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Nick, what happened to me is true. If the experience was not so, then all that I posted would not be of truth. Please, don't you understand this? How can Christ not be in me and yet I have these wonderful truths? It would be impossible. For they do not belong to me Nick, they belong to Jesus. All I can do is yield to his will. That is my only hope.
As you said we must grow in Christ. This is probably the most powerful statement you have made in my eyes. But how is this done? It is done by becoming less of ourselves. It is done by removing our self wills and replying on Christ's will.
For the less self will there is in my cup, the more fuller the cup becomes with the will of Christ.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 10 2006,00:56) Hi H,
Then why do you seem to teach that “Christ in you”
recognised by some sort of experience,
is the first sign,
and an instant
and the most reliable sign of salvation?Is it not wiser to teach obedience
and let the signs follow?
Should we not be led by the Spirit of God? The Spirit agrees with the scripture. If we are not led by the Spirit are we children of God (Rom. 8:14)?Quote (kenrch @ Aug. 10 2006,01:20) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 10 2006,00:56) Hi H,
Then why do you seem to teach that “Christ in you”
recognised by some sort of experience,
is the first sign,
and an instant
and the most reliable sign of salvation?Is it not wiser to teach obedience
and let the signs follow?
Should we not be led by the Spirit of God? The Spirit agrees with the scripture. If we are not led by the Spirit are we children of God (Rom. 8:14)?
Amen. It is God who calls us to repentance. Thank you brother.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 10 2006,00:29) Thst seed must be nourished and watered by the living Word of scripture to grow up till we can with Paul say
“it is no longer I that liveth but Christ that liveth in me”
The living Word is Jesus. Jesus referred to the writings as Scripture and also as the words of God. Never once did He call Scripture the Word of God.Note it is THE (singular) Word of God. There is only one. His name is Jesus.
Dear oxy,
Jesus is the Word of God. He is the Word that God spoke all of creation into existance with. By the Word and through the Word, all of creation came into existance.
Amen Nick. Everyone thinks when it talks of the Father begatting the Son, that it occured when the Father sent the Son into the world. They do not understand that if the Son had not been begat, none of creation would have been. For even before the heavens and the earth, in the beginning, the Father begat the Son, the Word.
Quote (heiscomingintheclouds @ Aug. 11 2006,22:33) Amen Nick. Everyone thinks when it talks of the Father begatting the Son, that it occured when the Father sent the Son into the world. They do not understand that if the Son had not been begat, none of creation would have been. For even before the heavens and the earth, in the beginning, the Father begat the Son, the Word.
H.. HiCan you tell me where the Son (Word) was “begat”?
According to my understanding of Scripture the Word was in the beginning with God and was God.
He gave up all to be born the Son of God.
And the Word was God. Don't you understand the concept of that. God the Father is incapable of any association of sin. In the beginning was the Word. He begat his Son in the beginning who was in his image. And the Word was with God. The Son was made God over all of creation. And the Word was God. The Son was begat of the Father to do the will of the Father. And even before the creation of the heavens and the earth, the Father had our salvation, the Word, in place.
Quote (heiscomingintheclouds @ Aug. 13 2006,13:17) And the Word was God. Don't you understand the concept of that. God the Father is incapable of any association of sin. In the beginning was the Word. He begat his Son in the beginning who was in his image. And the Word was with God. The Son was made God over all of creation. And the Word was God. The Son was begat of the Father to do the will of the Father. And even before the creation of the heavens and the earth, the Father had our salvation, the Word, in place.
Sorry H, but I'll need to see Scripture to back that up. The way I read Scripture is that the Word was in the beginning with God and was God.I don't see the word “begat” anywhere in there. He was there in the beginning, not later on.
Since God the Father has not a beginning and no end, whom do you suppose it is referring to here?
In the beginning was the Word. And the Word was with God. And the Word was God.
You have to ask youself, what is a word? God spoke all of creation into existance with this Word. This can be proven by scriptures.
Heb. 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Heb. 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
In this verse, it tells how God brought the firstbegotten into the world. The son was already begotten. Notice the word again.
Heb. 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Quote (heiscomingintheclouds @ Aug. 14 2006,14:27) Since God the Father has not a beginning and no end, whom do you suppose it is referring to here? In the beginning was the Word. And the Word was with God. And the Word was God.
You have to ask youself, what is a word? God spoke all of creation into existance with this Word. This can be proven by scriptures.
