptures written very ambiguously with vague interpretations describing horrific destruction, chaos, pain and suffering that will be had at the end of the world. Most of these doctrines come from the Revelation of St John the Divine. This writing is a vision by a very old John, alone on an island called Patmos. The writing called Revelation has caused the religious world to work overtime to make the new testament gospel of (glad tidings) into a warning of death and destruction that is about to be poured out on mankind. “Beware of the end of the world.” Revelation is a metaphorically and spiritually discerned book that religious persons are attempting to interpret and make understandable at a literal level. All Bible prophecy was about the coming of Jesus to establish the Kingdom of God. (Matt.11:13—Luke18:31—John5:39) Also included is the writing of Revelation which at ch3:v4 says it also is a prophecy. It also ends with the Kingdom of God being established in the earth or when Jesus appeared. The Revelation is an overview leading up to Christ. It is an unveiling or uncovering of the events leading up to and including the ministry of Jesus, the Christ, unto the establishment of the Kingdom of God. An uncovering or an overview of the mission of Jesus Christ. It is a prophecy which like all prophecies ended with the finished work of Jesus. Luke 16:16, All prophecy was until John the baptist. The prophets prophesied about the coming of Jesus and his work to accomplish. Jesus was the end of the old covenant way of serving God. They had lost their way to God through doctrines, rituals, rules, etc., and were in darkness and sin. Jesus established the new covenant arrival of the Kingdom of God. This is what he preached and that is what fulfilled his mission. Daniels interpretation of the Kings dream with feet of bronze, iron and clay was in the days of those Kings, the Roman Empire, God will set up a Kingdom that will NEVER BE DESTROYED!! There is no end time or end of the Kingdom of God on earth. So, when you read the New Testament, about the Kingdom of God which was the truth Jesus came to preach and establish, you must be born again by the renewing of your mine or re-create your mind to a new way of thinking that God dwells in you. Old covenant ritualistic works for God were passed away and the new way truth is the gift of the Spirit of God which has come to us in the words of Truth from Jesus the anointed Christ. Jesus said his words are spirit and are life.(John6:63). Jesus spoke Gods spirit words in parables, pictures, dreams. Only the spirit of God can reveal to you the Truth in this form. Seeing is no longer just the eyes, it is understanding. Hearing is no longer just with ears but understanding. In all knowledge get understanding. Understanding is with the heart! TK

[Elizabeth]

Quote (selah @ Feb. 24 2010,14:52)

Georg … “If you want to talk numbers, you have to talk to EdJ” How about talking numbers with you Georg?  Specifically the number of the beast as per Rev 13:18. 1.  What language and number system do you believe God intended for His people to solve this mystery?      For this was a main thrust of the question of this thread. Note the original Topic … A Coincidence or a Creation?  God's language to number the beast.    2.  Do you know why God did NOT specify the language to be used? Do you have a logical answer?  My answer was that it was not in existence in the day of John of Patmos.

selah

Now I see, what you're saying, thank you.

Rev 13:18   Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.  

You are right, there are two things here that did not exist when John wrote this book.
One, the beast; beast is a government, or a type of government that has a ruler.
Two, the man; the man is that ruler of that government.
That mans name, or title, will make up the number 666.
In v. 14 it talks about making an image “to” the beast that had the deadly wound and was healed, or lived. What beast/government received the deadly wound and lived? If you don't know the answer to that, how can you know who the image is? The answer is Rome; Rome received the deadly wound in 476 AD when the barbarian king of the Heruli deposed the Roman emperor Romulus Augustus, and made Rome his kingdom. The deadly wound was healed in 553 AD when Justinian reconquered Rome.
Now the question is, who formed their government after Rome? the pope, the Catholic church.
The pope is the emperor,
the cardinals are the senators,
the bishops are the governors,
and the priests and monks are the mayors.
The pope made himself a crown, and had this title inscribed on it in Latin;
“V I C A R I V S   F I L I I   D E I”
That means; “Vicar of the son of God”. The pope is self appointed, and a self crowned ruler.
Latin letters also have a numerical value.

V   I   C   A   R   I  V   S — F   I   L   I   I — D   E   I  
5   1 100  0   0   1  5   0 – 0   1  50  1  1 – 500 0  1 = 666

The pope is that man, he is the Antichrist.

