Hi Jack,You mentioned in your last post here:Quote It CLEARLY says that Christ's “having become so much better than the angels” is the CONSEQUENCE of His now being seated at the right hand of God.First, it is the name 'firstborn' and 'begotten' itself that makes Him above the angels. The very name itself testifies that He is above the angels. Soif…[Read more]

Mike,I don't know…I'll think about it.Dennison,Have at it Thanks for the fellowship guys.See you later…sweet dreams! Kathi

Dennison,Quote I also believe that Jesus is refferred to as the outstretched arm thingy. Great!Quote 1. Species? Define that. Well, a species is a type of kind. Like a human species…eneryone is human in the human species. A canine species, all animals in the canine species are canine. In the deity species…all are deity in the deity…[Read more]

Mike,Quote Nobody would ever recognize another as their god without also automatically recognizing that one was mightier than them. What do people do to gods, Kathi? That is true in the case of creation towards their creator. Their creator is obviously mightier than they. We are not talking about a created being relating to a self-existent…[Read more]

Dennison,So in your understanding, Jesus is not the begotten God but an earthy vessel to contain the Father?I still believe that frequently when God referred to having an outstretched arm, He was referring to His only begotten Son who serves Him.1. God is more of a species, a self-existent eternal species. Maybe race is not the right word.2.…[Read more]

Good Mike that means you are understanding. My son does not have the nature of deity and therefore, he would not be eternal. Only that which is deity nature is eternal. I don't know if the Son was in the form of an incorruptible seed or a mature God like the Father or some stage in between before He was begotten…He was perfect whatever that…[Read more]

Mike,Can you think of anything in scripture that shows someone born as an offspring that didn't exist before they were born? Adam wasn't said to be begotten, nor was Eve. They were created. A true offspring exists before they are born/begotten.Kathi

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Mar. 31 2011,22:23)Quote (Lightenup @ April 01 2011,08:18)Dennison,You are a modalist, don't you think?  This is the definition:ModalismModalism is probably the most common theological error concerning the nature of God.  It is a denial of the Trinity which states that God is a single person who, throughout biblical h…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 31 2011,22:07)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 31 2011,20:54)Mike,What you proved is that people worship something even though it can not save and doesn't have the nature of deity.  The carver worships the carving is an example of foolishness.  Just because someone makes something their god, doesn't make that thing mightier at a…[Read more]

Dennison,You are a modalist, don't you think? This is the definition:ModalismModalism is probably the most common theological error concerning the nature of God. It is a denial of the Trinity which states that God is a single person who, throughout biblical history, has revealed Himself in three modes, or forms. Thus, God is a single person who…[Read more]

Mike,What you proved is that people worship something even though it can not save and doesn't have the nature of deity.  The carver worships the carving is an example of foolishness.  Just because someone makes something their god, doesn't make that thing mightier at all.  It just makes the 'someone' a fool.4:8 GalNew American Standard Bible (©…[Read more]

Mike,Good point there. Don't you think that it would be a lot easier if Keith and Jack agreed with the creeds say about when He was begotten especially since they both claim to be trinitarians and the creeds are foundational to that doctrine. I wish they were orthodox trinitarians instead of orthodox except for the begotten part. There is…[Read more]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Mar. 31 2011,18:04)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 30 2011,11:04)“Lessor” is not at all clearly listed in John 1:18.  Is your son lessor human than you because he was begotten. The Father is greater by the fact that He is the Father, not because He is mightier.  He is also the Son's God because He is His Father and because He is G…[Read more]

Hi Mike,You asked: Quote #1 – So being the HEAD OF Christ doesn't imply that God is the mightier of the two?Do you think that it is possible that He is the head of Christ because He is the Father?Quote #3 –  Being the GOD OF Christ doesn't imply that God is mightier of the two?Do you think that it is possible that when the Father of the begotten…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,17:25)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 31 2011,17:20)You limit God.No you limit God because you say he can reproduce himself meaning he can become greater than infinite.An infinite God brings birth to an infinite God meaning we now have 2 infinite Gods making God doubly infinite. Nah, I don't buy it Kathi and neither…[Read more]

Keith,So a woman is greater than God because she can literally beget an offspring and He can't? I think that God can do anything and is not a specific gender. If the eternal essence was always Father with the eternal Son within Him then nobody changes into God.God can create the universe but can't have a literal Son…hmmm…sorry, I can't see…[Read more]

Keith,My son was a person before he was born/begotten from me…the Son of God was a person before He was born/begotten from His Father. When I was expecting my son to be born/begotten, I was driving alone in my car although he was inside of me, I was still considered alone, I couldn't drive in the carpool lane, in other words. After he was…[Read more]

Jack,The resurrection showed that Jesus was not only 100% man but fully God too. The resurrection proved that God beget Him as His Son before creation. He was fully God before He became flesh. Look at the order of events here:1God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2in these last days has…[Read more]

Jack,Why are you talking about me mainly and not to me? I find that immature. Does talking about me make it easier for you to accuse me falsely? I believe I have the early church father's on my side as far as the translation of monogenes in John 1:18. It is an adjective WITH a verb…an action. It is not an adjective with a noun.Kathi

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,14:52)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 31 2011,14:27)Jack and Keith read the scripture again:NLT Heb 5:5That is why Christ did not honor himself by assuming he could become High Priest. No, he was chosen by God, who said to him, “You are my Son. Today I have become your Father.”…but Christ did not take this high and…[Read more]