Are there two Spirits or One?

The Holy Spirit is a spirit, but is the Father also a spirit?

Well we know that the Father is God and God is spirit. The Father is the Father of all spirits and life. The Father is also the father of our Lord Jesus Christ? But the gospels tell us that the Holy Spirit came upon Mary and because of this, the child was to be called the Son of God. So who is the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ, the Father or the Holy Spirit?

Luke 1:35
The angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.

The answer is that both are the father if the Trinity Doctrine is to be believed. However, I will demonstrate that the Spirit of God is the Father’s own spirit and is not another person as many believe.

1 Peter 1:14-16
Be obedient to God, and do not allow your lives to be shaped by those desires you had when you were still ignorant. Instead, be holy in all that you do, just as God who called you is holy. The scripture says, “Be holy because I am holy.”

John 4:24
God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

So God is holy and God is a spirit, thus he can be described as a holy spirit. However, we are also taught that there is one spirit, so God is more correctly called ‘the Holy Spirit’, not as one holy spirit among two or many. If the Trinity Doctrine were true, then there would be two Spirits, the Father and the Holy Spirit. But scripture tells us there is but one Spirit.

Ephesians 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Further, scripture clearly says that “The LORD is the Spirit”, thus the Father who is God is the Spirit. Most agree that the Father is the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit took part in his conception with Mary. If the Holy Spirit was another person, then Jesus would have two fathers, the Father and the Holy Spirit. That is if the Trinity Doctrine was a true doctrine.

2 Corinthians 3:17
Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.

Also, if God is Spirit and he imparts his spirit into redeemed vessels, and if he will eventually be in all and through all, then that would suggest that God the Father will inhabit all by his own spirit. And we know he is the God of the living not the dead, so his spirit is life and the source of all life for his creation and also for his son. So creation is not inhabited by two spirits but one, that is God’s own spirit.

1 Corinthians 15:28
When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

Luke 20:38
He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”

John 6:63
The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing.

Finally, we are taught in scripture that he is the Father of spirits.

Hebrews 12:9
Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live!

For me I think of this in this way.

Q: Who is God?
A: The Father?

Q: What is God?
A: He is spirit

God is the Father and God is the Holy Spirit. This is not two persons but two aspects of the same God. While God is in heaven, he can inhabit all creation by his own spirit. Just as the sun is located in the centre of the Solar System, its rays shine out to all the Solar System. Similarly, our Heavenly Father can inhabit all creation by his spirit. However as an aside, God’s own creation is not even big enough to contain him. He exists outside the cosmos too.

1 Corinthians 15:27-28
For he “has put everything under his feet.” Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

1 Kings 8:27
“But will God really dwell on earth? The heavens, even the highest heaven, cannot contain you. How much less this temple I have built!

So God the Father can inhabit his creation by his own spirit.

This also makes sense when we read the following:

Matthew 12:32
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

It is worse to speak against the Spirit than it is against the Son. This demonstrates to us that God is above the son and even his Spirit is above his son because the Spirit of God is God and the son of God is the Son and we know that the head of Christ is God in the same way that the head of man is Christ.

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Author
Posts
July 8, 2015 at 12:43 pm#800788
princess
Participant
T8,
Hypothetically you have God and Jesus standing in front of you. You are asked to bow to your God? whom do you choose?

July 8, 2015 at 2:11 pm#800789
terraricca
Participant
hi princess
your question is a easy one we all should worship the same God of Christ ,his father and our father and our God and Jesus God ,
July 8, 2015 at 5:30 pm#800790
kerwin
Participant
t8,
Study scripture and you will see the word ‘worship’ in a biblical context and who that word is legitimately applied to.
You should study it some more as there is bias in translating certain words to worship.
Luke 4:5-8(Weymouth New testament)
5The Devil next led Him up and caused Him to see at a glance all the kingdoms of the world. 6And the Devil said to Him, “To you will I give all this authority and this splendour; for it has been handed over to me, and on whomsoever I will I bestow it. 7If therefore you do homage to me, it shall all be yours.’ 8Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘To the Lord thy God thou shalt do homage, and to Him alone shalt thou render worship.'”
Luke 4:5-8Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it. 7 If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine. 8 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
Weymouth catches more subtle points than the AV of KJV. Satan is saying homage because of its vagueness and Jesus sees the deception and places the word in the context of worshiping God.
Have you reached the point in your lessons when you have learned there is alternatives to translating a word in the original languages to worship?
July 9, 2015 at 12:27 pm#800807
Andrew AD
Participant
Andrew has no point at all says terraricca? Well if we honour God and honour Jesus and according to T8 we can also honour King David and other saints in the same way then I hear a faint cry from Rome calling us home.
July 9, 2015 at 12:46 pm#800808
kerwin
Participant
AndrewAD,
1 Chronicles 29:20Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless the Lord your God. And all the congregation blessed the Lord God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped the Lord, and the king.
A better translation is paid homage to than worshiped.
July 9, 2015 at 12:49 pm#800809
Andrew AD
Participant
Dear Princess, your journey has you where? I honestly don’t get your point here. You are not”there”? Just where is there? Do you mean worshiping a flesh and blood being? Fear not for Christ and his blessed Mother are now spirit. Feel free to honour them all as T8 even says.
July 11, 2015 at 1:24 am#800886
terraricca
Participant
Andrew has no point at all says terraricca? Well if we honour God and honour Jesus and according to T8 we can also honour King David and other saints in the same way then I hear a faint cry from Rome calling us home.
RO 1:21 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
EPH 6:2 HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER (which is the first commandment with a promise),
HEB 2:7 “YOU HAVE MADE HIM FOR A LITTLE WHILE LOWER THAN THE ANGELS;
YOU HAVE CROWNED HIM WITH GLORY AND HONOR,
Ro 13:5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience.
Ro 13:6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing.
Ro 13:7 Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor
you always should give honor as to each deserved it ;like a saint honor him as a saint ,but what does it mean give honor ? do you know ?
July 12, 2015 at 7:47 pm#800940
Proclaimer
Participant
Hypothetically you have God and Jesus standing in front of you. You are asked to bow to your God? whom do you choose?
I would honour the Father as God and Jesus as the son of God.
Is the son of God not worthy of our honour and praise? Or is the son of God such a lowly position that we have to elevate him to God in order to receive honour?
The Father of our Lord Jesus Christ is his God and our God.
John 20:17
Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them,
‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’“

