November 15, 2005 at 7:42 pm #42369
i was just wondering what some of you guys think about water baptism. Is it for the remission of sins, or an outward sign of inward grace?November 15, 2005 at 9:51 pm #42370
Hi and welcome,
Jesus told Nicodemus he must be born again of water and the Spirit. The Apostles in Acts showed it's meaning as they baptised in water those who believed and repented and then laid on hands for them to receive the Spirit.
Nothing has changed.
The message ususally meets now with ribald contempt. Naaman was none too thrilled when he was told to have a dip or two in the river either to be free from leprosy.
Peter said in Acts 2.38
“…be baptised for the forgiveness of your sins”
He also said in 1Peter 3 21
“…Baptism now saves you-not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience-through the resurrection of Jesus Christ”
Paul in Gal 3.27 tells us “..all of you who were baptised into Christ have clothed yourself with Christ”.and Romans 6 shows us it baptises us into the physical death of Christ so that we can assume a new heavenly body at the return of Christ.
Then it is like Joshua and the promised land. We are occupied territory with enemies within that have to be defeated and the land fought for. We are given the power and the grace to reclaim the inner man and let Christ be born into us as the Spirit. We can choose to submit to the leading of the Spirit and feed on the Word and be transformed by the renewing of our hearts and minds-till we have the mind of Christ.
Jesus in Lk 15 10 tells us “there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents and that we must all repent lest we perish.
God demands an individual repentant response to his Son's message and the sign of that faith and repentance before God, Christ, the angels and men is water baptism. It is an everlasting witness or sign too as shown in 1Jn 5 5-7.
And in Romans 6.3 f we are told we who are baptised into Jesus Christ are baptised into his death.November 16, 2005 at 8:19 am #42371
what kind of a background do you have Nick? I came from the church of christ background. I left there because of the Trinitarian teaching. I was recently studying with the United Pentecostal Church. I was baptized in the UPC becuase they were the only people i knew of who where doing it correctly. I was studying the godhead with them. They are Oneness believers. I no longer study with them because i see that it doesn't hold water. I'm a truth seeker who's been crying out to God for quite some time. Asking him to show me truth in his word. And he is showing me. Its so awesome to think that the Almighty God of the Universe listens to little ole me. But anyway i now see that Jesus is truly the Son of God, he is not a part of the Godhead, nor is he the Almighty. There is only One God, the Father. I came to this conclusion after alot of prayer and studying the material on this site. The problem is now finding a church here in Missouri that teaches the truth?November 16, 2005 at 8:41 am #42372
Hi and welcome Woutlaw,
Great to meet a true seeker. There is a lot of sideshows out there with huge and deluded followings. Very few want to know the truth. Few want to listen to Jesus and follow him. Few want to seek empowerment to be able to do so.
Me? Born catholic. Woke up 25 years ago amd baptised in water and the Spirit. Finding no denomination that really based itself on scripture have studied it prayerfully since then. I share to try to show what is written. The door of salvation is still not closed. But human nature??November 16, 2005 at 6:41 pm #42373
Do you currently attend a congregation? And when you say that you were born of the Spirit, was there a manifestation as in tongues? like i said i've just broke away from the United Pentecoastal church, and their view was that those who are born of the spirit will have the initial evidence of speaking in tongues. I examined the scriptures and found solid evidence of what they are saying. However the tongues of manifestation were understandable. In every case of this happening you see the phrase “for we heard them speak in tongues”. The greek word for heard is akouo, it has several meanings but the one that fits the context is to UNDERSTAND. how else would the jews at pentecost(ACTS 2) hear them praising God in each of their languages. How did Peter and the disciples with him know that Cornelius(ACTS 10 and those of his household were magnifying God. How did Paul and those with him know that the 12 disciples (ACTS 19) had prophesied. It is clear that the tongues of manifestation where understandable. Now the Oneness Pentecostals say that the tongues of manifestation and the gift of tongues are seperate. Anyway i've sat through several Oneness pentecostal, and other charismatic services and i never seen any interpretation of the tongues of manifestation or the gifts of tongues. What is your view on the manifestation of the spirit?November 16, 2005 at 7:08 pm #42374
I got another question for ya brother Nick, how do you deal with umm, let's say a co-worker who's going around preaching another gospel. I have a co-worker whom i've heard tell people all they have to do is accept Jesus as their personal savior (Sinners Prayer) and they are saved. He mentions nothing about repentance, baptism, or enduring to the end as our Lord said in Matt. 10:22, and Mark 13:13 that those who endure to the end will be saved. we've had discussions in the past, but i just don't want to argue over god's word. Paul tells us that the man of God shouldn't be involved in quarrels and they are useless. But at the same time Nick it actually hurts me deeply when i hear people preaching this stuff. What is your take on this? would you step up and say something?
Willie OutlawNovember 17, 2005 at 1:14 am #42375
The gift of tongues is an expected gift for the saved that all should seek. It speaks directly to God in groans that bypass the human mind. The tongues may be human or angelic languages but if always able to be understood then why does God also give the gift of understanding tongues?Believe and you are saved is a very popular deception that ignores the teaching from James about even demons believing. The verse usually quoted is Romans 10.9. If you look at the context of that verse you see that such events only come about after the changes in the sun and moon prophesied by Joel 2. That is yet to occur so it is best to stay with what Jesus did say to us.
” You must be born again to enter the kingdom.”June 22, 2007 at 7:07 pm #56212
You showed us a video of JW baptism.
Is JW baptism the same as believer's baptism?
Do everyone have to be rebaptised according to the JW way?
I read that you have to fulfill hundreds of prerequisites to be baptised as a JW.
Does that align with the the words of Jesus who said “let the little children come to me”?July 9, 2007 at 10:05 pm #58954
topicalDecember 22, 2017 at 9:46 am #820281
Romans is written to the saved as Rom 1 and other books of Paul tell us.