Heb. 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Heb. 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
In this verse, it tells how God brought the firstbegotten into the world. The son was already begotten. Notice the word again.
Heb. 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Jesus was begotten before He was flesh? I thought Jesus was the first created before He was begotten.Dear kenrch,
In the beginning was the Word. Even before the Father created the heavens and the earth, he begat the Word, the Son, our salvation. And the Word was with God the Father. The Father and the Son are together. And the Word was God. The Father made the Son God of all crreation.
So, even before the stars, moons, earth or anything, the first thing the Father did was begat the Son. He established our salvation before anything. You think what does the Word begat mean, and if you look it up it says to bring into existance. I believe the relationship between the Father and the Son is closer then anything we can imagine. Think how wonderful it is when an earthly Father has a Son. Now, what about the creator and his Son? When the Father begat the Son, he made him second in command in all things. He made him God over all of creation. He created all things through the Son and by the Son.
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.The Son of God was “begat” when Jesus was born. As long as God has been able to speak there has been the Word of God.
Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light. And there was light.
Joh 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and without Him not even one thing came into being that has come into being.So you can see that God spoke things in to being, but it was His Word that created them.
But the Word of God has always been. Important to remember too that the father was not in the beginning. He was never a Father until His firstborn was born.
But the Word of God has always been. Important to remember too that the father was not in the beginning. He was never a Father until His firstborn was born.
Dear Oxy,
You said the the Word had always been. If a word is not spoken, does it really exist? Don't you think that is why it is so important that men must confess with the fruit of their lips that Jesus Christ is Lord? If a man does not first confess with his mouth, he will not be saved. The words must be spoken into existance.
Why do you think that Jesus always said, for it is written. The spoken Word is the written Word. If the Word had not first been spoken, could it have been written?
As for the Son of God being begotten of the Father, this happened even before the creation of the heavens and the earth.
Heb. 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Now notice this verse the word again. It says when God again brings the firstbegotten into the world. The event of the Father begotting the Son had already occurred. For the Son was begotten of the Father in the beginning. If he would not have been, none of creation would have came to be. For all of creation came into being through the Son and by the Son by the will of the Father.
Heb. 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him
So when God begat the Word, he begat his Son, the quickening spirit.
Thanks Brothers, but I know that Jesus is the word that the Father used to create all things.
H, you say Jesus was begotten before He became flesh. How? Does the Father have a wife. Don't laugh some people say “wisdom” is God's wife. Anyway for Jesus to have been begotten before He became flesh then (if God has no wife) HOW?
Oxy, you say “As long as God has been able to speak there has been the Word of God”.
But Jesus prayed that He would become as He was before the world. If Jesus is just words then He was a thought in the Father's mind first. So Jesus wanted to go back to being a thought in the Father's mind?No Jesus was more than the words the Father thought of. But WHAT?
Dear Kenrch,
Brother, we are mere men. We think as men. God created man and woman and from this relationship, children come into the world.
Yet, you have to remember that God created this. This is God's creation and God's understanding. When you ask if God had a wife, that is nonsense. Isn't that belittling God? God created something out of nothing. Can we do this? And if so, how? By thinking first and then making it happen. But is that the same thing as what God did. No. Because when we think of an idea, we then draw up a plan and create on materials already in existance. God created something out of nothing.
The first thing God did was begat his Son, the Word. He spoke him into existance. If not first spoken, the Son could not have been. Does not the scriptures say there is not name greater then that of the Son? The Word was begotten of the Father, who begot the Son, the quickening Spirit.
Quote (heiscomingintheclouds @ Aug. 19 2006,12:48) Dear Kenrch, Brother, we are mere men. We think as men. God created man and woman and from this relationship, children come into the world.
Yet, you have to remember that God created this. This is God's creation and God's understanding. When you ask if God had a wife, that is nonsense. Isn't that belittling God? God created something out of nothing. Can we do this? And if so, how? By thinking first and then making it happen. But is that the same thing as what God did. No. Because when we think of an idea, we then draw up a plan and create on materials already in existance. God created something out of nothing.
The first thing God did was begat his Son, the Word. He spoke him into existance. If not first spoken, the Son could not have been. Does not the scriptures say there is not name greater then that of the Son? The Word was begotten of the Father, who begot the Son, the quickening Spirit.
Ok so was Jesus the first created or the first begotten before all creation.Rev 3:14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:
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