July 12, 2015 at 7:49 pm#800941
Proclaimer
Participant
You should study it some more as there is bias in translating certain words to worship.
Kerwin, this is the point I am making. Do you read my posts or not. You should if you are going to critique them.
The word ‘worship’ is the same word ‘honour’ and ‘bow down’. Depends on the translators as to what they decided was the most appropriate word to use.
I guess when it came to Jesus, a translator who holds him as God may choose ‘worship’.
July 12, 2015 at 7:51 pm#800943
Proclaimer
Participant
Have you reached the point in your lessons when you have learned there is alternatives to translating a word in the original languages to worship?
See my post above.
July 12, 2015 at 7:55 pm#800944
Proclaimer
Participant
@kerwin
t8,
If you worship two gods it makes you a polytheist. I worship God and pay homage to Jesus Anointed. Koine Greek does not always mark the difference between the two but there is a difference. It is probably one of many things you are to understand by the context.
What are you going on about now. I am sure you need to read my posts properly. Please read them before replying. I shouldn’t even need to tell you that. I do not worship Jesus as God or a god. I have been saying this from the beginning of these forums.
July 12, 2015 at 8:00 pm#800946
Proclaimer
Participant
Andrew has no point at all says terraricca? Well if we honour God and honour Jesus and according to T8 we can also honour King David and other saints in the same way then I hear a faint cry from Rome calling us home.
Still cannot see it. I will make it easy for you.
Do not honour Jesus, King David, etc if that fits with your theology.
I honour Jesus as the son of the living God. No one is twisting your arm to not honour him or dishonour him. That is your decision.
But this should be enough for you and all the skeptics. I honour and worship only the Father as God. It is really simple and it is true.
July 12, 2015 at 8:03 pm#800948
Proclaimer
Participant
Why is it that most here will believe I say and teach anything but what I really say and teach. Is this done on purpose to slander me or is it really just plain ignorance? I don’t like the choices, but it has to be one or the other. Or what?
The Pharisees did the same with Jesus Christ. Misinterpreted his teachings and then crucified him for the misinterpretation.
July 12, 2015 at 9:08 pm#800958
kerwin
Participant
T8,
Did you misspeak when you said “I worship Jesus as the son of God”?
I know the AV of the KJV uses worship in reference to Jesus and King David but unless the meaning of the word has changed over time that is a mistaken translation.
I also know your English is slightly different than mine as I live in a different country.
July 12, 2015 at 9:14 pm#800959
kerwin
Participant
t8,
According to what I have been taught the word worship is reserved for God alone while homage can be used with him or others. The thesaurus I looked at does name them as synonyms.
July 19, 2015 at 10:06 pm#801152
AndrewAD
Participant
Or what says T8? So you worship God as God and Jesus as the Son of God if I understand you correctly.? So you worship two invisible beings who jointly rule the universe right? I won’t crucify you for that and shame on those who would.
July 19, 2015 at 10:28 pm#801154
kerwin
Participant
AndrewAD,
Are you being honest is testing t8?
What definition is t8 using when referring to God and what definition is he using when referring the Jesus?
Are they the same?
Do you use the same ones?
I find certain thesauruses claim worship is a synonym to honor and other words.
Jesus is not invisible but I think t8 follows the Gnostic teachings that the physical does not exit in heaven so he may well hold he is.
July 19, 2015 at 10:43 pm#801156
AndrewAD
Participant
Am I being honest? I think so.And am I testing T8? I think not but only evaluating his teaching. And he claims Jesus is the Son of God who ruleth with the Father.
And is Jesus not invisible? Do you see him in the flesh? I don’t,but some do claim to.
July 20, 2015 at 12:20 am#801158
kerwin
Participant
AndrewAD,
I do not see the President of my physical country and I do not believe he is invisible while Jesus is the ruler of my Spiritual kingdom and has traveled to a far country to receive his crown.
Woe to those rebels and unfaithful servants when he returns.
July 20, 2015 at 12:32 am#801159
kerwin
Participant
AndrewAD,
T8’s chosen doctrine is flawed as Jesus Christ is the Son of David, as of the flesh, and the Son of God, as of the Spirit. We know the first because Scripture declares he was conceived in Mary, who is a seed of David. We know the Second because God said he would put his Spirit on him.
As for your point worship is said to mean the same thing as honor or other things and of t8 is using it in that sense it applies to both Jesus and God just as it was applied to both David and God in the OT of the AV of the KJV.
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