So Rom 10.9 is not a new way of salvation for the unsaved.
Specifically Romans and Galatians were written for the new Jewish converts.
Rom 10 encourages them to put their new faith into action and walk through the door of ChristDecember 22, 2017 at 10:25 am #820282
Acts 19 gives advice about how to be baptised.
Baptism in the name of Jesus is how the brothers baptised.
Many have been baptised in futility in the name of a nonexistent trinity .
A study of Eusebius and his record of the original reading of Matt 28.19 explains the misconception.
Acts 8.9-22 shows that the ritual of baptism by itself is of no value so the baptism of infants is not helpful.December 23, 2017 at 4:23 am #820295
To all…..we must be baptized with the holy spirit , to be truly saved. Water baptizm can be just getting wet, if it is not accompanied with baptizm of holy spirit. You will know if you have recieved the SPIRIT, HE SHALL MAKE HIMSELF KNOWN TO YOU. You shall recieve the peace that THE SPIRIT SAID THROUGH JESUS, JOHN 14:26 BUT THE COMFORTER WHICH IS THE HOLY SPIRIT, WHOM THE FATHER WILL SEND IN MY NAME, HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, AND BRING TO YOUR REMEMBERANCE, WHATSOEVER I HAVE SAID UNTO YOU.
JOHN 14:27…. “MY PEACE I GIVE UNTO YOU, NOT AS THE WORLD GIVES, I GIVE UNTO YOU. LET NOT YOUR HEART BE TROUBLED NEITHER LET IT BE AFRAID.
Peace and love to you all and yours. ……geneDecember 23, 2017 at 8:28 am #820298
Obedience to the command to be water baptised in the name of Jesus is a necessary part of fulfilling all righteousness.
When God baptised the listeners to Peter in the Spirit in Acts 10, Peter commanded that they be baptised in water in the name of Jesus Christ as well.December 23, 2017 at 9:06 am #820299
And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved.
Jesus Christ the Nazarene is the door.December 24, 2017 at 4:49 am #820303
To all…..baptizm in WATER IN the name of Jesus is ordained, but being baptized by water ONLY OR to the trinity of Gods will avail nothing , the baptizm of the holy spirit recieved from the Father is what counts. Whoever has been baptized with the holy spirit has the conforter, which will abide with him or her forever. Now if you have not the SPIRIT OF THE ANOINTING, YOU ARE NONE OF HIS, according to scripture. It is essential we all attain to the baptizm of the SPIRIT, INORDER TO BE SONS OF THE LIVING GOD.
Peace and love to you all. ……geneDecember 24, 2017 at 7:12 am #820304
Water Baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus matters to God.
1 Peter 3
For Christ also died for sins once and for all, the just for the unjust, so that he might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the Spirit, in which also he went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, who were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the Ark, in which a few , that is eight persons were brought safely through the water. Corresponding to that baptism now saves you-not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but the appeal to God for a good conscience-through the resurrection of Jesus Christ…
Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptised into Christ Jesus have been baptised into his death? Therefore we have been buried with him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, So we too might walk in newness of life. For if we have become united with him in the likeness to his death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of his resurrection..December 24, 2017 at 9:26 am #820306
Nick…..Two baptizm’s one of the flesh, the other of the spirit, no scripture that i know of says you “must” be baptized by water in order to recieve the baptizm of the holy spirit. Please post it if it is in scriptures. John said “i indeed baptize with water but one comes after me who will baptise with spirit and fire. He was indicating that his water baptizm was less important then the baptizm of JESUS. WATER ONLY CLEANSES THE OUTSIDE, NOT THE INSIDE. FIRST MAKE THE INSIDE OF THE CUP CLEAN THAT THE OUTSIDE MAY BE CLEANSED ALSO.
NICK i also believe in water baptizm as you, and have been twice, but it was the baptizm of the spirit that really counted, because when the elders laid hands and prayed over me is when i recieved the SPIRIT. There is also scripture that shows that the holy spirit came on people even before they were baptized with water, i believe both should be done.
Peace and love to you and yours. …….gene.December 24, 2017 at 9:48 am #820307
The whole of Acts shows the order of things that God ordained.
Acts 10.48 shows both are required as does Acts 19 1-6
John 3.5f also shows the need for both.
The baptism of the Spirit is not of cleansing but infilling and empowering. Acts 1 4-8. Acts 10.38. Lk 24.49December 24, 2017 at 10:27 am #820308
Jn 15.3 and Eph 5.26 show that the Word also has the power to cleanse.
God seemed to show that Cornelius and friends in Acts 10 has been made clean enough for His Spirit.
Yet Peter ordered them to be water baptised as well to show both baptisms are required to fulfill all righteousness.December 25, 2017 at 4:46 am #820318
Nick…..Please don’t think i am against water baptizm into the name of Jesus, becaue i am not. I was just showing the difference between them. The apostles were all baptized way before they recieved the holy spirit but none of that prevented them from denying Jesus, or even betraying him as Judas did, and they all heard the word of God from scriptures as well as Jesus himself, but none of that caused them to overcome anything, but on the first pentocost after the death of Jesus when they recieved the holy spirit they begain to be truly taught by GOD.
Water Baptizm “alone” does nothing but get you wet, millions have done that and have not the holy spirit just like JOHN SAID , ‘I COME BAPTIZM WITH WATER BUT There IS ONE ANONG YOU WHO WILL BAPTIZE YOU WITH SPIRIT AND FIRE.
Again i say, we should be baptized with water, as well as RECIEVE the baptizm of JESUS given by GOD the Father , SPIRIT AND FIRE. This is the baptizm from God the Father it changes our hearts and minds and is our true teacher.
Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
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