Preexistence (Part 2)

This topic contains 7,686 replies, has 48 voices, and was last updated by  GeneBalthrop 2 days, 21 hours ago.

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  • #832199
     Anthony 
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    Hi Gene  ypu keep on trying to correct me  on the gnostic.   Gnostic: Docetists said that the flesh and the divine cannot mix, therefore Jesus was truly God but only in the form of a human being. Gnosticism offered two traditional answers to the question . . . Adoptionist Gnostics said Jesus was a regular man, but when he was baptized by John a divine power descended on him and he was “adopted” as the Son of God. And Valentinian Gnostics accepted the idea of Jesus being truly human and truly divine, but argued that there were actually two persons residing in the same body, a human person and a divine person . . . and when Jesus died it was only his physical nature that was crucified, while his divine person lived on.you can search that out for yourself if you want. Don’t take my word. We need to search things out for ourselves. God bless Gene.

    #832201
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Anthony. ..your mixing up the GNOSTIC’S OF TODAY, WITH THE GNOSTIC’S OF THE APOSTLES DAY, COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GROUPS AND THERE BELIFS. I have studied in depth about the gnostics of the apostles day and there teachings are completely different then those of today,

    Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene

    #832203
     Anthony 
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    No I’m not Gene

    1. Docetists  and the

    Valentinian Gnostics  was Gnostic back then

    Search it out. God bless.

    #832204
     Anthony 
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    Hi Gene what would it even matter what the dating is, the fact is you believe in Jesus Christ just like some of them did.

    Gnosticism offered two traditional answers to the question . . . (Jesus Christ) Adoptionist Gnostics said Jesus was a regular man, but when he was baptized by John a divine power descended on him and he was “adopted” as the Son of God.

    #832224
     GeneBalthrop 
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    ANTHONY, I NEVER SAID Jesus is a GOD, I have been arguing aganst that for over 50 yars now, i do not believe Jesus is a God and preexisted at all nor do ibelieve he was just desguised as a human ast h e taught. No if any fit their beliefs here it you, because you as they believe Jesus came fromthe pelora as a GOD OR A DEMIGOD OF SOME KIND, i never even remotely implied any such thing.

    You’ve got your wires crossed, i have no belifs that in anyway connect with the Gnostic’s of the time of Paul and John. Like i said you getting the two periods CROSSED UP. I have no idea what modern Gnostic’s preach nor do i even care to know. But i certainly know what they taught at the time of the apostles, i have made a very in depth study of them, and their teachings.

    Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene

    #832241
     Anthony 
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    Hi Gene I don’t believe I said that I no you don’t. I’ll go back and check if I did I apologise for that if I did.. God bless Gene

    #832243
     Anthony 
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    Hi www      that was a good post. The one on page 510 this one:

    I can make this easy for anyone who can read. If one finds themselves having to be creative in explaining a supposed foundational truth while sacrificing the integrity of the scope of the Word, then one should definitely check their doctrine.

    God bless Anthony

    #832244
     Anthony 
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    Hi Gene I couldn’t find where I said Gene. Send it to me k.

    God bless.

    #832245
     GeneBalthrop 
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    Anthony, the Gnostic’s at the time of Paul and John only had one view and that was that Jesus was a God sent from the pelora of the GOD’S. ALSO that he was only desguised as a manm but was really a GOD. THE denied his need to recieve the anointibg spirit, reasoning that he was already GOD, and so did not need to baptized and recieve the spirit of God as other human do.

    Hence the apostle JOHN coined the phrase “ANTICHRIST’S , because they did not believe Jesus was a flesh and blood human, who came into his existence just as we do, and because they believed he was a preexisting God already he had no need to be anointed by a GOD.

    THE WORD ANTICHRIST, simply means, ANTI-ANOINTING, not anti-Jesus, as most assume, because the Gnostic’s did believe in Jesus, but a different Jesus, the one that nearly all CHRISTENDOM believes in today.

    The gnostic’s were in the true church, but as John said they went out from us, therefore proving they were not all of us, they started there own form of christanity, which eventually took over and became what is now christanity the apostate church was formibg even at the time of t h e apostles, just as PAUL AND John said, “for the iniquity does already exist”. Those apostles were fighting what now is the christian religion of this day.

    2THS 2, is talking about the false (INAGE) of Jesus now preached, that turned the man Flesh man JESUS into a GOD, which turns the (IMAGE) of him into the “man of sin”, and because the apostate churches did not love the truth, about the real Jesus, GOD sent unto them a deluding spirit, in order for them to believe the “LIE”, what lie? , that JESUS was a GOD.

    All who preach Jesus as a preexisting GOD OR DEMIGOD and worship him as such, are IDOLATERS, and are in the wide path of destruction that many go in threat, just as Jesus said.

    Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene

    #832267
     The Word’s Watchman 
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    Hi Nick

    RE: Vine and Branches. We are more like Jesus as he’s our brother (Heb 2:11). Jesus is the first fruits to die no more (Rom 8:29-30). We will be “cultivated” when he returns. (1 Corn 15:23-24). God is the husbandman. Though, we are all united as one with God and with His Son Jesus Christ (John 17:11&21)

    John 15:1  I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

    RE: Mary giving birth to Jesus.

    Yes, Mary gave birth to Jesus. Point is, he is not born of a man, from man’s seed/semen. Life of the flesh is in the blood (Gen 9:4, Lev 17:11). We get our genetic make up from our fathers passed down through the blood. This is why we all die because the curse of death is passed to all, our blood is corrupted. Jesus didn’t get his blood from man, he only took part of flesh and blood, he took the flesh part (Heb 2:14). This makes him able to be the pure sacrifice. God is not a man, He is Spirit (John 4:24, Luke 24:39). Jesus was created in the womb of Mary by God, thus making him from above. Just like when a person gets born again, they are born from above; being born again = being born from above (John 3:3). Think of it this way, God’s Word is His Seed, His Son is His Seed, His Son is His Word, when that Word get’s in you and you believe, it grows and you are anointed with the Christ in you, the gift from the Holy Spirit which is holy spirit the God Breathed Word. (John 20:22, 2 Tim 3:16)

    #832272
     NickHassan 
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    Hi WW,

    So you have established some things about your beliefs.

     

    1 Jesus was not a man like us. Despite being born of a woman and the verse in Jb 25 about that, he was born perfect.

    2 Jesus was not conceived but somehow existed before Mary and took on flesh somehow. Mary was not his mother.

    3 Jesus did not suffer temptation like us and did not need to be an overcomer like we do.

    4 We cannot possibly follow him-he has a huge head start.

    5 If these are your thoughts – they are scripturally wrong.

     

     

    #832273
     NickHassan 
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    Hi WW,

    We get half our genetic makeup from our father and half from our mother.

     

    #832275
     NickHassan 
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    Hi WW,

    Jesus did not get his blood from man?

    Where is this idea from?

    #832276
     NickHassan 
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    Hi WW,

    Jesus was created in the womb of Mary?

    You say his creation was his being born from above?

    Scripture says he was conceived. Why did would you add these ideas to scripture?

    #832278
     Anthony 
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    Hi Gene

    Here a link on Gnostics:

    http://www.humanreligions.info/gnosticism.html#Adoptionism

    I hope this helps on what I was saying about Gnostics.

    God bless Gene

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