Georg

[Ed J]

Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 24 2010,22:58)

Quote (selah @ Feb. 24 2010,14:52) Georg … “If you want to talk numbers, you have to talk to EdJ” How about talking numbers with you Georg?  Specifically the number of the beast as per Rev 13:18. 1.  What language and number system do you believe God intended for His people to solve this mystery?      For this was a main thrust of the question of this thread. Note the original Topic … A Coincidence or a Creation?  God's language to number the beast.    2.  Do you know why God did NOT specify the language to be used? Do you have a logical answer?  My answer was that it was not in existence in the day of John of Patmos. selah Now I see, what you're saying, thank you. Rev 13:18   Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.   You are right, there are two things here that did not exist when John wrote this book. One, the beast; beast is a government, or a type of government that has a ruler. Two, the man; the man is that ruler of that government. That mans name, or title, will make up the number 666. In v. 14 it talks about making an image “to” the beast that had the deadly wound and was healed, or lived. What beast/government received the deadly wound and lived? If you don't know the answer to that, how can you know who the image is? The answer is Rome; Rome received the deadly wound in 476 AD when the barbarian king of the Heruli deposed the Roman emperor Romulus Augustus, and made Rome his kingdom. The deadly wound was healed in 553 AD when Justinian reconquered Rome. Now the question is, who formed their government after Rome? the pope, the Catholic church. The pope is the emperor, the cardinals are the senators, the bishops are the governors, and the priests and monks are the mayors. The pope made himself a crown, and had this title inscribed on it in Latin; “V I C A R I V S   F I L I I   D E I” That means; “Vicar of the son of God”. The pope is self appointed, and a self crowned ruler. Latin letters also have a numerical value. V   I   C   A   R   I  V   S — F   I   L   I   I — D   E   I   5   1 100  0   0   1  5   0 – 0   1  50  1  1 – 500 0  1 = 666 The pope is that man, he is the Antichrist. Georg

Hi Georg,

You got the wrong guy on your radar screen!

                Get your facts straight

Did you ever read 1John 2:22, describing the 'antichrist'?
   The Pope denies NEITHER The Father NOR The Son!

              quran is Lord Mohammad=222

The quran denies the Gospel(Death, burial and resurrection) and Muslims consider the quran to be 666!
And on the 'dome of the rock' (located in Jerusalem) is the inscription  …'allah has no son'. (Matt.24:15)

According to the quran: Mohammad received it from the angel Gabriel

Gal.1:8: But though we, or (satan) an angel from heaven, preach any other
gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Col:2:18: Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping
of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
2Cor.11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles
of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing
if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Ed J

[karmarie]

Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 25 2010,16:59)

Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 24 2010,22:58) Quote (selah @ Feb. 24 2010,14:52) Georg … “If you want to talk numbers, you have to talk to EdJ” How about talking numbers with you Georg?  Specifically the number of the beast as per Rev 13:18. 1.  What language and number system do you believe God intended for His people to solve this mystery?      For this was a main thrust of the question of this thread. Note the original Topic … A Coincidence or a Creation?  God's language to number the beast.    2.  Do you know why God did NOT specify the language to be used? Do you have a logical answer?  My answer was that it was not in existence in the day of John of Patmos. selah Now I see, what you're saying, thank you. Rev 13:18   Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.   You are right, there are two things here that did not exist when John wrote this book. One, the beast; beast is a government, or a type of government that has a ruler. Two, the man; the man is that ruler of that government. That mans name, or title, will make up the number 666. In v. 14 it talks about making an image “to” the beast that had the deadly wound and was healed, or lived. What beast/government received the deadly wound and lived? If you don't know the answer to that, how can you know who the image is? The answer is Rome; Rome received the deadly wound in 476 AD when the barbarian king of the Heruli deposed the Roman emperor Romulus Augustus, and made Rome his kingdom. The deadly wound was healed in 553 AD when Justinian reconquered Rome. Now the question is, who formed their government after Rome? the pope, the Catholic church. The pope is the emperor, the cardinals are the senators, the bishops are the governors, and the priests and monks are the mayors. The pope made himself a crown, and had this title inscribed on it in Latin; “V I C A R I V S   F I L I I   D E I” That means; “Vicar of the son of God”. The pope is self appointed, and a self crowned ruler. Latin letters also have a numerical value. V   I   C   A   R   I  V   S — F   I   L   I   I — D   E   I   5   1 100  0   0   1  5   0 – 0   1  50  1  1 – 500 0  1 = 666 The pope is that man, he is the Antichrist. Georg Hi Georg, You got the wrong guy on your radar screen!                 Get your facts straight Did you ever read 1John 2:22, describing the 'antichrist'?    The Pope denies NEITHER The Father NOR The Son!               quran is Lord Mohammad=222 The quran denies the Gospel(Death, burial and resurrection) and Muslims consider the quran to be 666! And on the 'dome of the rock' (located in Jerusalem) is the inscription  …'allah has no son'. (Matt.24:15) According to the quran: Mohammad received it from the angel Gabriel Gal.1:8: But though we, or (satan) an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. Col:2:18: Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, 2Cor.11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works. Ed J

Well I always said the Pope cant be the antichrist
(Because he denies neither the Father or the Son)

But Ed?
I dont know what to say.

[Author]

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